My layout conundrum !

[Graham Walters]

Quite soon I will have a 12 x 8 shed at my disposal,virgin territory if you like, a bare canvas, and having never built a layout before the prospect is getting a little daunting, I have a theme set in mind, which although the product is fantasy, it's a bit of folklore around the are where I grew up, and as I have discovered in other parts of the UK.

 

So far I'm on my fourth prototype !

 

This was no1

 

 

 

I decided that this was totally impracticable,mainly because my backside is a bit close to the ground for me to be able to reach the far side of the oval, plus it didn't hold a lot of interest, and there was little room for expansion.

 

Layout No2

Was really no better, the curves were too tight, and the back scene meant that if I had a derailment I would have to drag the whole thing away from the wall in order to rescue the train, not ideal.

 

 

 

Layout No3

Adding a well meant I could access the furthest part of the track, but I would need a spinning chair to keep my eye on what was going on, plus at the age of 57 I wouldn't look forward to ducking under the board to access my hobby.

 

 

Layout No4

This is where I'm at now, the oval has gone, and been replaced by putting the track around three walls.

Here I have a Branch line station, a mainline station, and a branch for industry, the depth of the baseboard will finally be decided by the position of the shed door.

This I think is the best I have come with so far, the BLT is based loosely on an existing station, the mainline is a larger copy of that.

Storage will be by cassette, rather than fiddle yard.

 

[Southernboy]

It's interesting that your first three plans, on the whole, are 'roundy' layouts, whereas your fourth is 'end-to-end'.

 

Is that a conscious change? Or something that happened by accident whilst in the process of experimenting with what you could get in the space you have?

 

I ask because the two types of layout offer quite different experiences.

 

My starting point would be to determine what experience I wanted (along with deciding time and place / freelance), and then work from there ...

 

Sorry if I misunderstood anything, it's just the thought struck me so thought I'd best mention it.

 

---------

 

Another variation on your fourth plan could be to have a return loop at one end of the layout, giving you a  terminus, an intermediate station half-way, then the return loop (??)

[Titan]

Why not have a removable bridge section next to the door, you can then have a large roundy roundy all around the outside with gentle curves, and a large truss girder bridge would look rather impressive!

[neilrh]

I also like the idea of a removable bridge. My grandfather built his with a very sturdy 2 track bridge over a river (effectively an open top box), and he used a shaver socket to get power to the tracks on the removable section.

[Sidecar Racer]

 As mentioned above , if you want a roundy and no crawling then a lift out

section is the way to go , this is the one I knocked up , no decision has been

made as yet whether to scenic it or not . Uses pull apart multiblocks for track feeds.

 

 

[Graham Walters]

It's interesting that your first three plans, on the whole, are 'roundy' layouts, whereas your fourth is 'end-to-end'.

 

Is that a conscious change? Or something that happened by accident whilst in the process of experimenting with what you could get in the space you have?

 

I ask because the two types of layout offer quite different experiences.

 

My starting point would be to determine what experience I wanted (along with deciding time and place / freelance), and then work from there ...

 

Sorry if I misunderstood anything, it's just the thought struck me so thought I'd best mention it.

 

---------

 

Another variation on your fourth plan could be to have a return loop at one end of the layout, giving you a  terminus, an intermediate station half-way, then the return loop (??)

 

The change from roundy was becuase of the reach into the corners, the obvious answer was to have a well to reduce the amount of reach, then, the idea of crawling around on the floor at the age 60+ ( which I will be in 4 years time) somehow lost it's appeal !

 

The next obvious answer was the end to end, meaning the baseboards could be quite wide, the track could be close to the edge, leaving room for scenics etc.

 

I'm not that keen on a lift out section, I think I would end up trying to  crawl underneath.

 

A return loop is on the cards, a lot depends on the position of the door when the shed arrives.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Graham,

To be honest your plans are "all over the place" at the moment.

 

Get a large A4 notepad.

 

On the first page make a list of what you want from your layout. What are your priorities? Scale? Operation? Mainline or branch, or a combination? Urban or rural? Based on a real place or not? Era / region etc etc

 

Only you'll know the answers.

 

Look at real railways for inspiration. Don't try to "copy" another layout, though obviously many will inspire you.

 

Then begin scribbling out some ideas - don't get bogged down by the details; they can come later.

 

The key is to transfer what's in your mind onto the paper and see if it can become a reality in model form.

[Steve O.]

Hi Graham,

As Western Sunset notes, it's a good idea to empty your thoughts on to paper first.

I recommend looking at some of Iain Rice's books;

"Shelf Layouts for Model Railroads" or "Layout Design"

 

They are well illustrated and can take you step-by-step to a layout that will be manageable, realistic (in operation) and a lot of fun.

 

From your intro, I would go for a loop (roundy-roundy) around the walls (with the lifting section in the photos above) to let the trains go by / stretch their legs while you have another area for shunting.

 

Cheers, Steve.

[Sidecar Racer]

 

 

 

From your intro, I would go for a loop (roundy-roundy) around the walls (with the lifting section in the photos above) to let the trains go by / stretch their legs while you have another area for shunting.

 

 

 

That is a major advantage , locos get a good run , and you can sit and watch them go round ,

its got to be better for them than just going to and fro .

[Graham Walters]

Graham,

To be honest your plans are "all over the place" at the moment.

 

Get a large A4 notepad.

 

On the first page make a list of what you want from your layout. What are your priorities? Scale? Operation? Mainline or branch, or a combination? Urban or rural? Based on a real place or not? Era / region etc etc

 

Only you'll know the answers.

 

Look at real railways for inspiration. Don't try to "copy" another layout, though obviously many will inspire you.

 

Then begin scribbling out some ideas - don't get bogged down by the details; they can come later.

 

The key is to transfer what's in your mind onto the paper and see if it can become a reality in model form.

 

 

Can you elaborate on "All over the place" I prefer honest answers, I know it's practically impossible to get it "right first time" but I would like to start with the correct foundations.

 

The era I am going for is 1930's - 40's up to WW2, GWR of course, as my avatar implies.

 

The industry is thick runny and black, think "oil" and you will be somewhere near !

 

I have to admit that the BLT in the bottom right is based on a Hornby prototype layout configuration, the Station bottom left is just a larger version.

 

I'm starting to get my head round the "all around the walls idea".

 

In answer to others, I've endeavoured to search the interweb for idea's and information on how to build a layout, ( you tube is full of video's), but it all gets confusing, as there seems no set way to "start".

 

All advice is welcomed and absorbed.

 

Thanks for everything so far.

[skipepsi]

Planning is everything it avoids wasted time and money use a track design program others will suggest their favourite and if you use a PC you will soon be up and running. At 56 you don't want to duck under, the walk in gate type as seen on Big Jims thread looks good to me......  Plan to go all the way round and put bulges in the baseboards where you want stations yards etc..

[Graham Walters]

Planning is everything it avoids wasted time and money use a track design program others will suggest their favourite and if you use a PC you will soon be up and running. At 56 you don't want to duck under, the walk in gate type as seen on Big Jims thread looks good to me......  Plan to go all the way round and put bulges in the baseboards where you want stations yards etc..

 

A walk in gate sounds ideal, do you have a link to the thread please ?

[skipepsi]

A walk in gate sounds ideal, do you have a link to the thread please ?

full of helpful advice!

 

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69543-big-jims-new-build-shed-layout-now-with-running-trains/

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Hello Graham.

By "all over the place" I mean that whilst the first three plans have a common thread running through the designs, the fourth one seems to go off on a completely different tack - nothing wrong with that of course.

 

That's why I suggested you think carefully what you want from your layout.

[Kal]

Hi

 

Yes, i remember the feeling all to well. Just a few years ago, following an adhoc Christmas present from the wife of a train set, that sat in a box for 12 months, i decided to get it out and have a play.

I never had a train set as a child, never had any interest in railways, and so never expected to start the journey we are now both on; yes both, Jaz got the bug too!

 

I agree planning is best, but, we planned and planned around and around and eventually got... Well nowhere.

 

So i decided, i will just build the tables. And see how we go. About the same time we discovered copydex, a latex glue. So what?

 

Well it meant we could lay down track, get something going and while watching the trains go round, i could wait for inspiration. As it arrived the copydex made it easy to lift the track, change it to how i wanted and off we went again. Once i could visualise what i had, what could fit and what i enjoyed it evolved from there.

 

Not the best way i know, but for those of us that just cannot decide, until we see it running, it is an alternative.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[Mike Storey]

Hi

 

Yes, i remember the feeling all to well. Just a few years ago, following an adhoc Christmas present from the wife of a train set, that sat in a box for 12 months, i decided to get it out and have a play.

I never had a train set as a child, never had any interest in railways, and so never expected to start the journey we are now both on; yes both, Jaz got the bug too!

 

I agree planning is best, but, we planned and planned around and around and eventually got... Well nowhere.

 

So i decided, i will just build the tables. And see how we go. About the same time we discovered copydex, a latex glue. So what?

 

Well it meant we could lay down track, get something going and while watching the trains go round, i could wait for inspiration. As it arrived the copydex made it easy to lift the track, change it to how i wanted and off we went again. Once i could visualise what i had, what could fit and what i enjoyed it evolved from there.

 

Not the best way i know, but for those of us that just cannot decide, until we see it running, it is an alternative.

 

Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

I absolutely agree - as this is your first layout, you will have little idea what pleases you most until you get some track down. Few of us will ever have got it right first time, or indeed several times. Build the boards to suit your comfortable reach, try out a lifting hatch or swing gate, to solve the door problem, and get some track laid! CAD is fine for those that know broadly what they want to achieve, but you don't, not yet. You won't know until you have tried various combinations and run your trains "hands on". I would go for a design that allows a continuous run somehow, whether loops or full circuit, particularly for running in, but also because there will be days when you just want to sit back with a glass of something nice and watch a train......

[melmerby]

I have a 20' x 12' space and started with several sheets of A2 graph paper with ruler and compasses

I drew out what I wanted. 

Built the base boards (3' all the way round) and then found the track (Peco 00 code 75) wouldn't fit to the layout I had drawn without tortuous curves!

 

Got some cut-outs of the points made up and started again.

Laid out the paper points and lengths of track.

Started tracklaying based on this layout.

 

Once I had a basics the the layout I started running trains to see how it worked.

I kept adjusting the track layout to get better running opportunities.

I'm nearly there.

 

I now have a folded figure of eight roundy with a double track reverse loop and a double track branch to a terminus as well as a through station on the roundy bit

 

A train can run from the terminus down the "branch" on to main line, go round a few times, through the reverse loop, around a few times in the opposite direction and back up the branch to a different platform.

 

If several trains are running at once (DCC computer control) it looks quite impressive.

 

The moral is don't always stick with your first idea. It can grow and change as mine has as it is being built!

 

Keith

 

EDIT I have two lifting sections - one by the door with 2 x two track bridges and another in the middle on the reverse loop.

[Graham Walters]

Hello Graham.

By "all over the place" I mean that whilst the first three plans have a common thread running through the designs, the fourth one seems to go off on a completely different tack - nothing wrong with that of course.

 

That's why I suggested you think carefully what you want from your layout.

 

If everyone suggested the same thing life would be so much easier!

 

The consensus seems to be to go all the way around the walls, with a bridge of some kind to fill the gap, I can understand this, as it will give a lot more "pleasure" whilst the express is busy shuttling passengers to the seaside, I can be shunting and moving good around.

 

I also like the idea of the wider boards with the rails close to the aisle, this gives the advantage of being able to have decent scenes in the background.

[muddys-blues]

Hi Graham, welcome into the fray, If you want a round roundy layout, the lift out section doesn't have to be too elaborate, even as simple as 1 or 2 tracks, depending on your layout lines, you can have the lines disappearing into scenic breaks "tunnels, bridges etc" either side of the lift out section, make the lift out a square tubular bridge so it is lightweight but sturdy at the same time.

 

12' x 8' is a great size, but remember less is more sometimes, trying to cram a massive junction into that space soon eats up the footage available and you could end up with trainset curves.

 

Have fun, happy modelling

Craig.

[Sidecar Racer]

12' x 8' is a great size, but remember less is more sometimes, trying to cram a massive junction into that space soon eats up the footage available and you could end up with trainset curves.

 

 

 

 Doe's 30' by 10' sounds like acres of space to develop a large layout , I thought so until my mate and I stated

with our admittedly second hand purchase .

 

  Even with that length by the time you allow for station entry and exit scenery we can still only really have a six

coach platform length .

 

 It still has to look credible as a working railway system , so getting prototypical track formations and signal's

correctly located was important , luckily there is plenty of info and friendly advice available on this site , ask nicely

and many people will offer help , we have had plenty and could not have achieved what we have without it .

 

 Nice to see that you are Great Western and in the same era as us , we are using up to 1938/9 as are as our cutoff

point , but have stock that also enables us to run earlier .

 

 If you have some time to spare have a look at  the thread in my signature , you never know it might give you some ideas

and let you see that 'I can do that ' .

 

As a final reason for going all round , there is something about just watching trains roll around your hard work that makes

it all worthwhile .

[Graham Walters]

 

 If you have some time to spare have a look at  the thread in my signature , you never know it might give you some ideas

and let you see that 'I can do that ' .

 

As a final reason for going all round , there is something about just watching trains roll around your hard work that makes

it all worthwhile .

That is one heck of a project !

 

I've just spent the best part of an hour reading the thread, and looking at all the progress pics, I's shown me that less is indeed more, and just raising the track a little to form an embankment opens up a new realm of possibilites.

[Les1952]

I'm reading this from a slightly different perspective.  I agree wholeheartedly that to get satisfaction you need the facility to just watch trains go round- it is an excellent stimulus to thinking.  Aside from that after a couple of hours running an end-to-end line I lose the will to live......

 

Have you thought of N-gauge?   You can get a good main line in 10X3 giving you space to get to the back by going round then end......   Or is there a collection of stock already?

 

All the very best

Les