BenL

Good question Robin. From memory, I think the GWRJ article on wartime and post war GW liveries says that plain black was introduced in Feb '42 so presumably Halls built in the early war years prior to this would have been in lined green with shirtbutton.

Talking of your vegetation Robin, what have you used for the hedging along the back of the goods yard, running behind the yard offices? It looks very effective.

That's interesting - have they confirmed that to you? Great if so as the general consensus seems to be no Collett Halls received GWR lined green postwar, despite the Swindon directive in mid '47 that they should. Will definitely be in the market for one now.

Hi there, I'm looking for one of the above to spray black to go with my Hornby Derwent Grange in order to create Beenham Grange in her 1947 condition, ie GWR wartime black with the above tender. I'm happy to offer Derwent's original intermediate tender (which is in excellent, complete condition) as part of any deal should you have one of the above available. Many thanks in advance for any help anyone is able to provide, Ben

Thanks very much Mike, as someone modelling mid-Cornwall in 1947, this is very helpful indeed. Are there no goods workings beginning and/or ending at Truro? And thanks to St Endoc for this great thread on your layout, which I've very much enjoyed following the development of. Cheers, Ben

These do look fantastic - trying to think of an excuse to get the one loaned to the GWR for my 1947 mid-Cornwall layout! Does anyone know if military hardware was still returning from the Continent in 1947 and might have come through Falmouth? And were Warwells used for civilian vehicles at this time, the likes of traction engines for eg? Any thoughts much appreciated!

What grey do you use on those white rooves Robin? It looks good

Having bought a few of these a while ago and having yet to install them, please could someone pass on the new power and wiring instructions Dapol have reportedly issued? I've had a look on the Dapol website but can't find them. Many thanks in advance for any guidance anyone is able to provide.

Thanks Robin. On comparing the green with my Tintagel Castle, I noticed that it doesn't have a front coupling hook either! Maybe this is a long-standing Hornby oversight. As you hinted previously, the Knight's green is not quite as rich or deep as Tintagel's, and is more of a greyer, matt finish. But it looks pretty good and certainly not as insipid as the green on the Hornby GWR Kings I've seen in the shops and had been avoiding in anticipation of the now indefinitely delayed Hatton's version. I think the lining on the Knight is superb, even by Hornby's excellent standards in this area. Just a bit frustrating that the very noticeable route/power disk is not immediately above the number plate as it should be post-war, but not the most difficult thing to fix even if you're like me and wince at taking wet and dry paper and a toothpick to a £100+ loco. How's yours running Robin? I'll wait til tomorrow to try mine...

Very nice she looks too Robin. Just unboxed mine and seems much better built than the Lode Star version which I went through 3 of before giving up on getting one with all its parts fitted and in one piece. Mine seems to be missing its front coupling hook (as in the rendition of the 'real' front coupling hook, not the model tension lock coupling). Has yours got one or is this a general oversight? Mine's also got a slight kink in the running plate just over the cylinders on one side but not as bad as on some Castles I've seen and think I can live with it. Just need to give mine a run - bit concerned as one of the slide bars is bent outwards but maybe there's enough flex in the motion for it not to be a problem. But otherwise it looks great, even the green is not so bad in the flesh!

I think you're right in principle Fatadder, but I have a vague recollection that the GWR Journal article on postwar GWR liveries specifically mentions 4013 as being lined out postwar - however, that doesn't necessarily mean it was branded 'G crest W' as I think a Collett Hall is also mentioned in the same article as having received lining but I found a picture of it ex works in v early 1948 and while it was lined, it had no branding on the tender. But otherwise, yes, plain black or green seem much more likely for Stars on the postwar GWR. I think the Hornby 4013 has the correct details to be renamed as Newton Abbott-based 4012 and I'm tempted to do this and if I do, I'll probably go for plain green unless someone knows of any definitive evidence about its postwar GWR livery.

Photos now up on the Rails site https://railsofsheffield.com/gwr-4-6-0-knight-of-st-patrick-4013-4000-star-class-2016-range-r3455-Hornby-JJJA29977.aspx They've correctly omitted the steam pipes but is it my eyes or has the extra bogie spoke returned? The route/power disk is in the wrong place but at least there's no lining on the cylinders and it looks like it might be an improved shade of green

Ah, and very nice it looks too. I hadn't come across this hut before (R8586 it seems to be if anyone is interested), but the paint job you've done on it transforms it. Can you recall what paint you used Robin?

Some especially lovely shots recently Robin. Can I ask the origin of your line side huts - you seem to have a couple of these on the layout?

That's a great shot, thanks for sharing David. Does anyone know when 8700 got top feed fitted? I'm wondering if she'd have looked like this in 1947 and give me an excuse to buy the recent Bachmann model of her...

Thanks Miss Prism, that is helpful and makes it look nice and simple, although I'm not sure I trust myself to do a job that will be in keeping with fineness of the rest of the model. If Hattons aren't going to produce an ashpan for these, maybe this is a job for Brassmasters?

I am also slightly wary of the wonky coupling rods in some shots, such as the first of Coachman's above. Do these straighten out once running? This also put me off the Kernow O2, apart from the fact that a version without push-pull apparatus has not yet been produced in postwar SR livery.

Thanks for these shots Kevin. It really does look stunning but I still can't bring myself to overlook the absent ashpan - in the first shot you can see how it makes the loco look a little 'thin' midships. But maybe it won't be too difficult to represent the ashpan with some plasticard. Or maybe I should just get over this; it's just frustrating that such an otherwise superb model has such a glaring omission. I suspect I will eventually get over it and buy one, or maybe even the planned two.

6990 was built in 1948 and is a modified Hall. I read somewhere that it was given a G W branded tender from one of the 1947-build modified Halls for the purpose of the 48 exchange trials, seemingly in a last stand of company pride by its former servants.T The GWRJ 7 reference to a 'unmodified' Collett Hall in lined green was towards the end of the main article text, but as I mentioned above I'm pretty sure I found a photo of said Hall in ex works lined green in 1948 but without G W branding, suggesting the lining on this Hall wasn't seen in service in GW days.

In response to Fatadder's queries above, the research on postwar GWR Hall liveries I commissioned with STEAM and the NRM turned up no shots of Collett Halls in postwar GWR lined green - all the shots identified were either wartime black or postwar plain green. I've got the first volume of the Book of the Halls and that seems to show the same as far as I can tell. As has been realised above, this book also gives you some clue about likely post war GWR liveries on particular Halls as it includes the service histories of each so you can see if a particular Hall had major work post mid-late 1945 when I think Halls started being painted plain green rather than black. From memory, the excellent GWR Journal article on postwar liveries in vol 7 does mention a Collett Hall, in the 59xx series I think, that was observed in lined green postwar but i seem to recall that I found a photo of it exworks in 1948 (I think in Tony Sterndale's excellent Great Western Pictorial no.3, sorry I can't check as I'm away from my books at the moment) and while it was lined, it didn't have any branding on the tender so I think it was only lined in early BR days rather than GWR days. So while Swindon issued a directive in mid-1947 to line Halls, I'm starting to think it was only the 47-built modified Halls that got that treatment in GWR days. I would be delighted if someone did manage to turn up a shot of a Collett Hall in postwar GWR lined green, especially as I got a couple of Bachmann Halls expertly altered to this livery by Glenn (Mattingley Custom) of this parish. Given the mid-47 lining instruction, I tell myself it's what Swindon would have wanted, even if they didn't get around to doing it in real life.

That really would be great and sure to see a preorder from me if confirmed. Cheers, Ben

That is great news Robin, and thanks for asking them. Did you get a sense of whether they're aiming for lined or unlined postwar GWR green? Cheers, Ben

You're quite right Rob. And while the Halls look wonderful in this livery, the research on postwar GWR Hall liveries I commissioned with STEAM and the NRM turned up no shots of 'original' Halls in postwar lined green - all the shots identified were either wartime black or postwar plain green. I've got the first volume of the Book of the Halls and that seems to show the same as far as I can tell. This book also gives you some clue about likely post war GWR liveries on particular Halls as it includes the service histories of each so you can see if a particular Hall had major work post mid-late 1945 when I think Halls started being painted plain green rather than black. I would be delighted if someone did manage to turn up a shot of a Hall in postwar GWR lined green, especially as I got a couple of Bachmann Halls expertly altered to this livery by Glenn (Mattingley Custom) of this parish. I justified this as there was an official Swindon decree in mid-1947 that Stars, Saints and Halls would join Kings, Castles and Counties in being lined out - there are more details about this in a GWRJ article on postwar GWR liveries, volume 7 I think. So while I've seen no evidence of an 'original' Hall gaining this livery, I tell myself it's what Swindon would have wanted.

Here's hoping for some GWR postwar liveries - some interesting variations possible including 'Great Western' branding without the crest in the middle as shown in the Hornby publicity that accompanied the original launch of these coaches.

Hi Dave, Do the production versions have the ashpan fitted? Cheers, Ben