Hunslet 0-4-0T kit-build

[Ruston]

This arrived in the post, today.

 

Photo unavailable due to the pirates at Photobucket

 

Pictures of the contents to follow. The build will commence once I've cleared the workbench of a quartet of 1/72 scale 1930s RAF fighter biplanes.

 

It's been a long time since I built a metal kit... Fire up the soldering iron!

Edited July 25, 2017 by Ruston

[Arthur]

 

Go Dave, Go!

 

7mm I presume? Not a prototype that I'm familiar with so I'll follow with interest.

[Kenton]

 

7mm I presume?

Also available in 4mm

 

Another observer here ... though you will need a couple of days to read and digest the instructions ... it is an Agenoria kit

[peter220950]

 Also available in 4mm

 

Another observer here ... though you will need a couple of days to read and digest the instructions ... it is an Agenoria kit

 

 

This is one of the later Agenoria (Mike Williams) kits, so it might be a bit more of a challenge than the original Peter Stamper kits, I shall be watching with interest as it's the same as Cadbury No 9,

 

There's a Railway Modeller 4mm drawing published, if you haven't a copy I can dig it out for you. Look forward to seeing it develop, I've a scratchbuild that's half started somewhere in the box of 'loco's to finish'.

 

Are you modelling any specific loco?

 

Peter

[Arthur]

 

Not sure it's available in 4mm, at least yet, as it's only just appeared in the 7mm range. Agenoria did do both scales but a few years back the 4mm range was split off to CSP models and they don't show this model at the moment.

 

Could be wrong which is why I 'presumed' it to be 7mm,

[Ruston]

It is 7mm and my build is of no specific prototype.

 

Here's the contents of the box:

 

Photo unavailable due to the pirates at Photobucket

 

 

Edited July 25, 2017 by Ruston

[Marshall5]

Go Dave, Go!

 

7mm I presume? Not a prototype that I'm familiar with so I'll follow with interest.

It looks as if the kit is based on Hunslet works no.1684 of 1931 which worked at Kilmersdon Colliery up to the mid 60's.  It was first preserved at the long closed Bleadon & Uphill station museum but is now in derelict condition at the Middleton Railway.

Ray.

[Arthur]

 

This is what Agenoria say about it;

 

 

Hunslet 0-4-0T.

Reference : AM50

Prototype :

No Picture

No Picture

Options :

 

Available soon

email or phone us for availability.

Prices without Postage :-

Basic Kit:

Complete Kit: £320.00

Detailed Description

As a result of producing kit [AM/43] it was my intension to produce the Cadbury version of this Avonside 0-4-0T. However as it turned out the Cadbury avonside is totally different to the 1101 Avonside. In fact it was this prototype that was closer, the chassis is almost identical to that of the 1101. As such with a few modififications, this kit is well underway in production.A few more castings need to be made and a slight alteration to the etch and this kit is very close to complete. I will however finish off the others in the range before I concentrate on this kit. Although done as part of the Cadbury range of loco's [N0 9]this Hunslet will do any small layout. Capable of negotiating 12" rad curves. The kit will be in all nickel silver etch with all brass castings. Kit will be available complete.

 

Make of that what you will.

 

Here's the relevant web page, scroll down,this kit is near the end.

 

http://www.agenoria0gauge.com/7mm_Kits.php

[PGH]

Presumably the kit is based on Cadbury No.9 as that is etched into the kit - first photo post #7

 

Both 4mm and 7mm drawings of Cadbury No.9 were included in the Railway Modeller article of November 1965 by Don Townsley.  The same drawing appears on page 38 of the book "The Railways of Cadburys and Bourneville" (Bournebrook Publications 2002) with rather crudely applied Cadbury lettering.

 

According to Don Townsley in his history of the Hunslet Engine Works (Plateway Press 1998), in the early 1920s Hunslet introduced a range of inside cylinder standard gauge industrial locomotives that were easy to build and simple to operate, all 0-6-0STs with one exception.  At the same time they also developed a range of  outside cylinder locomotives with Walschaerts valve gear which were available in 0-6-0 or 0-4-0 and side or saddle tank versions.  These were more expensive than the inside cylinder locos (for the equivalent size locomotive) but easier to maintain.  Needless to say most customers went for the cheaper inside cylinder locomotives.

 

As far as I can determine, from this range of designs Hunslet built only 5 standard gauge 0-4-0Ts with outside cylinders and Walchaerts valve gear for use in the UK - 3 x 16" cylinder locos, 1 x 14" cylinder loco and 1 x 12" cylinder loco.

 

The 16" locos were:

Hunslet 1488 of  1925  WEST RIDING  supplied new to Pope & Pearson Ltd, West Riding Colliery, Normanton;  Scrapped by the NCB in 1965

 

Hunslet 1557 of 1927  JESSIE  supplied new to Tyldesley Coal Co. Ltd., Cleworth Hall Colliery, Lancashire;  It remained at Cleworth Hall apart from visits to Gin or Walkden Yard for repairs until rail traffic ceased there in 1961, then it was stored at Walkden Yard until sold for scrap early in 1967.

 

Hunslet 3665 of 1949  No.9  supplied new to Cadbury Bros Ltd., Bournville;  Scrapped in 1966

 

The 14" loco:

Hunslet 1509 of 1926  supplied new to Bradford Corporation Gas Department, Birksall Gas Works, Bradford;  Scrapped c1958

 

The 12" loco:

Hunslet 1684 of 1931  supplied new to Hall & Co, Coulsdon Quarry, Redhill, Surrey; later NCB Kilmersdon Colliery and since preserved.

 

There is a considerable difference between the 16" cylinder locos and the 12" cylinder 1684.  The former have 3'- 9" wheels and weigh 34½ tons in working order, the latter has 3'- 4" wheels and weighs only 23½ tons.

 

The 16" cylinder locos were fairly heavy and powerful for 0-4-0s.  An NCB report on Manchester Area locos at vesting date noted that HE 1557 JESSIE had "high axle loading" and was "not very suitable".

Edited November 19, 2015 by PGH

[Arthur]

 

Never rely on memory. Jessie was the first prototype I thought of but couldn't recall it having those deep cutaways under the side tanks. A quick Google search found a photo proving the fact.

 

Thanks PGH.

[Ruston]

I've made a start. Pictures to follow later. I've been warned that there are problems with this kit and I've already run into two straight away...

[Ruston]

Since my last post about this I was contacted by a modeller who has already built one of these kits and he went through the problems and innacuracies. The list is rather large, including a boiler that is too long, cylinders that are too wide and, that if made up as out of the kit, the valve gear would not work! After I encountered the initial problems I put the thing away in its box.

 

I have never built anything with outside valve gear but I was going to have a go until all the problems emerged and I decided that if I was ever going to build outside valve gear it's best that I learn on something that will work, so I ended coming to an agreement to pay someone to build for me. It will have the rods and frame painted and the bodywork primed but I will do the final painting and weathering myself and will fit DCC and sound.

 

It is being built with an open backed cab, as per 1488 WEST RIDING.

 

Photos unavailable due to the pirates at Photobucket

Edited July 25, 2017 by Ruston

[Osgood]

Since my last post about this I was contacted by a modeller who has already built one of these kits and he went through the problems and innacuracies. The list is rather large, including a boiler that is too long, cylinders that are too wide and, that if made up as out of the kit, the valve gear would not work! After I encountered the initial problems I put the thing away in its box.

…….

 

 

 

Dave - I have one of these kits currently helping to fill a cupboard of unopened boxes, but on the basis that at some stage I'd like to have a go at it, I would be very interested to learn more about what pitfalls might await me.

 

Is there any way I can achieve enlightenment?

 

Tony

Edited December 5, 2016 by Osgood

[ian@stenochs]

Hi Tony,

 

Treat it as an aid to scratchbuilding! I have built and enjoyed the experience of many of the original, Pete Stamper designed, Agenoria kits. All went together easily and built an accurate model. However I won't consider any of the later, Mike Williams, designs despite the fact that some are on my wants list. Far better to start from scratch and save the cash!

 

This is my WPR pug before weathering!

 

 

Ian.

[Guest Isambarduk]

"Treat it as an aid to scratchbuilding!"

 

Sage advice, in my view, when it comes to tackling any kit but particularly some early examples and not a few of more recent origin.  And, yes, in a good number of cases, it is less work, less trauma and more satisfaction to build from scratch with perhaps some proprietary castings, wheels (if you're fortunate) motor and gearbox. 

 

David

[Ruston]

Dave - I have one of these kits currently helping to fill a cupboard of unopened boxes, but on the basis that at some stage I'd like to have a go at it, I would be very interested to learn more about what pitfalls might await me.

 

Is there any way I can achieve enlightenment?

 

Tony

Hi Tony,

 

I can't remember all of the problems as they were told in person and not all written down in any form but in addition to those I have mentioned there is the fact that if you build it according to the instructions the smokebox will not line up with the cylinders. I'll ask for you but I'm not going to identify the  chap who is building this for me as he doesn't usually build for other people. If he's reading this he may contact you through this forum but I'll leave that to him.

 

Make sure you have been provided with the correct wheels too! I was given 3ft. 6in dia wheels, as was the kit of the chap that is building it for me. They should be 3ft. 9in (10-spoke as shown in the pictures).

 

When you open the box on this kit it looks as if you're getting a lot for your money but a lot of the etches are surplus, as are a lot of the castings. Another thing that put me off was the state of the lost wax brass castings. Bent piston rods and the things the valve rods should slide in were rough and there was no chance of the rod sliding in them at all. Have you tried drilling that stuff? It's very hard - another reason why I am not building it myself!

[Ruston]

For Osgood and anyone else who may be interested:

 

Hi Dave

List as requested

1       Buffer beams parts 37 & 38 not long enough to go width of the footplate

2        Cylinders too wide

3        Cast slidebars need replacing with scratch built ones

4         Cross head needs thinning by approximately  50%

5         cylinder end  106 and piston rod centreline needs moving out from the frame

6         Valve guide 102 needs moving outwards

7        Only one valve 104 is suitable the one shown in Dia 4 which although wrong for this prototype is how the valve gear has to be assembled without    a       disproportional  amount of extra work to the appearance of the finished engine

8        Rod 32 is either to fragile or will be over etched  and will need modifying

9       The instructions as to how the rod 32 is fitted to the valve don't work

10      I found the best way to get the chassis to work without the body on was to leave the pin in the middle of rod 32 overlong so it could provide
support by running on the top of the modified slidebars

11      not enough room for brakes between the cylinder end an front wheel and how do you use the lost wax castings supplied

12       How do you use the cylinder drain castings

13       Boiler is over length

14       Smoke box door is inset into the smoke box front whereas it should sit proud on a sealing ring

15       chimney and dome bear little resemblance to the prototype  3D. Printed ones are available from Modelu

16       Tank filler bears no resemblance to Hunslet ones

17       Lifting link part 34 very little in the instructions as to how to fit it   scratch built brackets required

18       Hole in footplate for part 28 to go through is in the wrong place

19       Tank tops are not flush with top of tanks on prototype

2 0       Guard irons wrong length

21       No real details of original sanding gear to smoke box mounted  sand boxes  there are some vague drawings

22       Back head  bears  little resemblance to a Hunslet back head

23       motion bracket needs modification

24       Hand brake not correct style for locomotive

 

25        Not enough overhang on cab roof

Suggest that before commencing building get a copy of the drawing that appeared in Novembers 1965 Railway Modeller

There may be more I just work them out as I come across them

These are my personal views and of course might not be shared by everyone People understandably get very protective of kits they have designed and I never slag them off given that I could not design one

 

[Osgood]

That is most helpful, Dave - much appreciated!

 

Tony

[ian@stenochs]

Hi Ruston,

If you found 25 "issues" with a kit for a small 0-4-0 tank one would seriously question whether the designer ever did a test build.

Ian.

[Ruston]

Hi Ruston,

If you found 25 "issues" with a kit for a small 0-4-0 tank one would seriously question whether the designer ever did a test build.

Ian.

The designer had one non-powered and obviously non-running one built up and on display but on close inspection it appeared that the valve gear didn't actually work.

 

It doesn't matter now anyway as I understand that he no longer produces kits in 7mm. I guess that means that not many of this kit will have been sold and even fewer will have been built, so my loco could be something of a rarity.

 

Built up and ready for the paint shop.

 

 

I collected it on Saturday and saw it run on the builder's own layout. I can't run it on mine until it is fitted with DCC but I can finish painting it. I have been provided with colour photos of West Riding and, in service, it was painted a sort of Brunswick Green, with black and white lining, so that's what the model will be given. Actual works photo http://www.dmm.org.uk/pitwork/2006/wr_7.jpg

 

Thanks very much for building it - you know who you are - and with all the chatting I think I may have forgotten to thank you at the time.

Edited July 25, 2017 by Ruston

[Ruston]

I have finally painted and lined it. DCC with sound and a "stay alive" has been fitted and the motion has recieved some weathering. It is now awaiting name and works plates before weathering the upperworks. I have decided not to name it WEST RIDING and it will now join several of my other locos in being named after a Royal Navy admiral.

 

 

Whilst playing with it I have been using a new gadget - a magnetic shunters pole from Marsh Lane Models - http://www.marshlanemodels.co.uk/

 

Please note:- I have had to edit the topic and in doing so remove some posts because they no longer made any sense at all after the edits and the loss of the earlier photos.

Edited July 25, 2017 by Ruston

[Osgood]

Turned out nice!

 

How do you find the magnetic pole?  Looking forward to trying mine.

The ideal would be I guess an 'electromagnet' version which would, upon release of a button, drop the link neatly on the hook!

[Ruston]

Turned out nice!

 

How do you find the magnetic pole?  Looking forward to trying mine.

The ideal would be I guess an 'electromagnet' version which would, upon release of a button, drop the link neatly on the hook!

The pole works well. I had one of the early versions and it wasn't so good but on the new one the magnet is smaller, the "shielding" seems to work better and the brass wire is of a thicker gauge and so doesn't waggle about so much. An electro-magnetic pole would be excellent! Anyone for creating such a  thing?

[Guest Isambarduk]

The pole works well. ... An electro-magnetic pole would be excellent! Anyone for creating such a  thing?

 

I am pleased to hear that your 'production' version of the pole worked well for you.  Yes, an electromagnetic version would be a great idea but, with current technology, I believe that the business end would be a bit chunky compared to the powerful permanent magnet and shield, but I would be very happy to discover otherwise.  That said, I do not find it difficult to let go of the lower link once it is on the hook - just push the pole down, the link stays on the hook and the pole is free to move away (with out picking up the lower link again).

 

David

[5050]

I've been using magnetic uncoupling for 3-links for years on Enigma Engineering - in 4mm.  I fit a soft iron wire bottom link only and use an old curved tapered fine riffler file, lightly magnetised by rubbing on a magnet.  The link is picked up on the tip of the file, placed over the hook and the file 'wiped' away downwards.  Works every time.

 

For me at any rate.  New operators soon pick the technique up.

 

Don't they Dave.

 

BTW - the loco looks great.  I'd like a 4mm one sometime.

Edited July 26, 2017 by 5050