Clem

Hi Steve, The trick with the safety bars is to make an elongated 'U' in 0.3mm by forming it around 0.45mm wire with your thin nosed pliers. The safety bars were/are wider than grab-rails and I use 0.45mm wire for the bars. The top part of the 'U' is lightly cramped against the end of the 0.45 wire. Then it's a simple job of dabbing a touch of solder on it and Bob's your uncle. It's more fiddly trying to get the holding loop in the brake van itself, though. I used to drill a couple of 0.3mm holes and try and fit a small loop at the corner of the window but lately I've found that a single hole will do if the the holding loop is formed of a 'U' with one long leg and the other butted up against the brake van, secured with tiny drop of that hot rocket stuff. I always start off doing a brake van with great enthusiasm and end up just being relieved that it's over when it's complete, though. :-) They certainly do have their fiddly moments.

Evening Tony, Andrew, Steve et al, Is this what you call a brake van special? Tony, I do like your humans. As good as I've ever seen. (visually that is... I don't know what they're like morally) . I didn't know the Hornby vans were out yet. But that's a lovely weathering job. Anyway - a couple more vans... The first a Bachmann which I obviously haven't yet bothered to finish (sheepishly, I must admit I've only just realised it - I must revisit this one! ) and the second an old Airfix kit converted to Toad D by cutting off the concrete platform.

The Parkside vans do scrub-up (down?) quite well. But (with a certain amount of resignation), I suppose I'll cave in and try one of the Hornby ones too. At least you can improve them with nickel silver handrails..... And anyway, you can never have enough brake vans, can you? :-)

I thought I'd give that programme a go last night. It lasted about 15 seconds before I turned the set off and stormed out of the room! I thought I would be watching something that would allow me to get as far away from such drivel as Eastenders as possible but when I switched on, the first thing one of the 'modellers' said was 'I'm basing this layout on Eastenders' Argggghhhh!!!

Good morning Tony. It sounds as though you had an enjoyable birthday. Many happy returns!!

I've just watched the video. Constructive criticism? Only constructive, I'm afraid...... Loved it! The layout, signals, the stock..... I absolutely loved it. A window into 1938.

I think the word he was looking for is 'distinctive'. The unique qualifying error is not unique. Many people are guilty of that bit of double talk. Actually, I find journalists are often the worst offenders.

No it couldn't have been him. Snakes don't bother fitting headlamps on the front.

That's a brilliantly evocative picture, Andrew. It just oozes atmosphere and everything in it feels right, from the weathering of the V2, to the Thompson coaches and the double arm signal, not to mention the wooden carriage sheds? and the GC water crane. Top modelling!

Cheers Andrew. I'll try to get along to that.

Hi Andrew. Fascinating read. When are you exhibiting again?

Hi Andrew, Thank you for your Leicester railway expertise. I've got the GC book 'GC from the Footplate' Rowbotham/Frank Stratford. He must have been great to talk to. You're way ahead of me on knowledge and information regarding the GC and what you've said here I find very interesting. I admit that I just assumed the J6s had been used prior to the L1s on the Woodford Locals but I've no evidence for it. Also, I had always thought that the footballers worked South as well as North for Nottingham Victoria but I know Leicester GC and Neasden were responsible for most of the express workings and thought the B17s were used just on semi-fasts. I know that the footballers weren't common on the GN lines to Derby and Pinxton although I do have a photo of 61662 with a brake van near Derby so they did appear on occasion. I moved close to the GC line on Wilford Lane just south of the Trent crossing in January 1960 and I could see a stretch of about half-a-mile from the house. So even when I wasn't by the railway, I could see from the bedroom windows what was running. Although the A3s had gone in September '57 there was still plenty to be seen at that time including V2s, J11s and L1s. I particularly liked the B16s in all their guises and, from memory, at that time there was still 2 or 3 each day on Woodford freights. One loco which stuck in my mind was 92250 which came up from the South one evening in 1960 on a short freight. But in those years of the early 60's you could almost see anything on the GC and it wouldn't be a surprise. By the end of '62 the line had become heavily under the influence of the LMR, motive power wise although visits of V2s, B1s and B16s (rebuilt) continued infrequently. Sad to see it decline and go.

Hi Andrew. It was my understanding that there was a change in the mid-1950s when Leicester GN became a sub shed of Leicester GC instead Colwick, although by this time I think the shed had been at least partially knocked down. Certainly it is listed as sub-shed of Colwick (along with Derby Friargate Slack Lane) in the early 1950s. At this time Leicester GC had one J5 shedded there 65495 and a J52 68839? so it did have its own goods allocation too. I know Colwick's Footballers worked almost exclusively on the GC and its J6s and later the L1s worked the locals to Woodford. I was under the impression that later in the 1950s Belgrave Road became a sub shed of Leicester in that engine men based at the GC shed used it as a signing on point. After 1953 when the Grantham services ceased there was a lot less activity at Belgrave Road although the Colwick freights continued until 1964. It would be interesting to have any or all of this conjecture confirmed though. I certainly hadn't known or heard about any of Colwick's shunting tanks being outsourced at the GC shed/yard although I know that Derby Friargate always had one (which returned to Colwick every week for a boiler washout) and I assume Belgrave Road had one up to the mid 50s. It's great delving into the workings of those days, isn't it?!

Hi Andrew, It just came back to me about your quote regarding Colwick locos outsourced to Leicester. Did you mean Belgrave Road (GN) or Central (GC)? I assumed you meant the GN shed which was a sub-shed of Colwick, but I know Colwick did have a some turns down the GC.

With Autumn now on our doorstep, over the last few weeks I've been looking to clear up one or two unfinished projects in order that I can firstly Spring(?!) clean the workshop and get any remaining Harvest-men spiders out and get a bit more organised before moving back on to scenery and buildings. One of my longest outstanding finishing jobs was a Connoisseur J69 which I built over ten years ago but at the time I didn't have a photo of the locomotive (68629) and so its condensing apparatus or lack of it was a bit of a mystery. I've recently come by a couple of photos which have finally given me that information and so I've been able to finish the loco and weather it. Another one of Colwick's finest, it moved to Colwick in November 1955 from Stratford. I don't know about anyone else, but I get a lot of satisfaction when I finally finish a long standing part complete project.

Lovely models! You captured the essence there, Andrew. And both beautifully painted and weathered. Must be on the Great Central London Extension ?

As a reflection of my complete and shameless tastelessness, I have to admit that I find the class 68 in Scotrail livery quite appealing..... But, on the other hand, it is a diesel and (sorry Clive), in my opinion no diesel will ever be as easy on the eye as the most grimy, run-down, work-stained steam locomotive.

I hope everyone is having a great summer. Congratulations Tony and everyone involved on the Little Bytham 30's weekend. What a fantastic effort and what eye-watering modelling! I'm certainly looking forward to the video footage. I was interested in Jonathan's discussion of the make up of his various trains from Grantham including the use of Mailcoach and Ian Kirk kits. With reference to the Ian kirk kits, I have just managed to complete this Ian Kirk diagram 261 Gresley 4-compartment BTK. Yes I know that the depth of beading is over scale and one or two other dimensions are slightly out but they really do reflect that Gresley look (certainly better than Hornby RTR examples) and I think they're well worth the effort. I particularly like them in crimson and cream as they ooze 1950s atmosphere in that livery (do I hear that word 'sacrilege'?). However, as one of the reoccurring themes of this thread is the inability of RTR locos to pull non-RTR stock, I decided to weigh the coach just to see what it came out at..... 311grams!!. The weight mainly lies in the MJT components (many are white metal) used to enhance the kit. Phew! Luckily my line isn't the ECML and vestibuled coaches are used only for excursions and 2 trains a day which had through coaches from Kings Cross.

Just about finished my Parkside Toad E to go (not necessarily permanently) with the developing wooden wagon coal train. Here's a shot before it goes into service. Parkside produce very nice kits. They go together really well and look pretty well spot on.... and good value. Thanks to previous links from Andrew and Jonathan, I've now got some Cambrian six and a half and seven plank wagons in to build, for a bit of variation. .... Mental note: must get back to the things I should be doing, i.e. the buildings and scenery.....

Lovely weathering on the two 4 plank wagons Jonathan. The trace of the original PO lettering on the corner strapping is a masterstroke! Thanks, and thank you also Andrew. I will be following those references up with a couple of purchases. I did actually wonder about GN 4 plank wagons too but without photo evidence that they lasted to the mid-50s I've left them alone. Having said that your's are in post common-user livery which brings us into the 40s at least, unless I'm mistaken. I've a feeling that by the mid-50s they were pretty well confined to internal use at collieries only. I've used Cambrian for their LNER steel minerals and the odd Gloucester 7 plank but not for anything else yet.

Thanks Martyn. I'd forgotten Eileen's had started selling them. Cheers, Clem

Hi Jonathan, I do like the variety of the wagons you've illustrated and the way you've weathered them. If I could live forever, I'd do an LNER period as well. But I'm stuck in the mid 50s with the workhorses from Colwick I love so much. (I may do a named B1 at some stage :-)). Regarding slipping in ordinary 6 plank wagons (had to laugh at the way you put it), I did the same with one or two 3H wagons before this present batch - mainly due to shortage of numbers. But you're dead right of course. Every photo you see of wooden mineral trains pre-1957 displays differences in heights not only due to the specified height of the wagon but also how much they'd worn out and pushed down on the leaf springs. The Bachmann wagons were a good start to building a rake as they pretty good for RTR but unless you use other sources, you just get a uniform height down the train and it doesn't look right. BTW do you know if anyone does a kit for the earlier 6 plank mineral wagons? I wouldn't mind a one or two of those in the rake. I could always scratch build but it takes that much longer to do. I do like the look of the Parkside wooden mineral kits. Now Peco have taken over, they seem to be no longer supplying EM or P4 wheels as Parkside used to do, if anyone's interested - but at least for EM, the OO ones can be opened out.

I'll try again... I was trying to reply to Jon's post on RTR and Kit built wagons, and also to Jesse's slightly critical post to say that I too have been building up a rake of wagons. In my case, as I'm basing my layout on a coal carrying line around 1954/5, my balance of steel minerals to wooden minerals is too slanted towards the steel minerals at the moment. Looking at photos of those years, I'd guess the wooden wagons outnumbered the steel minerals by 2 to 1 for coal. So I've embarked on producing a loaded coal train of 35 loaded wooden coal wagons and I've just finished the first 13 using a variety of RTR and kits. Here are one or two examples.. The rake so far consists of several Bachmann7 and 8 plank weathered up as well as Parkside 7 and 8 plank wagons, an ABS white metal 8 plank, a ratio five and a half plank of GW origin and two oxford rail 6 plank wagons. The photos I have illustrate the limited but common use of unfitted merchandise wagons for coal at this time and it fact the ex-GW wagon I can actually identify from a photo. The first photo shows part of the rake together before they all had loads. The second is a RTR Oxford Rail ex-LNE unfitted 6-plank wagon suitably 'dressed down' and modified with correct Morton 2-shoe brake gear The third is the ex-GW five and a half plank wagon as modelled from a photo (including correct number! - bonus!).... The last photo is of the ABS wagon part of an order of 7 plank wagons which were built as 8 plankers a they ran out of the correct spaced planks. I found out after it had been constructed that the LNE 8-plank wagons per se were built with angle iron strapping so the ABS kit is in error. But fortunately the last couple of hundred 7 plank wagons of this batch were built with 8 and with the flat strapping. BTW does anyone else have problems entering text when replying. That's what caused my earlier problem (along with Chris calling me into the garden to do some hedge cutting!). On Jesse's post, I can understand how irritating it might get to read some of the stuff which is posted here, but personally I find 99% of it pretty interesting and mostly a huge source of learning. It's certainly helped me become a better modeller. Occasionally though, it does lend itself to a misunderstanding, cross-purpose conversations and a bit of mutual consternation between the posters. Cheers for now..

Whoops!! I didn't mean to do that! I was hoping to reply quoting it though. It's funny how your fingers can get you into trouble!! I will post something sensible shortly... :-)