mikemeg

Jonte, Don't worry about raising queries, most of what I've learned was accumulated by raising queries or just making a bloody nuisance of myself, so I'm happy for someone else to do the same. Your query about faded whitewash, I would think so but really (and you know what I'm going to say here) the only way to ascertain this is to try it. For a whitewashed wall, I would be inclined to do the bricks as per the posting above and then use a different medium (not watercolour) for the whitewash, as otherwise (if you do use white watercolour) the whitewash will be coloured by the watercolours underneath. I'd probably spray the whitewash on - Projektpaint matt white - and then, once that is hard and dry, apply the dilute black wash though using pure turps as the diluting agent. For some reason, pure turps does seem to affect projektpaint (and yes it is spelt with a 'k') - usual disclaimer; it's just very good. Do this spraying from a distance further 'than it says on the tin' and just 'flick' the spray head over the brickwork and you will get a much more random coverage more redolent of faded whitewash. If you wanted some of the whitewash to be missing or cracked, then you could use a masking agent on the watercoloured bricks before spraying. Again, that masking agent needs to be non water soluble otherwise it will dissolve the brick colours. There is a technique using grains of rock salt, which are much larger than grains of ordinary table salt, and are just placed on the piece, randomly. This technique is much used by watercolour artists. A very light spraying from a distance too great to cause the rock salt grains to move; wait for the paint to dry and then just brush off the rock salt grains. This will leave 'pock marks' in the whitewash. These basic techniques I picked up from a guy who made models for Pendon; I watched him for around two hours at an exhibition. He turned white card into something beyond belief so I knew it could be done. I've just added a few touches to his techniques. Cheers Mike

James, There is a separate thread under Kitbuilding and Scratch Building about building the Q5/2 (apologies if you already know this) which is a test build of one of Arthur Kimber's loco kits soon to be available for sale. The Q5/1 is almost ready for sale. Arthur has plans for a number of ex-NER prototypes and as long as he makes em, then I'll build em, though I do need the LNER 'staples' B1, D49, K3, J39, L1, V2, V3 etc. as well as the ubiquitous WD's. I once worked out that in 1950 Hull had around forty different classes shedded across its four sheds. Add to that the ex-GC, ex-GN and even ex-GE locos, the ex-works locos from Doncaster on running in turns as well as the ex-LMS and its constituents' locos, which worked into or through the town and this was some place to see locomotives. Now, with only a handful of locomotive classes it is hard to believe that such variety could ever have existed. Cheers Mike

Nick, Thanks for that. I'm no brick layer so don't know the correct names but I'll now modify the post above. Cheers Mike

Firstly thanks to my old mate Mick Nicholson for his posting above. I've said a few times but will say again, without Mick's archive of plans, photographs, etc. none of this could have been done. I don't know what happened to that Patriot but many of the techniques which were first practised on that model I still use, though I've learnt to build in brass and nickel silver, since then. So, Jonte, the brickwork. Firstly I should say that I made my own for four reasons :- 1. On the model of Hessle Haven I wanted to concentrate on the railway and its structures, rather than the setting of the railway. So this model is very much about what lies between, or over, the railway fences. I'm not decrying any of the beautifully scenic model railways on here or anywhere else but that is the underlying 'ethic' of this model; it is a model of a railway. 2. The NER used a form of English Garden Wall Bond which had every fourth course as a bonding course i.e. a course of half bricks as they were layed end on. 3. That variety of colours of well worn and well weathered brick is something I have never seen on commercially available products, though it probably does exist. 4. I wanted the relief of the brickwork to show. The card I used was actually old Yorkshire Tea boxes cut up into roughly 6" by 4" pieces. This is about my limit for a single piece and even then a card of this size has 3,000 + bricks on it. Clearly I use the uncoloured/unprinted side. Since then I have found other cards which are of similar thickness and which will take a scribed line without tearing the surface. In general, the thinner the card the better it scribes. The card was then marked out in pencil with the horizontal and vertical courses. This took around half an hour for a 6" by 4" card. The scriber is one half of a compass (the drawing variety not the navigational one) with the point slightly blunted. The blunting is only very slight but this results in a groove rather than a scratch on the card surface. Then it's just a very tedious job of using a good steel rule and scribing the horizontal mortar courses, which is relatively easy. The vertical courses are much more trying as it is very easy to make a mistake. I could scribe a 6" x 4" card in around three hours and two of those would do the structure shown in the earlier photograph. I don't actually paint the scribed card, I make a paper tampon; much as printers used to use. This is a piece of clean kitchen roll tightly rolled up into a ball and then placed inside another piece of the same material. I dip this in paint, use it on a scrap piece of card to get rid of most of the paint and then apply it to the workpiece. The result is that the paint (watercolour gouache) does not get into the mortar courses. This process is applied with usually two or three colours :- Firstly a rather bright orange, toned down slightly with a little burnt sienna. Even so this is the colour of new bricks. Secondly a burnt sienna which is applied over the orange but which varies in its intensity of colour simply as it goes onto the card. This starts the process of adding the variety of hues and colours. The third part of the process is to pick out individual bricks in white (saltpetre) and then blacks or very dark browns. It is surprising how few need to be picked out to give that realistic look. When the whole panel is coloured 'to taste', still with the mortar courses largely card coloured, then I wash the whole lot with a very diluted mix of weathered black enamel mixed with white spirit. The white spirit actually cracks the water colour paint, just as real bricks acquire a cracked and weathered surface. More importantly this seals the watercolours and protects against any moisture. On the bridges, especially where years of smoke and soot would accumulate, then I apply a wash of black watercolour which I paint on at the top of the piece and just allow to run down. A spot of varnish will them simulate water on the brickwork. The card is cut for use with a craft knife (Stanley) with a new blade and the edges are always cut at 45 degrees so that they hide when joined. There you go, that's how I do it. You might think that this is a very long winded process and if I were making a long retaining wall or a cutting wall then I would opt for something much quicker. But where there are relatively few structures to build, then this does produce a result which gets as close as possible to real bricks. The photos, below, show the basic card I used - usual disclaimers on this Company - and a piece which has been scribed and then coloured with the orange and burnt sienna. Having to repixilate this photo might lose some of the detail but you can at least see how the mortar courses have not been coloured. And that colour of the bricks is just about right for structures which have stood for fifty or more years. This piece still has to be picked out with the whites, blacks, etc. and then washed down with diluted black enamel and sealed. Cheers Mike

Anyone who knew this place, right up until the closure of Richard Dunstons shipyard, might remember that there was another bridge here, one which carried the road into the shipyard over the Haven itself. This bridge will be a feature of the next section of the railway to be built but the abutment is already there. It took quite a bit of peering at old photographs to determine that the wall between the two piers of the bridge was actually curved and was wood. Now someone's going to produce a detailed photo, taken at exactly the right period, to prove "Oh no it wasn't". Just for the record, all of the brickwork on here as on the wing walls, is hand made, using a sciber on soft card. The brickwork is then painted with various water colours, using a stippling pad before being sealed with a very dilute coat of matt black enamel diluted in white spirit. The coping stones are all individually made from various thicknesses of plasticard and then painted with Humbrol stone colour. Cheers Mike

Thanks John. Have you been back to this place since those days? It is a mere shadow of what it once was, as so much of the railway of the 1950's and 60's is. But with a little more time and a lot more work then I should be able to recreate enough of it to remind me and, perhaps, one or two others of what it once was. E-mail me via the PM facility, if you would, as to how the Smartrax software works and what I would need to run it. Cheers Mike

Not a lot has been happening on Hessle Haven, the railway, while I build signals and now locomotives. Still the railway does still serve as a photographic backdrop for the various models which have been or are buing built. So a very North Eastern feel to these photos with a T1, J71 and J72 and a part completed Q5/2 on the first and a J72 on the second. Once the current phase of loco building is finished and while I continue with more signal models then I do intend to build the next section of the railway; the section beyond the bridge. Cheers Mike

And as the final offering for these prototype photos of this place, at least for now, then this one has to be my favourite. Once again it's one of Mick Nicholson's and is, above any others, the inspiration for the model. This would make a tremendous painting; this will make a tremendous painting when I can find the time to do it. Cheers Mike

Or an EE Type 3 pulling out of empty mineral yard with a load of empty 16 tonners. Same place, different motive power, same wonderfully evocative scene. Hell but that signal bridge was photogenic; so many photos taken with trains passing under that thing. And the models of that thing, and the one behind it, are all ready to install on the next section of the railway. Then we really can take some photos! Cheers Mike

Indeed they do all count, Sean. Given that this place didn't really change very much until around 1964, then I still want to take some photos of EE Type 4's, Peaks, EE Type 3's and Brush 2's (31's ?) and the other diesel classes which came through here. I might have to add a third rail, just to prop up the 16.5 mm locos but I did that on the A1 picture anyway, so that's no problem. Sunday excursions to Bridlington and Scarborough with all sorts of diesel locos in green with maroon Mk 1's. They're as much history, now, as the steam locos which they replaced. Cheers Mike

Many thanks for that Simon. One of the very gratifying aspects of having started this project and this thread is the number of folks who knew this place and for whom the railway seems to have stirred and evoked so many memories. There are some downsides to building a model of a real place, not least the sheer size of what needs to be built. The upside, far outweighing any downsides, is when folk such as your good self recognise and identify the place and relate their memories of it. So let me post yet another of those wonderful black and white photos. This one, taken on a glorious June day in 1960, just speaks volumes of how I remember this place and the trains which passed through it. Cheers Mike

Pretty much all that's left of what was once an amazing place, Sean. Just memories now, merely memories. That and those few precious black and white photos to remind us of how it once was. Cheers Mike

Before the inevitable lapse in postings, as the new baseboard is built, let me add a couple more photos. I call the first picture 'Evening Arrival' simply because it was taken in the late sunlight of approaching evening. What turned out 'right' on this photo was the sunshine and shadow on that V2 and on the gresley coach, which is scratch built using MJT components. The second photo, taken a couple of years ago, shows the same location with an A1 60114 on a train of varnished teak. My intention is to re-do this picture, once the next section is done, with all of the additonal details and railway added. Such are the devices by which we gain and maintain the motivation to continue on these lifelong projects! Once the next section is built this V2 and A1 can advance another two hundred or so yards. Cheers Mike

Just to add a little more context to this next section, the bridge in the photo above forms the end of the second existing section of the railway, so what will now be built is the section approaching the foreground of this photo from the bridge, around a scale 200 yards. So let me post one more photo, this one of the model of the bridge, for this place has a very special significance to me and a whole generation of local railway enthusiasts (we were train spotters) in the fifties and sixties. So this photo is simply called 'The land of lost content'. Anyone familiar with the poems of A.E. Houseman will recognise the reference, for the bridge and much of the railway has long since gone. Cheers Mike

It's many a month since I posted anything regarding Hessle Haven, the layout, this simply because I haven't done anything to the layout. Having now largely completed the signals for both the existing sections and the third section, then it's now time to start work on that third section. Ever since I started this project, about three years ago now, much of the inspiration has been derived from those wonderful black and whote photos of the late fifties/early sixties. As I have oft times observed, I was very fortunate in finding a source of these photos and of various plans and drawings of this locale from which the model could be made. Thanks must go to my old mate, Mick Nicholson, for this material, without whose extensive archives, none of this would have been possible. As I've also mentioned before, this layout is unashamedly my attempt to re-create that place of my boyhood and youth where I and many of my mates first discovered the railway So, armed with the ex-NER white plan (this is the NER plan of the track and signal formations, detailed down to the yard, 36" yard), the signalling plan and some appropriate photos, I can now set about re-creating the real heart of this place, as it was in June 1950. I'll try and avoid any repetition of what has already been said but, if anyone is interested, then I will document the build of this section as thoroughly as I can. Additionally, there are a number of lineside structures to be built - Hessle Haven signal box, Hessle gasworks or some vestige of it and another bridge over the Haven itself, not forgetting the row of cottages, which is about all that now remains of the linesdie structures in the photo below. And, of course, there is a 4mm model of a very young 'Penguin of Doom' aka Sean, to place somewhere on the model, even if he didn't inhabit this locale in 1950. My intention is to scratch build much of the pointwork, using C8 and C9 turnouts wherever ppossible; the 'C' switches will be much kinder to the 8-coupled locos than 'B' switches, even if each turnout will be some 10 mm longer. So let me restart this thread with one of those black and white photos, this of one of Hull's ubiquitous Austerities bringing a freight into one of Hull's marshalling yards - mineral yard. One intersting aspect of this photo is how the track becomes 'pinched' from its 10', 6', 10' spacing, beyond the bridge, to 6', 6', 6' spacing towards the foreground. Not too many four track formations were so spaced, which is why there were no signals located within the bounds of the track formation from the bridge towards Hull. Cheers Mike

Thanks for that. I guess none of us aged eleven or twelve as we were could have imagined that we were seeing the beginning of the end of an era. Strange to think that while BR was still largely a steam railway with all of the toil and Victorian working conditions entailed in driving, firing and maintaining those machines, Boeing was testing a jet airliner, the 707, which would literally shrink the world. But for all of that, they were wonderful machines and they were memorable days. Cheers Mike

On this day in history. Doncaster - January 3rd, 1959 Leafing through those old and much treasured notebooks from my spotting days, I came across the section for a trip to Doncaster, made in very early January, 1959. It's strange how, even though the notebook records only a few times and, of course the loco numbers, as I read through these lists, memories of that day came flooding back. It was one of those very still, clear, bright, crisp days of winter; the sort of day that the railway photographers relished with exhaust plumes reaching straight up into a clear blue sky. We had left Hull on a Sheffield stopper, hauled by one of Dairycoates shed's redoubtable K3's. I didn't record the time of this departure but, from memory, it was around 8.00 am. The line out of Hull was always full of interest. Immediately after leaving the station we passed Botanic Gardens shed. Hull had three large locomotive sheds plus a sub shed located on one of the docks, though one of the three, Hull Springhead, had probably closed by this time. After passing through the town, the line then passed Dairycoates shed - the principal shed in the town before passing through the various marshalling yards situated between Dairycoates and Hessle. This was once the largest complex of marshalling yards in the world with four separate yards on the same site. The four track main line going westward split at Staddlethorpe, with one part going on to Selby and another to Doncaster. After the stop at Goole, the ex NER line crossed the old L&Y lines with Goole shed (50D) just far enough away to prevent the loco numbers being discernable. After Thorne North the line joined the old GN/GC line from Doncaster to Immingham and Grimsby at Stainforth. Here there was another large concentration of sidings where ex GC and GN locos would lurk - J11's, O1's, O2's - along with the ubiquitous WD's and 9F's. Also visible, occasionally, at this point would be one of Goole's ex L&Y pugs, doing some colliery shunting duty, though this was quite rare; they tended to work the dock lines around Goole docks. On through Hatfield North, passing a stream of freight trains, until the train made its measured and careful entry into Doncaster. And here we really were at the heart of the old LNER, with the 'plant' offices facing the station, the birthplace of so many of the locomotives which we had come to know. This was where Sir Nigel Gresley, Edward Thompson and Arthur Peppercorn had presided over their mechanical engineering empire. This was where the fabulous Gresley A1's (later A3's) and A4's had first seen the light of day, alomg with so many other famous classes. I can still remember, as we alighted from our train, seeing an immaculate Thompson A2 - 60531 Barham - waiting to set off for the South. This was a Scottish loco, rarely seen south of Newcastle or even Edinburgh for the 61B (Aberdeen) locos, so was a very welcome sight. Doncaster shed, which was then an easy 'bunk', was a fabulous place still clearly exhibiting its GN traditions with J6's, O2's, J50's and J52's. The proximity of the GC was also clearly evident with J11's, O4's; and almost every class of LNER locomotive was represented with the exception of the A4's, none of which were allocated to Doncaster but could be seen on their way to or from the locomotive works. A lone Britannia - 70007 Couer de Lion - in an appalling state, was the first 'Brit' any of us had ever seen. There were nearly a hundred locomotives on shed that day, of a profusion of types now only barely believeable. All of the principal trains were steam hauled; Copley Hill A1's or Kings Cross A1's, A3's or A4's on the Leeds trains, Kings Cross, Grantham, Doncaster, York, Gateshead or Heaton pacifics on the Newcastle or Edinburgh trains with V2's seemingly on everything from express passenger to empty mineral trains. A quick visit to the entrance gate by the end of the Crimpsall erecting shops to see what had just come out of the paint shop in the 'plant' revealed another gem - one of Haymarket's A4's 60012. There was only one working which would normally see a Haymarket A4 this far south and that was the Elizabethan, and that was a summer timetable working, so Haymarket Pacifics were always prize 'cops'. Two memories of that day abide above all others. Looking over the roadbridge to the south of Doncaster station and seeing three A3's all facing south. They were Lemberg, Donovan and Doncaster, almost consequtively numbered, each with an exhaust plume reaching up into the cold, clear sky as they set off for the south; each deliberately slipped by their drivers with that incredible cacophony of sound as they took hold of their train. The second abiding memory of that day was our first sight of A4's, at very nearly full tilt, as they came through Doncaster on those expresses which did not stop there. It was a sight to stir the heart of any enthusiast; it still is! Fabulous days in a world now long lost in the mists of time. Cheers Mike

I did find another photo of one of these vans during the build process. This one was finished in BR bauxite, with BR markings. At this stage, the van body is largely complete though the roof still has to be detailed and fitted. This van has the end doors with windows, where others had a plain door. This one also has the angle iron stiffeners under the solebars and a slightly different arrangement of lamp irons. This photo also shows the home made brake yokes, between the brakes and also the various drillings for the handrails, all of which were done before assembly. The modifications to the solebars also show up reasonably well in this picture. This is not the final paint finish but just the first very diluted coat of the final colour. Often, if I am going to seriously weather a van, I paint the whole thing in a greyed natural wood colour prior to applying the final colour. Part of the weathering process is then rubbing through the top colour back to this wood colour, simulating areas where the paint has simply fallen or worn away. Also worth noting that the roof has been rolled to a tighter radius than actually needed. It's easier to stick them if the radius is too tight than if it is undersized and once glued to the final radius, using the ends as the guide, the roof will retain that radius. Cheers Mike

Yeah, I too used masking tape for the same purpose, at first. But it does leave a residue of the m/tape adhesive on the plastic and, if rolling anything from .015" or .010" plasticard, then this can tear or deform when the masking tape is removed. What I wanted was a method which didn't impact the rolled component and where there was no residue left on the rolled component. This way seems to achieve that and everything used to brace the thing, while the rolling is being done, is reuseable (Yorkshire see; owt fer nowt - or at least very little. Only a comment on this one Yorkshireman, not a generalisation!) Cheers and have a very good Christmas. Mike

One final little 'wrinkle', this one for rolling van roofs. I normally roll these around a wine bottle, which I then fill with near boiling water and leave for around ten minutes. The roof then assumes the curve of the bottle and will retain it. However, it is the bracing of the roof around the bottle which is the trick, especially spreading the forces along the edges using strips of .060" plasticard. On van roofs I also place another .060" strip in the centre of the roof and, as with the edge strips, the full length of the roof. This to prevent the rubber bands, which are under quite some tension, from digging into and distorting the softened plasticard. Otherwise the roof may not roll evenly and may not retain its shape. The photo shows the trick of spreading the forces, though this was for a curved wall and was rolled around a wooden former; nonetheless exactly the same process. The whole lot was then dunked in boiling water and held down - wood floats - for five minutes. Again all roofs so rolled have retained their shape over three or more years. Cheers Mike

Jonathan, Make a simple jig, preferably from cardboard or any material not affected by poly solvent. This jig is cut to the curved profile that you want the rainstrips to adopt. Make the length of this jig 2 mm less, at each end, than the length of the rainstrips. Fix the jig to the roof, temporarily, with blu-tack, double sided sticky tape or whatever, where the rainstrip is to go. When I made my jig I also made it of the correct depth so that it not only provided the curve profile but, by lining the jig up against the edge of the roof, it also positioned the rainstrip with reference to the edges of the roof to ensure positional consistency. Take your rainstrip, cut to the appropriate length (and with this curvature the length of the arc is approximately equal to the straight line distance) and glue the ends to the roof outside of the jig but with the strip curved around the jig, so avoiding gluing the rainstrip to the jig or the jig to the roof - this is why the jig is slightly shorter than the rainstrip. Leave this to set, whereupon the jig can be removed and the remaining portion of the rainstrip glued to the roof and you have evenly curved and consistently curved rainstrips. Cheers Mike

Jonathan, I've taken enough space on this, your thread, so please allow me to offer you encouragement on your models and on the LNER Toad D, which is looking very good. If there is any more information which I may have accumulated in the process of building mine, then just ask, either on this thread or by PM. Keep up the excellent work. Now I'm back to building my signals and locos. Cheers Mike

I managed to get hold of a copy of an LNER GA Drawing, to supplement the Tatlow information; there were too many queries to use the drawing in the Tatlow book as the sole source. The chimney plate is 1' 3" (5 mm) square, bolted at each corner to the roof. The chimney has an o/diameter of 4.5 " with the stepped portion having a diameter of 6". I assume that this was to keep the hot flue pipe away from the roof timbers; there would have been a circular hole in these roof timbers of a larger diameter than the flue pipe, I imagine. And there is a small handrail adjacent to the mounting plate and parallel to the van ends, towards the centre of the van, which was around 9 " (3 mm) long. Yes I used the Dapol lamp mouldings. First I squared them up on very fine emery, then removed the flash from the top projection. Then drilled them right though with a 1 mm drill and inserted sections of 1 mm aluminium tube into which are fitted pieces of clear polystyrene rod. The ends of this rod are then lightly 'polished' to give the impression of glass. Again, I did all ten lamps in one go and each took around ten minutes, from memory. It's one of those tiny details which benefits the model out of all proportion to its size. Cheers Mike

Using the plastic solebars, as supplied in the kit, one thing you can do is to use some 3 mm x .015" brass strip (this used to be available from Mainly Trains) and superglue it to the back of the solebar, making sure that the strip is glued over its entire length. This will stop any bending or twisting of the solebar, at least in the vertical plane. Yes, I know, bit late for the one you're doing, but you might do another one. On the ones I did, I retained the plastic solebars, because I wanted the springs and spring hangars, which were attached, however I filed the back and front of the solebar flat (the '[' section of the solebar is way overscale anyway) then glued a length of 3mm brass strip all the way along the solebar, after which I added .020" x 1.5 mm pieces along each edge of the solebar to give the '[' section. I now had a solebar which was 4 mm deep, which matches the drawing. The top and bottom of the '[' section were dressed back to around .010" depth leaving a 3.5 mm channel. A 3.5 mm x .010" plasticard strip was then detailed with rivet and various other details and then glued into the '[' channel over the brass strip using slow setting cyano. I did all ten solebars together and the whole process took a couple of evenings to produce the ten solebars for the five models. These were done around two and a half years ago and have stayed absolutely straight. Getting the solebars right, on these LNER Toad D's, is half the battle to capturing the essential character of these vehicles. Another thing is the stepped chimney, where the chimney pipe goes into a casting which then fits into a square plate with the corners rounded. And don't forget that on the LNER vans the lamp irons were fitted to the lower section of the veranda, again all helps to capture that character. As to the rainstrips on these vans - were they straight or curved - all I can add is that the LNER General Arrangement Drawing does give an indication of this. It also shows the extent of that curvature (or straightness)! Cheers Mike

It certainly is a beautiful object. I live quite close to the North Yorkshire Moors Railway where 60007 Sir Nigel Gresley spends most of its time. It's amazing how many folks, who never knew these things, just stand in absolute awe when 60007 appears, just as we did when any 'streak' appeared, fifty or more years ago. They were and are a timeless classic and continue to thrill as they always have. Cheers Mike