Il Grifone

Got 2 of these! Interestingly, it's described as GWR freight brown (???) but the photo shows BR(W) livery.

On a good day, with the wind behind you!

Anyone have any idea what could possibly be "RARE" about this. The 'Hornby' branding doesn't wash IMHO. http://cgi.ebay.co.u...=item4cf230cf24 The GF coach looks like a close relation of Hornby's strange 00 3 compartment effort. The original GF 00 4 wheelers were definitely of the 'chop a bit off each end of a bogie coach' variety.

Cr@p for collectors only! And does anyone want a Hornby Dublo N2 to go with it? http://cgi.ebay.co.u...=item483a23aed4 It's possible that it's not even the original box as I seem to remember paying 59/6d for mine in 1954. (No discount 'box shifters' then, thanks to Resale Price Maintenance). They're not 'rare' or 'hard to find' either. Or, if that one's a bit too expensive, there's this one without even a photo! http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hornby-DUBLO-No-EDL7-LNER-0-6-2T-BR-No-69567-BOXED-/310213064992?pt=UK_Trains_Railway_Models&hash=item483a23b920

Yes it was available with either chassis. There was also Gaiety's own chassis for it. The casting was quite crude even by 1950s standards and (roughly) represents a 27xx pannier* despite the 5700 number on it. It was presumably passed off as a 57xx, because the last 27xx was scrapped at about the time the model first appeared. It's one of the few prototypes for which Romford's 18mm 16 spoke wheels are more or less correct. Neither the R1 nor the Jinty chassis has the correct wheelbase, but both have the great avantage over the original of being reliable and having round wheels. * Parallel chimney, whistle on the cab roof and square windows in the cab. The valance and steps are also typical of a 27xx.

I have a GWR 70' composite from King's Cross. Still unfinished though I have painted the sides in 1922 livery. It stalled though missing ends and I've never got round to buying/making new ones. The sheet plasticard I used was a failure. When I find where it's stored I'll post a picture, along with the CCW clerestory I did actually complete.

The wagon has Dean- Churchward brakes, so the lever is redundant and could be used on something else. I must reassemble mine. It's been in bits for ages. So many trains; so little time!

The bowed sides are not uncommon (I have a K's B set which suffers from this - one day I'll get round to finishing it - stuck at the painting stage - 1922 livery!) For the van, the guard's compartment walls should solve the problem. No floor was the norm for K's, though the CORAL A has one. Equalising the bogies and proper brass pinpoint bearings sort out even K's bogies. Metal K's wheels (aka Jackson) are fine. Plastic ones are good only for the bin or making filler.

It just doesn't seem to be getting the TLC. When I saw it. there was still some paint. Try eBay or the local swapmeet for the K's kit. IIRC it's a K14*. The differences between K14/5/6 were in the ends. K15 having gangways. Earlier ones had Dean 8'6" bogies, later American. * The kit has the blank corridor ends and Dean bogies. The later are correct for K14 as built, but they did get swopped around. EDIT: Checked my references (which I should have done first!). K14 had five panel ends (like the Tri-ang clerestories) and K16 had the blank corridor end. This makes the bogies incorrect, but they did get swapped around or add the gangways for earlier lots of K15. This kit came with pin point axles (A review commented on how free running it was!) Unfortunately this makes the bogies too wide. GW bogies were 5' 9" between frames (maybe not the Dean I'll check*) whereas the K's frames are about scale 6" thick. Vigorous thinning down makes all the difference. Care however as the whitemetal is quite delicate. * Actually 5' 8½" with 5/8" frames for Dean bogies.

The K's kit is actually not too bad. It was one of the first kits I ever built back in the fifties. The GWS example is here http://www.didcotrailwaycentre.org.uk/wagons/41723/41723.html It's in a terrible state. I have some photos I took years ago somewhere. IF (big if) I can find them and copy them (they're slides), I'll see if I can post them.

I know TT is not that common and this is an unusual item but..... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/TRIANG-TT-T97-BR-4-6-2-BRITANNIA-BODECIA-LOCOMOTIVE-NEW-/220489314069?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Trains_Railway_Models&hash=item33562fef15 Pity the number and name don't match.

Interestlingly described as"MIB" ('Mint in Box' I assume) and "MINT" and then goes on to state "(many parts removed from plastic sprues)", which means it isn't! (I remenber these kits usually came with bits already off the sprues and often missing altogether. They were always very good at supplying a replacement part however.)

These were considered the 'Rolls-Royce' of model coaches at the time. IIRC they were priced at around £2, which compares with 14/11d for a Dublo LMS coach. (I would estimate 1/- equates to about £1.25 today.

The GF coaches appeared later in the sixties as R-T-R in 'Grafar' packaging. They were available in company liveries, whereas the kits came unpainted in black plastic. They appear to be of Southern design (approximately) for which their 8 foot wheelbase bogies would be correct. I have seen the non-corridors described as LMS 'Cathgart' stock, but comparing with photographs, they're not IMHO. My Formoway plastic (Deadway?) crossings and check rails are scheduled for replacement with metal and PCB sleepers in due course. Running was indifferent to say the least with these. My Tri-ang based GWR 633 Class would always stall on these unless everything was freshly cleaned. Is this the fibre based Welkut or the later plastic based type? I thought the latter only came in 2 rail. Anything 3 rail disappeared with the demise of Dublo.

Kadee do couplers for most Rivarossi (AHM in the states - see the Nat Polk interview), so it should be relatively painless. This model appears in the 1972 catalogue I have. I believe it dates back to the sixties Seeking info on German locos, led me to try the (Google IIRC) German translator. (My knowledge of German makes reading it rather tiring.) I ended up making a few suggestions of better translations!

I've not tried the Italian translator (not needing to), but the German fails miserably with technical terms. Very early Rivarossi is not very common even in Italy, probably because 1. it was/is expensive. (Most Italians had other things to spend money on at the time.) and 2. it suffers badly from mazak disease. The plastic items are bakelite which chips easily. I find Rivarossi wheels run well on Dublo track but need a small washer (the Peco ones are ideal) to increase the back to back so that they don't drop into Dublo points (at the blades where the gauge widens to about 18mm!).

For those interested there is this useful site. http://www.rivarossi-memory.it/ A knowledge of Italian is useful (like the NEM site, the English version is incomplete), but please ask if you need any help.

They appear to be HD bogies which would explain the 3 rail description. It's straight which suggests the sixties version. The first examples came with a diecast bogie with a plastic bearing unit. This was rubbish which would explain the choice of bogie. There are some Formoway points on eBay, but they are rather expensive and 2 foot radius, which may or may not be a problem. Also they are not 'Liveway', which probably is. The same seller also has some Pullmans. http://collectables.shop.ebay.co.uk/Trains-Railway-Models-/479/i.html?_catref=1&_fln=1&_ipg=&_ssn=bigcass48&_trksid=p3911.c0.m282

Speedy replies as always! I don't know how I forgot the Hudson and her coaches. I intended to add it after the Formo items. I also forgot to mention that all items are subject to Mazak disease. The wagon bodies seem OK but everything else is at risk. The great advantage of Formoway over Peco is that its to 00 rather than H0 scale. It's demise (together with Gem and Welkut) left us without a ready-to-lay 00 track.

To get this started, I'll give a short history as I remember it, which may be incorrect and I would welcome more information/corrections. I believe the first model was the Black 5 (GP5), which came with some strange 4 wheel coaches. This was followed by a 'Merchant Navy' (I read this is undersized and nearer to a West Country), a 'King' and a 'Prairie' tank. There were 2 series of wagons in dark brown, bauxite and grey - Van, 7 plank and steel minerals and a brake van and later 1, 3 and 5 plank opens and a bolster wagon. The first had diecast axleguard units and the second a tinplate unit. Coaches came as LMS? pattern non corridors and Pullman cars - Kitchen First with a variety of names (also in CIWL livery !) and a brake/3rd. There was also the three rail Formo series 0-6-0 + 4 wagons 7 plank & steel opens, van and brake. All? these were available irregularly during the fifties. The Formo wagons, I remember, were very unstable due to their tinplate wheel bearings and terrible wheels and would not run well on Dublo track despite the similarity with Formo track (a nicer version of Dublo track with embossed sleepers a larger radius and wider 'ballast'). Other wagons ran OK. Everything came with the neat, but eccentric Farish coupling, which will not couple with anything else due to its mounting height. The early sixties saw a 94xx pannier (mine runs beautifully) and a reissue of the 'Prairie', the Pullmans, the non Corridor coaches (in kits) and a new series of plastic wagons. Other products were corridor coaches (promised as kits, but I think only R-T-R) and Formoway 00 (not H0! ) flexible track. This was followed by the 'Grafar' R-T-R era up to the mid 70s (possibly 80s?), after which all production switched to N gauge.

Does anyone know whether the original patent of the Peco coupling (1946 IIRC) is still valid?

Yes it's the later 60s plastic version (no possibility to bend these!). These came with the Trix (rather than Trix Twin) pin point wheelsets, which had a quite reasonable profile, compatible with HD and BRMSB. The Trix Twin wheels were an entrely different matter. (B-B 12- 12.5mm. 4.2 mm thick - of which 1.7mm flange - and 2mm deep flanges ). I would agree about the free running capabilities of the underframes. These will find the slightest slope.

The problem with the Trix version was their enormous wheels necessitating a narrower uncoupling ramp. (This was also copied in the later -60s - Jouef/Playcraft version.) Full compatibility involves bending the uncoupling dropper in or out (Peco included instructions on this). This variation didn't save Trix from a lawsuit, which they lost. Incidently the Trix version is rather more reliable than the Dublo variety, thanks to the higher lift of the ramp and the upward 'prong' for coupling with the rather neat pre-war coupling (and the Trix Express post war type).

Drill out the rivet from above* and then the coupling can easily be removed intact. (Sell on eBay if not broken). Drill two holes and the new coupling can be fixed with screws and nuts. Alternatively a replacement underframe as the Dublo u/f is not up to the body. The original patent was indeed Peco - rights being sold/leased to Meccano Ltd. for 'toy' trains. Trix were later allowed to use it under licence. Tri-ang didn't want to pay the licence fee and lumbered us with the ghastly Tri-ang Mk II & Mk III (aka tension lock). * Tricky in the case of open wagons as the rivets hold the body on.

Rare yes (for once!), but a tad OTT pricewise IMHO.