Harlequin

Yep. If you are being really strict about using the Minories box then the hinge posts interrupt P2 and that's one of the compromises in this design. But in reality there are lots of ways to work around it.

I've tried out all the suggestions and for me, the best compromise for Seironim is pretty close to the original. Let me explain why: The parcels bay has decent length and avoids the hinge post. The curve in the parcels bay sets up the curve in the platforms - it all fits together. I know the parcels bay has to be shunted using the inbound line but I can't see a way to avoid that that doesn't adversely affect multiple other aspects of the design (IMO). The curve in the platforms is strong with just one deliberate turn, no changes in radius. The peninsula platform is prototypically wide. Platform faces are over 4ft 6in long. Using a curved turnout in the crossover to P2 straightened the platform lines up too much and affected the clarity of the curve. Using larger radius turnouts in the crossover to P2 prevented it handling full length trains. Using Large Ys in the throat made the peninsula platform between the parcels bay and P1 too thin and/or too short. The loco spur is still facing the platforms and I think that's better because: The throat is less congested It allows P2 to be longer It makes better use of the bottom left corner the baseboard It's similar to Greenwich Park (see below), although on the other side, admittedly Full length trains can pull up against P1 with room for the loco to release itself. Full length trains in P2 either have to be released by the pilot or set back to use the release, as Zomboid suggests. There is room on the P2 side of the station to do that without fouling other movements. New things in this design: Shown the hinge posts, so the box is an exact reflection of Minories. The crossover into P2 has a 3 degree turn inserted to help smooth out the platform curves and clear the bottom hinge posts. High level station building hides the proximity of the buffers to the edge of the world. Platform canopies Another road overbridge cutting across at an angle to create a mini-scene in the middle. Here's Greenwich park circa 1895. (The scissors crossover is under Royal Hill overbridge.) Edit: Oooh! I just realised that there would be a fantastic view looking into the scene from bottom right, through the two bridges to the throat pointwork.The tracks turn towards the viewer and then turn away again as they pass through the bridge shadows!

SketchUp (not owned by Google any more) has a "Photo Match" feature. It's in Sketchup Make, the last free desktop version, but I'm not sure about the online versions or the later subscription versions. https://help.sketchup.com/en/sketchup/matching-photo-model-or-model-photo

I had time to glue the sides and the ends together today: The end frames were slightly twisted so I had to force them into line and one corner isn't quite right but I think it will be OK. I should get the baseboard in tonight and maybe the other half will come together a bit quicker this weekend, because I won't have to stop and think about what I'm doing so often.

"Zen and the Art of Minories"

I think Seironim needs to be distinctive and different to Minories (as I think Compound said earlier). Thus: Where Minories needs pilots, Seironim allows locos to release themselves. Where Minories has platforms either side of double tracks, Seironim has a central release road. Where Minories has straight platforms, Seironim's are curved. Where Minories has simple departures, Seironim needs a shunting pattern to move ECS in and out of the central road Etc... By definition, Seironim physically has to mirror the basic footprint of Minories. So flipping the track plan horizontally isn't really playing the game! It should really use standard Peco Streamline turnouts, not bent and not cut. Remember the inspiration for Seironim is a real station, Greenwich Park. So we're not completely in fantasy land. I know we're trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot here but you can see that so many of these variations very nearly work! Maybe we've already seen the best compromise but maybe there's still something better. Just needs a bit more thinking and trying... P.S. I think Zomboid and I are on the same page on this one!

That looks very nice, very smooth. A couple of problems, though: "Full length" trains (~3ft plus loco) would have to pull right up to the buffers in both platforms, so the release crossovers are not as useful as they should be . The parcels bay passes through where the hinge posts would be if it folds like Minories.

Hi, 4th radius curves forming an oval will probably not realistically fit on an 8*4, I'm afraid. The track would be right up against the edges of the board.

Just trying some to improve things: The reverse curve into P2 is improved, P2 is wider, the parcels are shunted on the outbound line with shunting on the inbound only needing to handle pilot locos. But the parcels siding is shorter, I'm not sure yet if P1 is long or wide enough, the throat is more congested and it seems to have lost some character. (Maybe trying too hard to retain the curves.)

Thanks Izzy, I think Zomboid reversed the loco spur in one of his versions, as well. The route into P2 is via the blue crossover so if the train is "full length" and all the coaches stand alongside the platform then the loco is always going to be trapped, I think. But reversing the spur might still be a good move.

I'll recheck but: It is drawn to scale and it does fit with reasonable platform width for Platform 1. (>50mm for the majority of its length.) The tracks use the standard Streamline 51mm between centre lines. There is 20mm between track centres and platform edges. Yes Platform 2 does reduce to a thin sliver (in my latest drawing, not yet published it's bigger than in the drawing above). Platform 2 is at the front edge of the scene and is sliced by the model volume - there is more width, it's just not in this model. The plan is curved and does fit within 305mm / 12in width. From the bottom on my latest drawing where the P2 track is closest to the front edge of the box in mm: 21 (partial P2) + 20 + 51 + 51 + 20 + 69 (P1) + 20 + 53 = 305 So I think the design stands up to this challenge...

Yes, I noticed that and when I tried it, it made P1 either too narrow to be realistic or too short. The 1ft width constraint makes life very difficult but if the design is to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with Minories (literally!) I feel the basic design has to work within it - even though nobody will probably ever build it in that form! (Is that going a bit over the top? Maybe. Sorry, just dreaming.)

Yes, that would be fun and not too difficult because the box construction is just mirrored. The final graphic would be mirrored too in a very satisfying way: Before I commit to it, though, can anyone see any huge flaws in the track plan of Seironim? Is the position of the parcels bay a complete killer? (I realise it would be difficult to operate - but maybe that's a good thing...???) There is a reverse curve on the route into Platform2 but that's the only one of the 6 possible inbound and outbound routes (the same as Minories...!) and I don't think it can be avoided in the space available. What are people's opinions of the fact that a lot of P2 falls outside the model's volume?

@Keith Addenbrooke suggested restating what the original Minories plan actually was and noted that we can't reproduce the original drawings. So here's my version of the basic SP35 design using Streamline parts and shown in the parallel projection style of those original drawings: Feel free to copy and distribute this image as required but please add a link back to this post. Created in Xara Designer Pro and Sketchup. This is not intended to be definitive in any way - it's just my interpretation of the plan.

Have a look at period photos, such as here: http://www.gwr.org.uk/no-tenders.html GWR loco coal (best Welsh loco coal) was generally very chunky. BTW: The OP also asked a similar question recently in the “Detailing RTR” forum and there are some more answers in there.

Is this the book? https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=oUVTBAAAQBAJ&pg=PT265&lpg=PT265&dq="ash+flats"+steam+railway&source=bl&ots=JY8L-qVMbw&sig=ACfU3U0juzXnM0j19jNipwu5qzyI7Dqzhg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiS3bjH3YjqAhU-Q0EAHQhcAR4Q6AEwAHoECAwQAQ#v=onepage&q="ash flats" steam railway&f=false The implication from the quote is that an "ash flat" is simply a flat solid surface onto which ashes are dropped and from where they can be easily shovelled away later. P.S. At Moretonhampstead the (cold) ash piles were right next to the shed.

I think it's inevitable that in any thread discussion is free-wheeling and will veer off-topic for long periods. We're all creative people and we like to share new ideas that are sparked off by the original topic. But we should think about the new reader who is looking for the information described in the title and the opening post...!

Thank you! Perhaps I'll show you some of the mistakes, niggles, failures and disasters some time! I have to say that a lot of it is down to having good tools and using them carefully. Being able to cut clean, square edges is crucial. I hope I'm doing my Grandad proud.

Oh yes! (And oh yes.) Two examples are Patney and Chirton (branch to Devizes) and Par (branch to Newquay).

Carpentry update! (Oh the excitement...) Here's one the end frames ready to have the top bar glued on. I wanted to make the joints a bit stronger using dowels but drilling accurately positioned holes in both parts was taxing. I split two top bars trying to fit them and had to remake them. Here's one cramped up while the glue sets: One of the front panels with the rail that will support the deck glued on: Dry run assembly of the platform half: The buffer end panel being glue to end frame #1: I need more cramps! (Every woodworker always needs more cramps...)

By the way I am pronouncing Seironim, "Sigh ro nim" most of the time but sometimes, "See ro nim". Sigh rhymes with My as in "My Nor ees" - which I know is wrong but it's how I've always said it! Never Ever, "Sigh ro nime" or "See ro nime"!

I agree with Half-full. There are numerous threads on here about Lais decoders proving to be unreliable or failing. Zimo non-sound decoders are around £20 and won't let you down.

Bing Bong! <Pinches nose, turns on echo machine> We apologise for the late departure of the 6.52 from Liddle Muddle. This is due to the presence of the unearthly black object on the platform. For your safety, please remain frozen and continue to ignore the device, which may be sending images of you to a higher dimension. Engineers have been informed and they will be here as soon as they have opened their crate of specialised tools. Thank you.

Yes that would be great. Thanks.