otherplanet

Thank you. Unfortunately Andrew Stadden's figures, whilst beautiful, do not really include any in suitable poses for drivers. I had forgotten about Dart castings, which is odd since I do have some of their other kits in my stock box. Unfortunately most of their figures with suitable poses are also in uniform, but there are definitely some possibilities there. Thanks.

Could anyone please help with sources of model drivers for fitting into the cab of road vehicles. Specifically my interest is Edwardian to mid 1920s. Ideally I am looking for cast metal as they are for 00 scale radio controlled vehicles, therefore every fraction of a gram is valuable for traction / steering performance. But resin, 3D prints etc are tolerable if metal is not available. I am also most interested in general goods, IE not uniformed bus drivers, although these are of interest. I am modelling in 00 scale, but I am open to using 1:87, especially as the inside of model cabs tend to be undersize due to practical limitations on wall / roof thickness. I already have a good stock of Langley figures, but run out of the most suitable without resorting to duplicates, so wish to move away from this as my main source. They also seem a little large (again especially when squeezing into a cab) I have found some good sources on military figure sites. But they tend to have very distinctive uniforms. Whilst I don't mind a bit of tweaking, filing or adding sculpting paste. I would prefer to minimise the effort. similarly locomotive footplate crew tend to be uniformed and often the wrong pose, although at least raised arms are easier to repose than when folded in the lap or other normal seated figure poses. Any suggestions welcome. Thank you in advance

Technically the Kiel Kraft Foden is the C-type that wasn't launched until the 20s. The WW1 model is the 'Foden 5 ton'. Which has squarer panels down the side of the boiler rather than flared. Traction engine steering rather than Ackerman and a number of other differences. But you may consider the differences small enough to suit your needs.

As usual, its taken some time to make progress. Mainly due to other distractions, but particularly because the uncoupling mechanism has been really fighting me. I'm still not happy with it. the rail uncoupling works well, other than it doesn't retract far enough into the body when its finished. Which means it then gets in the way of the road tail hook. Also the road tail hook is pushed down by the servo and is then sprung open, which means if the trailer is only partially engaged, it tries to break the servo out of its mount, which is a shame because otherwise it works beautifully. I will attempt to improve it for the next one, but its held up progress for too long. So I intend to pause it now and move on to test other aspects. Anyway Here is a short video, please excuse the manual handling to push it back and forth. With no weight inside, smooth hard tyres and big fat wires going to the external servo, it doesn't self propel to any useful degree yet.

What are the dimensions of the receiver? It could also potentially be used for other applications, for example, controlling the gates of a distant level crossing without having to route wires through to it. Or maybe have side doors on a milk van that open whilst at the platform?

So, disappointingly, the gears I ordered from kkpmo have failed to arrive. They initially sent someone else's order and after several emails to get them to answer, they agreed to resend the correct parts, but still no sign of them, and its all gone quiet on the email front. Which is all rather frustrating as apart from the cost, some are sizes not available from other sites like Sol-Expert. Whilst considering whether I can find a ratio I can buy without having to change the currently printed chassis, it occurred to me to try printing a set of gears. Its something I had planned to try at some point anyway, so time to give it a go. Searching online for guides on modelling gear profiles, I discovered that Onshape (the CAD tool I use) has a gear profile function to download, so creating the models was really easy. I have added a flange to the rear face to give something for the support structures to attach to. I also printed a test plate with stub axles to test them on. Shown in mesh are 10tooth, 15tooth and 14tooth Mod 0.2 gears. The profiles are pretty good, but 'very' slightly over sized, the 14 and 15tooth gears are on axles that are 0.1mm further apart than they should be. But otherwise, these were slightly tight to start with but ran in quite quickly. They are as printed except boring out the hole in the middle. The gear to the left is 14tooth but with a 2mm hole to fit directly to the output shaft of the 6mm gear motor. I am sure these will not be as strong as proper acetal gears, but they certainly run OK to start with. Having built them into the chassis, they run well enough for the tractor to drag itself and a trailer with the receiver on it around. (although the drive wheels have very poor traction, being hard plastic with no plasti-dip on them). They are showing a little dust on the teeth after running for a bit, its not clear whether this is just from running in, or will continue to deteriorate. I have since tried a slightly different design that I can sand the flange off after printing, Which will allow me to get the maximum length of gear for maximum strength. I intend to try these shortly, with a bit of silicon grease to minimise the wear and then see how long they last on a life test. Either way, this definitely works as a method of assessing a chosen gear ratio before ordering proper parts. I did try to make some videos of this first run, but they didnt come put well, so I will have to try again soon. However the next step (before life testing) is to get the uncoupling system working properly. The rail uncoupler works, but the tow hook for the road trailer is still fighting me at the moment, it needs a bit more precision and planning to get the rather close dimensions to work properly Assuming I can resist the temptation to try building a differential!

Hoorah to exhibitions getting going again.

Ahh. I understand now. Thank you

Thank you both. I am pleased with the progress. PhilJ W. Do you mean the picture on page 10? I suspect the dash panel in that photo may still be in grey primer as they appear to have not finished building the cab. I quite liked the idea of yellow, although probably more ochre as looking up that gamboge it sounds rather expensive. I know that the Edwardian tastes were sometimes quite garish, as characterised by the range of pre grouping liveries. But if that panel is grey, then it suggests the proper paint job is a darker shade. Ultimately you are correct. rule 1. Thank you

Thank you. I hadn't thought so much could be assessed from the monochrome photos, your comments about the yellow and reds are interesting, I had been wondering about a yellow, but shall put that to one side. The light green and grey seem the most promising if I cannot find any original details. Thank you again

Does anybody know what colour the Stronach Dutton tractors, manufactured by Guy motors for RoadRails Ltd were painted? Most specifically the one that ran on the Stronchie Distillery tramway, not that I have any reason to think it was different from the others, so any information is welcome. I have been unable to find any reference to the colour in any literature, the book by R.G. Cash, or web site. I know the colour was changed for the later Beardmore vehicles, as used on the Wembley tourist line, the restored coach is painted dark green which I presume is correct. But the Guy tractors are clearly a much lighter colour, and I am fairly sure I have read some reference to this being a deliberate change. although I cant find it original now to double check. Obviously all the original photos are monchrome, which leaves the original colour being a light shade of almost anything between green, blue or even yellow. Plus of course grey. (sorry I don't own any original pictures to illustrate the point.) http://dave-mills.yolasite.com/stronach-dutton-road-rail.php I would appreciate any information that could help with completing my models in the correct colour. Thank you

Some progress with the CAD and the build. I have now CAD modelled the complete vehicle, printed everything and put them together as a dry run. Some of the smaller detail parts are still on the bench (steering wheel, gear levers, tail light) and there are others which will be made from scratch. The grills over the large open sections at the rear will be cut from etched mesh, which I need to get around to ordering soon. I did print the starting handle, just to see how the printer would cope, It came out beautifully, but its far too flimsy to survive and the final one will be made up from wire. There are still bits of fettling to do, some of the print supports have not been fully cleaned off for example and nothing is glued, just pressed or clipped together, the front dashpanel for example is just pressed into a tight fit pocket, and the windscreen is held on mostly by wishful thinking. The front suspension has come out particularly well. I found some model rivets online in 0.3, 0.5 and 0.8mm diameter. So have designed the front axle to make use of these. (the 0.5 specifically) these are a great improvement over bent brass wire, firstly they are a spot on 0.5mm, so with a matching drill, I get a nice tight fit on the static side, but a little extra work leaves the moving joint nicely running. The head of the rivet seems to hold well and looks much better. As mentioned above, the printed steering knuckles proved much stronger than I had hoped, I designed them to be cut from brass channel, but after such a promising print, I have amended the design to add some bosses around the bearings and stiffened it up a little more. The front wheels have a short length of 0.7OD brass tube inserted into the hub, and the 0.5mm rivet is then passed through this, through a M1.0 washer and then glued through a boss in the knuckle. The track rod will eventually be clipped off under the joints, but not until after painting. (the assembly is resting on a set of wide blade tweezers to stop it rolling away.) The two bosses on the top of the axle are for the compensation mechanism, the one at the rear is an optional feature to connect the coupling bar to that runs to the rear of the vehicle. This should be connected to the rail bogie, but I am allowing for some trials to see what works best in model form. (this is the back up plan) Over all, I am really pleased with this assembly, the wheels run smoothly and the knuckles turn freely, but there is negligible slop. I am also very pleased with how the more subtle details have printed. The embossed ribs just behind the cab and around the dash panel look good despite being very small, only about 150um tall for the concentric squares. but the makers plate and headlamp aperture covers on the front have lost definition and don't really stand out, I will probably tweak the model and re-print this part. The structures inside the rear of the engine bay are to clip a servo into. Most of the photos of the prototype show this space as being fairly empty although I think the radiator and cooling system was in here. The coarse mesh grills combined with 1920's photo editing also obscure what little detail there was, but I am sure it will be more obscured in the model, however, the servo should allow the coupling to work. Some of the photos of early versions of these guy tractors at had a hinged buffer beam at the rear, that looks like its intended to allow some basic shunting, probably when the vehicle is in road mode (it cant reverse properly when in rail mode as there is no steering.) I did attempt to model this as well, it printed beautifully, but I could not open up the holes in the brackets on the rear axle that it hinges on and the buffer is just too flimsy. (photos of the prototype one suggest they had a similar problem and its not seen in most photos so I think they gave up with it.) I will upscale it a little and make it from metal, and attach the brackets as new larger seperate parts. as I am hoping it will work well enough to keep the 'hand of god' off the model. in which case it will be worth the modeller's license Next steps are to get the motor, gears and steering servo installed. This is mainly waiting on the gears to arrive for the drive train. I also need to decide what colour to paint it. I have not found any reference as to the colour of these early vehicles. The company changed colour scheme to a dark green with the introduction of the later Beardmore steam tractors for the official Wembley tourist line. But these Guy tractors were much lighter in colour. If anyone knows anything please let me know, I will also ask in the Questions section on the forum.

No criticism meant, only jealousy

Personally, I consider It is a shame that you are focussed on the N gauge market. These look a really nice, broad and detailed range. Whilst I don't expect to be buying any, as my preferred scale is larger, I thoroughly wish you well. You deserve great success for your efforts.

Yes. 4mm. Thank you. I did consider going up to 7mm, but decided it is possible to get everything in, and it will reduce the layout size and hopefully reduce the time needed to build a layout. Assuming I can get it to work. I may yet regret that decision.

Next installment, this bit should help to identify the prototype to anyone who knows what they are. This is a Stronach Dutton patent tractor, made by Guy Motors for the RoadRails company. It was invented to overcome the theoretical limitation of light railways that the weight of the locomotive needed to haul heavy loads resulted in the track needing to be made heavier and therefore more expensive than required for the wagons themselves. additionally, that the earthworks involved in minimising gradients also added to the cost. The tractors use the rail bogie at the front to steer and guide the vehicle along the line, whilst the big rubber tyres on the rear provide the traction with high grip to the ground. Additionally, the vehicle can demount from the bogie using a set of ramps, and drive off on the road, hauling a normal road wagon. Whilst an oddity, I do not claim novelty on this model, there has been a very good website http://dave-mills.yolasite.com/stronach-dutton-road-rail.php and a book by R.G. Cash from which I have taken a lot of inspiration. There is also a video on the BFI https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-the-stronach-dutton-road-rail-tractor-1925-online all of which are reference previously in RM web. There have also been a few models, including a representation of the principle on 'Ankh Lesspork' (I think I have that right) I haven't however seen any attempts to make a model of these particular vehicles. please tell me if you know different. Obviously, the big opportunity for me, and the reason I have put this in the radio control section, is that I am planning to model this with radio control, so that I can run them both on the rails and on the road, (and hopefully demount them in between). The plan is to put a servo in the large box on the far side, on the near side there is a hinged lid which will secure the gear motor, which then drives through a couple of spur gears to the central drive shaft which runs to the top of the prototypically HUGE differential case. There should be space above the motor for a battery and the receiver. and behind all of these on the platform above the driving wheels there is enough space for a second servo, which will hopefully operate and uncoupling mechanism for both the road trailer and, using a magnet similar to the unimog shared by Eduard above, hopefully the railway wagon tow bar. Next step is to update the bogie design based on this first build and then model the cab and bodywork, at least the basic shapes. Meanwhile I need to order the gears so I can get it running.

Oh well, thanks anyway. That's an interesting prototype, it could make a nice model, I wonder if they made more of them than they made roadrail tractors. I see a commonality between your booklet and the content of the website. http://www.historywebsite.co.uk/Museum/Transport/commercial/Guy/guyhistory2.htm

Sorry I'm late to spotting this thread. The upper photo is relatively common (for an almost unheard of prototype). It can be found in a few modern sources including the book by RG Cash, which includes the original photo with the background of the factory still intact, as well as this modified version. Guy motors and RoadRails both used it in their publicity materials. Guy seem to have been very proud of a vehicle which seems to have been quite troublesome to a number of its owners. The second picture is much rarer, there is one copy from a website about Guy. It's the only one I have seen that shows the engine to any level of detail. Although Commercial Motor magazine archives have some reasonable pictures of other aspects of the drive train. I presume there are no other pictures of it in the booklet? As with most old photos, there are very few good quality images of the rear / rear quarter and none of the cab interior. Oh, and It ran on 2ft gauge track

Its been a while, much building & decorating work, along with family etc have kept me quiet. But with the painting all done by Christmas I was finally able to justify treating myself to a 3D printer in the black friday sale. Its a Phrozen Sonic Mini 4K, DLP resin printer I have been working on the CAD for my first model over the holiday. This is intended to be the main vehicle(s) for a new layout and is the first RC vehicle built from scratch for me. (if CAD modelling and then printing counts as scratch building). I expect to need multiple to allow 1 in operation, 1 charging and 1 spare, as a bare minimum. However I have started with a functional prototype, I have only focused on functional detail: how thin, how small, how strong, do they fit. Basically all trying out the capabilities of the printer, and teaching myself how to use it. A process which is definitely still in progress as I didnt manage to get all the supports in the right place and havent yet got the measure of the amount of swelling I need to compensate for when parts need to fit together. Its also just the chassis and wheels Anyway. here it is. A somewhat unusual method of compensation for the front wheels, an attempt to avoid the need for pivot point in the middle. I am pleased so far. there are a few bits which need beefing up, but mostly its much stronger than I had hoped. Its printed much finer detail that I had hoped and finer features than I had hoped. Those leaf springs are only 200um thick. So a few improvements, and then I can get on with some of the body and putting in more detail. Dont hold your breath, printing is quick but my modelling is still slow. Any guesses as to the prototype?

A wagon turntable. Does this mean you are planning cable shunting, or a walking man pushing the wagons along the river quay? All looks interesting.

Congratulation Giles. Nice work. I have been intrigued since you first mentioned it, as to what you would include and how. I hope it sells well and inspires more people to have a go.

Yes, very much like that. A very nice piece of work, well done. Unfortunately most of the 4mm scale cranes do not have the gears so well cast, in fact many have them cast in situ. And I won't have the space to mount the motor above the base board like that, so I think the challenge will be harder. I also only need a relatively light weight 1 to 2 ton capacity for the prototype. I am quite tempted to go for a wooden framed crane with a full height vertical post and the big windlass wheel at the top that is operated via a chain. I am thinking that could give me a route to put the motor in the base and hide a spindle up through the post to drive the cable spool at the top. Not fully planned it all through yet though. May well change it by the time I actually attempt to build something.

You under estimate the attention that can be generated in learning from a master. Keep going, I'm interested in how you make use of the new printer, I'm planning to treat myself to one in the near future.

Brilliant Giles, I have been trying to work out how do do exactly this, but with V skip wagons. You are way ahead of me. That motion is perfect.

Then you should visit us on the 'Radio Control' topic and we can show you how. You are right, it really adds another dimension.iframe widget