LNER4479

Well, as many of you will be aware, Grantham's stock has been on its holidays, 20 mins down (up?) the line to Little Bytham, allowing us to see sights like this: 'Robert' himself gets to grips with a 15 coach formation comprising a reasonably accurate portrayal of the 10:10 King's Cross to Leeds service. This was one of the two regular workings for the unique Quint set, seen in the middle of the train. We run this train on Grantham - but it doesn't load to 15! But the weekend was notable for the debut runs of two forthcoming new trains for Grantham. This is Jonathan's meticulous depiction-in-the-making of the famous 1938 recreation of the 'Scotch Express' (Flying Scotsman) of 1888. This was of course all put together to celebrate the launch of the new 1938 Flying Scotsman sets of coaches and the press launch took place just a few days before Mallard broke the world speed record - what a week THAT was for the LNER! The two trains (No.1 with the 1888 rake and No.4498 with the 1938 rake) met up at Stevenage, where guests transferred from the former to the latter. Our intention is to bend history just a little and have them meeting up at Grantham instead. This train of Jonathan's looks like it's going to be a real head-turner, a beautiful piece of modelling in the making. Not to be outdone, I burnt a bit of midnight oil meself and here, in a not dissimilar vein, is the inaugural run of the Nottingham Quint set. Complete with C1 Atlantic and a 6-wheel brake to replicate the inspirational picture in the Cawston book that first sowed a seed in my mind, this is hopefully a spur to get the thing sufficiently advanced to run at the Wakefield show in November. That is also Jonathan's target for his new train. We reconvene again, back at base, in just under two weeks time. Watch this space.

I agree with others - invert the girders. This is how Grantham's was done. What I did was to reduce the height (depth) of the girders which made the pit slightly shallower and - I perceive - more prototypical in terms of its depth. Like most turntables, the Dapol (nee Airfix) one is a bit long so you can simply cut the girders to the length you need and adjust the deck length to suit. I didn't make use of the supplied deck in fact; I just glued the girders to a plain piece of 30 thou plasticard and built things up from there.

Before we get too much older, a few more from my 1T57 day on Saturday, hopefully in the spirit of the thread. Here is a clearer photo of 'The Waverley' charter, crossing Ribblehead viaduct. 45690 'Leander' at the business end. Very much a personal favourite of mine although a) I don't care very much for her current livery of BR lined black - she'll always be LMS 5690 in glorious crimson lake to me! b) diesel in attendance due to fire risk and it was doing its fair share of shoving c) not a prototypical 1968 loco. BUT, it was about history and 'being there'. There were at least two others there who were staking out their spot from 50 years ago. Train passed through some 20-25 mins late at 12:45. And - wonder of wonders - the sun was actually shining. At Ribblehead! And then, in true end-of-steam, MNA tradition, I set off in frantic pursuit of more trains! A 160mile, three hour dash via M6 and A50 took me to Loughborough where the GCR was hosting an end-of-steam gala. Star of the show was of course the 1T57 engine, 70013 Oliver Cromwell. Slightly disappointed that my only chance to see it coincided with it running tender first. This was the 16:00 off Loughborough - funnily enough, also running 20-25 mins late. BUT, symbolic again, I saw her working, 50 years to the day. Final shot and full credit to the lads n lasses at the GCR who had gone to some trouble to recreate one of the end-of-steam specials from 4th August. This is 8F 48624, renumbered as 48476, double-heading with 73156, renumbered as 73069. The GW liveried stock is a bit incongruous and the '8' is sporting an early crest but otherwise a credible effort, very much in the spirit of the day. To conclude on a modelling note: we're at the Leeds model railway show 27th/28th October with Shap, running in 1967 end-of-steam mode. So plenty of Black 5s, Britannias, 8Fs and 9Fs rubbing shoulders with diesels and blue n grey stock. Do say 'hi' if you get to see us there.

You forgot to mention the all encroaching vegetation, Tony. Notwithstanding all the other things you cite (which I 100% agree with), the very fact that you can't even get a clear view of many stretches of the modern day railway does rather limit opportunities for lineside observation and photography.

Ribblehead today

OK, so in anticipation of the big day tomorrow, here is my only picture contribution on this wonderful thread. Yes - I was there! Albeit nobbut a little lad of 4. I can remember it - but didn't have a camera of my own(!) However... I believe I am on this picture! This is a crummy version of Colin Gifford's take on 11th Aug 1968 and, whilst you can hopefully make out that this is indeed 1T57 at Ribblehead, of more interest to me is the group on the left. My Dad has camera in action (he was taking cine film), whilst my Mum clutches on to my younger brother (no doubt complaining about the cold wind). I appear to be sitting down in front of my Mum! I can just about remember the event. I recall that, after the train had passed, we didn't rush straight back to the car. Asking where Dad had disappeared to, I was advised that he had gone to see the loco take water. My infant mind conjured up an image of someone aiming the bag of the water column at the tender as the loco passed by! I do believe that it did indeed stop at Blea Moor for a top up (anyone confirm that?). I have no recollection of the two 'fives' heading south. Years later I asked my Dad about that and he said that he simply couldn't face it - seeing the very last train, so speak. I think that was one of the realities of 11th August 1968, folks genuinely upset that it really was 'the end'. Of course, no-one could have known then what the ensuing 50 years would hold. A strong sense of history lured me back to Ribblehead 10 years ago this very day for the 40th year recreation of 1T57, which ran on 10th August 2008 (a day early!) and the weather conditions were pretty similar! This is my picture this time - note the wind whipping the Brit's exhaust away, almost exactly as it did in 1968! Tomorrow, I shall venture out to this hallowed ground again. There are likely to be diesels about (fire risk) and it might well rain (ironically) but I want to be there. It's scheduled to be 45690 doing the northbound passage of the viaduct; 70013's mainline ticket has expired but she is scheduled to be in action at the GCR's 'end of steam' event so I'm planning to pop in there in the afternoon … en route to a model celebration of 1938(!) But that is a different story.

Sorry - missed this first time round. As has been already mentioned, we make use of Code 100. I think we're 'serious', in the way the OP mentions? To emphasise a couple of points (ha!) made by others. Code 100 is more resilient to the rough and tumble of the exhibition circuit. Painting the rail sides makes a huge difference in terms of toning down and blending in the larger size of the rail. And laying to 45mm track centres helps as well (although that applies equally to Code 75). All that having been said, Shap is laid on Code 75 (concrete)! To some extent a bit of a try out (there's nowhere near as much track). Only comment for now is that it takes more care to lay even and true as the smaller section makes it more susceptible to knocks, kinks, undulations, etc. It's only been to one show so far so we'll have to see how it fares in terms of durability. (All photos courtesy of Tony Wright)

You indeed right to point out that there were many heavier trains that were required to be hauled between Doncaster (where the pacific would have to come off) and Leeds. Some trains shed a portion for Hull at Donny but otherwise they would still be quite sizeable trains at least as far as Wakefield (Bradford portion detached) for which the more powerful ex-GC types would have indeed been useful. The trial of the B3s on the southern section only appears to have lasted for a few years. Valour herself was transferred back to Gorton in 1927 but, ironically, was transferred to Copley Hill in 1942 for working between Leeds and Doncaster (after the bridge had been strengthened!?) But of course, that was during extraordinary times. The only picture I've seen of a loco other than an Atlantic on the Queen of Scots Pullman after the B3s and prior to the pacifics taking over is of a Director (5510 Princess Mary), photographed by Maurice Earley in 1932, heading southbound. Was that a substitute for a failure or did they work the train regularly for a time? Interestingly, on the same day Mr Earley photographed the northbound West Riding Pullman exiting Stoke Tunnel hauled by an immaculate Atlantic 3284 - and I mean immaculate, polished buffers, the works! Coach roofs aren't white though...

Related historical note: The Gresley pacifics were originally banned between Doncaster and Leeds due to the condition of the bridge crossing the river Calder near Wakefield. The Queen of Scots Pullman service went this way (taking the Leeds Northern route to re-join the ECML at Northallerton) and hence, as it was a shortish formation pre-war, the Atlantics were kept diagrammed to work the service from London up until bridge strengthening works were finally undertaken in 1936. Thereafter, two pacifics were allocated to Copley Hill and took over the workings. Without said strengthening works, there could of course have been no West Riding streamliner train hauled by A4s.

Ah - you noticed that then. I think that coal cart suffered some collateral damage during Ally-Pally pack up. Not so noticeable in the last picture. (altogether now: I got three wheels on my wagon ... but I'm still rolling along ... ) Ref the 'too clean' mechanical horse. Interesting (?) historical note here is that Grantham was one of the locations chosen in an LNER pilot project to replace traditional horse-drawn drays for local goods deliveries. So, on Day 1 at least, such things would indeed have been very clean. It's appearance at sleepy Little Bytham would however be on the 'incredible' side of 'improbable'. Thanks for earlier comments on coal wagons incidentally - for once, they are my own work (the numbering / weathering of the loco is all Jonathan) for which a little explanation is called for. I had a need for a large number of ex-PO wagons on my previous 1950's LMR layout so can call on approx. 40 such wagons from that project. These were all RTR, some of which use the incorrect 10ft wheel spacing chassis of messers Mainline & Airfix. However, my knowledge level did improve over the years, thanks to the acquisition of 'Detailing and Improving Ready to Run Wagons' [iain Rice, Irwell Press, 1993] and 'The 4mm Coal Wagon - a step-by-step guide' [John Hayes, Wild Swan, 1999]. When it came to Grantham, I simply selected those existing wagons that seemed / were most appropriate to ECML (ie collieries whose wagons could have been seen heading to London - I will freely admit however that some of these have turned out to be incorrect in that regard). To these have been added more targeted vehicles. Notable in that selection therefore are two wagons bearing the legend 'S C'. Stephenson Clarke, one of the largest (the largest?) coal factors* of the era (*agents for coal distribution). When you start looking closely at pictures of the era, S C coal wagons are everywhere. Jonathan has recently undertaken a batch build. Incidentally, and rather poignantly, Stephenson Clarke Shipping Limited went into liquidation in July 2012, during the life of the Grantham project. It was Great Britain's oldest shipping company, founded in the Hanoverian era (1730) when mass transport by rail was still 100 years away and the 'shipping' in its title solely referred to ships. Some of that might well have been coastal shipping from the coal staithes of the north east (supplied by the early waggon ways of the day) to London. Isn't it interesting where model railway research takes you?

Several folks were kind enough to post videos on Youtube of the layout operating whilst at Warley. This one is probably the best (but not if you like diesels as he stoically filmed steam only!) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiXAfSzy44A (our sequence starts at 34:08. Apologies for the attack of the gremlins at the summit!) There is, I understand, a small video on the Model Rail site (Chris Nervard did a bit of videoing whilst he was here) but you might have to be a subscriber? That's all I can offer for now. But a comprehensive video in due course would be nice, certainly.

Bit like this, perhaps?

Turning now to the 'coffee pot' itself The structure is formed up round a rather ingenious former, with the top piece having sacrificial tabs to help align other pieces before being filed flat. The distinctive sides required the curves to be formed - one gentle, the other more pronounced - before locating on the afore-mentioned tabs then filing flush. It was made easier by the fact that the main bulk of these parts were half etch so as to provide the ridge on the top. Just a case of finding a suitable bar to bend it round, taking it steady and continuing to offer it up to the former until the desired shape was achieved. The completed assembly. Now attached to the rest of the body structure. I decide to install the wire at the front whilst I could still get at the inside; it gets bent to shape to fit in the hole in the smokebox below the chimney. A little further on, with most of the body details now fitted, showing the tank to be more integral to the overall appearance. Next time - making it all go.

Oh cripes - just caught up with the news, although I had gathered he wasn't well. Can only echo the thoughts of others in ranking Allan as one of the true giants of the modelling world and certainly an inspiration to this modeller over the last 40 odd years. One of those whose brilliance shone out of every page of an article depicting his latest creation. It was a delight to be able to exchange pleasantries through his involvement in this wonderful forum of ours in recent years. RIP Allan

Picked up my copy this morning and would just like to say, as the chief architect of the Shap layout, what a superb job Chris and the team at Model Rail have done in presenting the layout. Particular thanks to Richard Foster who accompanied Chris Nervard for the 'shoot' to get the story. I think he has done a splendid job of turning my rambling responses to his patient questions into an engaging article to accompany Chris's fantastic photos. I am (naturally) delighted at the result, which portrays not only my efforts but those of the Shap team that so readily contributed. Thanks guys!

Well, it is indeed 'out'. Picked up a copy this morning and thoroughly enjoyed the read and the presentation. I can say that because, in this case, it wasn't me wot wrote it! Richard Foster came along with Chris Nervard on the shoot and, despite me leaping about all over the place, he patiently asked his questions and recorded the answers on a variety of aspects of the layout and its background and has turned this into the article that accompanies the photos. I think he has done a splendid job of this and am delighted at the result, which portrays not only my efforts but those of the Shap team that so readily contributed. Definitely worth buying a copy if the layout floats yer boat.

Loving all the pictures Tony. The milk train is one that doesn't (yet?) feature in the Grantham schedule. However, there are two interesting things of note. The LNER was one of the first of the 'Big Four' to switch over from handling milk in churns to conveying it en masse in specialist tank wagons in the mid-1930s. The very first tankers were 4-wheelers; however, they rode badly at speed, resulting in the milk being half way towards butter on arrival, hence the relatively rapid progression to the much more familiar 6-wheelers. The other interesting fact about the LNER milk service was its origination point - Ingestre. Where?! One of the furthest-most points of the GNR empire was Stafford, reached via a railway line that branched off the Derby-Crewe line beyond Uttoxeter - the North Staffs Railway afforded the GNR running powers in order to reach it. Hopelessly uneconomic, it closed to passenger traffic in 1939; however, its one saving grace was that it ran through the middle of the Staffordshire milk farming area and the GNR was thus able to steal a march on the more logical providers of such traffic. United Dairies established a creamery at Ingestre and Weston railway station and it was from here that the milk traffic ran - possibly combined with traffic from other areas? Once it had picked up east coast metals at Grantham then it would be a fair gallop no doubt to the capital, the transit time before that not being particularly quick, one imagines? The destination was a distribution point at Finchley, I believe. It was for this reason that the ex-GNR Stafford line remained open until 1951 (rails not finally lifted until 1959). Is that unique - a line staying open purely for milk traffic?

1) Only 15, I'm afraid - the coaching stock superintendent didn't bring enough TKs with him ... 2) Minor pedantry - the 6-wheel CL is a Bill Bedford etch. As always, some 'different' pix from your lens

Further to Tony's post above, here is the information for that Leeds train, together with a few other bits n pieces from the last 24 hours First of all, a drone-like view of mine (not possible in 1938!) shows the train in a wider perspective. This is train 324 (down), which departed King's Cross at 10.15am in summer 1937 and 10.10am in summer 1938, following in the wake of the Flying Scotsman and 'Junior Scotsman' and destined for Leeds ... and other destinations in the Ridings, as will become clear. This is the front of the train and dates it as 1937 as the first vehicle behind the loco is the avant garde cinema coach, a typical publicity-driven feature of the LNER in this era. This vehicles is not shown in the 1938 formation, hence 1937. Despite it being completely enclosed as built, Roy Mears assures us all that it comes complete with projector and raked seats, cinema style! Behind this vehicle, we then have a classic three coach through portion, formed up as Brake Third - All Third (corridor) - Brake Composite. Such formation provides a proportionally small amount of first class accommodation and is otherwise a complete train - it is destined for Harrogate but is shown to reverse at Leeds (Central), which must mean that the main formation behind it was shunted out of the way first at Leeds before continuing its journey; either that, or it was detached at Wakefield and went ahead of the main train. The diagram book does not say. Here is the main 'core' formation of the train and is of course made up of the famous - and unique - ex-GNR Quintuplet dining set. The first class end is marshalled at the buffer stop end from King's Cross - note the one less window; larger bays of the first diner compared to the third diner. The final third of the train is equally as interesting (well, I think so!). Immediate behind the Quint is another 3-coach through portion, this time for Bradford. It is not the same as the Harrogate portion however, as this is formed up as Brake First - All Third (corridor) - Brake Third, ie a greater proportion of first class accommodation. Note how the Brake First is marshalled next to the dining set, giving the least distance necessary for the toffs of Bradford to walk through for their (early) lunch. This is all indicative of Bradford being regarded as a more important destination to the LNER than Harrogate (not quite the same story today, perhaps?!), a legacy of the wealth from the woollen trade. This portion would have been detached at Wakefield and the brake van immediately behind is also for Bradford, making a four coach train for onward transit. By comparison, the last two coaches in the train are a comparatively mundane two coach portion for Hull (detached at Doncaster); both are brakes however - Compo and All Third so, again, a smattering of first class seating available. We don't have the space to run such a large train on Grantham so it was a delight to put this together this morning. The formation is 100% as per the 1937 diagram book for a mid-week (Tues-Thurs) service in terms of type of vehicle, although I can't guarantee that every last vehicle is the correct diagram number. Other than the cinema coach, this is all Jonathan's work. Great also to see Grantham's 'pet' A1 No.4479 'Robert the Devil' equal to the task. A few other pix of mine, although it's scarcely worth bothering, seeing as how the master lensman will be able to capture much better images. These are really so as I can capture the replacement signals in position. Here, the 'drone' has hovered over the station pointing south. No trains (apart from the solitary horse box) but what a lovely, homogeneous railway scene. Looking the other way as the northbound Silver Jubilee hoves into view. This is based on a photo Tony has and I think he might try getting a better version of it himself over the next week or so. Down at the platform ends, we see a full-fitted express goods rattling down the bank. Very much the preserve of the K3s trains like this in the 1930's - the V2s were only just starting to appear in squadron numbers as the war broke out. And finally, to prove that we just didn't plonk all this in front of the camera, here are two mediocre video clips, nevertheless showing this goods train and the Leeds express in motion.

Note to self - try and remember to look out horses n carts...

Flying Scotsman set usually loads to 10 or 11 as it doesn't stop at the station. All others tend to be 8 or 9. We'll need to bring every last teak that'll turn a wheel with us to make rakes up to 15. Jonathan's in charge of the 50 wagon goods consists.

The practice weekend is also necessary for the simple time taken to put the stock on the track, connect up three links and to decide on full coaching stock formations (we assume that 8-9 coach formations won't 'cut it' on Little Bytham!) - that in itself usually takes several hours of set up at a show as it is. Looking forward to it immensely

Next instalment. At this point, the chassis etch arrived. Despite the instructions saying to complete the body first, I was keen to at least assemble the basic chassis and see how it fitted to the body. The main thing to note here is that, despite this being a fine, intricate kit, probably more suited to the EM/P4 end of the scale, in this case, the loco is intended for a OO layout with two foot radius curves and using Code 100 track! Consequently, as can be seen, Markits wheels have been used, a suitable type being found in the 'Industrial' area of the catalogue - IND 14/10 (Barclay 14mm (3' 6") 10 spoke). The prototypes had 3' 7" so the difference is barely noticeable and being slightly smaller, helps with any clearance issues given a deeper flange than a more scale wheel. Note the simple compensation bar on the front axle, allowing a small amount of rocking movement. With only four wheels to pick up from, the loco needs every help to ensure good current pick up. A hole is provided in the rear of the cylinder former. The bar is soldered in, resting on the top of the axle, before the axle holes are enlarged (very carefully, in the vertical direction only. Slidebar assembly and cylinder block ready to be attached. The former is quite fragile at this point. This shows how the two parts are fitted together. They interlock together and then are positioned on the frames. A piece of brass tube is then fitted for the whole thing to be soldered up solid around. A very neat piece of design. The rest of the related cylinder parts ready for assembly. All assembled and running smoothly.(I could tip the track back and forward and the chassis would roll accordingly). The only thing permanently fixed at this point were the front coupling rod pins, as these need to be filed back to get the clearance for the piston rod crosshead. The rest needs to come apart again when it comes to installing the motor. And the obligatory 'progress so far' photo. This was quite encouraging, as everything seemed to be fitting well and nice n square. Next time - the 'coffee pot' itself.

Finitched! And with a few days to spare. Mind you, I still have stock to service, etc so probably just as well. Plan is to swap over with the two upper quadrant equivalents this weekend so as they're all ready and bedded in for the main event. Hopefully further reports after the weekend. A few compromises / cheats along the way as this was meant as a quick build due to the temporary nature of their installation - but hopefully they will still look the part and add to the pre-war ambience.

Sounds like a date! (In about 10 years time - ha!) You'll have one of at least eight different control positions to choose from when it all comes to fruition