RandyWales Posted June 27, 2014 Author Share Posted June 27, 2014 Hi again... To demonstrate that controlling the motion and sounds separately is simple, I've recorded this short demo of my Bachmann Class 105 departing Costleigh New Cut station. The speakers are beneath the layout Randall 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Anderson Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 The URL for the Soundbyte App is changed. One needs to search for Black Cat Systems in the App Store, now £2.95. I like the idea for Club layouts of having a "Sound Operator." Could well suit someone who likes model railways but doesn't build. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Anderson Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 Randy, one thing you could help with regarding the App and an iPad. Do I need to hook up to a Mac to get sound files from iTunes? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted October 25, 2014 Author Share Posted October 25, 2014 Randy, one thing you could help with regarding the App and an iPad. Do I need to hook up to a Mac to get sound files from iTunes? Hi Ken....I connect my iPad to my Microsoft Windows laptop that has iTunes installed.... Basically, I select Songs Library then File -> Add File to Library, and then File -> Devices -> Sync. Within SoundByte, I press and hold a button, which opens up the configuration page for that button. Click on the entry called Music Library which jumps to the iPad Songs app and select the required sound for playback. If you refer to my earlier post in this thread, you will learn how simple it is to set up functions like Looping, Fading and button colours etc.... Probably the most important function is "Touch fades other Carts".... Please let us know how you get on.....and if you need any more help, please ask. Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted October 25, 2014 Author Share Posted October 25, 2014 Another quick Soundbyte tip..... Click the "Setup" menu button at the top of a Rack page and you will see a configuration page for the chosen "rack". Select the options shown below.... Active buttons will now have a white frame around them and you'll also see a progress bar for the active sound. (You can see these options in action in the videos) Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Anderson Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 got it, thank you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benbow Posted November 26, 2014 Share Posted November 26, 2014 Just read through this lot and found it very interesting. Downloaded Soundbyte and had a play. It has many possibilities for me. I have never been that keen on sound fitted locos for a number of reasons. With steam the sound doesn't seem deep enough to me, no doubt a product of small speakers and loco sound in isolation to me is a bit odd. I really like the idea of having ambient sound together with superimposed locos, wheel noise from carriages, wagons etc etc. Driving the loco to the sounds is not difficult and I find more effective given that sound can continue and fade off after the train has reached the fiddle yard rather than abruptly stopping. Thanks for opening up new possibilities for me. Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted November 27, 2014 Author Share Posted November 27, 2014 Just read through this lot and found it very interesting. Downloaded Soundbyte and had a play. It has many possibilities for me. I have never been that keen on sound fitted locos for a number of reasons. With steam the sound doesn't seem deep enough to me, no doubt a product of small speakers and loco sound in isolation to me is a bit odd. I really like the idea of having ambient sound together with superimposed locos, wheel noise from carriages, wagons etc etc. Driving the loco to the sounds is not difficult and I find more effective given that sound can continue and fade off after the train has reached the fiddle yard rather than abruptly stopping. Thanks for opening up new possibilities for me. Roger Hi Roger...It's great to hear that you've given Soundbyte a try, and I'm grateful that you mentioned that it's not difficult to control the sounds separately. These days, I really feel that there is something fundamental missing if I run my 4mm trains without sound. It is really amazing running a model train through the layout synchronised with a professionally recorded soundtrack played through stereo speakers. I have edited some soundtracks especially for the purpose.....build and fade with the doppler shift in between centred on the train passing my viewing position. Sound decoders? Pah! Please keep us informed of developments... Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted August 25, 2015 Author Share Posted August 25, 2015 Hi again... I'm bumping this topic simply because there may be members out there who haven't seen it but are interested in providing sounds for their loco fleet/layout...at a cheaper cost than £100 per loco. I'm also hoping someone else is inspired to seek out new possibilities... Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nickwood Posted August 26, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 26, 2015 (edited) I've just found this thread which seems really interesting. I notice that it was said earlier that the oundbyte app was £2.99 in the app store, but when I search for it it comes up as £29.99 for the Lite version. Call me a cheapskate but I would be happy to risk £2.99 by way of an experiment but perhaps not £29.99. Was the price quoted incorrect or am I missing something. Edited August 26, 2015 by nickwood Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted August 26, 2015 Author Share Posted August 26, 2015 I've just found this thread which seems really interesting. I notice that it was said earlier that the oundbyte app was £2.99 in the app store, but when I search for it it comes up as £29.99 for the Lite version. Call me a cheapskate but I would be happy to risk £2.99 by way of an experiment but perhaps not £29.99. Was the price quoted incorrect or am I missing something. Hi NickWood... You need to search Black Cat Systems in the App Store.... It would appear that another, but totally different Soundbyte app is also being marketed by someone else.... The price doesn't show when I view the Black Cat Soundbyte as I've already bought the app. However, it is also available bundled with three other apps for £7.99 from Black Cat Systems, and the other three are individually £2.99 each, so £2.99 for Soundbyte looks correct. Give it a go....(no involvement other than as a satisfied customer). Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted August 26, 2015 Author Share Posted August 26, 2015 Randall, I too, took advice from clickerty-clack, he cost me a b****y fortune in purchasing new sound recording equipment! Initially I used the Miditron controller and PC like clickerty, but eventually moved on. However, Bill's advice was spot on. I now use the Sparkfun sampler which I fit into 5" gauge as built, but I'm also currently engaged in remodelling the PCB to fit into O gauge and possibly larger OO gauge models with an integral DCC chip and inertia controller all combined on one board. I use the Crest-Electronics (Aristo-Craft) Revolution train controller for my 5" gauge stuff. NB: The Crest receiver has inbuilt sound which I switch off for this application. The Sparkfun sampler delivers 16bit/48khz audio through its own onboard amplifier and likewise with your own system Randall, shatters the myth about small speakers not sounding good. (Another myth busted by Bill). I can control 99 locomotives with the Revolution Controller and by changing the mode of acceleration and deceleration and thus changing the sampleset banks for each running profile, I can have different sounds for light engines, under load pulling passenger or freight trains. The difference being I can change those banks of samplesets by use of changing the handsets throttle position or by train type (and not CV values like Zimo ). I also have no drop out issues as the sound is contained and played on the locomotive. Since I am using a sampler rather than a playback device the engine note changes follow the handsets throttle changes immediately and the motion of the locomotive follows the sounds. With 32Gb on-board memory I can store 2048 individual sounds and play them through 14 internal stereo channels mixed down to a stereo audio output. I reckon on paying £100 for 5" gauge loco sound & receiver and about £40 - £45 for the combined O gauge DCC sound version. Controlling DCC decoders by iPhone app is of considerable interest, I have not researched this area at all and would appreciate some tips on any good apps available. More focussed upon controlling the motion and external outputs rather than sound though. Hi Doddy... Thanks for replying....very interesting but lots of detail I haven't come across before, so I need time to digest your post and check out your gear.... I am in total agreement with your sentiments about Bill....a really nice, knowledgeable and approachable guy. He did confide some of his ideas on sound production to me, which I have utilised to improve my samples, but a lot of what he told me went Whoosh over my head... Lucky I have all his emails to refer to when I need clarification. I must get back in touch with him... Soundbyte doesn't have motion control of trains, but on the times I've taken my Bluetooth speaker-fitted 7mm stock to my club, nobody picked up on the fact I was controlling the sounds and the locos separately. It is so easy. Everyone was impressed by the quality of the sounds though. Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nickwood Posted August 26, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 26, 2015 Hi NickWood... You need to search Black Cat Systems in the App Store.... It would appear that another, but totally different Soundbyte app is also being marketed by someone else.... The price doesn't show when I view the Black Cat Soundbyte as I've already bought the app. However, it is also available bundled with three other apps for £7.99 from Black Cat Systems, and the other three are individually £2.99 each, so £2.99 for Soundbyte looks correct. Give it a go....(no involvement other than as a satisfied customer). Randall Hi NickWood... You need to search Black Cat Systems in the App Store.... It would appear that another, but totally different Soundbyte app is also being marketed by someone else.... The price doesn't show when I view the Black Cat Soundbyte as I've already bought the app. However, it is also available bundled with three other apps for £7.99 from Black Cat Systems, and the other three are individually £2.99 each, so £2.99 for Soundbyte looks correct. Give it a go....(no involvement other than as a satisfied customer). Randall Thanks, searching Black Cat Systems in the App Store took me to the same result as before i.e. Soundbyte Lite @ £29.99 confirming the developer as Black Cat Systems. However going to their BCS website took me to a link back to the App Store and produced an App called Sound Byte Cart Machine App @ £3.99 which is also available in a bundle with three other apps for £7.99 so I'm assuming this is the one you mean? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted August 26, 2015 Author Share Posted August 26, 2015 Thanks, searching Black Cat Systems in the App Store took me to the same result as before i.e. Soundbyte Lite @ £29.99 confirming the developer as Black Cat Systems. However going to their BCS website took me to a link back to the App Store and produced an App called Sound Byte Cart Machine App @ £3.99 which is also available in a bundle with three other apps for £7.99 so I'm assuming this is the one you mean? Sound Byte Cart Machine...that's the one Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 (edited) Hi again.... I've been watching videos on Youtube again ..this time looking for HST Intercity 125 Paxman Valenta sounds to use in sync with my new Hornby blue/grey High Speed Train. I've had a bit of a revelation. Up until now, I have been transmitting sounds from my iPad (running Soundbyte) to a bluetooth speaker beneath the layout. (nb on my O Gauge layout I transmit high quality sounds direct to the locos using onboard Bluetooth speakers). This evening, however, I was searching through Youtube with my iPad on my lap and then synchronising the running of the model on the layout with the real thing in the video. There was an astounding difference having the high quality REAL sounds playing through the decent quality iPad speaker on my lap Previously, having the speaker beneath the layout did admittedly take getting used-to. Tonight, though, having the speaker on my lap, with my viewing position relative to the real train in the video was absolutely astonishing. With the speaker much closer to me, the sounds reaching my ears genuinely seemed as if they were coming from the Power Cars and carriages running on the layout and not from the iPad in my lap. A combined optical and aural illusion? Those who appreciate the screaming Paxman Valenta sounds would have smiled as the model slowly accelerated in time with the real thing in the video. I was able to immerse myself in the soundscape of the real thing, which let me tell you is streets ahead of the sounds from a soundchip. I am slowly building a full library of sounds that will allow me to view/listen-to many different train consists, with different locomotive types, from various viewing positions on the layout. My sounds are taken from videos on the web, but others are sounds made available for home use by enthusiasts using professional recording techniques. I use Youtube Downloader to download the sounds. The same product can also create a soundtrack as a seperate file for loading (via iTunes) into Soundbyte (after suitable editing in Audacity of course). As a caveat, sounds produced as described, would probably only be suitable for the individual operator rather than several people as the source of the sounds are localised because of the nearby positioning of the speaker. Someone standing a few feet away probably wouldn't have the same experience. If you would like to see examples of REAL train sounds being run very effectively in sync with model trains, then search for Everard Junction on Youtube...The many video tutorials / video blogs each have an introduction that shows model trains running through the layout accompanied by a real soundtrack. Very effective. When I have more time, I will try and create videos of my own to demostrate how realistic using real sounds actually is on a model railway. This is a topic that was advocated by the late John Allison of Warley MRC way back when. He was a very inspirational modeller. Finally, be aware that you have to control the sounds and motion of the trains separately. Some advocates of DCC sound on RMweb who obviously have different views to me have recently posted comments that the link between sound and motion is vital. This is totally misleading and probably has something to do with vested interests. After all, when you have invested hundreds in DCC Soundchips, something that is low cost but is more effective must stick in the craw. Randall Edited September 23, 2015 by RandyWales Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 Hi again... Just a little note to advise anyone interested in using real sounds on their layout. The number of high quality train videos on Youtube is accelerating by the day. Many enthusiasts record both Steam and Diesel Gala days and post them on Youtube. Some are really top notch and recorded in HD. When you play back a video in Youtube, you should have an option (under Settings) to increase the display resolution. If you can, change the setting to 1080p HD because the quality of audio is correspondingly higher. Youtube Downloader also has this option. Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Reichert Posted September 24, 2015 Share Posted September 24, 2015 For US Operations modellers, doing lots of switching, the motion link is probably essential for maintaining the illiusion. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpiper Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Hi again... Some members will be aware that I have been a keen participant in the Cheaper and Better DCC Sound thread. Driven predominantly by my personal opinion regarding the excessive cost of 7mm Sound Decoders, I was convinced I could save a huge amount of money by coming up with an alternative. That thread has been quiet for a couple of months, but still seems to be generating interest, judging by the rising number of hits..... I concede that the thread would appear to have stalled, but I think that was because conflicts were starting to surface. Offline, however, I have continued to strive towards this personal goal, ably assisted by Clickerty Clack, who is a very genuine and knowledgable guy when it comes to sound matters. I have been looking at several methods, whilst trying to develop the link between sound production and motion control of the locomotives. I made great strides using the free (and very professional) PureData music production software program which can share USB gamepad-driven control methods with the free JMRI DCC system. Puredata has a big brother called MaxMsp which has much more functionality, but the licence is quite expensive. However, I developed a workable system during the four week free trial period. It is an offboard (pc-based) system, sending sounds to the loco via Bluetooth Audio Streaming. That is more of a longterm project, and the free version is certainly cheap in comparison with Sound Chips. The other major benefit is that the sound quality is far superior to that available on current Sound Chips. As part of my 'education', I tried to program a LokSound project, but I was really surprised and disappointed to find that the compilation process reduces the sound quality by around a third - necessary to pack enough sound samples onto a chip. At this time, however, I would like to share with members a method of Layout Sound production that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere before. It's very early days yet, but this an exciting new angle, so watch this space! Above all....it's more or less 'as cheap as chips' (unlike Sound Chips!)... I'll post a video in the next few days.... Randall I have beem following this with great interest, what sound programme did you use, or shuld I say sound mixer app ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted October 23, 2015 Author Share Posted October 23, 2015 I have beem following this with great interest, what sound programme did you use, or shuld I say sound mixer app ?Hi PeterP...The program I use to edit sounds for uploading into Soundbyte is the world-reknowned Audacity, which is free (MS Windows). For our purposes, it is fairly straightforward...you load the soundfile, which is displayed as a graphical soundwave. You can set start and endpoints for playback, make adjustments to get it just right. You then save the result as a file, which is then loaded into Soundbyte using iTunes as described in an earlier posting. The DMU samples in the video were all extracted from a single file that was downloaded free for personal use. If enough interest were to be expressed on this thread, I'd consider delevoping a series of instructional videos for Youtube. regards Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted October 23, 2015 Author Share Posted October 23, 2015 (edited) Hi again... Just a little note to advise anyone interested in using real sounds on their layout. The number of high quality train videos on Youtube is accelerating by the day. Many enthusiasts record both Steam and Diesel Gala days and post them on Youtube. Some are really top notch and recorded in HD. When you play back a video in Youtube, you should have an option (under Settings) to increase the display resolution. If you can, change the setting to 1080p HD because the quality of audio is correspondingly higher. Youtube Downloader also has this option. Randall Hi again...To follow on from this previous post of mine...here is another suggestion with regard to obtaining suitable sounds from Youtube.... The phenomenal advances in the quality of Train Simulator graphics has prompted consequential improvements in sound quality. Increasing numbers of TrainSim enthusiasts have been posting videos of their scenarios on Youtube. The sound quality of most of these HD videos is good enough for our purposes. A quick Google search will unearth absolute gems. Watch out for those whose creator doesn't give a running commentary.... External overhead 'close-proximity shots' of the simulated locos will provide the best sounds... If you are a TrainSim bod, you will be able to create your own recordings..... I am using this method to create my own library of sounds for my O gauge fleet. I use 'SoundByte-to-onboard-Bluetooth-speaker'...much superior sound quality to those of DCC chips... My objective was to find a cheaper way of equipping my 7mm fleet with sound..I am well on my way. Youtube Downloader can be used to extract the soundfiles for uploading into Audacity. I want to emphasise (again) that controlling the trains and the sounds separately is easy. Watch my DMU video again....you'll hear me pressing the controller buttons as the Class 105 soundtrack accelerates. Enough said? regards Randall Edited October 24, 2015 by RandyWales Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted October 25, 2015 Author Share Posted October 25, 2015 For US Operations modellers, doing lots of switching, the motion link is probably essential for maintaining the illiusion. Andy Hi Andy... I politely disagree... It is far easier to synchronise sounds and motion when train movement is slower, as when shunting. Randall Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Hi again... Wow! I've just watched a video of professionally produced DCC Soundchips with 'latest developments'....station announcements, platform noise and BIRDSONG sounds etc that prototypically emanate from the locomotive speaker. This real added-value development is seriously making me reconsider my quest for cheaper sound. Randall Edited November 14, 2015 by RandyWales Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
raymw Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hi Randall,I hope you are joking. Background sounds should obviously emanate from the background - separate speaker for station, another for woodland bird song, another for traffic, etc. At a tenner a time, and free software/sound files, you can outperform any sound produced in a compromised loco speaker/sound system. If it ain't moving, you don't even need bluetooth - just a cheap mp3 player or three would do that. Best wishes, Ray Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giles Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 A friend of mine has some background noises programmed into a couple of his locos by a very well known and respected supplier/programmer, and is delighted with the option. After all it is free, one can control it, and depending on the type of sound and the volume it's playing at, it's not so easy to localise it's source. It goes without saying that you can have an independent source for extra sounds if you so wish - but this is simply a technique for gaining extra use out of hardware that you already have. Don't be so ready to knock it when some other (excellent and very well respected) modellers enjoy it - there must be something in it! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hi again... To follow on from this previous post of mine...here is another suggestion with regard to obtaining suitable sounds from Youtube.... The phenomenal advances in the quality of Train Simulator graphics has prompted consequential improvements in sound quality. Increasing numbers of TrainSim enthusiasts have been posting videos of their scenarios on Youtube. The sound quality of most of these HD videos is good enough for our purposes. A quick Google search will unearth absolute gems. Watch out for those whose creator doesn't give a running commentary.... External overhead 'close-proximity shots' of the simulated locos will provide the best sounds... If you are a TrainSim bod, you will be able to create your own recordings..... I am using this method to create my own library of sounds for my O gauge fleet. I use 'SoundByte-to-onboard-Bluetooth-speaker'...much superior sound quality to those of DCC chips... My objective was to find a cheaper way of equipping my 7mm fleet with sound..I am well on my way. Youtube Downloader can be used to extract the soundfiles for uploading into Audacity. I want to emphasise (again) that controlling the trains and the sounds separately is easy. Watch my DMU video again....you'll hear me pressing the controller buttons as the Class 105 soundtrack accelerates. Enough said? regards Randall In many cases,it may be possible to download the sound files direct from http://www.uktrainsim.com 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now