34theletterbetweenB&D

Sorry if you don't like it, but it is the nickname in common currency. It's a man's world, motor sport...

What else would you expect from Davros' daughter? That's a sobriquet that I'll remember for at least this season.

The grammatical error and the failure to mention all other road users rather than simply drivers says otherwise to me. But as ever, YMMV.

Have posts 3003 to 3005 given you a clue that your understanding is significantly defective on this point?

Let's be fair here. There are other manufacturers with locos and little to no matching stock for them to pull. Oxford, with four steam era wagons released after their first loco are ahead of DJM and SLW in this respect, and have announced a range of coaches. Oxford's choice of the LNER design general merchandise open means they have a wagon in their range appropriate to all standard gauge tracks in the UK where there were scheduled freight services from the grouping to BR blue. Peaking at roughly 2% of the steam era freight stock and of common user status, they went and were seen everywhere. Now look at Bachmann and Hornby at a similar point in their trajectory, when first launching models aimed at the adult market. Bachmann staged something of a tour de force with their BR mk1 and 16T steel mineral introductions, and have gone on from that point with steady expansion of both coach ranges and freight stock by majoring on common wagons; Hornby as I recall it had a goodly tranche of the 'newly tooled in China' loco models before us before coaches to a matching standard appeared; the wooden body K type Pullman cars, and these not exactly everyday vehicles. None of this to imply that OR's products are perfect, but credit for the right intentions is only fair: and happily the LNER six plank open is no more flawed than is typical for OO RTR wagons. So for my money their best wagon subject choice so far is also the 'plum'.

Funnily enough - and contrariwise - there's me thinking that Oxford could do a lot worse in carving out their niche, than by adopting a similar approach to Heljan. I thought Heljan's OO diesel selection on their own account rational: which might be characterised as 'we'll try everything for which no centre motor drive competitor model exists or is announced, starting with the more numerous types'. So a 47, 26/27/33, 52, 35, 17. With those done all that was available without competition as Bach, Dapol and Hornby had built up their diesel ranges in parallel, was then a set of pilot scheme 'disaster classes' and prototypes for which there were no models present or announced; 15, 16, 23, Falcon, Lion DP2. There are similar 'no current good competition' zones available to Oxford, in all of steam locos, coaches and wagons, largely down to a combination of old Bachmann and Hornby models lurking in their catalogues (the Dean Goods was a good spot in this respect) and some notable gaps in coverage South of the Trent. That's without even thinking about the humungous hole in coverage to the North. Are OR going to be brave and try the latter?

and D, He, DJM, etc. This suggests to me the response I first heard when acting as best man at a wedding, in response to the groom eulogising the happiness he had found with his new wife. In broadest, loudest and gravelliest bass Scot's tones, (for most of the groom's family hailed from those parts) from the back of the very large room: "Aye laddie, and wish you joy; now get some sea time in."

I have the inestimable advantage of family members who are definitely way better drivers than I am, to keep my limitations in that sphere of activity ever before me. Starts with my wife who has twice avoided valiant attempts by others at head on collisions which I am convinced I could not have achieved, weaved confidently through a rain of falling floor boards being dispensed by some on the M5, and only last year dodged a 'free range' vehicle very adroitly. (Having made it safe off road, the greater problem was locating the owner from among the many possibilities around the sloping hardstanding from which it had rolled.)

Smallish motors in the Garratt, and the failed example that someone was kind enough to dismantle and put a photograph on here had undoubtedly had a meltdown. I rather suspect a sum of contributions, not very special manufacturing quality of the motor, then placed under rather more load than desireable from both mechanism and running as a 'double header', the most likely set of causes. I see an example - just one! - running regularly, and it is fine. We have no clue to the scale of the failures, known to Hattons alone; and their view will be distorted by the 80% sold that have never turned a wheel to any extent.

Since Bachmann dragged RTR OO locos and vehicles from toy to model, there's been a steady growth of both the size and quality of the cake: Hornby, Heljan, Lima, Golden Age, Vi Trains, Dapol, Realtrack, DJM, Oxford Rail, Rapido, SLW, quickly come to mind; and it looks like the same is now happening in OO track. If OR - and indeed others - are smart, there are still plentiful niches to build their slice of the cake. Cleverest OR release for me to date, 6 plank LNER design general merchandise open. Every realistic layout based from 1923 to 1965 should have a few kicking around.

I have just one available pic of the Trestrol C, in 'LNER Wagons, 4B' on p266. Worth a trawl of Paul Bartlett's site; although this SCV was a real rarity, to which my 'build 2 accurate from 3' is an allusion. What I failed to mention is that while underlength for the Trestrol C, this vehicle is very close on length to the clearly related Weltrol P design of 1937 (p282 of same book): a 400% more numerous vehicle. So there we are, better match lengthwise to one SCV design, but with constructional features that clearly relate to another longer SCV design.

True enough, but if the number of prosecutions is as great as reported, I'd be feeling a little leery if that were within my responsibility. That's more than enough people affected to set off a class action looking for any error in the implementation of the scheme. (I have a recollection of a similar event some time ago where a minor procedural error was detected, and an authority had the costs of a failed defence and refunds.)

To which we may add the six wheel bogie 'Trestrol' a very neat model based on the LNER's Trestrol C design of 1938. (As a teen I thought this some kind of US design, as it figured heavily in their Battlesplat! range alongside many of the other Lionel sourced designs.) But as better information has become available I now know that it is based on a UK vehicle, and for all it is roughly 10% underlength it remains comfortably the largest specially constructed vehicle model ever available in OO RTR. (A cut and paste job can produce two scale length vehicles from three, and since the general proportions of the very sharp mouldings are correct, this is well worthwhile.)

Built from accurately scaled parts to the correct dimensional layout of course there isn't a problem. After all the full size parts are all present on the prototype. Follow on question: and what is the minimum radius on which the resulting model runs?

Anyone else? Preferably who has fitted the fixed Cartazzi frame option to their A4 and then tested it to see what the minimum radius capability is?

What would constitute evidence of a manufacturer taking note of dissatisfaction? In my book the necessary evidence would be a brisk resumption of 'normal service'. My evidence: Dapol, may or may not be listening, but they still have OO announcements made in the previous decade not making progress, and plenty of folks observing this. Hornby, when Sanda Kan were closing down; endless complaint about delays which took years to resolve as they got new contractors engaged and up to speed. Bachmann, I don't think there's any shortage of input about the discontent, no evidence of a systematic response. (And we know that the Kader operation still has at least some capabilty to move product from announcement to available to purchase in the timescales achieved in the past; so they are definitely making decisions within the business about what progresses, and at what rate.) Any rationally managed business - and I am assuming these were and are - is going to note dissatisfaction among its customers and hopefully respond in order to minimise that. But that's wholly in the hands of that business, there's nothing a customer can do to effect the necessary changes.

My dear wife last night just before we retired: "I was speaking to Mrs XXXXXXXXX this afternoon, and she mentioned that for the time ever in her experience you were a little grumpy." What? I have known Mrs XXXXXXXXX since she entered the world as Miss YYYYYYYYY and threw up all over me in my new primary school uniform at what may well have been our first encounter at the school gate, she cradled in her late mother's arms. And now in my seventh decade she has finally noticed my discontent? Clearly I haven't been making sufficient effort. Resolved: although I have no truck with new year resolutions and the like, I shall henceforth attempt to give fullest and unequivocal expression of my feelings toward whatever displeases me. 'A little grumpy'? Let me tell you how I feel about those who don't pay attention...

That's one view. I am of the opinion that this is going to be their standard operational model for all reliveries from existing tooling. The retailers are offered a product selection, and what gets manufactured is only that which the retailers order in sufficient quantity to make the production run viable. (This 'pull' system has been operating for a large variety of consumer goods for many decades.) If that's correct then some time mid year there will be a list of cancelled/deferred products. Let's see.

Everyone is free to make their own decision on that one. I will buy whatever is offered that suits what I wish to model, and is of acceptable quality and price, irrespective of maker or delay from announcement. I was very happy with the much superior B17 from Hornby when that finally bowled up - I suspect that was four years or so from first announcement to going on sale - and likewise will happily entertain the purchase of a Bachmann V2 (or three) when that appears. Unless of course a cunning competitor spots the opening, and knocks in a winner before Bachmann get around to producing it; or alternatively I have a sudden burst of DIY activity and produce my own.

My experience says it will not. Customer expectation, built up over many years of better performance, cannot be simply wiped away by stating 'it will now take typically three times as long from announcement to product on sale, compared to what we have previously averaged'; which is I believe a pretty fair assessment based on the observed performance of the business by this customer. I find this performance disappointing, having become accustomed to a steady supply of new introductions from this source from 1999 to 2014; which were well thought out to expand what it was possible to model, principally using RTR product. But there it is, nothing can be done about it, Kader have the right to run their business as they choose, and this is the way they are choosing to operate their Bachmann UK organisation.

A question for any black labeller. Have you tried the alternative fixed Cartazzi frames; and if then operated with a flanged wheelset, what's the minimum radius requirement (both manufacturer's suggestion and own experience if possible)?

There's 3 inches extra distance on the 7P between the bogie wheel centre and the leading driver centre, and the cylinders are correctly positioned between the bogie wheels, and it's a significantly shorter loco. On the 7P model Hornby have used very small flanges on the bogie wheelsets (0.35mm) and the bogie moves forward when lateralIy displaced, which is possible because the cylinder block rear is significantly further forward relative to the trailing bogie wheel on the 7P. I can see why the model designer might favour the compromise of leaving the leading brake shoes off on the 8P model. It's Tom Coleman's detail design work on the 8P I am afraid! Might be worth suggesting that the leading brake shoes be made as a clip in piece for user application? They will fit on a display model on straight track; and those of us prepared to 'fiddle' will be able to make them work on larger radius curves.

Brace yourself; I had to wait to check out the model I once owned, now operating on a friend's layout to remind myself of my discontent with it. It took me a while to work out what was amiss on the current model when I acquired it some dozen years ago. It looked lumpen beside the grace of Doncaster pacific models, but then you would expect that to some extent; although not to the degree I was feeling. But gradually, by inspecting it against photos the shape errors made themselves known. It's a clear 2mm overheight overall and on boiler centreline, and the firebox shape is incorrect with easily noticeable knock on effects on the cab front. (Look at the consequent angle of the firebox sides, far too near vertical on the model, compared to the prototype.) Judging by the scan samples shown in the first page of this thread all this is going to be corrected, and I suspect when these models are released there will be some consternation among those owning the earlier model. Those with long memories may recall the fuss accompanying the releases of the first models of Swindon designs with the correctly rendered taper in plan of the fireboxes; or the complaints over Bachmann's Deltics caused by eyes suffering the effects of Lima Deltic induced distorto-vision. The new model if delivered corrsponding to the scans, will immediately look significantly leaner and longer - and righter and better! - positioned alongside against the old model I reckon.

Analyse it as a product, it will be a little more expensive to manufacture than a sound fitted A4, thanks to extra features. But it is a lot better than a sound equipped Hornby A4 because it sells at £400 instead of circa £200. That's what 'all the bells and whistles' products are about, enhanced profit. At least in this case you do actually get something different in the box, unlike the supermarket ploy of putting 'Taste the Finest' on the packaging, and then charging three or four times the money for the same item labelled 'ordinary'. Is it better? Depends on your priorities. It doesn't look any more like a duck than the most convincing other duck already available (which I can get to pull a 2.5kg load thanks to my willingness to install lead within) so to me it isn't. But others will feel differently. Generally a choice in options is evidence of strength in a market, so I see the availabilty of such an option as good news, even if it is of no direct interest to myself.

They seem to like four packs, and could do a 'mixed traffic' set of the last to enter service in 1947 - so still Big Four - of the GWR County, LMS Black Five, LNER B1 and SR light pacific; all of which are in their range.