RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 13, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 13, 2017 (edited) I started work on this project at the suggestion of Tim Shackleton who had told me that the diagram 1/148 HUO coal hopper has never been available ready to run which is surprising as there were so many of them built albeit to slightly different diagram numbers but apart from the early batches and the diagram 1/153 version the only significant differences were the types of buffers and axle boxes which were fitted. These wagons were the forerunners of the 'Merry Go Round' coal hoppers. The chart below shows the sequence of the builds of these wagons by the year of build. The different brake types started with a form of LNER clasp style shoes on each wheel and no ‘Tie bar’ between the axle guards with a centrally positioned V hanger for the lever. This was followed by the most common configuration which was a type with just one shoe per wheel with an offset V hanger and a tie bar between the axle guards. The final type, unique to diagram 153 had a disc type brake fitted to the Right hand wheel on each side of the wagon. This version was short lived and in most cases the brake was disconnected and the vehicle subsequently classed as unfitted, these wagons had been originally classed as ‘vacuum fitted’ whereas all the other ‘Lots’ were built as unfitted wagons. Axle boxes and buffers were often changed as the wagons aged, the list shows the types of equipment fitted ‘as built’ as much as I have been able to ascertain but I can’t guarantee this information is 100% correct. The diagram 153 and 155 wagons had 16” buffer heads, all the others had 13” buffer heads. Year Lot no. B33xxxx no. Qty built Diagram Brakes Buffers Axlebox vac pipe 1954 2609 3002 - 3499 498 148 Clasp Spindle Oil No 1958 3121 3500 - 3699 200 148 Single Various Roller No 1959 3221 3700 - 4849 1150 148 Single Self cont'd Roller No 1960 3315 5595 - 5694 100 153 disc Oleo Roller Yes 1960 3314 4850 - 5594 745 148 Single Spindle Roller No 1960 3374 5695 - 6234 540 148 Single Self cont'd Roller No 1962 3425 6235 - 6384 150 153 disc Oleo Roller Yes 1962 3426 6385 - 6932 548 154 Single Self cont'd Roller No 1962 3437 6933 - 7175 243 148 Single Various Roller No 1963 3466 7176 - 7753 576 155 Single Self cont'd Roller No 1964 3526 8163 - 8262 100 155 Single Hydraulic Roller No 1965 3525 7754 - 8162 409 155 Single Hydraulic Roller No Lot 3525 were built at Pressed Steel, all other production batches were built at Shildon I've had a couple of test etches made and as usual the very first one ended up in the scrap metal box but the second one came out quite well. I found the most difficult part was assembling and fitting the side stanchions. On the real wagon these are of pressed steel construction which isn't easy to replicate in an etch. I ended up making it from three layers which fold up to form the front face and another etch to form the foot which sits above the solebar. I have modified the etch significantly on the one I am building now but haven't quite got to that stage of the build yet. I decided to have two etches made, one in brass and one in nickel silver and I'm currently building the nickel silver one. It is much nicer to work with than the brass version but unfortunately that puts the cost of the etch up by nearly 40% over the brass one. Here are a few photos of the build so far. This is the basic shell of the hopper. This is the basic chassis with the ends added and a couple of small gussets which strengthen the end supports. Most of the wagons had spindle buffers when built but these were often changed to self contained types. I decided to fit the 51L models version to this wagon but found out afterwards the correct buffer should be the LMS models (Dave Franks) B018 self contained buffer so I shall have to order some of those for later. This shows the actuator links for the hopper doors at the end of the wagon. The NEM pocket can be left off if it isn't needed and the linkage then becomes more visible. The chute covers will be the next thing to go on, they should (if I've got the dimensions correct) cover the open space which can be seen on the hopper where the chutes are situated. So far everything has fitted together well, the challenge is the chute covers and side stanchions. I'll post a few more photos when I have got those parts assembled. Ian Edited March 13, 2017 by macgeordie 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 (edited) Is this model in 4mm? Whatever the scale it is mightily impressive. I started some plasticard based ones about 3 years ago which are on this thread: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/66197-br-245-ton-hopper-huo/ At the moment I haven't the time to trim all the supporting braces to width for mine and work out how to build the internal hopper chutes (other projects have far greater priority). Whilst an etched brass model will take me a while to build if these do become available then they will be a lot easier to finish than my scratchbuilt ones. I noticed that you chose the earlier style (1/148) body. I don't know whether you have thought about the later 1/155 body where the vertical section was the same height on all four sides. Regardless, I look forward to any developments regarding these wagons. Edited March 13, 2017 by Flood Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Ks did a cast kit- unfortunately, it was based on the first wagon to be built, which was significantly different to all the others. The underframes of quite a number of these wagons were re-used to build 21t MDOs in the late 1970s/early 1980s. This does look to be a very fine model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 (edited) I noticed that you chose the earlier style (1/148) body. I don't know whether you have thought about the later 1/155 body where the vertical section was the same height on all four sides. I am confused !! The models in the photo have ".....the vertical section ... the same height on all four sides". The first wagon to 1/148 - as modelled by Keysers - did not have ".....the vertical section ... the same height on all four sides", but I believe that all subsequent wagons, to all diagrams, did have ".....the vertical section ... the same height on all four sides". That may not be reflected in the official BR diagrams - but that means nothing !! Regards, John Isherwood. Edited March 13, 2017 by cctransuk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted March 13, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 13, 2017 Ian, you might have given me a chance to make inroads on the coke hoppers first! Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 (edited) John You've confused me. Ks represented the first 2 wagons with the vertical end shallower than the side. Then the common diag 148 with vertical end deeper than the sides. Followed by diag 158 which had the vertical of sides and ends all the same depths. The OP doesn't mention this fundamental difference. Paul http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brhopperhuo Edited March 13, 2017 by hmrspaul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 John You've confused me. Ks represented the first 2 wagons with the vertical end shallower than the side. Then the common diag 148 with vertical end deeperr than the sides. Followed by diag 158 which had the vertical of sides and ends all the same depths. The OP doesn't mention this fundamental difference. Paul http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brhopperhuo Paul, Quite right - that'll teach me to rely on (an increasingly flawed) memory !! I can only plead that it must be at least thirty years since I converted a Keyser's kit into a 1/148 - and I don't think that I've had cause to check the history of the 24.5T hoppers since ! Regards, John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted March 13, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 13, 2017 And of course DJM has discussed producing these as RTR in 4mm and 2mm but no mention of which diagram http://djmodels.co.uk/?p=470 No updates on this for a while though. Beautiful modelling macgeordie, I'm pretty certain these beasts were used on South Wales-Avonmouth Coke flows as well as Coke hoppers in the 1970s, so very interested in the prototype and their modelling. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iak Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Heavens mercy dancing hamsters..... Yet more etched naughtiness Ian, I had forgotten that you might do these beasties. A thing to remember for some is that Nickel Silver is a no no for some poor souls. The allergy is not nice, I was diagnosed the back end of last year. Nickel Silver is great to work with agreed mind, in spite of cost and allergies. Methinks the savings jar needs digging out again...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 And of course DJM has discussed producing these as RTR in 4mm and 2mm but no mention of which diagram http://djmodels.co.uk/?p=470 No updates on this for a while though. Beautiful modelling macgeordie, I'm pretty certain these beasts were used on South Wales-Avonmouth Coke flows as well as Coke hoppers in the 1970s, so very interested in the prototype and their modelling. Neil Yes a pity that a company claimed them and then seems to have lost interest. They replaced the COKES in South Wales as the latter rotted away. And some had extended lives at Onllwyn and Bolsover in their internal user fleets Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 13, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 13, 2017 Hi Gents Thanks for the positive comments. The sides of the wagon are a different height to the ends as per the BR diagram, it is a bit more obvious in this close up the corner. Iain, if you want some of these I can get them done in brass for you instead of nickel silver. I never realised that anybody could have an allergy to it. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iak Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Thanks Ian. Let's see how things go. We can discuss nearer your making them available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 From the shades of Gray folder. https://flic.kr/p/fdaYzY P 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 13, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 13, 2017 From the shades of Gray folder. https://flic.kr/p/fdaYzY P That's an interesting photo Paul, I haven't seen that one before. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 14, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 14, 2017 I got the hopper chute covers and the end stanchions fitted today, and fortunately everything fitted as it should. This is the chute covers in place. and the end stanchions. With a bit of luck I'll get a bit more done tomorrow. Ian 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizard of the Moor Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Some even made it down the Waterloo branch in Aberdeen. https://flic.kr/p/5KkPMm Lovely work, Ian. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 14, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 14, 2017 Some even made it down the Waterloo branch in Aberdeen. https://flic.kr/p/5KkPMm Lovely work, Ian. Blimey, I knew they got around a bit but I didn't think they got as far as Aberdeen !!! Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 Some even made it down the Waterloo branch in Aberdeen. https://flic.kr/p/5KkPMm Lovely work, Ian. Alas this is a XX rather than a 24.5! Mark Saunders Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 14, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 14, 2017 Alas this is a XX rather than a 24.5! Mark Saunders What is an XX ? Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 What is an XX ? Ian The use of Roman numerals for Hopper wagon capacity on the LNER hence XX for twenty ton hoppers (uprated to 21ton in 1939 and 21.5 tonne under metrication). Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 15, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 15, 2017 I made a start on the two types of 'central position' side stanchions today and although they went together, I had to do a lot of filing and fiddling with them to get them to look right. I wouldn't be happy sending etches like that out to anybody so I'll modify the drawing and get another test etch done first. I still have the main side stanchions to assemble as well, I should be able to make a start on those tomorrow. Here are a couple of photos of the two different types of side stanchion I have provided on the etch. There were one or two other variants, but not on the diagram 1/148 wagon which is the subject of this project. There was a 'one off' with a weird square cut out type of side stanchion which I think was done to test unloading equipment at a power station for a 'Merry go Round' train, I seem to remember reading about it in David Monk Steels book about Merry Go Round trains. The stanchions aren't soldered to the wagon yet, I just sat them in position for the photos. Ian 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad McCann Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 You've really got my attention with this one, Ian! Significant wagon for Central Scotland, particularly the eastern side where they were used on the Kincardine traffic in particular. Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted March 15, 2017 Share Posted March 15, 2017 There was a 'one off' with a weird square cut out type of side stanchion which I think was done to test unloading equipment at a power station for a 'Merry go Round' train, I seem to remember reading about it in David Monk Steels book about Merry Go Round trains. This is the modified one, although the experiment has been removed. http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brhopperhuo/e10d0af83 Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 16, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 16, 2017 The use of Roman numerals for Hopper wagon capacity on the LNER hence XX for twenty ton hoppers (uprated to 21ton in 1939 and 21.5 tonne under metrication). Mark Thanks for the info Mark. I'm not really very well up on LNER stuff even though I am a Geordie. My main area of interest is LMS and BR stuff (principally wagons but you'd never guess from my project list !!!) up to about 1970. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium macgeordie Posted March 16, 2017 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted March 16, 2017 This is the modified one, although the experiment has been removed. http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brhopperhuo/e10d0af83 Paul Hi Paul, yes that is the photo I have seen before, interestingly it is one of the diagram 153 wagons which had the unusual disc brake on the right hand wheel. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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