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10800

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  1. 10800
    Although I haven't started building the layout yet (next month maybe?) I have been assembling a few trains to run on it, especially some reasonable length ones, and here's a couple of them (straight from the box, no weathering yet or replacement couplings).
     
    (Note that in these photos the trains are more or less plonked on temporary track - the DB is on 00 track on the new DRAG TT2, but has humps over the board joins where the sleepers haven't been removed yet; and the Western and Mk1s are on P4 track on the old and soon-to-be-replaced TT1).
     
    This is the down Ilfracombe portion of the Devon Belle around 1953. The formation is correct, and all the Pullmans ran on the Devon Belle, but maybe not in the same rake.
     

     

     
    From the locomotive the cars are: Brake 3rd no. 27, Kitchen 3rd no. 61, Kitchen 1st IBIS, Parlour 1st ROSEMARY, Kitchen 3rd no. 31, Kitchen 1st MINERVA, Kitchen 3rd no. 171, Guard 3rd no. 208, Observation no. 13.
     
    Then, moving on about 10 years we have the Wolverhampton-Penzance 'Cornishman' at about the time when the pure chocolate and cream rakes were getting the odd maroon replacement. From the locomotive the formation is BSK-SK-SK-CK-CK-RU-SO-SK-BSK.
     

     

  2. 10800

    Basic Templot done

    By 10800,

    Spent a pleasant hour or three doing the basic Templot plan for Balcombe station yesterday, using the 1910 25-inch OS map as an underlying picture shape together with some photos in the 1950s to modify some of the detail/errors in the map and changes due to the subsequent elapsed time - notably the change in position of the trailing crossover between the two main lines from the platform area to north of the entrance to the down refuge siding.
     
    FB on the main line (thanks to Martin Wynne for pointing me at the correct switch option ) - nice D12 crossover! - and BH in the yard.
     
    Will probably leave the detailed tweaking until we get the available photos from Lens of Sutton.
     

     
    At full size this bit alone is about 9m long - but we should be able to compress it a bit by reducing the length of the two refuge sidings.
  3. 10800
    We've decided that the main running lines will be FB rail (as they were by the 50s) but with the yard and refuge sidings still in BH. Research into the precise kind of FB fixings is ongoing (and thanks to Colin Craig's website and links for valuable material on this).
     
    Whilst at Warley I also bought a Lens of Sutton photo listing from Roger Carpenter's stand and was pleasantly surprised to see a dozen or so Balcombe photos listed, so they will be ordered.
     
    Another piece of luck is that my unbuilt Kemilway lattice footbridge will be perfect for our needs on Balcombe, although on the down side it butts up against a wood-panelled enclosed stairway/ramp leading from the road to the ticket office, so that will be an interesting mixed-media structure.
     
    Fairly soon we will need to start making quarter-scale mockups to give us a clearer idea of what we need to do.
     
    And purchases of 6PAN and 6PUL kits from Phoenix/SRG can't be far away; now then Hornby, after reviewing the success of Bachmann's 4CEP and with all your Pullman experience, how about an RTR 5BEL eh? (those Marc Models ones are awfully expensive!).
  4. 10800

    First field visit 20/11/09

    By 10800,

    Re6/6 and I, accompanied by Captain Kernow who knows a good grice when he sees one, visited Sussex yesterday to have a look at Balcombe station for the first time. Initial reactions were good, and the following photos give an indication of what it is like now - only a double track main line now, all the yard and refuge sidings have gone, but many of the buildings and other features of interest survive.
     

     

     

     

     

     

     
    Train services are very frequent (usual Brighton main line interval services) but with only some of the First Capital Connect trains (319s) stopping at Balcombe. The trains were otherwise exclusively Southern 377s.
     

     

     
    (Self-portrait with 319!)
     

     
    We then visited Balcombe (Ouse Valley) Viaduct after doing a quick return trip to Haywards Heath to cross it, and to say we were gobsmacked is a bit of an understatement! (see gallery at http://www.rmweb.co....album&album=407 . The character and beauty of the structure, especially the oval cutouts in the piers, is inspiring us to represent it a bit more faithfully than the model viaduct we already have does - how best to do this is now being thought about, whether or not it includes substantial parts of Nigel Hunt's magnificent freelance model.
     
    A quick look at Copyhold Junction north of Haywards Heath couldn't be resisted! Excellent views in both directions and instant recognition of the viewpoint shared by many well known photos of the past. The line coming in from the east now only serves an aggregates quarry at Ardingly, but the fantasy of heritage electrics one day travelling the line to Horsted Keynes on the Bluebell Railway as they did until 1963 was something John and I were very aware of! For now it was just more 377s to look at.
     

     

     

     

  5. 10800
    Well yes it is, just that due to working from the inside track out the first one onto the curve is the inner 00/P87 circuit. And we had to give something a powered run didn't we?
     

     

     
     
    Captain Kernow update - 10/11/09
     
    Of course, when the Traffic Department made their hasty request to run a train, the Electrical Engineering Department belatedly realised that none of the sections was electrically linked, so the Electrical Improvisation Committee was duely formed, with the single task of holding metallic objects across both sides of the copper clad sleepers at the board joints:
     






     
     
    As regards the use of Peco code 75 track, in preference to something finer scale, we opted not to use C&L, due to the flange-hitting-the-inside-of-the-chairs problem with some R-T-R OO flanges. We also felt it might not be as robust as something like Peco. For the same reasons, (robustness), we decided not to use SMP. Peco does highlight the difference between that type of R-T-R track and P4 quite nicely (meant in a non-elitist way). We could have used Exactoscale 'Fasttrack' for the OO as well, but given that the track constructions slaves esteemed DRAG colleagues assembling the rail onto the P4 stuff nearly revolted last night, when it seemed that their Statutory Tea and Biscuits may have been threatened by more demands from the PW Superintendant for finished track, it is probably just as well that we settled for Peco!....
     
    End of Captain Kernow update
  6. 10800
    Just had to use that lovely word lacuna!
     
    I've just had some 1:2500 map sections courtesy of West Sussex CC archives, unfortunately there is nothing between 1910 and the 1970s so more research needed to verify the 1950s condition.
  7. 10800

    A concept emerges

    By 10800,

    John and I have been bouncing some ideas around and I've sketched out a possible layout concept. Effectively two dioramas, one of the station itself and one containing the viaduct. As if this is not enough, John has proposed making the join between them adaptable, FREMO-style, so that additional scenic sections could be added at a later date. Well, let's see how it goes with just this for the moment!
     

     
    Meanwhile I've ordered some 25-inch OS map copies from West Sussex County Council archives, and we will hopefully be off on a field visit in about three weeks to, well, visit the site in the field .
     
    The viaduct we have is 14 arches, as against the 37 of the real one, so it will be an impression rather than a full reproduction (it's still nearly 8 ft long as it is).
     
    Once I have the maps it will be time to fire up Templot again and we can scare ourselves as to how long the layout is going to end up. And if we want to run a 12-coach PUL/PAN formation (as we do ) the fiddle yards will need to be 12 ft long as well - each end. Either that or the fiddle yard operators will have to be very very quick, Gromit-like, in receiving and sending out trains!
  8. 10800
    Another routine DRAG meeting last night, with both TT1 in use and work continuing on the trackwork on TT2. Here it looks like we've left CK on his own (not true, others were busy threading rail into trackbases etc )
     

     
     
    But meanwhile, John (Re6/6) had just taken delivery of his new Noch Grassmaster for Matford, and gave us a quick demo. The following pictures speak for themselves really, although it is difficult to convey the 3D effect on a 2D image.
     

     
     

     

     

     

     
    Now that's all very well as a basic demo of how it works, but it's a particularly bright green set of fibres with no (not yet) additional texture.
     
    John also showed us a demo board he had done earlier, but starting from a position of existing basic ground cover (which could be hanging basket liner, lint, carpet underlay or whatever). This next picture is the initial groundcover:
     

     
    Then with the Noch fibres added:
     

     
    And finally (after the PVA has set) after a good suck with the vacuum cleaner:
     

     
    Which gives a good base of rough ground for further detailing.
     
     
    Update from The Captain, Tuesday 27/10/09
     
    A few of my own photos from last night (apologies for quality, taken on camera phone).
     
    Brain Harrap (right) seemingly caught in mid-ballad.... Clearly, something doesn't seem quite right in this photo...

     
    Re6/6 had brought in a recent acquisition for us to admire, but someone forgot to remind him that we were only laying P4 and OO track that night....

     
    Mr F. Adder made a surprise but welcome appearance, and was immediately put to work on slave labour the important task of threading rail onto track bases. As usual, he did his modelling on his feet....

     
    This was clearly a source of some amusement....

     
    Peter Archard brought in his scratchbuilt 16XX pannier for a spin. We ran it on TT1 first, then laid a bit of spare track on TT2 as well.

  9. 10800

    The end of Camberhurst?

    By 10800,

    Some of you will know of my planned Camberhurst layout from the old site http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7091
     
    I'm not sure any more whether this will ever happen. This is for a variety of reasons, including
     
    * Time for a sole project considered against other commitments
    * Space to put it up at home
    * I don't really like shunting, much prefer trains passing through the landscape (c.f. Eridge, Tawbridge)
    * I also feel much happier with real locations, or at least something closely resembling a real location - Camberhurst just didn't 'feel' authentic enough.
     
    Camberhurst was a useful planning exercise nonetheless, and if anyone wants to base a layout on its design then that's fine by me.
     
    What I'm now thinking of, in conjunction with John Farmer (Re6/6) is a simpler through station layout where we can both indulge in our interest in 1st generation SR EMUs and electric locos but also throw in a bit of steam and other stuff as well. Most of Eridge's stock will also be at home.
     
    So we're looking closely at Balcombe in Sussex, on the Brighton main line south of Three Bridges. This has the following attributes:
     
    * Fairly simple two-track layout
    * Still exists, although I'm not sure how much original infrastructure survives (sounds like an excuse for a field trip to me)
    * Electrified, and what's more used to have tramway overhead in the yard for CC1-3 etc - I think Balcombe was actually the test bed for the bigger yards equipped later such as Hither Green and Hoo Junction
    * Ouse Valley Viaduct nearby, and John is itching to use the viaduct we inherited from Nigel Hunt's layout on something
     
    etc etc etc
  10. 10800
    This blog covers the doings in the Devon Riviera Group of the Scalefour Society, aka 'DRAG'. Not to be confused with 'SWAG', mind, which is the South West Area Group of RMWeb...
     
    There are several members of RMWeb in DRAG, including Re6/6, 10800, Metropolitan, FatAdder and Brinkly. We meet twice a month in the Teignmouth area.
     
    Although we are an official AG of the S4 society, most of us have various amounts of OO and R-T-R stuff squirrelled away.
     
    Our current project is 'TT2' (Test Track 2 - our 9m x 4m 5-track P4 test track. This logically enough will replace TT1.
     
    TT1 is a double track oval (pretty large) in P4, which was to be put up every evening we met in a local hall, to let us run our locos and stock. However, all things are part of the learning curve, and TT1 was no exception. Differing types of P4 track and poor quality timber led to boards warping and the track otherwise not keeping it's proper alignment. Consequently we could not be sure that any derailment was due to the stock or the track!
     
    The new TT is built using better materials and by people well-versed in carpentry. A consistent track standard is being used (Exactoscale Fasttrack and copper clad pointwork). A quadruple track oval, with various configurations of crossovers and pointwork will test our locos and stock thoroughly. The outer track also has two long passing loops and on the inside of the four P4 tracks is a circuit of OO P87 track... to enable us to run all our OO R-T-R purchases so that our P87 member doesn't feel left out!
     
    Progress so far has been documented in the Layouts section of the old forum, but I will use this blog to add further photos and reports as work progresses. We have thus far completed all baseboards and have actually started to lay track!
     
     
    Tuesday 29/9/09
    A good nights work at Holcombe last night, more track laid on the first 5 straight boards - see photos below.
     
     
    Apart from mentioning the general meanderings of our Area Group, we will also be focussing on the specific progress of TT2 construction. Baseboard construction is complete (see http://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=514) and tracklaying is just starting in earnest.
     
    Last night work continued on the track on the 'easier' straight side (which only has the one B7 crossover). Firstly, CK and Andrew get to work:
     

     
    A variety of weights (some edible) was used to hold down the newly glued track whilst the PVA cured:
     

     
    At board joins, the rail is soldered to copperclad end-protectors, with bits of brass shim to match the rail height with the main run of Exactoscale FastTrack:
     

     
    The first vehicle traverses the B7!
     

     
    And some of the team admire the evening's work - David, CK, Re6/6, Nick and Brian
     

     
    (I probably need to make future gallery pictures a bit smaller for sharing with the blog).
  11. 10800
    Although somewhat depleted in numbers the DRAG meeting tonight managed to complete tracklaying on the first straight side of the test track, except for the transition curves into the ends. This included the 00/P87 track, and there's no denying the contrast between the P4 and the Code 75 Peco (maybe a cruel comparison as I know 00 track can be made to look much better).
     

     

     
    John's Heljan Cargowaggon with Kean Maygib P4 wheels went through the crossover at whatever speed we could shove it.
     

     
     
    Meanwhile, some recent purchases on display included John's Hornby Maunsell CK in blood & custard - I'm not sure about the blood myself, seems too dark to me.
     

     
    And my complete (at last) authentic formation 9-coach Ilfracombe portion Devon Belle (destined for Tawbridge)
     

     

     
     
    Thursday 22/10/09
     
    A slightly belated entry here, but a small number of us had a very focussed session chez Re6/6 last Saturday, where John was able to set up 4 of the 5 straight boards from the other side to that already completed (above).
     
    I was very pleased to see that the A5 crossover that I thought had been 'mislaid', had in fact been laid on one of the boards back at the original Saturday session at Holcombe a few weeks ago.
     
    In fact, we found that it had been laid on the wrong board as compared with Rod's Master Plan, but a bit of quick improvisation and executive decision making saw us quickly shuffle the other crossovers around to achieve a new configuration, which should serve us just as well (I really didn't want to have to lift an already-glued crossover, plus plasticard base!).
     
    By mid-afternoon (at which point I had to leave to attend CTMK on her sickbed back at home), we had virtually laid a double track, with crossovers, along the 4 boards. A short while later, the others left and John continued laying plain line on his own, until virtually everything along the 4 boards was down, with the exception of the OO P87 track (due to me not taking it with me that morning!).
     
    So we now have to finish the 5th board, which will probably take the evening next Monday night at Holcombe, and then start on the curved boards. These will feature superelevation on the centre two tracks (the Up and Down Fast lines).
     
    Photos to follow when uploading becomes possible again!
  12. 10800

    Inspiration

    By 10800,

    00 roundy-roundy - Tawbridge
     
    by 10800
     
    original page on Old RMweb
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:09 pm
     
    It's all Hornby's fault , coupled with an approaching birthday (making me more time conscious, not because of presents potential), where I live, and my attraction to all things of the green tendency. And maybe the Hull boys' recent layout project. I'm giving consideration - serious consideration - to building a relatively small roundy-roundy layout in 00 based somewhere in North Devon around 1960, using exclusively RTR stock.
     
    The scenic bit would be just a double track secondary line - no station, no points - passing through the countryside, or perhaps over a river bridge. All I want really is to be able to watch trains go by in the minimum of time and with the minimum of effort. Having only plain track on view, and at a high eye-level, minimises the trauma to the P4 side of my brain . Peco points will do for the fiddle yard at the back.
     
    Stocking it is (or will be) so easy - M7, N, T9, unrebuilt Bulleid Pacific, Ivatt 2-6-2T, Standard 4 2-6-4T, Standard 4 Mogul, Class 22, Bubblecar maybe, Maunsell coaches etc etc.
     
    I'm already hunting on Ebay ...
     
    Have I gone completely barmy?
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by noddycab on Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:16 pm
     
    Sounds like a nice little idea, i like the idea of just plain track and countryside... The river bridge would set it off nicely.
    When u going to get the kettle on and get the biscuits out to make a start on it?
     
    Andy
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by shortliner on Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:57 pm
     
    looks like the fiddle yard will be bigger than the layout, with that stock-list!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:26 pm
     
    Considerably, Jack! But at least the trains are short!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by sunshine coast on Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:32 pm
     
    And why not ... There are ,after all only so many hours in a day ...
     
    Rod .............Ebay ......and ....Model shops ......!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Gordon S on S</STRONG> on Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:36 pm
     
    Sounds good Rod, but you don't need a fiddle yard....A decent traverser will easily do the job..
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by johnteal on Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:38 pm
     
    How small is "relatively small" ???
     
    John
    RJR
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:12 pm
     
    I'm thinking in the order of 10ft x 6ft, but without having sat down and planned anything yet on paper. Really governed by retaining a reasonable scenic length and not having excruciatingly small radii on the ends. It won't be permanently erected at home whatever size it is, but it could be put up in the dining room occasionally (subject to approval from the authorities and locking the cats away), or at DRAG if they will accept a non-P4 layout, or hopefully at exhibition.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:18 pm
     


    sunshine coast wrote:
    and ....Model shops ......!
    Gotcha Trevor! Next time I'm in the area, or even not ...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by westrerner on Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:38 pm
     
    If you can get hold of it have a look at Iain Rice's 'Mainlines in Small Spaces' . It contains layout in 10ft x 7ft based on Port Issac Road, Whilst it is a station he has some interesting ideas on a fiddle yard. Basically Two long sidings facing opposite ways (for the ACE) two shorter sidings as cassettes (also facing opposite ways) with a continuous run between them, Going from cassette to cassette or long siding to long siding gives end to end running. The whole unscenic part of the layout is about 9ft and the scenic section is about 14ft. The main part of the visible bit of the layout is a long transition curve with the tightest radius being 30inches into the fiddle area.
    I hope all that makes sense. You could leave the station out I suppose, but on his layout it is used as a passing station on what was a predominantly single track line.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by John B on Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:50 pm
     
    It has massive appeal, Rod.....
     
    I keep having similar thoughts of building something OO, just to "run in" things before the inevitable gauge conversion, of course...

     
    Plus there's the excuse for all the stuff you want that's just too Sou-Western to run on Eridge or Camberhurst!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Re6/6 on Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:03 pm
     


    10800 wrote:
    or at DRAG if they will accept a non-P4 layout, or hopefully at exhibition.
    Anything goes at DRAG!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:08 pm
     


    John B wrote:
    just to "run in" things before the inevitable gauge conversion, of course...

    That will be the answer I give when the P4 detector van comes calling ...
     


    Plus there's the excuse for all the stuff you want that's just too Sou-Western to run on Eridge or Camberhurst!
    Dead right, I'm wondering if it was that damned Class 22 that tipped the scales - even the T9 is OK for Eridge (well there was one once).
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by davidpk212 on Wed Mar 12, 2008 8:46 pm
     
    Another person willing to "take the plunge" and build an MLRT! Yipee! At this rate we'll have caught up with SLT building by Christmas...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by jongwinnett on Wed Mar 12, 2008 9:37 pm
     


    John B wrote:
    It has massive appeal, Rod.....
     
    I keep having similar thoughts of building something OO, just to "run in" things before the inevitable gauge conversion, of course...

     
    Plus there's the excuse for all the stuff you want that's just too Sou-Western to run on Eridge or Camberhurst!
    hear hear...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Thu Mar 13, 2008 8:55 am
     


    10800 wrote:
    John B wrote:
    just to "run in" things before the inevitable gauge conversion, of course...


    That will be the answer I give when the P4 detector van comes calling ...
     

    Plus there's the excuse for all the stuff you want that's just too Sou-Western to run on Eridge or Camberhurst!

    Dead right, I'm wondering if it was that damned Class 22 that tipped the scales - even the T9 is OK for Eridge (well there was one once). I see that you haven't taken Dr Kernow's psycological advice and locked yourself away in a small room with all the back numbers of the Scalefour News for at least 10 years......
     
    Well, as they say on First Great Western local services.....'Welcome aboard'....

     
    Shall I build that B7 crossover in OO after all, then?!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Thu Mar 13, 2008 9:23 am
     


    davidpk212 wrote:
    Another person willing to "take the plunge" and build an MLRT! Yipee! At this rate we'll have caught up with SLT building by Christmas...
    MLRT?
     
    Main line run through?
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Barry Ten on Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:14 pm
     
    It's a really nice idea, Rod - chimes with similar thoughts I've been having recently. I've often thought I could be just as happy with a well-modelled diorama - just a single or double track running through, no sidings or anything - as with a more orthodox layout, provided there was lots of storage space for a variety of trains. And I've been thinking about some kind of Southern or S&D themed layout to go on the second level above my current project. Its just madness not to model the Southern right now, isn't it?
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Tue Mar 18, 2008 12:31 pm
     
    This project is starting to build up a bit of momentum now. It will probably be 12ft x 7ft, with a scenic section at the front of around 8-9ft. I started trying to be really complicated in the fiddleyard, with loops, sidings, crossovers, a double slip etc but concluded this was unnecessary. There will now just be a long loop for each of the two running lines, and all four roads can be subdivided into three sections (it will be DC) for holding short/medium trains, or one long and one short, or one very long; a trailing crossover between the up and down (in the FY!); and possibly a couple of stub sidings for loco storage.
     
    Baseboard construction will be conventional ply/softwood block sandwich type. The low-level river crossing, which is the main focal point, need only be a couple of inches above the water. I'm looking at three 4ft x 2ft boards front and back, and interestingly the side curve boards could be little more than 3ft x 15in drop-ins connecting the front and back runs.
     
    The scenic section will be framed by a continuous thin plywood/MDF backscene, curved at each end to come to the front of the boards about 12 in from the ends. I will need to determine by trial and error where it crosses the tracks to avoid the 'sharp curve just inside the tunnel' routine, but there should be around 9 ft of scenic travel.
     
    Now, because there is just rural scenery - no station, no signals, no buildings to speak of - this could be sufficiently generic to be almost anywhere in the wilder parts of the country, and at any time in the last century. So I'm thinking it could be the answer to my fantasies of having layouts based on prototypes I like away from the Southern, and for which I will just never have the time to convert stock to P4 - Eridge and Camberhurst will be all I need for that thankyou!. In 'Withered Arm' mode (or Devon diesel hydraulic mode) the backscene could have suggestions of Dartmoor tors on the horizon, but it could be made to have interchangeable slide in backscenes to change it quickly to (say) somewhere on the lower levels of the Waverley route - and change the stock to a V2, A1 and a couple of Claytons, some maroon Mk1s and off you go!
     
    As it says on the TV recycling ad, 'the possibilities are endless'.
     
    For those coming to the RMWeb day in Taunton at the end of April, I expect to have plans and mockups of the layout on display.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:21 pm
     
    We DRAGgers had better hope that the Provisional Wing don't catch up with us - they'll string us up by our Romfords if they do!!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:10 pm
     
    I'm temporarily without a scanner, so I've had to just photograph it, but this is the sort of thing being considered:
     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by ian on Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:14 pm
     
    You could take it a stage further Rod and build two or more sets of front boards with different scenes on - urban approaches on a viaduct, tunnel approach in a cutting.....
     
    Sorry - I'll stop - you've got quitre enough on your plate!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by sunshine coast on Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:27 pm
     
    Nice and simple .......set the trains running open a beer and watch .......excellent ....
     
    look forward to seeing you at the meet ....
     
    Regards Trevor....
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:51 pm
     


    sunshine coast wrote:
    set the trains running open a beer and watch .......
    Cheers Trevor - actually, there's space for a couple of handpumps on the fiddle yard boards ...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by westrerner on Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:07 pm
     
    It's a nice idea. I like the idea of a changeable backscene and the idea of coming into the room and just switching and letting the tarins trundle round great. But just as a point of interest are you going to have automatic train control in the fidle yard. ie as one train leaves the fiddle yard the next one moves forward etc. and after the trains in that loop have completed their crcuit the points change and the next loop does it showpiece, That really would be good to watch with a G&T in hand(or a good pint of real ale).
    __________________________________________
  13. 10800

    Signature haulage

    By 10800,

    Balcombe would see these as the main traction on fasts (which wouldn't stop!)

    http://semgorgu.ipower.com/gallery/6pul_1.html as well as Brighton Belles.
     
    Semi fasts and stoppers would be
     
    http://semgorgu.ipower.com/gallery/4lav.html and http://semgorgu.ipower.com/gallery/2bil_01.html
     
    Whilst Newhaven boat trains and freights would be either steam-hauled or with Bulleid's CC1/2 and 20003 Booster electrics such as (first two pictures, actually in Balcombe yard):


    http://semgorgu.ipower.com/electric/class70_1.html
  14. 10800
    O10800WB - a little holiday modelling
     
    by 10800
     
    original page on Old RMweb
     
     
    Go to comments
     
     
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Feb 22, 2009 12:08 pm
     
    Blimey, is it so long ago I last looked at these?
     
    Yesterday I decided to try out the operating system concept described earlier in this thread on the nearly-finished Eridge up starters. Remember that the idea is to have the signals unpluggable, so no connections or hook ups with gubbins underneath. Real engineers should look away now please ...
     
    Firstly, the main bits - signal, various diameters of brass bar and telescopic tubing, razor saw, mitre box etc
     

     
    I slid some tube over the ends of the control wire. They are different lengths so that the 'clock weights' finish at different levels for convenience (Eridge has plenty of room under the boards for this). The tube was soldered in position (at the end away from the signal baseplate) with the other end hard up against the baseplate guide tube with the signal in the stop position, thus making a limit of movement when returning the signal to on. The wire was snipped off at the end leaving about 1 mm proud.
     

     
    I don't have a pillar drill or a lathe so out came the minidrill stand. Having cut lengths of 3/16" brass bar in the mitre box with the razor saw I wanted to drill a 1mm hole in the centre that would fit over the protruding wire left over from the previous stage.
     

     

     
    I probably didn't drill quite deep enough because soldering the bar onto the wire and butting it up against the tube whilst keeping everything in line was a bu**er. At least I found a use for the two pairs of reverse tweezers, one with the offset points! Next time of course I will drill a 3/16 hole in a block of wood for the bar to stand up in while doing this, but it worked anyway.
     

     

     
    The original idea was to slide 7/32" brass tube over the bar and solder it to the underside of the baseplate to act as a support and guide, but the resulting additional friction prevented the easy movement of the bar, even after lubrication with graphite. Probably because of the alignment issue referred to above (I could have said I put the slight dog-leg in deliberately to give more clearance between the two weights! ). But it seems fairly robust anyway, and the 5/8 tube which will go over the lot (and plug into 21/32 tube mounted in the baseboard) will provide additional protection.
     
    Main thing is it works. The brass bar is heavy enough to pull off the signal arms under gravity when support from below is removed.
     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by pinkmouse on Sun Feb 22, 2009 12:47 pm
     


    10800 wrote:
    The brass bar is heavy enough to pull off the signal arms under gravity when support from below is removed.[/attachment]
    Hmmm. Fail safe? I think not. The Ministry of Transport inspecting officer might have something to say about that!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Feb 22, 2009 12:53 pm
     
    Damn you Carruthers, you've spotted the flaw in my design!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by beast66606 on Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:57 pm
     
    I made a signal with working mechanical slotting using similar techniques - but mine did fail safe - although the balance weights were at the bottom of the post so a lot easier
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:21 am
     
    Mounting tube now fitted, also lamps, finials, balance weights, the main ladder and a phone/electric cabinet. Apart from sorting out the SOUs underneath, which will have to wait until that bit of the layout is finished, all that's left to do on this one is some plasticard support plates at the top of the main lattice post and then paint it. Then it's on to finish the other two Eridge brackets.
     

     

     

     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by timlewis on Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:34 pm
     
    Looks excellent Rod: well done. I'm a long way off building signals yet, but looking forward to it in a masochistic kind of way
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Tue Feb 24, 2009 11:55 pm
     
    Cheers Tim - for a first one it's taken a while, so long that I look back at some of the initial work on it and cringe in a way that only the builder can about his own creation! The next two will be a bit troublesome because of having to add more landing at the front, but it's all experience ... oh yeah, and fun as well
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by pinkmouse on Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:18 am
     
    Look forward to seeing them next time you're up, very impressed with pics.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:58 pm
     
    While on holiday last week I took along a small toolkit and a pile of plastic wagon kits with the intention of putting a few of the basic body shells together and giving some impetus to finishing them in the forseeable future
     
    As an aside, we stayed in the village at Portmeirion, and the views from our carefully-selected double aspect apartment were like this
     

     

     
    Anyway, here is the basic set up - piece of plate glass, cutting mat, small try-square, some MEK and a few files and knives
     

     
    By the end of the week I had put the bodies of these together (most of one rainy day and a few other odd hours while Mrs 10800 was reading):
     
    Three Parkside BR standard 12 ton vans and a Ratio LMS van. None of the roofs are fixed yet (the floor in the case of the Ratio van) pending addition of lead weight. The Parkside vans were quite old (labels with 'W&H Models, ??????‚??1.95'!) and the floors needed trimming to fit so there was quite a bit of draw-filing going on. Fortunately I glued together the two side/end pairs and then joined them together rather than building around the floor as per the instructions.
     

     
    Chivers SR 20 ton mineral, Ling, Tunney and two Parkside Grampus. The Chivers kits are a joy to put together, showing how a bit of thought and design can aid the modeller (just like the old Chivers brass kits) and the moulding quality is superb. Because of the tabs and guide ridges you have to put these together in the stated order! The newer Parkside Grampus were pretty good too.
     

     
    Parkside LNER extra long CCT, rain strips filed off because they're in the wrong place (will glue some plastic strip on in the right places later)
     

     
    Parkside Mink G (a dedicated Masokits chassis will be going under this)
     

     
    Chivers pigeon van, again a lesson in how to make a good plastic kit
     

     
    And finally a Cambrian Salmon. This was a bit of a pig compared to the others - soapy plastic (all black so it was hard to see what was going on half the time), lack of crispness, poor mating surfaces etc. In this particular kit the floor is in two halves which you have to just butt-join together, and the sole bars and internal bracing have nothing in particular to attach to. Here is the recommended use of a square to line them all up:
     

     
    Despite all that, when it's painted and weathered it will hopefully turn out to be acceptable, especially with 2 or 3 track panels as a load
     

     
    I'm away again next week (work this time) so I'll see what I can do with a few Bedford springing units in the hotel in the evening and get some of these rolling.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Adam on Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:54 pm
     
    Hi Rod
     
    Impressive productivity there, more so if you get them finished! If you think the Salmon was a fiddle, wait 'til you get to the track panels, and more particularly, the chains... One tip you may find of use based on dad's experience. Weighting and keeping these wagons from warping can be a problem which dad resolved by gluing (I think he used some form of reasonably heavy duty epoxy - not Araldite) a pair of bicycle spokes to the underside of the wagon. A useful 2 in 1 approach.
     
    Adam
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by timlewis on Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:22 pm
     
    Well, you have been busy! Pretty impressive. Now all you need are the W-irons, and the wheels, and the brakegear, and the weight, and the sprung buffers (you did think ahead and drill for them before joining ends to sides didn't you ), and the vac pipes, and the painting, and the transfers and the weathering. So, nearly finished then .
    Seriously though, that's a damn fine effort for a couple of days work. Amazing what can be done with a bit of forward planning and some uninterrupted modelling time. (And a nice view from the window too).
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:33 pm
     


    timlewis wrote:
    Well, you have been busy! Pretty impressive. Now all you need are the W-irons, and the wheels, and the brakegear, and the weight, and the sprung buffers (you did think ahead and drill for them before joining ends to sides didn't you ), and the vac pipes, and the painting, and the transfers and the weathering. So, nearly finished then .
    Seriously though, that's a damn fine effort for a couple of days work. Amazing what can be done with a bit of forward planning and some uninterrupted modelling time. (And a nice view from the window too).
    But he won't have been able to enjoy the view if he's been enjoying the view of the underside of a Cambrian Salmon instead!!
     
    Good start to the wagon fleet, Rod, and as Tim says, the hard work (but fun! ) is still to come!....
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:18 pm
     


    Adam wrote:
    If you think the Salmon was a fiddle, wait 'til you get to the track panels, and more particularly, the chains...
    Hi Adam
     
    What's the problem with the track panels - I was just going to make some 60 ft lengths using Exacto thick ply sleepers and chairs, am I missing something?
     


    One tip you may find of use based on dad's experience. Weighting and keeping these wagons from warping can be a problem which dad resolved by gluing (I think he used some form of reasonably heavy duty epoxy - not Araldite) a pair of bicycle spokes to the underside of the wagon. A useful 2 in 1 approach.
    Now that doesn't surprise me at all - I was thinking in terms of thin strips of lead sheeting in between the trusses and around the bogie pivots, but the bicycle spokes idea is quite good
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:20 pm
     


    timlewis wrote:
    and the sprung buffers (you did think ahead and drill for them before joining ends to sides didn't you ),
    Might have done ...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Tony W on Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:42 pm
     
    Hi Rod
     
    Since you've been so busy modelling I'm guessing you weren't on Porthmadog High Street the other day at 5:30 in the morning to see the first train to travel between the Festiniog and Welsh Highland Railways.
     
    Hope you had a good holiday
     
    Tony
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:54 pm
     
    Unfortunately not Tony - I only learned about it afterwards, and I doubt if Mrs 10800 would have been impressed if I'd gone out to see it anyway!
     
    We did travel on the Ffestiniog on that day though (see separate thread), will be back in September for the full Monty most probably!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by nevardmedia on Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:06 pm
     
    Nice looking job them there signals!
    How did you 'chunky up' the etched laddering? Solder?
    You're a lucky man - If I took all my modelling stuff when we go on holiday, the Mrs would be seriously upset "this is a supposed to be a break from everything so you can spend quality time with me"
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Grimleygrid on Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:25 pm
     
    Wow, the semaphore signal looks fantastic. Absolutely stunning modelling.
     
    I am impressed that you can take modelling on holiday with you. Mrs. Grimley would not be for that!!
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Adam on Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:56 pm
     


    10800 wrote:
    Adam wrote:
    If you think the Salmon was a fiddle, wait 'til you get to the track panels, and more particularly, the chains...

    Hi Adam
     
    What's the problem with the track panels - I was just going to make some 60 ft lengths using Exacto thick ply sleepers and chairs, am I missing something? The tedium of doing it?
     
    No, seriously, it's the chains to hold them on that are the real fiddle factor (unless you get into drilling holes in the end of the rail for the fishplates of course...). Stick them on firmly enough of course and there's a bit of rigidty from the rail too, which is handy.
     
    Adam
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:46 pm
     


    nevardmedia wrote:
    Nice looking job them there signals!
    How did you 'chunky up' the etched laddering? Solder?
    You're a lucky man - If I took all my modelling stuff when we go on holiday, the Mrs would be seriously upset "this is a supposed to be a break from everything so you can spend quality time with me"
    Cheers Chris
     
    The ladder was just strengthened by tinning all over (still illegal in some counties I believe ) before removing from the fret. I think it still needs a support bracket half way up but I don't remember seeing one on photos of the signal concerned.
     
    As for taking modelling stuff on hoilday, it was Mrs 10800's suggestion - on rainy days she relaxes by reading and I model!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:48 pm
     


    Adam wrote:
    No, seriously, it's the chains to hold them on that are the real fiddle factor (unless you get into drilling holes in the end of the rail for the fishplates of course...). Stick them on firmly enough of course and there's a bit of rigidty from the rail too, which is handy.
    I'll have to check out some photos as to how it was done and see what the options are
    __________________________________________
  15. 10800
    O10800WB - a little holiday modelling
     
    by 10800
     
    original page on Old RMweb
    Go to comments
     
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:13 am
     
    While I have them with me for safekeeping during Eridge's rebuild, I thought I'd put up some pics of the Eridge goods shed, built a few years ago (it's the one on my avatar) showing some more details of its construction.
     
    The model was based on photographs and a drawing of a very similar shed (but brick-built) elsewhere on the Cuckoo line. Basis of construction was stripwood, Evergreen sheets for the main walls, Wills slate sheets for the roof, and lots of plasticard strip of various sizes.
     

     

     

     
    The roof was a bit of a problem because of the small size of the Wills sheets, which I attempted to deal with (not entirely successfully) by solvent-welding sheets together. It's not as bad in the flesh as it seems here.
     

     
    This shows the interior and the stripwood frame. The platform is just ply timbering for pointwork, and the crane is another Wills product.
     

     
    The roof was based on a plastic strip A-frame concoction.
     

     

     
    Finally, some paint and weathering experiments with the humble Ratio P-way hut.
     

     

     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by number6 on Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:14 pm
     
    Lovely. I would have liked to see how a small shed like this worked back in the day... - you could get quickly overloaded inside if you didn't tranship stuff quickly. Lots of brute force required too. What was the gallows on the end wall for?
     
    I particuarly like your building corners.
     
    Raphael
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:29 pm
     
    Cheers Raphael
     
    The corners were tidied up by yet another application of thin microstrip!
     
    It took me ages to find out what the gallows thing was. I understand it is a gauge used by the p-way department when realigning and reballasting in the station, to make sure the rail-to-platform height is maintained. Previously I had thought it was something to do with wagon loads and door access, so I may need to take it off and review its length! There was also one hanging on the signalbox at Oxted.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:15 am
     
    Nothing especially exciting, but for anyone who hasn't seen it here's how you change the wheels on a Heljan 33 (same process applies to other Heljan locos).
     
    The raw materials - in this case Kernow limited edition green 33/0 and Ultrascale P4 conversion pack.
     

     
    Pull off bogie side frames from the pins which also hold the pickup strips. Be careful with the 33 because you have to negotiate around the lifting lug on the solebar positioned mid-bogie (not an issue with the Hymek or 47).
     

     

     
    With the aid of a small screwdriver, gently lever off the bogie cover plate, exposing the wheelsets and gear assembly.
     

     

     
    Lift out original wheelsets. At this stage I also nipped off the RTR coupling pocket.
     

     
    With needle nose pliers, bend out the pickup strip to ensure contact with the wider-spaced P4 wheels.
     

     
    Check back-to-back of replacement wheelsets.
     

     
    Drop them into place, ensuring the gears mesh and the pickups are not caught on the outside of the wheel.
     

     
    Snap back cover plate and refit side frames.
     

     
    Rewheeled bogie to the left, original to the right. Repeat process on other bogie.
     

     
    The first bogie took about half an hour, mainly due to the photography and being interrupted by The Archers. The second one took about 5 minutes.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:38 am
     
    Excellent Rod, my blue one will be there tonight for the double-heading!...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:39 am
     


    10800 wrote:
    and being interrupted by The Archers
    I don't answer the door to 'em now...
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by craigwelsh on Mon Mar 10, 2008 10:44 am
     
    I didn't realise Ultrascale had full metal backs on their newer conversion packs, much better for pickup than the older ones that just had a metal tyre. I should probably swap some proper Ultrascales into my Hymek at some point and put the Black Beetle wheelsets into something that should have 14mm dia wheels.
     
    ps I see your B2B gauge is as tarnished as mine although the cutout in my Exactoscale B2B allows the gear to drop down so the whole wheel is against the gauge.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Mon Mar 10, 2008 11:23 am
     


    craigwelsh wrote:
    ps I see your B2B gauge is as tarnished as mine although the cutout in my Exactoscale B2B allows the gear to drop down so the whole wheel is against the gauge.
    I think you probably have the later version, Craig. Mine is the same as Rod's gauge....
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Mar 10, 2008 11:37 am
     


    craigwelsh wrote:
    I didn't realise Ultrascale had full metal backs on their newer conversion packs, much better for pickup than the older ones that just had a metal tyre.
    They must have changed some time ago Craig - the wheels on my Hymek and 47, which must have been purchased at least 2 years ago, have full metal backs.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by craigwelsh on Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:17 pm
     


    10800 wrote:
    craigwelsh wrote:
    I didn't realise Ultrascale had full metal backs on their newer conversion packs, much better for pickup than the older ones that just had a metal tyre.

    They must have changed some time ago Craig - the wheels on my Hymek and 47, which must have been purchased at least 2 years ago, have full metal backs. I must admit most of my Ultrascale purchases so far have been second hand to avoid the wait (and save some money!) so I haven't had any new production. Good to know though, will definiately have to change the Hymek wheels and put the 14mm ones in something else.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:56 pm
     


    Captain Kernow wrote:
    Excellent Rod, my blue one will be there tonight for the double-heading!...
    And very successful it was too!
     
    viewtopic.php?f=25&t=19496
     
    Faultlessly smooth running from both 33s I must say. I still prefer the green one though!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:40 pm
     
    It's been far too long since I looked at these, so I thought I ought to try and finish them before the Eridge MkII track is completed! So out they came for a rinse and a health check. This is what they looked like at the current stage of progress - from left to right: down inner home bracket (SR railbuilt post, lattice dolls); combined up advanced starter and splitting distants for the next box - also railbuilt post and lattice dolls; and up platform starter bracket (LBSCR lower quadrant arms, lattice post and dolls. Some minor repair work needed to the counterbalance pivot on the latter and the movement-limiting wire on one of the distant arms, and a couple of the spectacle plates have gone (these will probably be replaced with Kristal Klear and coloured pen).
     

     
    And from the back
     

     
    Horrendously cruel enlargement of some of the crank and wire arrangements. Real signals have cables and pulleys, so this is a compromise of course, but when all the detail is added and the signals are painted it shouldn't look such a mess. I'll also trim off the tails on the control wires (0.33 mm brass wire) a bit closer when I'm happy with everything.
     

     

     
    I didn't plan sufficiently for the actuation arrangements, so the short sections of bearing tube that the control wires pass through (the three-arm signal in this case) were too close to the plug-in cylindrical section for the method I now want to use. I didn't want to unsolder the cylinder 'casings' because of the knock-on effect on the signal itself, especially in respect to the whitemetal railbuilt posts, so I have now removed them by carefully snipping them into sections with tin snips and levering the sections off. The tubes will now be replaced by new ones in a more suitable position.
     

     

     
    The diagram below (not to scale) shows in cross-section how I now plant to actuate the signals, using Tortoise motors mounted so the movement is vertical rather than horizontal, but most importantly enabling the signals to be removed easily for safety. The basic idea is that the 3/16 inch brass bar acts as a counterbalance enabling the control wire to be pulled down by gravity, and pushed up again by the action of the Tortoise. There will be additional limit stops added for the Tortoise arm itself to prevent too much movement being imposed on the signal arms, and the brass 'weights' will be lubricated with graphite (4B pencil). If necessary the wire/bar assembly could be removed for maintenance by detaching the control wire from the signal.
     
    The black bits on the diagram are fixed, the red are the moving parts on the signal assembly, and the blue the moving parts from the Tortoise(s).
     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by pinkmouse on Mon Jul 21, 2008 7:19 am
     
    Looking good Rod, I look forward to seeing them in the flesh.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Jul 21, 2008 8:03 am
     
    Thanks Al - next stages are:
     
    1) Finish off all the crank and wire fitting
    2) Solder on all the safety rails and ladders
    3) Fit the details - counterbalance weights, lamps, finials, strengthening plates on the railbuilt posts, track-circuit diamonds if appropriate etc etc. To avoid bits falling apart when soldering, these will probably be glued with epoxy (and some bits will be plasticard anyway)
    4) Paint
    5) When I have the track boards, build and fit the actuating mechanisms
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Horsetan on Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:17 am
     


    10800 wrote:
    ......next stages are:
     
    1) Finish off all the crank and wire fitting
    2) Solder on all the safety rails and ladders
    3) Fit the details - counterbalance weights, lamps, finials, strengthening plates on the railbuilt posts, track-circuit diamonds if appropriate etc etc. To avoid bits falling apart when soldering, these will probably be glued with epoxy (and some bits will be plasticard anyway)
    4) Paint
    5) When I have the track boards, build and fit the actuating mechanisms
    Any plans to illuminate them, Rod?
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:24 am
     
    No Ivan, Eridge only runs in daylight! And TBH I'll be more than pleased to have the arms go up and down. Mind you, on the down inner home and up starters the backblinders are there to stop the signalman seeing the white backlight when the signal is pulled off ...
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Tue Jul 22, 2008 10:41 pm
     
    Slowly but deliberately steadily progressing with the rod and crank arrangements. I'm using the cranks that come on Alan Gibson signal bracket frets, which come in two sizes - trying to use the small ones where possible but sometimes they just don't give enough throw so have to use the larger ones. There's a lot of trial and error, and moving of position to get the most reliable and efficient configuration. Also lots of frustration with the wire fitting - especially with the bending of the tails once fitted, where you can cause a bit of damage if not careful. For this reason I'm only doing a bit at a time, but the worst is now done Otherwise it would soon be a case of "right so you want to bounce do you, let's see how much you bounce off that *!@!** wall over there!".
     
    One useful tip is to use dividers and Bill Bedford's handrail bending jigs to prepare the wires. Saves the error of multiple measurements on something that rarely keeps very still.
     

     
    Just offer up the dividers to the crank-crank separation concerned, and adjust to fit:
     

     
    Then transfer the dividers to the jig and find the length that matches:
     

     
    and prepare and cut the wire accordingly. Works every time.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by timlewis on Tue Jul 22, 2008 11:04 pm
     


    10800 wrote:
    There's a lot of trial and error, and moving of position to get the most reliable and efficient configuration.
    Hmm, don't you just love trial and error.
    Nice to see these again: looking rather good. I always think that good signals really make a layout: it seems to be the thing that everyone leaves till last (maybe you know why!) and then it's not always easy to get right (one of the advantages of modelling a real place, assuming you have a signalling diagram that is).
     
    Tim
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Hamilton on Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:23 am
     
    There are some really usefull little tips there thank you very much that I will take on board for my next signal construction project (after building some points and a loco and some rolling stock!)
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:18 am
     


    timlewis wrote:
    Hmm, don't you just love trial and error.
    Best way to learn and improve, although sometimes it doesn't seem that way I should have started with some simple single-post examples (which I now have two of to do now that the layout has extended a bit at the station end) but hey life is for living
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:24 am
     


    Hamilton wrote:
    There are some really usefull little tips there thank you very much that I will take on board for my next signal construction project (after building some points and a loco and some rolling stock!)
    Mick Nicholson of this parish has suggested pre-heating the wires with a match to make bending easier. Bending the tails round is just about my least-favourite task in modelling because of the potential damage you can do and the all-round fiddliness. I had thought about using a 1-2 cm length of tubing as a lever but the smallest I had available was 0.7mm bore and so there was still too much slop over the 0.33mm wire to make it effective. So it was back to the needle-nose pliers, perspiration and blue air!
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:38 pm
     
    The good news is that all the wire and crank fitting is done!
     

     

     

     
    Not so good is that the various crank bearings (or rather my method of doing them) means that they (and the counterbalances) protrude too far forward and so the landing rails would be inboard of them on at least two of the signals Hmmm ... OK, just another challenge and part of the learning process I guess - what I will do is graft another plank worth of landing on the front of the existing landing to provide the space and clearance without the whole thing looking stupid. I could cut off the rear of the landing and move that to the front, but then I'd have to drill more holes for the uprights in the next plank in and I don't fancy doing that in situ; I could unsolder the dolls and move them back a shade - no I couldn't, not after all that effort in getting the wires working . So the landing will just end up being a little wider - another compromise, but the least of several evils I think.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:31 am
     
    Now that they're 'working' I've decided to take each one through to completion separately. So starting with the ex-LBSC up starter, this now has ladders on the landing and the rails added (authenically wonky! ). Starting to look more like a real signal now! There's just about enough room to squeeze the lamp in between the doll, arm, ladder and backblinder on the left hand one.
     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Horsetan on Sat Jul 26, 2008 12:00 pm
     
    The signal arms seem very similar to the GSR / CIE arms, Rod.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sat Jul 26, 2008 4:02 pm
     
    Indeed so Ivan, straight out of the Saxby & Farmer catalogue!
    __________________________________________
  16. 10800

    KAG meeting 1st October

    By 10800,

    I managed to organise my work schedule around another visit to my 'other' area group last week to catch up on progress and do a bit more myself.
     
    Here is Mark, Mike and Al (Pinkmouse) not getting in each others' way as the Eridge trackwork gradually gets more extensive
     

     
     
    Chris had meanwhile pre-chaired all this rail before going on holiday - whether this is cause and effect we don't know . When he comes back we'll show him the Colin Craig FB etches that Mark bought at Scaleforum!
     

     
    This array of track gauges is probably a bit OTT!
     

  17. 10800

    Trackwork progresses

    By 10800,

    Eridge (P4) rebuilding
     
    by 10800
     
    original page on Old RMweb
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by pinkmouse on Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:27 pm
     
    Yup, first board done in very fetching pink and black.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:31 pm
     


    pinkmouse wrote:
    Yup, first board done in very fetching pink and black.

    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sat May 02, 2009 5:02 pm
     
    Steady progress being made on ballasting and tracklaying on all the plain track sections. This was all done before the discovery of the use of Johnson's Klear for ballasting
     
    Once the plain track is done, the P&C work will be done ex-situ and ballasted after fitting. In fact the first bits are under way now, so there may be some pics of that soon.
     

     

     

     
    When the trackbed boards were cut we were using a Templot printout based on A3 sheets joined together. Despite care in joining the individual sheets, there was a offset discrepancy of about 2 inches over the 25 ft overall length discovered when we used a single roll-plotted printout. Fortunately the turnout on the left foreground here is only a trap point so we can just get away with it.
     

     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by martin_wynne on Sun May 03, 2009 3:51 am
     


    10800 wrote:
    When the trackbed boards were cut we were using a Templot printout based on A3 sheets joined together. Despite care in joining the individual sheets, there was a offset discrepancy of about 2 inches over the 25 ft overall length discovered when we used a single roll-plotted printout.
    Hi Rod,
     
    That's an error of 0.67% which I would regard as significant.
     
    Templot includes a printer calibration function for the highest accuracy when printing directly. But it's not available for exported DXF files, and using it with commercial PDF printing firms means a double trip to the print shop.
     
    For DXF files you can make your own correction via the print scaling function, but again it means two trips to the printer (and adding some background reference lines to the file).
     
    The most likely causes of a mismatch are:
     
    1. Use of a laser printer instead of ink-jet or other cold printer. Laser printers heat the paper, causing it to shrink and distort slightly. Ink-jet printing is recommended for the highest accuracy when printing from Templot.
     
    2. Uncalibrated roll printer. Over a 25ft length any variation from the quoted dpi figure can be significant. On a heavily-used commercial printer the most likely cause is wear of the print roller.
     
    3. Wide variation of ambient conditions in which the paper or printouts were stored. For laser printing, paper which has been stored in damp conditions will shrink noticeably when printed.
     
    Sorry to hijack your topic, I'm never quite sure of the correct form to adopt when responding to a side issue like this. The layout is looking good!
     
    regards,
     
    Martin.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by pinkmouse on Sun May 03, 2009 8:49 am
     
    Martin, I doubt very much that any of us involved in Eridge consider it a hijack.
     
    This is however interesting information about the issue of laser printers, it is something I had in the back of my mind from using a laser to create PCB artwork, but as I don't work with the very tiniest of SMT components with the tight tolerances involved, it was never an issue, however I can now see how it creates problems with a design on such a large scale as this. Still, nothing we can do about it now, just something to bear in mind for Eridge MkIII.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun May 03, 2009 1:07 pm
     
    Hi Martin
     
    Maybe you misunderstood me, or I expressed it badly, it wasn't an error in overall scaling, just a lateral shift due to (my) cumulative errors in sticking a lot of A3 sheets together when we cut the baseboard tops compared with the single roll plot being used now for trackbuilding. Lengthwise it was spot on.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by craigwelsh on Mon May 04, 2009 10:23 pm
     
    Looking good Rod, we'll be going through all this in a couple of months when we start relaying the main lines on Slattocks following the S4 Soc AGM..
     
    I've had access to a 42inch wide roll plotter so we used that to print out the yard and it will be used for the main section, it certainly is a lot easier than sticking bits of A3 together.
     
    We've been relaying the yard but keeping the points in place and it proved 'interesting trying to tie the Templot print out to the points that had been laid. Hopefully it'll all be working again by the AGM though.
     
    Interesting how you ballast all the sleepers before laying the rail.. I assume these are all still 1/2 height sleepers?
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon May 04, 2009 10:54 pm
     
    Thanks Craig
     
    Yes they're half-height sleepers with rivet holes, which help in placing the rail (once ballasted you can't see the Templot print any more ) although rivets aren't being used on the plain track, just Exactoscale chairs glued to the sleepers. P&C work is being done separately before ballasting and using rivets at crossing vees etc.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sat Jun 13, 2009 4:51 pm
     
    Some pointwork now being installed in between the lengths of plain line
     

     

     
    And a couple of shots showing the board-end "track strengthening" process - PCB with brass bar onto which sleepers are threaded (if we remember ) and rail is soldered to. The sleepers are currently loose but will be bedded into the ballast and cosmetic half-chairs added in due course.
     

     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Captain Kernow on Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:21 pm
     


    10800 wrote:
    the board-end "track strengthening" process - PCB with brass bar onto which sleepers are threaded ................. and rail is soldered to
    Hmm, interesting.... food for thought, I think...
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:07 pm
     
    The idea is that (unlike just soldering the rail to copperclad) you can still use chairs and maintain a gap between the rails and the sleepers.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by jim s-w on Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:32 am
     
    Looking great Rod
     
    Are you sure the check rails and wing rails wouldn't be combined in a crossing though? I dont know about your era but they sometimes are now a days.
     
    Cheers
     
    Jim
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Jun 14, 2009 5:01 pm
     
    Jim, presume you mean extending the wing rails to be the check rails for the opposite crossing? It seems logical in some respects, but I haven't seen it done much in the 50s/60s even if it only means leaving a short gap.
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by jim s-w on Sun Jun 14, 2009 5:04 pm
     
    Thats right Rod
     
    I did wonder if it was a more recent thing.
     
    Cheers
     
    Jim
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Andy G on Sun Jun 14, 2009 8:27 pm
     
    It was quite common in the Manchester area in the 50s and 60s and Slattocks will feature them, but it does seem to be a case of checking the prototype at the appropriate date.
     
    Andy
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:49 pm
     
    While having a few days off I'm cracking on with building some of the Eridge pointwork ex situ.
     
    This is the crossover from the down loop into the goods yard, with trap point and entry to the end dock. Here's the Templot printout laid out with ply sleepers already in position (rivets on a few of them). This is actually the bit nearest the camera in the very first photo in this topic on the old version of the layout.
     

     
    After planning out and threading on the chairs - including key direction, as this is bidirectional I opted for alternating except next to fishplates where the keys have to be pointing the other way - I decided to solder on the brass fishplates before laying the rail (in places where only a cosmetic rail join is needed). Despite the Brassmasters packet these are old Colin Waite ones. The steel rail is quite old too, hence the rust - realistic huh?
     

     

     
    First 'straight' stock rail fixed, covering two turnouts.
     

     
    First vee (1:8) in position, gauges in place (the block gauge just acting to stop the nose of the vee going tight to gauge with respect to the stock rail).
     

     
    And the vee in place. The red marks are where physical rail joins are required, not just cosmetic ones (for polarity control).
     

     
    Hopefully more to come tomorrow (off out to the jazz tonight )
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:44 pm
     
    It's really spooky to see someone else's version of the same prototype! Ralph Burrows' depiction of Eridge in MRJ 192 is very nice indeed, but he did have six years start on us, and I presume he hasn't torn it all up and started again either!
     
    It doesn't say what gauge it is, although I guess it's 00 just from the references to moving straight from Peco to copperclad and to using RTR stock without mentioning conversion - so that would speed things up as well.
     
    It says something for the operational interest in the prototype, because that is four versions that I know of - this one, ours, Vivien Thompson's somewhat disappointing one that was in RM a couple of years ago, and another home-tied EM version somewhere in Cheshire (which I think is set in LBSCR days).
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Mon Jul 27, 2009 1:26 pm
     
    More on the turnouts
     
    The Martin Wynne (well that's where I got it) method of forming obtuse angles in wing rails - couple of rail offcuts, small screwdriver, jeweller's hammer, light tap and there you are (only two hands and no tripod available so no action shots!)
     

     

     
    Wing rail being fitted using flangeway, triangular and block gauges - spot the mistake (rectified later ) in the last chair on the right!
     

     

     
    Exactoscale insulated fishplate in place for the switch rail
     

     
    Switch rail fitted, and completed common crossing (will do check rails later)
     

     

     
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:03 pm
     
    A couple of shots showing a bit more tracklaying progress - now almost got one line complete end to end
     

     

     
    __________________________________________
    Comment posted by Dave Holt on Sun Aug 30, 2009 3:06 pm
     
    Rod,
     
    This is looking very nice, indeed, look forward to further progress. The sweep of the curve on the main line is just crying out for a re-built West Country with 12 on, flat out! - And I've got just to loco!!
     
    Keep up the good work.
     
    Dave.
    __________________________________________
     
    ??? posted on Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:28 pm
     
    Thanks Dave, we might borrow your WC one day!
     
    It would have to accelerate pretty sharpish out of the (extended!) fiddle yard though, and the 12 on might have to be mainly Gresley or Thompson (?) bogie pigeon vans for authenticity - passenger services usually only went to 7 or 8.
    __________________________________________
  18. 10800

    Partial set up last night

    By 10800,

    A diminished attendance at DRAG last night saw much of John's progress on about half of the boards and enabled a bit more track to be laid.
     

     

     

     
    Here is the current stub-end on the two superelevated tracks
     

     
    And Pete meanwhile has been making excellent progress on the master control panel, complete with automatic blanking out of DC power when DCC is plugged in and lots of indicator lights which the rest of us don't understand yet .
     

  19. 10800

    Work and play

    By 10800,

    I made one of my too occasional visits to the KAG clubroom on Thursday to see how the rest of the team were getting on. It was a full turnout and so there was no room for everyone to work on the track. Instead we see Mike's J class again, but in video this time:
     
    http://www.youtube.com/user/video10800?gl=GB&hl=en-GB#p/u/3/hV0R6RuO01c
     
    http://www.youtube.com/user/video10800?gl=GB&hl=en-GB#p/u/2/yWZaFPK2wO4
     
    And while those that could find some space worked , Mark got his DCC kit and two sound-chipped diesels out for a play at the far end:
     
    http://www.youtube.com/user/video10800?gl=GB&hl=en-GB#p/u/1/LYOVzoALM7U
     
    http://www.youtube.com/user/video10800?gl=GB&hl=en-GB#p/u/0/f_cv4VcnJSU
     
     
     
     
  20. 10800

    Planned expansion

    By 10800,

    The current 'continuous running' topic in the main forum reminded me how long it is since I updated this, so:
     
    It is still very much a goer of a project, and it is likely that I will be starting (with help from Re6/6) on extruded polystyrene-type baseboards in the near future - although on past experience I'm not going to state any timescales!
     
    It has also grown a bit and is now about 20ft by 9ft. The reason for this is to give a longer scenic runpast section and storage, especially with 9 or 10 coach trains, and to enable prototypical curves to be maintained in the scenic section, only decreasing to a ruling 33 inches well off scene. Obviously this prevents all of it being put up at home, but that was always going to be a squeeze and a rare opportunity, so it will go up from time to time at DRAG and maybe at shows.
     
    Here is the latest Templot of the frontage
     

     
    The back (storage sidings) isn't finished in Templot, but with use of Peco pointwork I'll probably just build it in situ, likely to be 4 or 5 roads in each direction.
     
    I haven't sketched out the latest scenic plan yet, but it is likely to be just a stretched version of the earlier one
     

     
    The main difference is not having the s-curve, which is a bit contrived, but also to slew one of the lines at the river crossing. This is to take advantage of a nice single track bespoke bridge I have acquired, and so the premise will be that the line was originally built single track but doubled later with a separate (and different) river bridge.
     
    As previously described in this blog, trains will mainly be a mixture of Southern Withered Arm steam and Western diesel hydraulics. There are no plans for any WR steam locomotives . The idea is for the layout to represent somewhere on the north side of Dartmoor in the 50s/early 60s at a time when the WR route from Exeter to Plymouth is closed for engineering and (diesel) trains are being diverted over the SR route.
     
    Most of the stock for running on it I already have, and the train register will give me quite a bit of variety:
     
    Ilfracombe portion of Devon Belle (WC with nine Pullmans)
    Van train (hauled by WC, N, Hymek, lots of choices!)
    Western on relief Cornishman or other named train (9-10 choc/cream Mk1s with the odd maroon replacement). Could also use D600 Warship on this when/if Kernow/Dapol commission is realised.
    Local WR train (Ivatt tank, Hymek, Cl 22)
    T9 or M7 on local SR train (Maunsell P set or augmented formation)
    N on milks/goods/ballast trains
    Short clay train (Cl 22 possibly)
    Bubble car and Class 108 DMUs
  21. 10800

    Weather 1, Field trip 0

    By 10800,

    John and I were planning on going up to Sussex today to get some more detail photos (at the time of the last trip we weren't planning on doing the whole viaduct) but in view of the weather we decided to postpone and get some other planning issues out of the way.
     
    One of these was to confirm the distribution of the board sections making up the viaduct and its approaches, and on laying the trackbed laser-cut sections out we decided finally on:
     
    Approach section with 4 arches (1.4m)
    10-arch section (1.4m)
    9-arch section (1.26m)
    10-arch section (1.4m)
    Approach section with 4 arches (1.4m)
     
    So the configuration is basically symmetrical with four of the boards of the same length and the centre board shorter by the amount of one arch.
     
    We then annotated all the track bed boards for cutting, including the scheme for overlapping (the 3mm boards have to be laminated together to make a 6mm track bed).
     
    Having done this, we could now start to think about the vertical design of the boards, which will probably 'step down' progressively from each end to the centre as the topography falls.
     
    Meanwhile, drawings are well advanced for production of etches for the curved brickwork sections for the main arches and pier apertures.
     
    As for the field trip - maybe we'll do that in the Spring when the weather is better and the days longer, and probably make it an overnighter to avoid 8 hours of driving all in a single day. Stopping over in the vicinity of the Eridge layout on club night is a distinct possibility!
  22. 10800

    Plinths and pavilions

    By 10800,

    Good day's progress today over at John's. Pavilions finished apart from decoration around top of columns, finalised track bed cutting on end boards, and attached 'plinths' to balustrades - using 3.3mm ply sleeper strip, makes a surprisingly big improvement to their 'solidity'. Not done the coping yet, walnut stripwood not yet arrived. Also made a jig for consistent fitting of the corbels supporting the refuges - Mark has finalised the design and a trial run of 20 has been ordered from Shapeways.
     
    Meanwhile John was making good headway on making the basis for the approaches to the viaduct proper, on which the pavilions sit. The photos show a provisional placing of all four pavilions at one end. The balustrades between the pavilions have 28 arches, and those between the inner pavilion and the first refuge have 21, compared to the 'standard' 19, so some 'cut-and-shut' work was necessary to make these.
     
    No this isn't an early pre-production of the Hornby 5-BEL, but an old Wrenn Belle we happened to have handy.
     

     

     

     

     

     

  25. 10800
    It's been a long time since there were any updates to the viaduct project (and no I haven't done any more to that footbridge). This has been due to a variety of non-modelling issues for both John and myself.
     
    Anyway, we're back looking to rebuild some momentum. This weekend we have made significant progress in conceptual planning of the final presentation format (of which more in due course). The main thing was to decide how high to have the track, bearing in mind that it will be different (higher) for the viaduct on its own compared with when it's exhibited with other modules. This has been done, and the track level will be at 1.40 m off the floor for the viaduct solo, and 1.15 m otherwise.
     
    The next thing was to determine depth of scenery at the back to the backscene, and the height of the backscene, taking into account likely viewing distances and eyelines. With some experimentation we were able to reduce the depth of board behind the layout without seeming to compromise the illusion.
     
    This is the real view through the viaduct:
     

     

     

     
    And these are the preliminary test images from today's experiments:
     

     

     
    Don't worry about the missing balustrades and pavilions - these were never permanently attached and have been removed pending final detailing and fettling.
     
    The backscene image is based on photos from the actual location. Obviously the final versions will be in (muted) colour with some 'real' vegetation in front. We'll decide on the actual sizes later on when we are nearer completion.
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