My new project - London K class trolleybus in 1/43

[John lewsey]

What a lovely model

[Mister Spoons]

A busy day spent constructing the trolleypoles; these are based on the PC Models/Alan Kirkman OO Scale pole kits but substantially modified to look more like the ones fitted to the K class, and most other UK trolleys.

 

 

The fret is tiny; and the trolley wheel a microscopic item, I cleaned out the holes that I was going to solder wire into before cutting the parts out, redrilling to 0.6mm to suit my use...

 

 

These parts are the pole components I am utilising.

 

 

 

I had an idea how they would go together and be functional - but basically 'made it up as I went along'

 

 

The crosspieces added; I looked at pics of the roofgear on the real thing and of the Russian diecast which look pretty effective

 

 

Assembling the pole and the swivelling base together....

 

 

 

Once assembled the poles were painted all over with Gun Blue which blackens the metal chemically; they will need a few treatments as the effect is a touch patchy, but I thought that using paint may clog the springs and thought this might be effective

 

 

The eyes on the long end of the springs were soldered and drilled to 1.3mm to fit the crosspieces, I'm trying to source springs with smaller eyes....

 

 

The main body of the work done, just the trolleyheads to go.....

 

 

Trolleybuses generally used skids rather than wheels; I've used the wheel but only a a guide where to file the groove that would/will carry the wire.

This was a very fiddly procedure and being so small the solder joints would melt when adding parts, even on the lowest setting!

 

 

Got there in the end though; the wire tails fit down the trolleypoles they are very fine tube, 1.2mm OD and 0.6mm ID, and the loops underneath were used to retrieve the poles in the event of dewirement - each vehicle carried a long bamboo with a hook on the end to facilitate this, slung in a carrier underneath the vehicle.

 

 

nearing completion, just one trolley head to fit, and then.......

 

 

Test fitting! Poles up....

 

 

And poles down

 

I'll be making a few refinements to the poles, primarily with regard to the springs and crosspieces, I've also fitted the power cable which you can see on the roof, just behind the gantry!

 

A long day but quite fruitful........

[PhilJ W]

Only the first London Trolleybuses were fitted with trolley wheels, from about 1935 they went over to carbon inserts which was imperative once war started as they were less likely to produce flashes in the blackout.

[asa]

Modelling of the highest standard Mister Spoons,a fantastic piece of work.

[Mister Spoons]

Only the first London Trolleybuses were fitted with trolley wheels, from about 1935 they went over to carbon inserts which was imperative once war started as they were less likely to produce flashes in the blackout.

Absolutely right there Phil; I have just had a quick read-up on this and as a result of high numbers of dewirements in comparison with the trams they replaced a solution was sought - Diddler 26 was trialled with larger trolley wheels the size of dinner plates, which must have looked VERY strange - shame I cannot find a picture of these.... Anyway they proved ineffective and number 14 was fitted with the metal skates with carbon inserts which proved successful, and all existing vehicles were retrofitted with these, and this system was specified for all new vehicles, the first of which were the Phase one vehicles for the 657/667 and the 654, together with the Bexleyheath operation. Apparently when there was adverse weather conditions the carbons needed replacing daily!

 

@ asa, John Lewsey; thanks for the compliments guys, it has been a thoroughly enjoyable build with plenty of challenges, with some still to come; I am starting to look at the motorisation aspect, and although it's not likely to begin before our holidays I have sourced an accurate diagram for my next trolley project which is the L3 class which was latterly used at Fulwell after the Q1's were sold to Spain. All the evidence suggests that most of these were quite battered by the time they arrived at FW in comparison with the K's at Isleworth which had been very well looked-after by their previous keepers....

I have little experience of weathering so may take the soft option of modelling one of the dozen or so L's that were transferred in from Finchley Depot for the last few months, as FY looked after their charges like first-borns.....

 

I've learned a huge amount from building 1058 in terms of techniques and materials that were not available when I built the Brussels car, as well as having a few of those 'If I was going to do this again I'd do it differently' moments....

 

Ah well, I guess I'd better get my head down and start on the upper deck seats, all twenty of them!

[PhilJ W]

Don't forget one of the Albion or Leyland Cub service lorries, they were often seen changing the carbon inserts 'en route'.

[Mister Spoons]

Don't forget one of the Albion or Leyland Cub service lorries, they were often seen changing the carbon inserts 'en route'.

I'd guess that the driver on hearing the scraping of a trolley head with a worn insert on the overhead would alert the next inspector on the road, and a vehicle would be despatched to a predefined point.

 

The rear roof domes were painted glossy brown in an attempt to disguise the droppings from the trolleyheads, I should think that the mixture of carbon and grease would have been pretty unsightly and difficult to shift; the brown dome also adds quite nicely to the aesthetic of the vehicles too!

Edited June 25, 2014 by Mister Spoons

[Mister Spoons]

 

Well I grasped the nettle and began the process of building the upper deck seating, same strategy as with the lower deck, just more of the little blighters! These are the offside ones.

 

I've also added the decals; the London Transport and numbers are from Terry Russell, and all others are homebrew

 

 

and the real thing.....

 

 

Front view

 

And the rear.....

 

 

I'll be continuing with the seats on Tuesday, along with the small detail items; mirrors, wipers, sideguards and mudflaps, and a few more handrails & suchlike...... we're entering the end phase and I shall hopefully have 1058 close to completion when I visit Hugh next Saturday!

[bobster]

Superb David.

 

Cheers, Bob.

[ThePurplePrimer]

Lovely !

[Nobby (John)]

You should be very proud of this, do you exhibit your work at all?

[Mister Spoons]

Thanks for the positive feedback and compliments guys; I have enjoyed every moment of this build and once we return from our holidays I will be building an L3 to keep the K company!

 

I have not exhibited John, but if I can get the models motorised I do have an idea for a small portable sectional layout involving a truncated version of Isleworth depot with a working turntable traverser - see the video below starting at about 0.59 - a very unusual piece of equipment in London....

 

 

and enjoy a bit of Del Shannon while wallowing in nostalgia!

 

This is a long-term dream-type project but to have something to run the trolleys on would be excellent, and built in sections should be achievable....one day! I know that Isleworth Depot is available from Kingsway John in 4mm so I may contact him and see if the artwork could be upscaled to 7mm.......

As a first step I will put a diorama together and see what develops.

 

As Mrs Spoons is working late today I'm carrying on with all those seats - less work to do on them tomorrow....

 

Cheers again for the encouragement and great feedback folks

 

David

[Nobby (John)]

That's amazing, all the years I spent growing up in London and all the garages I visited albeit after the demise of the trolleybus, and I never knew about a turntable/traverser!

[Pete Harvey]

Thank you for posting the link to the video.

 

Health & Safety would go ape if they still used things like that with school children just walking around "what no safety railings or guards" I would hate to have to do a risk assessment on that.

 

Pete

[Mister Spoons]

Glad you enjoyed it John, I never get bored with watching film of London trolleys (and later 60's and early 70's stuff too) especially when it's places I knew then and now. We lived at Kew Bridge with the 657, 667 and 655 at the end of the street, and so much of the film I posted on about page two is good memories of growing up in that part of west London!

 

The Turntable Traverser was quite impressive, and clever use of space in what I believe was the smallest depot in London; I think (having had a quick squint in one of my 'library' of LT trolley books) that quite a few depots had them, what wasn't supposed to happen was traversing and turntabling at the same time! As a later generation of LT staff what was in the rule book and reality were often a distance apart haha..

[Mister Spoons]

Thank you for posting the link to the video.

 

Health & Safety would go ape if they still used things like that with school children just walking around "what no safety railings or guards" I would hate to have to do a risk assessment on that.

 

Pete

You are right there Pete, but a bevy of Joe Public was a very rare exception on LT premises!

I know that the film was within the last couple of weeks of operations at IH, as the vehicle on the TT was a Fulwell-based L3 which would seldom have entered Isleworth Depot. I reckon this film was taken on a farewell tour which took place on 15th April 1962; The trolley was 1528 - one of the two L3's with sliding top vents left in service, the other tour vehicle being 1425 which had half-drops.

 

LT were strict on non-employees being in depots so these folk must have been on that tour and it appears that some leeway was shown to the participants!

 

PS: I found a couple of pictures online showing TTs in use at Carshalton and at Bow as well......

 

PPS: I've found a still photo of 1528 on the TT at Isleworth, on an enthusiasts tour which was taken on 29/4/62 so I was partly right; you can recognise some of the people in the film!

 

I don't know if 1528 was involved in the 15th April tour but 1425 certainly was!

 

It seems there were a good few private tours in the final days.

Detail Detail.......

Edited June 30, 2014 by Mister Spoons

[alant]

Great to see the finished model, looks superb!

[asa]

What an interesting video,I really enjoyed it thanks.

[ozzyo]

Hello Mister Spoons,

 

some very nice modelling going on here of a subject that I don't know much about (but I know what I like and I like this).

 

I would like to ask a question of two. But first can I say why? I always thought the trolley poles would have grooved wheels. To keep the pick-up arms on the wires as the "bus" did not always stay under the wires.

But in one of the posts above it mentioned skids, how would a skid stay on the wire? (I'm thinking along the lines of a pantograph). Would it have some sort of guide "thing" at each side?

If it was a wheel at the junctions I can think I know how it could work, but a skid I'm not that sure of.

 

A new question, what was the voltage that most of the trolley buses ran on?

 

If the trolley buses and trams had to cross the wires that must have been a bit of fun as well.

 

 

I'm from up north and the only trams that I had seen in use had been in Blackpool, until we got the new ones in Manchester. 

 

OzzyO.

[Mister Spoons]

Hi OzzyO,

 

In the early days of trolleybuses in London the grooved tramway-type wheel was used, but because the trolleybus doesn't stick to a fixed path along the road the number of dewirements was unacceptably high and an alternative sought, after a few experiments with wheels of curious dimensions it was found that a skate (with a grooved carbon insert) instead of the wheel was far more stable; here's a picture of a short type head which was the standard until around 1946:

 

 

The skate is located in a very similar fashion to a wheel, it can rotate about the pivot point in much the same way as most wheel type heads, and because the groove is elongated by comparison with the wheel it was far less prone to misbehaving. From around 1946 a modified type was used which had an even longer carbon insert which was self-lubricating with a graphite content eliminating the need to use addition lubrication. This meant that the converted buses that roamed the network greasing the overhead were retired....

 

LT trolleybuses ran at 600v, which was supplied at -300v neg and +300 pos, and I have no idea why this was chosen as the old trams were -0 and +600, perhaps to do with minimising corrosion?

 

The busiest junction on the London system was the Nags Head on Holloway Road, a real spiders web of wiring here:

 

 

and life must have been even more complex when the trams ran alongside, up to 1952, although the trams collected their current via the conduit here

 

 

straightforward 90 degree crossovers were probably one of the simpler pieces of special work as they have no moving parts, on the LT system most of the turnouts (aka frogs) were manual with a handle which was mounted to a traction pole ahead of the junction with a visual indicator ahead, and a reset trip after the special work, there were some push-button semi-automatic frogs and a very small minority of automatics which worked on a 'power or coast' basis which was probably quite tricky in London rush-hour traffic!

Edited July 1, 2014 by Mister Spoons

[PhilJ W]

Hello Mister Spoons,

 

some very nice modelling going on here of a subject that I don't know much about (but I know what I like and I like this).

 

I would like to ask a question of two. But first can I say why? I always thought the trolley poles would have grooved wheels. To keep the pick-up arms on the wires as the "bus" did not always stay under the wires.

But in one of the posts above it mentioned skids, how would a skid stay on the wire? (I'm thinking along the lines of a pantograph). Would it have some sort of guide "thing" at each side?

If it was a wheel at the junctions I can think I know how it could work, but a skid I'm not that sure of.

 

A new question, what was the voltage that most of the trolley buses ran on?

 

If the trolley buses and trams had to cross the wires that must have been a bit of fun as well.

 

 

I'm from up north and the only trams that I had seen in use had been in Blackpool, until we got the new ones in Manchester. 

 

OzzyO.

The skids are U shaped so that they 'enclose' the wire. Another advantage of skids was that they lubricate the wire with a film of carbon. At crossovers and junctions the live and return are separated in much the same way as model railway turnouts and crossings, think Insulfrog. Most trolleybus systems worked on 500-600 volts DC but at least one in Switzerland was 1500 volt DC.

[Mister Spoons]

Hi PhilJ W,

 

nice comparison with Insulfrog there!

 

Don't know if you have seen the picture of a trolley turning into (I think) Colindale Depot whilst taking juice, a wonderful bit of arcing! Only a black and white image sadly; I've never seen a colour pic of a LT trolley arcing - have you?

[david.hill64]

LT trolleybuses ran at 600v, which was supplied at -300v neg and +300 pos, and I have no idea why this was chosen as the old trams were -0 and +600, perhaps to do with minimising corrosion?

 

I wonder if this was to do with insulation? Insulators suitable for 300V will be smaller and lighter than those rated for 600V.

 

For a tram the rails have to be at earth so the overhead must be at working voltage, just like electrified railways. I did read about problems with stud contact systems where horses could depress and energize the stud with their hooves leading to unfortunate consequences, but perhaps this is an urban myth.

 

I have really enjoyed following progress of this build. I remember trolley buses in Derby, Reading, Cardiff, Walsall and of course Bradford most;y seen as incidentals to train spotting trips in the 60s. When going to Leeds for my University interview in 1971 I did take a trip to Bradford for a quick ride on a trolleybus. My only experience in the UK. I also remember seeing what I think were ex LT trolleybuses near the railway station at San Sebastian Spain in 1973.

[Mister Spoons]

Good point there David, I would think that weight saving is a major consideration with the overhead for trolleys as there's two of everything up there compared to tramway overhead; LT's overhead developed over the years - the earlier wooden insulation being superceded by lighter, more durable 'dumbbell' system items, although wooden items were in use to the end.

Regarding the stud contact system, there was also a magnetic stud method in which the stud was lifted by magnetic force, energising at the top of travel... urban myth being a 'stuck' stud remaining powered, to the discomfort of peeing dogs..... I'm sure it would only be a myth as dogs (as we know :-D ) preferred to raise a hind leg against traction poles, causing corrosion to the bases of the poles. I understand that is why LT and others encased some pole bases in concrete!

 

I also remember the trolleys in Reading and Bournemouth, and Bradford, Bournemouth being regularly visited, Reading less so and Bradford only once.

 

As regards the LT Q! trolleys sold to Spain, I bludgeoned my parents into submission, instead of the Costa Brava we went to the Atlantic coast of Spain a couple of times, sampling the delights there; I particularly enjoyed Santander as the livery was almost London, with brown rear roofs and domes, and La Coruna which were better kept and two-tone blue and cream. Take a peek at David Bradley Online (if you haven't already!) to see some wonderful photos of the Q!s in Spain, as well as a plethora of London trolley pics and info....

[Catweasel]

That video took me back some. Getting on the trolley at the Wellington for the Bush. Very tight turn at the Wellington it was. I believe the trolley garage is still there.