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Scenic break on a viaduct





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#1 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:22

I'm building a small N-gauge layout which is meant to be set in East London (somewhere between Fenchurch St and Barking); the trains run on a viaduct. It's set in the 1970s/early 80s.

I need to find a scenic break at the left-hand-side and because I'm running the track on a viaduct I'm not sure I can have the usual roadbridge solution to disguise the entry into the fiddle yard.

Picture 054.jpg

I'm planning on placing an island-platform station at the left-hand side. From what I can tell stations which serviced track running on a viaduct were at street level (Shadwell, for example). Otherwise I'd have opted for a station building/road combination sitting above the platform (Upton Park) and forming a scenic break.

Can anyone think of a situation where a road runs over a railway line which is on a viaduct? This would be my ideal solution, but is it Barking mad?! :lol:

Anyone got any suggestions?

Andy



#2 PhilJ W

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:38

There were plenty of tall buildings right up close to the lines in east London including 1960's blocks of flats.

#3 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:44

There were plenty of tall buildings right up close to the lines in east London including 1960's blocks of flats.


Fenchurch street viaduct.jpg

Point taken, but space at the front of the layout is a little limited.
I'm certainly going to be using tall buildings at the RHS of the layout on a board that will disguise the turnaround to the traverser at the rear.

Andy

#4 PhilJ W

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 21:30

What about a hydraulic reservoir? These resemble an oversize water tower without the tank. There is one outside Fenchurch Street station that is right up against the viaduct that is now a listed structure. They would be about 50' long by about 20' deep and about 3 stories more than the viaduct.

#5 Del

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 21:35

Could you go for side platforms? Then you can use the platform buildings to block the exit.
Or a proper big East End pub.

#6 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:09

Could you go for side platforms? Then you can use the platform buildings to block the exit.
Or a proper big East End pub.



There certainly will be an Eastend pub. Whilst there isn't a lot of scope for buildings (deliberately), a pub is in the frame.

Although this one is on Holborn, the name fits!

viaduct tavern.jpg

Rest assured my student days in the Eastend have, strangely, equipped me with a familiarity with the genre. :)

#7 Gwiwer

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:16

I would go with the line disappearing between tall buildings. That would be very prototypical as Andy B's image shows. I could add several more but they don't really add to that one. There are places where a road crosses a railway which is on a viaduct, or where a road crosses two railways one above the other, but all of those I can think of have the road at ground level and the railways below that which is the reverse of your scenario.

#8 Mike J

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:17

There certainly will be an Eastend pub. Whilst there isn't a lot of scope for buildings (deliberately), a pub is in the frame.

Although this one is on Holborn, the name fits!

viaduct tavern.jpg

Rest assured my student days in the Eastend have, strangely, equipped me with a familiarity with the genre. :)


A lovely building this one. It will make the layout prettier, no, no, don't mock, it does help. Flat on one side and right up to the railway side, but I suppose it depends on what type of urban landscape the viaduct sits in, residential, commercial or industrial as I'm not familiar with the area. I'd like to see more of your layout as it progresses. Keep the photos coming and good luck.

#9 Nick Holliday

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:20

If this were based on a Southern viaduct I would suggest either a signal cabin on a gantry as Clapham Junction and elsewhere, or perhaps another railway line, maybe disused, at right angles. Can't think if the Eastern had such signal boxes, but there were odd lines at different levels that might be of use.

#10 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:23

What about a hydraulic reservoir? These resemble an oversize water tower without the tank. There is one outside Fenchurch Street station that is right up against the viaduct that is now a listed structure. They would be about 50' long by about 20' deep and about 3 stories more than the viaduct.


Sounds a possibility, Phil.
Struggling to find a reference on Google though. But have just come back from the pub! :)

#11 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:33

A lovely building this one. It will make the layout prettier, no, no, don't mock, it does help. Flat on one side and right up to the railway side. I'd like to see more of your layout as it progresses. Keep the photos coming and good luck.


Cheers, Mike.
The layout is "Roding Reach" if you want to follow it.
Here's the gap between the main line and the supposed branch "Tilbury" to cater for freight. (Yep, single line but space dictates compromises!).

Picture 057.jpg

Yes, I modelled the back of the viaduct, maybe unnecessarily, but it is a small layout and those arches are quite therapeutic!

Thinking of some derelict land or scrap yard maybe to fill it up.

Andy

#12 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:36

I would go with the line disappearing between tall buildings. That would be very prototypical as Andy B's image shows. I could add several more but they don't really add to that one. There are places where a road crosses a railway which is on a viaduct, or where a road crosses two railways one above the other, but all of those I can think of have the road at ground level and the railways below that which is the reverse of your scenario.


Cheers, Gwiwer,
Happy to go with the majority vote on this one. Interested in the hydraulic reservoir idea, as well as the pub!
Hoping to create something that folk will say: "Yep, that looks right".
Andy

#13 Mike J

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:40

Lovely lovely, the start reminds me of Stoney Lane Depot, a very nice layout. You must have been replying as I was editing my post. I will follow this with interest as a fellow N gauger. :D



#14 AndyB

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:50

I will follow this with interest as a fellow N gauger. :D


Cheers, Mike,
This is my first N gauge layout, so plenty of mistakes and learning ahead.
Andy

#15 Edwin_m

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 23:31

If you could stretch your timescale a bit, the DLR does some fairly improbable things including a track that flies over then dives under other tracks, the whole lot elevated. You could reasonably imagine it passing over an existing railway viaduct on a concrete flyover, probably with interchange platforms to add extra interest.

#16 Kris

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 08:16

Tall buildings or billboards spring to mind.

#17 DavidB-AU

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 08:35

Here's an option from the right area. It's ugly but it's tall and the architecture fits the period (predates it, I think).

Google Street View

Just have to pretend it's up against the railway.

Cheers
David

#18 Gwiwer

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 08:59

A post-1990's view there David. Burdett Road is an area I am very familiar with across the past 40 years or so ;)

#19 AndyB

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 10:47

Can't think if the Eastern had such signal boxes


If memory serves, a signal box at Fenchurch Street spanned the tracks as you suggest. However, there is a brick-built structure to the south side of the tracks which a number of sources suggest to be the "old signal box".

Maybe there were a number of iterations of it?

Andy

#20 AndyB

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 10:55

It's ugly but it's tall and the architecture fits the period (predates it, I think).

Just have to pretend it's up against the railway.


Hmmm, ugly is the word, David!
Yes, in all probability this was constructed in the 60s. By coincidence I had relatives living on the banks of the Roding who were moved into a similar structure in the late 60s to make way for the imminent arrival of the North circular through Manor Park/Ilford.

#21 AndyB

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 11:08

Tall buildings or billboards spring to mind.


Ahh, the old billboard ploy, I do enjoy a good billboard ploy! :D


Thanks, Kris, I'd forgetten about that idea. I think I may go for this!

#22 AndyB

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 11:11

If you could stretch your timescale a bit, the DLR does some fairly improbable things including a track that flies over then dives under other tracks, the whole lot elevated. You could reasonably imagine it passing over an existing railway viaduct on a concrete flyover, probably with interchange platforms to add extra interest.


Thanks, Edwin. I'm fairly rooted in the 70s/early 80s. But it was a good idea, thanks.
Andy

#23 PhilJ W

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 11:20

Another suggestion is to use an OEL gantry to 'frame' the opening, or a signal gantry. This is as well as the tall buildings not instead of.

#24 AndyB

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 11:31

What about a hydraulic reservoir? These resemble an oversize water tower without the tank. There is one outside Fenchurch Street station that is right up against the viaduct that is now a listed structure. They would be about 50' long by about 20' deep and about 3 stories more than the viaduct.


Phil,
I can't find the hydraulic reservoir you mention.
But there is this structure which might be brought in to play:

http://www.flickr.co...oon/4470010095/

Also, like your idea of the OLE frame.
Andy

#25 PhilJ W

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 11:35

This is an example of a hydraulic tower >> http://en.wikipedia....msby_Dock_Tower
Although this is not typical of the ones in the London docks it gives some idea of the size. There is also a large water tower alongside the line at Reading that has now been converted into flats.
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