Golden Fleece 30

Thank you Player of trains. I think the better looks compared to the Wrenn version is due to Duchess cylinders used as opposed to the later City ones. I do prefer these ones. Once I started re-drilling the R1, and Castle, chassis's they became so much more versatile. Garry

Sorry for slight of topic but just for interest here is my Lord of the Isles, 3-railed running through different tracks, Dublo and modern later style Peco. It shows what a 4-2-2 can do. Garry

David, what about the Lord of the Isles chassis modified for a connecting rod? The bodies are similar although without a single to hand I cannot say. As you have seen my 3-rail Lord of the Isles will pull 9 Exleys so it should be okay for this, shouldn't it? Garry

There will be a bit of difference in price though, even the deposit is about 3 times what a kit would be. I know the finish etc of Locomotions will be good but not to a couple of hundred (at least). Garry

Here are a couple of photos showing where the Rebuilt Royal Scot is at. It is all soldered up in the photo without chimney although I am not too happy with the cab area I am not going to try to adjust it. The chimney and smoke deflectors are only laced in position. I want to try to have the deflectors screwed on to make the painting easier so hopefully a small nut can be soldered on the flange. Dublo R1 buffers are used which although not quite correct are better than any whitemetal offerings. The tender is all complete but needs a false internal chassis making (as per Dublo). Garry

Hi Ray, just copy and paste the http code from you tube. Garry

Here is my latest R1 chassis modification, this time to make a rebuilt Royal Scot. The front axle has been moved 8mm or so further forwards and Castle wheels fitted along with Duchess valve gear, this did require the connecting rod lengthening 6mm. All it needs is the Bristol models kit finishing and fitting around it. This kit is a very nice one, the boiler looks quite round after the two halves were soldered together. Garry

Hi David, I would not say the Dublo A4 was puny as such, to me it was a better scale than the Hornby/Tri-ang offerings but it was not intended for use as a Spam can set. Both you (I guess) and I have used it because it is a single slide bar as such. I do prefer the older Duchess valve gear as opposed to the later City ones which did look over scale although still far superior to the competitions versions. That is old, when did Airfix buy them out, early 1960's ? I remember my father buying the Kitmaster Biggin Hill and their Perfecta kit to motorise it with the Tri-ang XT60. It was not a success, even trying to glue the metal rings on the wheel treads was not straight forward if I remember correctly. Garry

Farish Merchant Navy part 5 Here we have the cylinders, slide bar and connecting rods fitted. The whole valve gear as such I drew up in AutoCAD and had etched in Nickel Silver. The cylinders, as with Wrenn Spam cans, are too wide and should not have a radius at the top so thankfully there was plenty of metal on which allowed me to file down to a better width. Because I was using the A4 chassis I obviously had to remove some metal from this too but I could not get the body quite low enough so I filed a small ridge on top which helped locate the body and drop it into position. Garry

Hi David, I don't think there is any difference between Dublo and Wrenn wheels although I was told the axles were different. I was told (rightly or wrongly) Dublo plated their axles but Wrenn did not. My first Spam Can used the A4 valve gear but after getting a Wrenn chassis (and then some locos) and producing my own it is now a candidate for a replacement set. As for a bogie and pony truck, I am certain I have the pony truck but unsure about the bogie. The pony will need to be set further back as that was one of the areas of a larger difference in size, length ways that is. With reference to the drawing it could be the first one was wider and the remainder narrower, the first one was a completely different shape with curved cab sides, widows peak top front casing, tender sides to match cab, smoke deflectors and fairings etc. It was rebuilt I think to the later Spam Can profiles, but I did say I think, not fully sure. I have thought about a Wrenn tender top but want to see what is available in the household first Garry

Hi Brian, Wrenn did do a handfull of locos with a 5 pole motor, all the B/B Hurricane locos had one and a couple of others had the odd batch done but mainly they were 3 pole. The last batch of A4's and City's had 5 pole motors too along with all flanged Castle wheels. Their W/C and Scot chassis's are very, very expensive, thats if you can get hold of one. They may fit but at the price I would not contemplate buying one anyway. My loco chassis is an old Dublo Mazak 3-rail one which seems to be coming along nicely. Wrenn Scots and Spamcans had backheads cast into the bodyshell so Ringfields would not fit, and, due to the size of the Ringfield protruding at the rear I prefer the vertical motors. I am hoping to find somewhere in the loft or garage or shed an old tender I can cut out the front from to use before I go to the extent of making one. My next part will be the slidebar fitting to the A4 chassis and seeing if the Wrenn cylinders are suitable. For their own Spamcan the cylinders from the rebuilt version were used and therefore too wide protruding outside the body instead of level. Garry

Farish Merchant Navy part 4 Here we have the wheels painted and coupling rods fitted. Also the bodies have been sprayed gloss varnish on the blue only. This actually shows some of the casting "imperfections/original paint issues" so I may go back to an all over satin. One major deciding factor maybe is that I put the number transfers on the satin and the new gloss did not change the shade due to the transfer film so a paler shade shows through. A new buffer beam has been made from brass angle and Dublo R1 buffers, for some reason it looks to droop at the moment. The tender body (which needs a front making) is only resting on a new Wrenn base which needs new wheel clips and proper wheels fitted. I may however make a new full interior base similar to Dublo.

Farish Merchant Navy part 3 A start has been made on the chassis now, a Dublo A4 chassis with Boxpok wheels fitted. These are a full set of new Dublo 3-rail wheels I have had for a couple of years waiting for that "special project" and so I guess this is it. As opposed to my usual tapping on wheels onto an axle I bought a cheap Hamblings wheel press recently and modified it for Dublo wheels. I owned one of these presses a long time ago (40+ years ago) and threw it away saying never again but relented and it has not done too bad now. Now to look for some replacement Wrenn style valve gear I made for a job like this and then reassemble the rods and motor, the motor and its ancillary parts being removed for the wheel press tool to fit. Garry

7026 Tenby Castle Here is my blue Castle finished apart from its centre pick-ups which will be on the loco and not the tender. I have just noticed that I forgot to put a blanking plate in the tender front where the normal loco to tender wire goes. I did polish up a new copper chimney only to find they were made of brass and copper plated, so yes, the plating polished off. This is an old Denbigh Castle 2-rail Chassis which has had its wheels shorted out with electrical paint and metal tender wheels fitted on the same side. I have gone for the gloss boiler and satin black finish, and, unusually for me I found a reversing lever to replace. I normally loose those along with the front hooks. I am not too happy with the "brass" safety valve cover and when a suitable paint turns up I will probably redo it. This was done with a paint pen marker and is not as good as they used to be. Garry

I agree but also it is not easy to get a replacement these days in good or bad condition. 40 years ago I might (no would) have cut the body up which was before the times of keeping decent items for posterity. That is why I am using the Dublo A4 chassis for this loco as these are plentiful. I certainly forgive you lol. I have to say though when talking of Heresy I do change most of my Dublo couplings and replace coach bogies etc Basically most will look as normal but do have minor modifications. Garry

Very nice Brian thanks for the photos. It looks as if it was made for it. Most of the green I use is Brooklands Green as it is a close match to the Dublo shade but my choice was always Cherry Paints BR green. Unfortunately Ian sold the business a long time ago to Precision/Phoenix paints but the paint is not as good as when Ian Cherry made it. Their BR green is not bad and I have never used the Railmatch shade although I do use Railmatch varnish's and roof greys but all aerosols, I have never mastered airbrushing. Garry

Hi Brian, about 30 years ago I was looking at using a Tri-ang motor in a couple of Dublo chassis's, cut the chassis's down but then ended up using the tender drives so the mod never materialised. It will be interesting to see yours for this loco. I like the idea of soldering the Tri-ang worm to the Dublo boss. At least you can release it if necessary as opposed to using the Romford bush making it a press fit. Garry

Hi David, Having seen a handful of colour photos and a friend who mixed paint for models and for real ones stating that RAL5002 (Ultramarine) was the closest I would say the bottom photo was the closer one to real life. To me the bottom one looks like an original whereas the top one looks to be a poor scan of the same photo. Even the bottom one is slightly different to the Blue King at Didcot yet they are supposed to be the same. My Dublo City I have just posted on that thread was done with RAL5002 mixed at Halfords. I always preferred Agfachrome as Kodachrome had a red tint and Ektachrome a blue tint to my eyes, others thought Agfachrome had a green cast so as individuals we all may see something different. Are these drawings I copied recently any good? They show the dimensions of the M/N compared to the W/C. Garry

Hi Brian, I have to say the Farish Spam Can's do look nice, especially for something about 50/60 years old. I like yours in green, more so with standard lines all the way down. To me a Spam Can does not look right with the box type lining on the cab and tender. Did you cut out the cab floor for the Dublo chassis so the Ringfield fitted or did you change the motor? Mine is going to use the A4 chassis as soon as I sort out some axles. At least you got the top line in the correct place, Farish has it far too high but as I want to keep its originality it will stay like that. If I could not have touched up the paintwork then it would have been repainted fully. I have bought the W/B/W lining in case I needed it but I also wanted it for a Millholme Models M/N which I also want to paint in blue. It was interesting having to have tested it as a 3-rail one, what was the layout you ran it on called "Syward Junction" from "I'ad that"? Garry

Here are some maroon repaints I have done of both the City and Duchess locos. Dublo's maroon did seem an odd colour shade especially some versions that had nearly pink looking cylinders. Mine were done with a metallic shade which is hardly noticeable after varnishing. I do have an LMS repaint as I needed one for my Exley lined out set, this again was metallic but a different shade. One photo shows my LMS version with an original Atholl and London for comparison. Garry

Yes Ray, a long, long time ago. I never had one, was always going to buy one or two but never got around to it. I have a Gaugemaster one from about 5 years ago but not wired it up yet. I cannot remember, but think I was told by Gaugemaster that there may be an issue if using Dublo track having the metal base as a common return if more than one controller was used. Garry

Hi David, Here are some comparison shots with a Wrenn Spam Can body along side, the cab rear ends are aligned up. The Wrenn is 168mm and the Farish 175mm from Buffer beam front to the rear of the Cab floor (also end of the sides). The Wrenn does have a little extra overhang past the rear draw beam. The buffer beam is a casting with three holes, two for the locating pips which hold the smoke deflectors on and one to screw into the body to hold it. This was quite soft and easily broke trying to drill a small hole and again when filing it. The main difference between the two in real life is the distance from the rear driving axle to the pony wheel and then from there to the rear. There is a 3" difference between centre and rear driving wheels I think but all the other measurements are about the same. Regarding colour photos not only do emulsions change over time but between AgfaChrome/Ektachrome/Kodachrome there were different hues/casts to different peoples eyes. A clean or dirty loco, a dull or sunny day can give a different shade too as can underexposure (darker) and overexposure (lighter). I have included two photos of the same shot from different web sites and they show a change in colour. Garry

The answer Paul is I do not know. I do have to make a new buffer beam as this one just fell apart trying to arrange some buffers, probably mazak rot but I don't think the body is the same so should be okay. Just received a tender chassis and will look for some Dublo axles for the Boxpoks. I have a few other locos on the go plus layout it is time fitting it all in, as well as a wife and 3 small children lol. It looks good with nameplates and transfers now though. The colour in this photograph is quite close to the models true shade. Garry ps Someone said in an earlier post they thought their nameplate had slipped as it was lower, not really as Merchant Navy's usually had theirs this low. Farish put them on high at times.

Queen Elizabeth. Here is my Blue City loco recently painted. The City of London is how it looked before stripping (I did not have a "scrapper" as such so this was used). It is finished off with the colour RAL5002 which from a model and real railway paint supplier in the 80's said this was the closest. The transfers were actually for the 8F shaped tender so the tender has had about 4 sections cut and swapped used to make up the shape seen here. I am too tight (being a Yorkshireman) to buy a set when these would never be used and who wants a blue 8F? The three quarter view is slightly lighter where as the side view is more like the colour. I do like using Modelmaster nameplates though as they do a full set specifically for Dublo locos in Stainless Steel, that is to fit the cast moulding as well as a scale set. Garry

Farish Merchant Navy - Part 1 Having recently obtained a diecast Farish M/N body and tender in blue, from member 5050, I wanted to keep its paintwork as original as possible so using a paint as close a match as I could I painted over every rivet head and scratch where metal showed through. One smoke deflector had to be all repainted, the other in places as can be seen from the three individual photos (these three were taken by 5050 (Paul) and the blue is lighter here due to the flash). I have not masked anything off and did the same touching up on the black. The white lines were touched in again freehand as I did not want to risk pulling anything off not knowing how Farish's paint held up to start with. I took the decision to not adjust white line widths but to keep as original as possible again.The bodies were satin sprayed to see if my touch up was suitable to allow nameplates and numbers to be added, I guess Yes, possibly tonight's job. There are a couple of places I missed having seen it in daylight but that will be done later. I have stripped and fitted a Dublo A4 chassis to make sure I can get it in making a brass mounting plate at the rear. Part 2 to follow later. The blue is a lovely shade not quite but similar to the one in the real loco photo.