2mm 25 ton SR brake van

[Kris]

Hopefully over the next few weeks I will be using this topic to show the progress made on a variety of 2mm kits (some might be "n" but these will be converted to run on finescale track).

 

Although I've said this will run for a few weeks, I'm hoping that it won't be long, as the longer it runs the longer I haven't been working for.

[Kris]

1st kit.

 

B H Enterprises Bulleid coaches (SR8), these are 59ft brake corridor 3rds to dia 2121.

 

I bought these coaches about 10 to 15 years ago and built the composite in n gauge then forgot all about the other 2 coaches in the pack. The other day whilst rummaging around at my parents I came across these, and recovered them. When RMweb disappeared for the server upgrade the other day I thought that I would take the advantage to build these 2 coaches.

 

Opening up the packaging allowed me to assess what was present and what was lost. At first glance all appeared to be good. I knew that the bogies provided would be of no use to me but had a couple of sets of 2mm soc standard SR bogie etches to hand ( I must replace these on the off chance that the missing bits they were intended for ever get produced by the manufacturer).

As I looked through the kit and re read the instructions, it came back to me why I had not built these, no matter I would press on using the experience that I had gained in the time since purchase to see what I could do with them.

 

Step one - remove the paint I had previously added, it was the wrong colour scheme for me now. Easy.

Step two - Drill holes for, and fabricate door handles and rails, repaint as desired - no issues here.

Step three - Look at how the body shells are constructed, Ah here's where the problems start. If you build the kits as intended they seem to end up much to high, with the structural glazing units being taller than the etched sides, so at this point I ditched the instructions and started by adding the cast ends to the etched sides. Then I added the coach base, this is a generic piece that needs cutting to length.

Step four - Add the glazing units, these are generic so like the base need cutting to size. There is also a need to trim sections from the top and bottom of these to get the to fit satisfactorily.

Step five - The roof. I hate doing roofs. Again a generic roofing section that needs cutting to length, unfortunately the shape of this section is slightly different from the coach ends provided, so a bit a bodging is needed here. To add with the adding of vents, rain strips and other odds and ends found up there I next printed out a copy of the plans that are provided (having checked my reference sources these were close enough). Printing these out meant scanning and resizing as they were rather distorted (10mm+ to wide but the correct length) Once printed I stuck these to the roof sections. These will not be removed. I then drilled the holes for the vents and added these. The worst bit is still to come. Adding the rain strips. (So far I have not done these) I will be sticking these directly to the plan (hence leaving it stuck on) to hopefully get them right ish)

Step six - Whats going on underneath the body????? Only after I built up the first one did I realise what was wrong, it all was. The underframe that is provided bears no resemblance to what was provided on the real coaches, it even has to many supports (3 instead of 2). I still have not sorted out the first coach. The second coach I have bodged together an approximation, it's not perfect but it is much better that the provided items. The kit also does not provided enough V hangers, and I appear to be missing (I might have lost) the battery boxes and air tanks). Going back to the coach chassis, there should be a foot board running the length of the coach, this is missing and needs to be fabricated.

 

And that is roughly where I have got to at the moment (photos to follow later or tomorrow)

 

Thoughts so far

 

Parts of the kit are rather nice, the etches and the castings, the body shell concept just does not work for me though.

The kit appears to be slightly out of scale for both 2mm and n so the amount of work that will be put into resolving most of the other faults will be limited. Having gone this far it's now dawning on me that at some point I will have to purchase another coach from this range to complete the 3 coach set (I don't think that the composite is salvageable). This time though I may see if I can just get hold of the castings and etchings.

[Kris]

This is the starting point on the coaches for today.

 

 

 

This is the coach with the replacement underframe. Next job on here is to pop a little filler on the roof. This will wait until the other coach is at the same stage.

 

 

 

This coach still needs a replacement underframe. This will be scratch built using scrap etch material. The next job on this coach is to add a few passengers, then glue the roof on so that I can then get the filler going on both coaches.

 

 

 

Just a quick shot of both coaches together. Couplings on these coaches will be mixed. Southern coaches had drop head buckeye couplings. Given this I am going to be using dapols knuckle couplers between the vehicles. These couplers will not be used on the outer ends of the brakes. Here I will be using some form of screw coupling to allow attachment to locos and other stock.

[Kris]

2mm 3 link couplings

 

As a break to coach building (something to do whilst glue is drying) I thought that I would start to convert some of the couplings on my freight stock. I have decided that my freight stock will not be used for shunting purposes, so 3 link couplings are the way to go. Now this might be an admission that I have

1. to much time on my hands
2. need to get out more
3. exceptional eye sight
4. a need to find ways of making things difficult for myself

or any combination of the above....

 

To my knowledge there are a couple of options for this in 2mm - use the Mathieson Models version, or make your own. I decided to go for the latter of these options. I had already built several wagons with coupling hooks in place so all I needed to do was get some chain, and hey presto it's done. Getting the chain was the easy part this seemed to do the job and for less that the price of a pack of the ready made units I have enough chain for about 250 wagons (not that I have anywhere near this number). Adding the chain to the existing hooks does come under the heading of being rather fiddly, but once added looks ok, and will look even better when I get round to blackening the chain. There does appear to be a problem with attaching the wagons to locos though. The buffer shanks appear to be set to far out (or the hook is to far in) which is currently causing buffer lock and derailment on the curves of Avonwick. As a quick solution to this I may add a forth link to the loco's chain, this should be enough, thus solving the problem.

 

 

 

 

Note the buffers locking between the loco and 1st wagon.

 

So far I have only converted a couple of opens and the macaw, but this appears to prove the theory for the use of this type of coupling in 2mm, even if it's a right pain to couple the things up.

I will need to purchase some coupling hooks for several of my wagons as I don't appear to have added them and have binned the etches containing them (drat).

 

Right glue should be dry now, so back to coach roofs.

[Kris]

Right then back to those coaches and onwards.

 

The coaches have now had a coat of paint added to the areas that needed it. The under frame still needs to be sorted on one but this will have to wait until I build another coach to get some spare parts from the left overs of the next one. I will also be waiting until this point to sort out the under frame details. I can't say that I'm very happy with the results of these coaches but there we are.

 

 

So what next then?

 

I'm going back to wagons, and a Lowmac EK from a Masterclass models etch (now available via the 2mm soc). I don't have the self contained buffers that this should have, but I don't know who does these at this scale so will just use what I have.

 

Here we go then.

 

 

[Kris]

Just a quick update on the lowmac. Whilst it shouldn't be a particularly fiddly kit, I do appear to have had quite a ham fisted attempt at the axle boxes, the joys of laminating multiple etches!

 

So far I have made up the chassis, and when wheels are place in the thing, it appears to roll freely.

 

 

[Kris]

The lowmac is now ready for the paint shop, hopefully the undercoat should be done early this afternoon.

Generally this was a reasonable kit to build. In a couple of places the etchings had not completely cut through, but given the size of some of these pieces this was not a problem. Those areas with duff etching were very easily resolved. I also misread the instructions and completed the build in a different order to the suggested one, however in hindsight this was possibly the easier was of doing things.

There will be a slight hiatus in kit building as I appear to have run out of buffers so an order will have to be sent of tomorrow for some more. In the meantime I'll get on with some more scenic stuff on the layout.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This last one is a little out of focus, I should have checked the photo before removing the wheel sets for painting and taken another one.

[Etched Pixels]

To my knowledge there are a couple of options for this in 2mm - use the Mathieson Models version, or make your own

 

There are also the MFK couplings some of the 1:160 Nfine people have - etched in stainless steel so they can be operated with a big magnet. Not tried them but some day I must have a fiddle

[Kris]

There are also the MFK couplings some of the 1:160 Nfine people have - etched in stainless steel so they can be operated with a big magnet. Not tried them but some day I must have a fiddle

 

Thanks for that suggestion. Ben A suggested those to me on another post so I had a look at them. To me they appear to be a good idea. Unfortunately the design looked wrong for the UK. Once I get a little money coming in I might look at getting some etched using a similar system but with a UK profile coupling. For the 3 links adding a steel link at the end would work (well in theory anyhow). This would certainly come under the heading of fiddly.

 

 

 

 

[Kris]

Right onwards again

 

Over the last couple of days I have mainly been building a van and some bogies. The bogies will follow later.

 

I seem to have a reasonable number of open wagons but very few vans so with my last order to the 2mm soc I ordered a couple of BR standard vans to see how they compared with the rather nice Farish offerings.

 

Apart from the fact that my Bauxite paint seems to have gone a little gloopy all seems good with the van that I have built so far. I still need to add some vacuum pipes and a couple of data panels, along with the transfers (haven't got those) but I'm reasonably please with the results.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The final photo shows the new van next to a Farish van. There is a slight difference in size as would be expected given that they are to fractionally different scales, but I don't think that it is overly noticeable. The Farish van has got replacement 2mm wheel sets in it.

Apologies that the colours are a little off. The room I was taking the photos in is dire for this.

[BernardTPM]

While there will be about 1mm difference in length, the difference in width will only be about 0.5mm as the latest Farish vans are to the scale width; a lot of earlier N Gauge vans RTR and kit were slightly overscale width, though the very old W&K BR(LMR) van was correct.

[Kris]

The length difference sounds about what I have found.

[Kris]

Right now, on to those bogies I mentioned earlier. Over the past few days I have been "talking" to Steve in his Smokey Bacon thread about his rather nicely developing Calne Layout. During this the subject of the coaches that he would be needing came up, several B Sets and how he would need to be rewheeling them. Previously in my Blog I have talked about how I have done this for one coach of a Dapol B Set and Steve's comments prompted me to get off my bottom and crack on with the other coach.

 

I have chosen to model these as dia 147 coaches. These ran with 9ft plate bogies rather than the 7ft examples found on earlier dia's. The reason for the choice of bogie comes down to what was in stock when I purchased them.

 

I have only touched the bogies at this point. I am aware that there are other modifications that I need to make to fully enhance the coach.

 

Below are photos showing what I did for the construction. Most should speak for themselves. I very much followed the 2mm socs general instructions for these bogies, but do find that once I have soldered the axle covers on and removed the etch frame then it is a good idea to run some more solder around the edges of the axle boxes to reinforce them and give a smother finish.

 

 

 

The starting point showing the etches, coach and tools that I would be using. I hide the hammer in case of frustration

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Etched frames all completed and just need folding up now.

 

 

 

 

 

It is only after this point that I enlarged the holes in the new bogies to accept the old bogie securing pin. I wanted to use this pin as it gives me the option of easily returning the "n" gauge bogies to the coach should I want to do this in the future. The holes were simply reamed out to 2.5mm. I reamed the bogie securing boxes whilst still on the etch as when I had previously tried this not on the etch I succeeded in pushing the sharp edges of the etch into my fingers, ouch

 

 

 

The new bogies and the original Dapol bogie.

[Kris]

And continue as the last post would not let me add all the images I wanted to??? Hey Ho

 

 

 

 

These last couple of images just show the new bogie temporally attached to the coach before removal and painting (the first coat is drying as I type).

 

As supplied these bogies come with stretcher bars. These are easy to remove.

 

Something that I did notice looking at various images of these coaches before doing this was that there did appear to be a couple of photos of them on a different type of bogie (not a plate one) so I will have to be careful when I renumber these.

[SteveBedding]

Kris

 

Thanks for posting this clear and concise summary, it most certainly is an improvement and looks very straight forward and relatively simple (...of course it's best to avoid the "ouch's"...). I've made a couple of the 5'6" LMS Diamond Frame bogies before so I'm quite happy with the level of complexity and this has shown how easy it is to 're-use' the existing pivot/mounting point.

 

This has spurred me to crack on with another 'diversion' and I'll watch the further developments with interest...

[Kris]

No problems Steve. Looking at the pictures that I popped up I have also remembered 1 other thing that I did not add. On one part of the side etches there is a small step (at each end). When soldered to the next part of the frame this then attaches to the larger main end step. The small step does nothing and in this case is not needed, in fact it becomes a pain when you try and fold the main step. Best to remove the small step I feel. I forgot to do this as can be seen in this picture.

 

 

[Kris]

I fiddled a little bit more with the original B Set coach that I had changed the bogies on as I had never been totally happy with it, the coach could at times pick up a rather lopsided "drunken" look. Looking at the bogie in comparison to the new ones (shown above) I noticed that I had not placed the second spacing box onto the base of the bogie. As the etched bogie is much thinner than the original plastic Dapol one it needs this second spacer box to ensure that there is not to much slack on the pin. If this slack is present the coach can gain the lopsided drunken look, adding the box stops this.

[SteveBedding]

...As the etched bogie is much thinner than the original plastic Dapol one it needs this second spacer box to ensure that there is not to much slack on the pin. If this slack is present the coach can gain the lopsided drunken look, adding the box stops this.

 

Very useful tip there Kris

[Kris]

Over the past few days I have been building some Masterclass models Toplight coaches. At the moment I'm waiting on buffers, bolts and top hat bearings to allow me to complete these. The buffers have been on order for a while now so until these turn up the underframes will remain unpainted.

 

I have built a mix of 57ft and 70ft coaches.

 

 

The 57 footers

 

 

The 70 footers

 

As I have been building these the swear box has been filling up, but this afternoon has become a struggle and a chore getting the last underframe for a 57 footer completed. Given this I will clean up the work that I have done so far over the next day or so and leave the soldering iron alone for a few days until I have become less frustrated.

 

All of these coaches are corridor stock, I just haven't attached the corridor connectors yet. They turned up today, once again good fast service from Ultima.

I have further examples to build but at the moment this will most likely provide me with more than enough coaching stock for Avonwick to be going on with.

These coaches will be finished in crimson and cream to represent them at the very end of their working lives. I have worked out some of the running numbers, but not all. There are photos of 57ft Toplights in this livery on the Kingsbridge line so I'm not stretching things to far, the 70 footers however. Well modellers licence, they'll make a change from the stock running on the majority of 2mm / n gauge layouts.

[nick_bastable]

Kris whose roofs are you going to use ?

[Kris]

Kris whose roofs are you going to use ?

 

 

I'm going to use the roofs that came with these. They appear to fit nicely, at least they do on the coach I built a few months ago.

 

 

[SteveBedding]

Looking very nice as expected - though I suspect they'd look better in brown & cream rather than the maroon I anticipate you'll choose Seriously, they look very tasty - must put some on on my wish list...

[Kris]

I agree that they would look nice in brown and cream, but wrong period, never mind.

[bcnPete]

coaches without bogies?...and you were questioning my 7mm brass locos running on paper track

 

Seriously nice work Kris - perhaps when you get said bogies you can do a close up shot of each coach - they do look like nice etches.

[Kris]

I know that the missing parts for the bogies are on their way, so once they arrive I should be able to build up some of them and get the coaches rolling. Hopefully the bolts will be one their way as well so I can hold the coaches together.

 

On another note I have been trying out a different type of glue for holding windows in. So far so good apart from the fact that it does not do much for the paint.