RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 21, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 21, 2014 Over the past two years I’ve managed to accumulate a number of OO items alongside my more usual N gauge stock. This has been largely due to ‘unmissable’ offers and promotions, but also as a result of some ‘personal’ purchases of locos that I remember from years past, or have ridden on more recently, that weren’t available in N. So now the plan is to build something for them to run on, and given the nature of the stock I think my best option is a much-shortened version of Llangollen in the present day, a preserved railway that has held many fond memories for me over the years. I need to make it clear at this point that this will be an ‘in the flavour of’ layout rather than an actual prototypical replica, as I just don’t have the room for the full thing! The intension is to build a 9’ long ‘shelf’ layout about 18” wide to accommodate the station and loop using Code 75 track, and have a detachable fiddle yard about 5’ long for operating sessions. My stock is all DC and includes a 57xx 5775 in BR black L/C, a 56xx 5601 in BR unlined green (to be lined and renumbered to 5643) and a black 9F (to be renumbered/named as Black Prince), all of which have featured at Llangollen over the years, as well as 9F Evening Star; Class 40 D200, Class 47 D1916 and Class 45 D55. I also have 6 maroon mk1 coaches, several BR vans and 3 Toad brake vans, so it’s well catered-for! The layout will basically serve as an opportunity to see the locos and stock trundling up and down the station and ‘hanging around’ the water crane and shunting one or two vans around, just as they do on the real thing! I may experiment with appropriate DC sound modules to complete the experience. Here’s the trackplan drawn very roughly in Paint; it's not to scale and the point positioning has yet to be confirmed: I would be hugely grateful if someone could recreate this in some appropriate programme with code 75 medium points (RH on the left; then RH and LH into the Bay; LH onto the lower loop) Thank you; that will help to see if I’ve done my sums right or if I need more room! Possible movements are: A loco enters from the fiddle yard under the bridge to the left pulling 3 mk1s and stops in the station. It then runs round the train, stopping to take on water and exits left back to the fiddle yard. A loco enters from the fiddle yard pulling 3 mk1s and leaves them in the station exiting to the water crane opposite. Another loco enters and draws the coaches back to the fiddle yard. A loco enters from the fiddle yard with 3 vans; stops to uncouple 2 then shunts one into the Bay platform. Then it can run round or push them back and so on… With 3 toad brake vans a ‘brake van ride’ can slowly shuttle up and down the near platform, then exit to fiddle yard. I can also have a ‘Diesel Derby’ and have the big guys lumbering up and down the platforms… And that’s just a few I came up with on the spur of the moment! Please let me know what you think; it’ll be a ‘work in progress’ for some time yet as I’m currently detailing Prestatyn to bring it to a more finished state, but I just wanted to put down a marker and hopefully things will pick up once that’s done. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modelling Martin Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Looks really good. I like the idea of a preserved railway layout as it can offer a lot of operating potential. I had a similar problem to you stock wise as i received a lot of them when i was younger and "thought they just looked good" not very specific in era or origin. After realising i couldn't have a rail freight class 20 realistically operating with an A4 i decided a preserved railway was the only way! Sorry i can't provide the track plan though, my operating system doesn't really support them. Gary Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jintyman Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Hey David, This looks like it's going to be good, Llangollen is one of my more frequented preserved lines (due to it being only 30 odd miles away). I'll look forward to watching this with interest. Jinty ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 23, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 23, 2014 Here's the sort of thing I have in mind operationally; Summer's afternoon watching beautiful locos rumbling up and down the platforms (mind you, it's even better when it's not so crowded!) http://youtu.be/L1Eum8KstGc More soon David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold simonmcp Posted May 23, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 23, 2014 Have they taken out the Three Way Point in preservation? Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 23, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 23, 2014 Have they taken out the Three Way Point in preservation? Simon Was that in the station area? If so, I assume so as I've not seen one there since they started renovations... Anyone else shed any light on this? David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsignalman Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Have they taken out the Three Way Point in preservation? Simon The crossover was removed, leaving only the trailing connection into the loading dock siding, by BR in the early 1960's. The track was entirely removed by BR (or contractors) after the line closed to freight in 1968. I remember reading that the Llangollen Railway was the first preservation scheme to relay SG track on a previously lifted BR line. A couple of photos from 1976. The track plan shown in your plan was adopted from the start; presumably to obtain a usable length of headshunt under the road bridge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWales Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Our friendly Neil of this parish had an article published as Plan Of The Month in Railway Modeller some years ago...October 2004 rings a bell (may be wrong though!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 I really like the idea; I've thought about it several times myself as rarely do we see preservation modelled well and it's a location which lends itself to a narrow plank. I'd consider not having the point (and necessary trap) this side of the bridge on the l/h side but to use the fiddle for running around to give a bit more breathing space. There's some fine red brick villas which would look good in low-relief behind the trees. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave47549 Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 24, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 24, 2014 I really like the idea; I've thought about it several times myself as rarely do we see preservation modelled well and it's a location which lends itself to a narrow plank. I'd consider not having the point (and necessary trap) this side of the bridge on the l/h side but to use the fiddle for running around to give a bit more breathing space. There's some fine red brick villas which would look good in low-relief behind the trees. Like it. You could go to town with the scenics as well if you wish: DF00006.JPG Thanks chaps; good idea about the point under the bridge; I'll try and get a proper scale plan drawn up to see how it'll affect the length of the fiddle yard. For scenic items, most buildings will have to be kit-bashed rather than scratchbuilt as my skills haven't developed that far as yet, but I hope to create a useable representation of it; if I can create a backscene of the area behind the station like the one I did for Prestatyn that'll help too... As far as stock goes I'm researching how to replicate that amazing shine you only ever see on preserved locos - so far Tim Shackleton seems to be the man in the know unless anyone else has any suggestions?! Keep the comments coming! David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 A nice idea, this, with the natural cut-off point of the closed tunnel making an obvious "end" to the layout. Rather than just click "like", may I add my own picture of the run-around pointwork by way of showing support? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torn-on-the-platform Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 I look forward to following the progress off this layout! As Andy pointed out, preservation is rarely modelled well (with a few notable exceptions), often used as an excuse to run anything with little thought. Its nice to see someone tackle a real prototype, even if it is a condensed version. My visits to the Llangollen haven't been too successful - one was an unavoidable, and very wet Thomas week, the other was the washed out Steel Steam and Stars III, but Llangollen is an interesting station and I still hold it in the highest regard! Here is some evidence of the breakvan rides you mention. I think the train consisted of 2 toads and a BR 20t, but this was 10 years ago so I'm not really sure! The service train itself had a pannier on the Llangollen end and large diesel (representing D119) at the other. To add to the disappointment of the visit, the top and tailed train meant no running round, and the pannier was facing Carrog, and therefore the carriages. Hopefully one day, I'll manage to visit on a sunny day where everything goes to plan! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linners Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Our friendly Neil of this parish had an article published as Plan Of The Month in Railway Modeller some years ago...October 2004 rings a bell (may be wrong though!) I was going to mention Neil Rushby's plan too - but I think it was the December 2004 RM rather than the october one. It is smaller than the OP's plan, but I am sure its worth a read. I have always liked the track layout and coupled with the main scenic features I think it would make a superb layout! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Good shot of the other side of the bridge when it was in use.. https://www.flickr.com/photos/96859208@N07/10541628936 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 24, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 24, 2014 A nice idea, this, with the natural cut-off point of the closed tunnel making an obvious "end" to the layout. Rather than just click "like", may I add my own picture of the run-around pointwork by way of showing support? IMAG0267A.jpg Thank you for this; interesting to see the actual length of the headshunt here; they got a dining car in the Bay once and I can't imagine how they did it! Interesting loco too; hmmm...!! David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 24, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 24, 2014 I was going to mention Neil Rushby's plan too - but I think it was the December 2004 RM rather than the october one. It is smaller than the OP's plan, but I am sure its worth a read. I have always liked the track layout and coupled with the main scenic features I think it would make a superb layout! Thanks for this; dashed onto Ebay and got a copy for a £1.00!! Should be an interesting read... David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsignalman Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 A couple of photos taken 22/9/1991 which I hope may be of interest. A 2-car DMU stabled in the headshunt. Looking from the bridge, the DMU is standing ahead of the ground disc due to the shortness of the headshunt. The points are the original flat bottom rail ones. The signal box diagram showing the layout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 24, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 24, 2014 A couple of photos taken 22/9/1991 which I hope may be of interest. A 2-car DMU stabled in the headshunt. 008.jpg Looking from the bridge, the DMU is standing ahead of the ground disc due to the shortness of the headshunt. The points are the original flat bottom rail ones. 011.jpg The signal box diagram showing the layout. 004.jpg Some very interesting detail shots there including the little signal tucked under the awning; seems the original point is beyond the west bridge as Andy suggests so I'll look to try arranging it that way... Thanks for the info David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 28, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 28, 2014 Like it. You could go to town with the scenics as well if you wish: DF00006.JPG Question for someone - based on this picture, what would you say was the height of the retaining wall to the river at the right hand end? With my eyesight I make it 8 stone courses from the top to the pipe/railing (?) and another 6 below which would be about 15 feet allowing for block height and mortar; does that sound about right, or way off?! The wall rises to about 4 courses above track level so the track would be about 10 feet above river level if so... If that's all too course and someone knows the proper measurements that would be great; just trying to plan the baseboards and allow for variations and heights etc. Thanks! David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steve Purves Posted May 28, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 28, 2014 Just a note, but theres a chap just planning exactly the same as you but in N gauge over on the N gauge forum... I have pointed him your way, perhaps you can be of use to each other!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 28, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 28, 2014 Just a note, but theres a chap just planning exactly the same as you but in N gauge over on the N gauge forum... I have pointed him your way, perhaps you can be of use to each other!!! Probably the same chap I contacted via Youtube!! His layout is far more extensive than mine as he has a round-the-room run including Berwyn station; some nice buildings too... Thanks for the info David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steve Purves Posted May 28, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 28, 2014 Probably the same chap I contacted via Youtube!! His layout is far more extensive than mine as he has a round-the-room run including Berwyn station; some nice buildings too... Thanks for the info David Must be another one then as this guy is in the very early woodwork stages... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted May 28, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted May 28, 2014 Must be another one then as this guy is in the very early woodwork stages... Clearly a popular choice of theme then!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jivebunny Posted May 28, 2014 Share Posted May 28, 2014 Hi David, Steve brought your project to my attention, and "very early woodwork stages" is certainly one way of describing my version I suppose (haven't started yet!) Of all the bits of railway in the UK, we seem to have started work on the same stretch in the same week! But a very nice stretch of railway it is, and one of which we clearly both have fond memories (I grew up in Chester and must have first visited Llangollen in the late 80s or early 90s). I too will be modelling the station area in an almost-but-not-quite-prototypical way - essentially straightening out the curve a bit to make it a more linear layout - although with the benefit of a smaller scale I'll be adding the shed area for interest, and the lines up to the Goods Junction signal box, at which point the passing loop ends and trains will continue onto a traverser, before sliding across and reversing into a hidden fiddle yard behind the sheds. One thing I spotted whilst trawling the internet and which is probably worth noting while you're still in the planning stages, is that you can juuuust about stable a two-car 101 DMU in the up / top / northern-most shunt neck (fouling the points leading to the bay / dock) without preventing access to the lower one. I didn't realise this until I stumbled across the below photograph, and it opens up a few more operational possibilities. In theory you could probably also fit a large pacific class locomotive and an 0-6-0, but I have yet to find any supporting evidence for this! I'll certainly be watching this thread with interest anyway, and wish you all the best in tackling this lovely part of the country. https://flic.kr/p/5xiLZE JB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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