RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted June 11, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 11, 2018 I have spent many hours at Saltley sadly most when the old steam shed had been demolished. I am therefore intrigued by the ironwork on display to the left of the brick building/ roundhouse....was this a new fabrication or is it the skeleton of a building being demolished? The more I look I suspect the latter...Looks like the demolition of No.3 Roundhouse. It only had its wartime bomb damage repaired c1959 but didn't last another ten years. Regarding the Peak under the coal stage I think it is a combination of the light and the film or scan. It looks like a full yellow end livery to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted June 15, 2018 Author Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) Whilst it is always nice to show the best bits..now and again.....tried the Garratt last night....first time for a while....it wouldn't run showing a short. I narrowed it down to one of the insulated driving wheels. The careless application of flux near to the insulation usually when soldering the crankpin top on....anyway over time it eats away at the cork...you know when applying power leads you get a bright sparking light and whiffs of smoke. The driver now uninsulated ....replacement ordered...will this loco ever cease being a source of grief...meanwhile V2 progressing more soon Edited June 15, 2018 by 46256 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted June 22, 2018 Author Share Posted June 22, 2018 (edited) Quick update on my nemesis....garratt....two wheels arrived seemed quite expensive...but arrived with axle and crankpins.... Wheel now replaced took opportunity to tweak where the coupling rod was just touching the lower motion bracket on one side. Anyway wont tempt fate further other to say now concentrating on V2. Edited June 22, 2018 by 46256 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted June 23, 2018 Author Share Posted June 23, 2018 I've always believed the best way to learn is from the mistakes of others...so will share...my layout has some very tight curves ....plus my initial poor trracklaying skills In my defence has improved in time but not quite up to Norman Soloman standards. This factor has led me to build umpteen chassis with very great " slop" in order to traverse my system. The RTR guys do this anyway...the Sideplay on axles for example . In the case of the Garratt the revolving bunker chassis kept stalling on one of my tighest curved points...the exit from fiddle yard. On close examination....courtesy of Bachman led head magnifier realised the rear insulated wheel was touching the point blade...causing the short. The remedy has been to place a washer on axle reducing Sideplay...seems to have worked whilst still allowing it to traverse this tight spot. I have found the solution to any number of modelling problems to be trial and error...tweaking here tweaking there...never glamourous and often frustrating...hey ho I could always take up stamp collecting.. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark axlecounter Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 Hi Brian hope all is well. I know how you feel when everything is going bad. But just think you have built what you see in front of you and don’t let it get you down. You will get there buddy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted June 24, 2018 Author Share Posted June 24, 2018 Good evening Mark, thank you for your kind words..I have posted recently not so much to vent my frustration...but rather to assure fellow modellers that it dosn't always turn out right the first ...second.. I believe we modellers often inhabit our own private...worlds...our latest project....our workbench. The threads on here and the model press show the process...the result..but often if at all the little tweaks required or when it goes so wrong you just want to give up. Please be assured when the fault (s) are ironed out the satisfaction is worth it. Best wishes Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted July 20, 2018 Author Share Posted July 20, 2018 Saltley depot October 1966 photos found on Facebook by my good friend Don Taggart. I will be meeting Don and other train spotting friends from the sixties and seventies at the SVR on 4th August....a certain anniversary. Ironically given our unusually hot summer there might be a steam ban in place! ....deisels travelling past dormant steam locos ...some how quite ....well realistic...little did we know that some of those steamers would outlive those new dangled diesel usurpers... 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted July 20, 2018 Author Share Posted July 20, 2018 On a modelling point, my Garratt....you guessed it...on running in my sauna like loft...the two twelve series mashimas ran so hot you could not touch them. This in turn led to the controller overloading. On researching via the net it seems this series motors are prone to this...or at least some...a batch are. They have been removed and my portescap rg4c powered chassis from my kitmaster straight tender build has now been substituted with great success. The two twelve series motors and gearboxes are removed and I believe they can function OK in a single application by not in duo as in the Garratt. I have secured a portescap motor and gearbox of eBay which will power the kitmaster. On the other hand might try a single assembly taken from my Heljan construct. ...in any event lots of work to do when the conditions in my loft don't resemble a Turkish bath... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) two more of Saltley this time by the station...both from Warwickshire railways site....the picture of the 8f brings back memories of sitting on top deck of 161 bus travelling into Brum with mum..standing up and peering over the wall of Saltley viaduct onto the gasworks and numerous tracks below often with trains passing underneath....all steam and smoke. The 8 f picture was taken early Decmber 62... Mum used to take me into Brum to go to the toy department at Lewis's at about this time of year.... Edited July 21, 2018 by 46256 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manna Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 G'Day Folks Love the pic of the 2f, tons of character. manna Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted July 22, 2018 Author Share Posted July 22, 2018 (edited) G'Day Folks Love the pic of the 2f, tons of character. manna thanks manna....the photo was taken by the late DJ Norton. He delighted on getting photos from all sorts of line side places such as yards, signal boxes. We modellers for the Birmigham railway scene owe him a great deal of gratitudejust for good measure my own 2f coming out of the yards...it is created from a GBL jinty....the other view is the cab of a 2f crossing the road bridge and on into Harborne railway station. In my former career in the old bill, on a Sunday afternoon on 2 to 10 shift, I would often walk down the harborne walkway in Edgbaston ....the route of the harborne branch. The road bridge was the limit being fenced off....and indeed part of the yards now forming Rose Road Nick... Edited July 22, 2018 by 46256 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 3, 2018 Author Share Posted September 3, 2018 Everyday sights at Water Orton early 1983 taken by my good friend Don Taggart. The old track layout still in place but not for long....and the sadly missed East box... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 3, 2018 Author Share Posted September 3, 2018 A glorious shot of a peak n full flow at Washwood Heath....and one of her successors passing east box again 1983 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 3, 2018 Author Share Posted September 3, 2018 Don has just sent this....as boys living to the east of Birmingham we would often travel by bus over Saltley viaduct. The station was accessed by a small opening in the wall and down steps onto the single platform. On the other side of the bridge were the numerous lines leading to New Street...the gas works were either side and the MPD to the left. A hive of activity.Don had always wanted to take a photo....so in 1983 he parked his van on the viaduct and took a pair of step ladders from the rear and set them up. He then perched on the top and this is the result. The floodlights are St Andrews footy ground....as with the others the scene now is very different 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 3, 2018 Author Share Posted September 3, 2018 Examining the photo clearly the HST is en route to New Street....the 47 probably making for the sheds from Washwood Heath yards...the class 25 sitting in the bankers siding waiting to assist heavy freights up St Andrews jct either onto Ex GW metals at Bordesley or up over those lines and onto Camp Hill. In steam days this was a class 3f duty....Terry Essery in his Saltley Firing days book recounts firing one of those 43284 shunting Water Orton yards...or on this banking duty in a filthy brum pea Souper of a fog relying on the fog detonators for safety...different times....still amazed at the bravery of footplate crew and signalmen who braved the blitz.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 3, 2018 (edited) image.jpegDon has just sent this....as boys living to the east of Birmingham we would often travel by bus over Saltley viaduct. The station was accessed by a small opening in the wall and down steps onto the single platform. On the other side of the bridge were the numerous lines leading to New Street...the gas works were either side and the MPD to the left. A hive of activity.Don had always wanted to take a photo....so in 1983 he parked his van on the viaduct and took a pair of step ladders from the rear and set them up. He then perched on the top and this is the result. The floodlights are St Andrews footy ground....as with the others the scene now is very different Lines L to R were Up & Down Camp Hill Through Siding, Down Goods, Bank Engine Siding, Down Main, Up Main, Up Goods, Up & Down Lawley Street Through Siding, Siding. I had the pleasure of working on the signalling for the layout alterations on the old boxes at Landor Street Junction, Duddeston Road, Saltley Junction, Saltlay Sidings, Washwood Heath Sidings No.1 and No.2 in 1967. That was in preparation for the new Saltley PSB. We commissioned a different layout every second weekend for six months. Previously the lines had been 2nd Down Goods, Down Camp Hill Goods, Down Lawley Street Goods, Down Main, Up Main, Up Camp Hill Goods, Up Lawley Street Goods, 2nd Up Goods. The Goods Lines were all 'No Block' worked under special instructions. If the line ahead was occupied the Signalman was supposed to show a green flag and then clear the signal. Edited September 3, 2018 by TheSignalEngineer 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 3, 2018 (edited) image.jpegimage.jpegEveryday sights at Water Orton early 1983 taken by my good friend Don Taggart. The old track layout still in place but not for long....and the sadly missed East box... I don't regard Water Orton as one of my better jobs, but in the cash-strapped situation of the time it was the best way of keeping enough to operate the traffic as it was then. The Civil Engineer came up with several grandiose schemes which required the building of a new platform on the Down Slow as it became, and the Up Fast going across 'The Dog' car park.Some were completely un-signallable within the rules and ended up with the East and West junctions almost overlapping. The added complication was severe scouring at the river between Water Orton West and Castle Bromwich. There was an imminent risk of the Down Goods ending up in the water. Edited September 3, 2018 by TheSignalEngineer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 4, 2018 Author Share Posted September 4, 2018 Thank you signal engineer for your post always nice to see other contributions on this thread. The alterations in the early eighties certainly changed the trackwork. The loss of the yards and small station goods was felt by me, but the removal of the crossing and bi directional running over the one line still takes some getting used too. A couple of years ago I was on the platform waiting for the then green duchess of Sutherland to go through on a special. It did so but strangely to my eyes travelled from the BHam direction on the line that had been the down fast... It always intrigued me that back in 1908 the Midlsnd had created extra lines because of this bottleneck and here we are in 2018 with the increase traffic again being restricted because of the 1984 track removal. Please this is not intended as criticism of those who were employed just the apparent short sightedness of the planners....progress....my old job had a slogan...West Midlands Police. " Forward in Unity" or as wiser wags had it " Backwards in Disarray" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 4, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 4, 2018 The 1908 Kingsbury cut-off not only gave more capacity but saved expresses from going through Whitacre at 20mph. Incidentally our next door neighbour in the late 1960s came from Whitacre and had worked on the building of the line. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 4, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 4, 2018 Thank you signal engineer for your post always nice to see other contributions on this thread. The alterations in the early eighties certainly changed the trackwork. The loss of the yards and small station goods was felt by me, but the removal of the crossing and bi directional running over the one line still takes some getting used too. A couple of years ago I was on the platform waiting for the then green duchess of Sutherland to go through on a special. It did so but strangely to my eyes travelled from the BHam direction on the line that had been the down fast... It always intrigued me that back in 1908 the Midlsnd had created extra lines because of this bottleneck and here we are in 2018 with the increase traffic again being restricted because of the 1984 track removal. Please this is not intended as criticism of those who were employed just the apparent short sightedness of the planners....progress....my old job had a slogan...West Midlands Police. " Forward in Unity" or as wiser wags had it " Backwards in Disarray" The basic problem at the time of the 1980s remodelling was that we were skint. The track at Water Orton was life expired and we had a remit to try to get 100mph through the station on the Kingsbury line. There was little new money available in the job, so the Regional Investment Manager and engineering departments ended up doing some creative accounting based on the cost of relaying the existing layout like-for-like, the amount in the budget for signalling maintenance such as servicing of point machines and relays, renewal of degraded wiring and cables, etc, and the amount saved on remedial works to river erosion along the Down Goods between Water Orton West and Castle Bromwich. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 5, 2018 Author Share Posted September 5, 2018 Yes we enthusiasts aren't aware of the financial realities of running the real railway. I hadn't appreciated the effect of the nearby river Tame never having seen it flood badly, something that changed if I recall not that long ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 5, 2018 Author Share Posted September 5, 2018 Signal engineer are you aware if any of the proposed improvements are likely to be implemented? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 5, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) Signal engineer are you aware if any of the proposed improvements are likely to be implemented? I don't know what is actually in the pipeline for the area in the short term but Network Rail's Route Utilisation Strategy has a medium term proposal to do basically what we were talking in 1979. Currently Water Orton is running at 80%+ of theoretical capacity in the peaks which is pushing the limits of what can be run with a robust timetable that doesn't start to unravel when a Signaller goes to the toilet. In the medium term plan the Derby and Nuneaton lines would be paired with a transposition to the existing Up/Up and Down/Down pairing at Castle Bromwich. A new platform would be needed on the Down Nuneaton line at Water Orton and boundary issues are noted on the Up Derby line. The old Down Goods between Water Orton West and Castle Bromwich would be re-instated as the Down Nuneaton, and the former Up Goods between Water Orton West and Water Orton East re-instated as the Up Derby. Also proposed is the re-instatement of double track between Water Orton West and Park Lane to avoid the need to hold a freight on the main lines whilst waiting to go towards Walsall. The long term strategy would see a complete re-hash of the running lines between Landor Street and Water Orton East, with a grade-separated junction at Water Orton to put the Derby lines on the south side and the Nuneaton lines on the north, thus giving access to the Sutton Park line and Lawley Street yards without crossing NE-SW traffic on the flat. Another option mentioned in the long-term strategy is the re-instatement of the Stourbridge - Dudley - Walsall line to give an alternative to the Camp Hill line for freight through Birmingham. This would relieve some pressure on the Barnt Green to Water Orton stretch but would have adverse effects on Worcester, Stourbridge and Walsall areas. For all of the background see this document. https://cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/West-Midlands-and-Chilterns-Route-Study-Final.pdf Given the state of Network Rail's current projects I am expecting to get a birthday card from The Palace before anyone sees a flyover at Water Orton. Edited to correct link to document Edited September 5, 2018 by TheSignalEngineer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted September 5, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 5, 2018 I like the picture of the approach to Harborne in post #462. for the last three years my Dad was based at Harborne Fire Station in Rose Road which was just beyond the Chad Valley factory visible in the picture. Judging by the cab i would guess that the loco is Monument Lane's 58271 which was a regular on the line in 1959/60 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted September 5, 2018 Author Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) In respect of the Stourbridge Walsall....I am now a black country resident so know this area well....that line is earmarked for a new Metro extension to merry hill shopping centre....an improvement but sadly light rail as opposed to a full freight line. Harborne fire station...yes remember the building but cant recall if operational when I worked Harborne area 1987 to 96....do remember the old nick which was demolished....by accident apparently....I was a sgt ...one Sunday afternoon drinking a cup of tea in the back office with two of my Pcs...suddenly a flustered office Pc came in ..."quick the chief insp has turned up...." Cue Sgt and two Pcs hastily leave the back office and hide in the dog kennels in the rear yard... Edited September 5, 2018 by 46256 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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