young37215

The Bachmann Queen Mary breaks down quite easily with 4 screws enabling the constituent parts to be separated. I decided to hand paint thinking that might create a more worn appearance. Using an old tin of a Humbrol grey paint, two light coats produced a pleasing effect. I need to add the yellow band to the body side and a third coat of grey. A single coat of roof dirt will get another coat to deepen the colour but overall I’m happy with progress. 
 

I am doing a little preparation for a day or two of airbrushing with several BSOT's needing varnishing and weathering in addition to a number of wagons requiring their framework weathering. As ever I have been distracted by another task on the long list of 'to do's', the Queen Mary brake van DS56292 that usually sat in a siding at Crianlarich. It did move around on occassion, in 1986 it got to Fort William as in the first picture below. I acquired an olive green Queen Mary a while ago and am looking for the colours I need to do a repaint. I am not sure if the livery was a very faded variation of engineers grey and the consequences of sitting in the damp for several years or something else. Given how faded the paint is I am not sure that identfying the original colour is necessary but if anyone can clarify it would be helpful.

In 1986 it also had a trip to Bridge of Orchy

There are 2 more pictures in the attached thread showing the Queen Mary in her more usual position at Crianlarich together with a brief comment on the reasons for her being outposted there.

16 hours ago, Moonter said:

I was watching these amazing films and they made me think of your layout.

Peak Rail Presents - Doug Copley's Lineside Images #3.1- Fort William to Mallaig (undated) (youtube.com)

Peak Rail Presents - Doug Copley's Lineside Images #3.2 Kyle of Lochalsh to Inverness (1986-88)

 

 

Doug Copley's videos are well worth a watch by fans of the 1980's, his Oban line dates slightly later than my era but still a useful reference source. The Royal Scotsman material is some of the best that I have seen. I think I have said before that I hope that somewhere in the archives is some more WHL specific material.

The epoxy resin arrived yesterday. I need to create the base for the small Lochan to try it out and have ordered several different shades of the Woodland Scenics water undercoats for the base. As Bod says, much trial and no doubt error to come!

Nice work with the lever frame. On the basis that there are 2 FPL's on the frame as shown on the signal box track diagram, I am guessing that the 2 point rodding runs will have been for the FPL and the point.

14 hours ago, BoD said:

I see Bachmann has announced more Mk1 TSOs in blue/grey.  Hooray!!!!

End steps removed where appropriate. Hooray!!!

Bogies fitted with electrical pickups. Maybe useful. Extra drag ?

Optional version with fitted passengers. £10 extra.  Jury’s out.

 

The prices though.  Ouch!!!!!!

The blue and grey re-runs are long overdue albeit Bachmann prices are increasingly eye watering. With the usual 15% to rrp discounts, £50 a coach compares with Ebay prices that I have seen Mk1s changing hands for in recent months and I don't think Bachmann will struggle to sell them. Personally I have more Mk1's than I need for WHL4 although I am interested in the electrical pick ups because I plan to add lighting to the coach fleet. I know that there are options available to add pick ups to existing coaches like the DCC Concepts wheel springs, but if Bachmann make the bogies with electrical pick ups available through their spares outlet I will be taking a close look. 

I am still working my way through the maze of epoxy resins that I might use for the lochans. I have not yet got certainty as to exactly what the Woodland Scenic Deep Pour water comprises but I am failrly certain that it is epoxy resin. Compared with alternative clear epoxy resins, it is at least 3 x the price meaning if I can find one that can be coloured and I feel comfortable with, I will probably try this. 

Nice job with the duff, the original 47569 was 1 of 2 ETH 47's I never had for haulage. Having repainted a couple of locos in the last year or two I know how rewarding it can be when you get to a finished loco.  

On 04/02/2024 at 21:02, ISW said:

 

Rob,

 

In which case, just use a thin sheet of mirror. If that's 'too' reflective, then a thin sheet of glass with the back painted black will also work.  I've seen the same 'trick' used by Andrew Peters in depots to create puddles.

 

Ian

Nice idea Ian but the shape of the lochan will be irregular and I want to create the illusion of depth which I think will be best achieved using a resin. I know nothing of resins so I had a read up on them yesterday and find that, as ever, there are lots of choices. It seem that epoxy resins are the least toxic and easiest to work with,  @TheGreenHowards suggested resin is a polyester resin which stink and are rather toxic albeit are noticeably cheaper. Although I cannot find out exactly what the Woodland Scenics product comprises, from the comments in their marketing it seems fairly evident that it is an epoxy resin. WS also caution care with the paint used to colour the base landscape, it seems that emulsion can react with their product and so I'll need to use something else to cover and seal the area. 

In addition to some more running I will be working on the lochan area landscape over the coming week. My aim is to create an area where a 10mm depth of resin will be required and I'll see how the landscape works out before making a final decision on the product I use to fill it. Having filled my head with questions about the choices of resin, some running was required to provide a distraction. 37112 approaches Garelochead with an Oban service.

Thanks to everyone for their response, this has been a useful exercise and gone a long way to clarifying my thoughts. I have also learnt a new word, lochan is not something I had heard before. From the responses and my research I consider a resin product will give the best effect for the lochans on WHL4. I have looked at a few resin options and all seem similarly priced and fairly expensive. I am currently leaning towards the Woodland Scenics product where I think the Murky Deep Pour is the way to go. The link below shows an excellent resin pour in a diaroma where the landscape most closely resembles WHL4. Whether I add the Modpodge will be a decision taken after the resin has been poured and allowed to dry.  

As a next step I need to do some more work on the base of the lochans. I think a layer or two of clingfilm covered with plaster cloth will create a watertight area as well as raising the height of the central floor area into which I pour the resin. I am hoping that by raising the central height I'll reduce the amount of resin required. As a starter I'll trial this on the small lochan first to gain some experience and see how things work before attempting the bigger area. Watch this space, I might need to have a few days of running to build up some momentum before starting! 

Progress with the mountaineous section has been slow largely because I cannot quite get clear in my head what I want to see. I plan to include a loch running along side the track as it approaches the gradient summit of about 1000mm in length and 120mm width as shown in the picture below. The smaller area marked will also be filled with a water effect product as a test and learning experience for the loch. I need to tweak the landscape and paint the 'floor' of the loch a darker colour to emphasise the depth. It will require a resin or similar product to create the water effect which is something I have zero experience of. I have watched a few Youtube videos where Woodland Scenics Deep Pour water has been used to good effect and am tempted to try this out. It is not cheap, £40 plus a bottle for 12 fluid ounces and I need at least 2 bottles for the loch. 

Does anyone have experiences of Woodland Scenics Deep Pour to share or counsel to give on what else I could use to create the visual appearance of water?

What I am looking to create is a variation on the bottom end of Loch Eilt to the north of Glenfinnan. 

If I can recreate the reflection effect I will be a happy camper

With a modest amount of effort WHL4 has a 4th BSOT with SC9005 now available for service. I went for the cheap and cheerful, time saving approach again by not doing the internal work to create the buffet counter and standing area which saves a few hours work. Only 1 of my 4 BSOT's has been treated with the full conversion, whilst I plan to do the full conversion over time, having run the BSOT fleet for several months I have not noticed the difference. Weathering and the red stripe designating the buffet area are outstanding, otherwise the coach is complete. 

I'll repeat my previous observations that the addition of 20 g of lead (10g at each end over the bogies) to bring the weight up to similar to the Bachmann Mk1's makes the coach feel more robust and easing the back to back on the factory produced tight wheel sets can only help improve running. Having made these adjustments to my 3 existing BSOT conversions the improvment in running is noticeable, I do not recall a BSOT derailing since they have been updated when previously they were prone to doing so on the entry and exit small radius pointwork of the main fiddle yard.

Renumbered coach and window covering added. 

Guards periscopes cut away, a layer of roof dirt weathering will cover the scratches

End steps removed and painted over. I'll leave the Hornby molded hand rail and pipework

Ready for service, I'll swap this with a BSK into one of the Mallaig rakes 

Slowly onwards with all 5 signal boxes nearing completion. Although a lot of work has been required which will not be obviously visible, I plan to have lighting in the boxes which should make the detail more visible. The knowledge that the boxes are reasonably accurately detailed also makes me feel good.

Mallaig was reasonably straightforward once I had found a picture of the internal layout. The view below only requires the addition of a seat and a signalman to be complete. 

Crianlarich has been fiddly because the dimensions of my model are smaller than the real thing. On WHL4 the signal box has 3 sets of windows to the platform whereas on the real thing it is 4 which make WHL4's signal box 25% undersized. As a consequence the lever frame has been shortened from 24 to 20 and even then remains a tight fit. I need to add desks for the signalmans train register and the 2 token machines. Annoyingly I painted the desks red, not brown which I want to correct. I managed to get the right colour white for the windows!

Crianlarich was one of the few signal boxes on the WHL which was occupied full time. This meant that all of the signalling equipment was contained within the box, on the down platform side this comprised most of the instrumentation in addition to the lever frame. I had to trim down the Ratio equipment to fit the box, when superglued in place it looks the part. 

Awaiting repainting and fitting is the residual furniture and equipment for Crianlarich. Despite being a junction, only 2 token machines were required because the line north was tokenless block through to Rannoch.

In between the signal box work I started a new running day. 37111 had charge of the down sleeper and is seen waiting departure from Crianlarich.

On 20/01/2024 at 19:05, meanach said:

‘They pretty much all had the fireplaces in place when I started Ian , not sure when they were removed though . Most of the signalmen had electric heaters on though . ‘This is a reply from John Hynd who is a bit of a legend of a driver at the fort. He started late 79. 
 

Fantastic interior work Rob ! 

Given that most of the signal boxes only contained lever frames and were uninhabited for most of the day, I cannot see that heating the boxes will have been a major concern. I do'nt recall seeing chimney smoke coming from any of the signal box or station building pictures that I have looked at along the way. My suspicion is that post the end of steam, coal for the fires will have been less easily available hence the introduction of electric heaters in signal boxes and, in all probability, station buildings. I also think more widespread use of electricity for lighting explains some of the cable trunking that appeared in the 70's and 80's.

Ever onwards, yesterday I completed Arrochar signal box and made good progress with Ardlui. In the course of working on Ardlui I discovered an error made on the construction of my signal box where there door faces west, not south as it does on the real thing. It is no big deal and I won't be changing anything, it is just a minor irritation which I have been blissfully ignorant of for the last 5 years. It is largely invisible on the layout being on the farside of the usual viewing angle. Of greater concern is a lack of pictures of the inside of Ardlui signal box other than the lever frame. By this I mean the area where the residual signalling equipment was relocated on the demolition of the station building which leaves little option but to make an educated guess as to the make up of the area.

Completed internal arrangement of Arrochar signal box, 2 down

Ardlui 15 lever frame takes shape, the 2 end levers were repainted and are currently drying.

I finally managed to get 2 sets of suitable Hornby Commonwealth bogies from Ebay after 6 months of searching albeit rather expensively at £20 a set. These clip easily on to the chassis and after adjusting the back to backs, seem to run smoothly. Running quality is critical for me and was the main reason for my determination to get Hornby bogies. 

Now I can focus on creating additional BSOT's, I plan numbers 9005 and 9003 which were early SCR arrivals. First up will be 9005 where a 1983 picture of one side of 9005 is below. The only picture I can find for the opposite side is an early view with the old BSO number E9373 which can be seen at the Facebook link at the bottom of the post. Ideally I would like a better picture of both sides to determine where the red stripe above the windows should go and the Buffet signage that was applied to the window on the side opposite the counter. I cannot find any pictures on Flickr, does anyone have any suggestions as to where I might find pictures for 9005 and 9003? 

https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10230917969868684

36 minutes ago, Modelu Chris said:

Good afternoon! Venturing off my usual page. If you drop us an email I'm sure we can sort something. Not having it on the cabinet is fine (Please see picture) but some CAD work would need to be done for your changes. 

 

 

Kind regards,

Chris

What a constructive response which sounds very positive. I will correspond with Modelu and see where it leads. If anyone else is intested in the Tyers 12 it might be an idea to register your interest with Modelu, obviously the more they sell, the more attractive it becomes to produce a new design.

My researching the signal boxes has led me to conclude that only 2 of the signal boxes on WHL4, (Ardlui and Crianlarich) had more than lever frames in them. Photgraphic evidence of Arrochar and Garelochead shows this reasonably clearly which simplifies the work I plan for now which will be signal box detailing only. I plan to fit out my station buidings at some stage meaning I will still need 8 token machines. What will be more challenging is finding pictures of the internal layout of the station buildings along the line. I have plans of the internal layout of the standard building but nothing for Crianlarich. Given it has been quite a challenge to find signal box pictures and I do not recall seeing any internal pictures of buildings along the way, I am not optimistic of internal station building pictures being available. Of course if anyone knows or can suggest where I might find anything I would be grateful.

The last of my research projects, Garelochead. Another chimney with no obvious signs of an internal fire/stove can be seen as late as 1987.

Only the lever frame can be seen in this internal shot

19 hours ago, Dunalastair said:

 

Before the time of your evocative model, but were they tiles? They look much more like typical Scottish slates - quite probably from the Ballachulish quarries. If not Ballachulish then perhaps Aberfoyle, as the NG tramway down the hill connected with the Strathendrick and Aberfoyle / NBR, whereas the lochside pits at Ballachulish connected (by a shorter NG tramway) to the C&OR / CR branch. It might make more sense to use material which generated carriage revenue for your own railway. 

Unquestionably slates, my error. This is what can happen when a southerner models Scottish landscapes!

I am considering approaching Modelu to see if they can do a custom order of token machines. I need 8 and only want the machine, not the machine and cabinet which is what Modelu currently offer. I would also like the machine to be a Tyers No 12, at present they only make a Tyers No 8 because my research has identified that the Tyers No 12 was what was used on the WHL. You can see the red machines in a couple of the pictures of the last few days. 

Tyers No 12 is subtlely different from the No 8

Crianlarich token machines,

Tyndrum token machines, 

On 12/01/2024 at 15:53, Fishplate said:

 

Hi @young37215, have you seen this site? :

 

 https://signalbox.org/photo-gallery/north-british-railway/arrochar-tarbet/

Yes thank you. It is of limited use for the WHL although Arrochar is one of the few signal boxes it covers albeit in relatively superficial detail.  

On 12/01/2024 at 18:43, 37081LochLong said:

I take it Ardlui was different since the station building burnt down and there was always someone in the little box when I was there?

The 1970 shot pre demolition shows the lever frame to the eastern side of the box. There is nothing else visible indicating that the rest of the equipment must have been in the station building. Again there is a chimney but no evidence of a fireplace which leads me to suspect that electricity had been connected and an electric fire had replaced the coal stove of old.

The 1977 picture shows how the residual equipment was crammed in and the thunder box added for the signalmans convenience. All were removed after the introduction of RETB and the destaffing of the station. Note the roof has  had the tiles slates removed which appears to have been replaced with felt of some decription.

No expense was spared to provide passenger comfort on the WHL in the 1980's as the extensive, airline style passenger lounge shows! The token machines can just be made out at the back of the box on the western side.

The Ardlui box on WHL made by Ed Hall matches the 1984 shot quite nicely although I need to add the thunder box. 

Whilst away I have been looking at the Arrochar signal box with a view to deciding on the internal fit out for WHL4. I would like to get this as close to reality as I can hence my researching for pictures of the internal layout in the 1980's. The signal box on the south end of the station platform was bog standard WHL design, the 1984 view below shows very little of the usual paraphinalia that would be expected to be seen in a signal box. I have read that that token machines, telephones and other associated equipment were frequently housed in the station building which I assume must have been the case at Arrochar.  

Mr Llangollen Signal Man has some helpful material covering much of the WHL, his 1984 view of the Arrochar 17 lever Saxby & Farmer frame is a good starting point.  

The internal signal diagram on the wall above the lever frame has reflections of what might be token machines although these are not visible in other pictures around the same date. More pictures of the internal layout would be helpful.

Externally there were a couple of unique features namely the adjoining relay box and the chimney. Other pictures indicate that there was no fire in the building on the 1980's, again I am guessing that the fire had been removed some time earlier.

This 1978 view appears to support my view of a lack of fire, there is no smoke coming from the chimney and if there was no fire on a day like this then I suspect there was no fireplace!

In summary I have enough information to fit out the signal box although I am not 100% certain on all of the detail. If anyone has any more detailed information I would like to hear from them.