The Ruston 48DS class - a rivet-counter's guide

[Guest Isambarduk]

It seems to me that, as the 48DS is such a small prototype and it would not be expected to have much of a haulage capacity, there is plenty of room to fit a small motor and gear box and that it would be necessary in 7mm scale to drive only one axle.  At least, that is what I would do.

 

David

[brack]

I'd put a small gear motor across the centre of the chassis and drive both axles by delrin chains, at least that was my plan. Using a similar motor in 00 on my 3d printed y7 it managed to pull over 800g piled on an unlucky wagon in my rice pudding skin test, so I expect a similar motor in a 7mm 48ds would manage to shunt half a dozen 7mm wagons.

It's even vaguely prototypical to use a central sprocket and chains.

[Dava]

I'd put a small gear motor across the centre of the chassis and drive both axles by delrin chains, at least that was my plan. Using a similar motor in 00 on my 3d printed y7 it managed to pull over 800g piled on an unlucky wagon in my rice pudding skin test, so I expect a similar motor in a 7mm 48ds would manage to shunt half a dozen 7mm wagons.

It's even vaguely prototypical to use a central sprocket and chains.

 

I think that is a better idea. I've recently built a 7mm 4 wheel loco which drives on one axle and even well weighted it struggles with a few wagons. I do have the 'Electifrying Trains' kit of the 48DS to build and have held  off partly because the drive is from both motor shafts onto both wheels. This makes any form of compensation very difficult which on a short wheelbase loco is worth having. Driving via Delrin chains would allow one axle to move vertically.

 

Dava

[decauville1126]

It seems to me that, as the 48DS is such a small prototype and it would not be expected to have much of a haulage capacity, there is plenty of room to fit a small motor and gear box and that it would be necessary in 7mm scale to drive only one axle.  At least, that is what I would do.

 

David

My Impetus 4mm one has only a single axle drive and it was a real pain to get it balanced to give anything like a reasonable performance. A small pulley and light belt would give 4-wheel drive but I can't bear the thought of stripping it yet again, and the axle gear mount fills the space between the frames anyway. In 7mm a belt-and-pulley would be easy and this allows compensation/suspension. I've also used High Level gearboxes in small 7mm locos without any (apparent!) ill-effect.

[alastairq]

Didn't CLAG produce some axle hung motors with belt drive? [Or, was it Manchester?]

[Ruston]

I have 48DS in 2mm (N),  two in 4mm (EM) and two in 7mm (O).

 

The N gauge version doesn't run and is a wagon load only but all the others are powered on all 4 wheels. One of the 4mm locos is the old A1 kit and has been fitted with a chassis from RT Models. The other is the Judith Edge kit and uses the provided chassis.

 

One 7mm loco is a 44/48HP and is entirely scratch built. It uses a small Mashima motor with a 50:1 worm drive gearbox, which is further reduced 2:1 by Delrin chain and sprockets. The other is a modified Electrifying Trains kit but with a scratch built chassis. This also runs a small motor through a worm drive gearbox and Delrin chain. It's not difficult to power a 7mm 48DS on all wheels.

 

Build here :- http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/42289-ruston-48ds-in-7mm/

[Guest Isambarduk]

I see.  Sounds as if I should be looking to design a four-wheel drive for my 7mm model then.  I had originally thought of using a belt but then I thought 'no need'; I am still tempted to try it without one first, though.  Time will tell.   David

[hartleymartin]

Are there more drawings of the 44/48DS? I note that in the drawing the hood is flat-topped, but most pictures show a curved top to the hood. The flat-top type is good for me, as it is much easier to make it from plastic sheet.

[decauville1126]

Didn't CLAG produce some axle hung motors with belt drive? [Or, was it Manchester?]

http://www.clag.org.uk/axle-hung.html

 

But I've never found the etched stuff available - I think Bill Bedford is on here and might be able to illuminate.

[Ruston]

Are there more drawings of the 44/48DS? I note that in the drawing the hood is flat-topped, but most pictures show a curved top to the hood. The flat-top type is good for me, as it is much easier to make it from plastic sheet.

The drawing I posted is of what you might call the pre-production 44/48HP loco. As far as I know it is the only one to have that style of bodywork. All other 44/48HP and 48DS locos had the curved engine covers as in all the other photos.

 

I have got more drawings that I can post.

[pete_mcfarlane]

On the subject of drawings, I stumbled across the Lincolnshire Archives website. They're in the process of digitising all of the R&H drawings, and they seem to have done most of the ones for the 48DS. To the point where you could probably build a full size one. 

 

Link is here - click on the images tab. 

[Dava]

On the subject of drawings, I stumbled across the Lincolnshire Archives website. They're in the process of digitising all of the R&H drawings, and they seem to have done most of the ones for the 48DS. To the point where you could probably build a full size one. 

 

Link is here - click on the images tab.

 

Digitizing the Ruston archive is a great project actually being delivered by the two Universities in Lincoln with the County Archive and Siemens. There is a great resource of material and I hope the search interface can be improved further to make it easier to find what you're looking for.

 

Dava

[pete_mcfarlane]

I've been doing more digging on that website - as Dava points out, the search interface isn't great. But I did manage to find the GA for the prototype 48HP standard gauge loco. 

 

http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--Gen-arr-oil-loco/1752011.record?ImageId=666010&pt=S

 

It doesn't help that they've used acronyms to speed up data entry. here's a search for 'gen arr': http://www.lincstothepast.com/searchResults.aspx?keywords=gen%20arr&cmd=GoToPage&val=1

[pete_mcfarlane]

And more stuff:

 

44/48HP loco: http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--Arr-of-Oil-Loco/1752389.record?ImageId=666868&pt=S

 

Ditto but with non-standard buffing gear: http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--Arr-of-oil-loco/1752561.record?ImageId=666701&pt=S

 

And another, this one 3'6" gauge: http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--Arr-of-oil-loco/1752596.record?ImageId=666666&pt=S

 

A metre gauge 48DS: http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--General-Arr-of-Oil-Loco/1753101.record?ImageId=669040&pt=S

 

Not a 48DS, but what looks like a 10HP NG loco modified as a standard gauge shunter. I've seen some home brewed conversions of these (there's one at Crich) but not an official R&H attempt at one, although a there's no guarantee that it was built: http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--Arr-of-Oil-Loco/1751391.record?ImageId=665272&pt=S

[Ruston]

And more stuff:

 

Not a 48DS, but what looks like a 10HP NG loco modified as a standard gauge shunter. I've seen some home brewed conversions of these (there's one at Crich) but not an official R&H attempt at one, although a there's no guarantee that it was built: http://www.lincstothepast.com/Ruston-and-Hornsby-Plan--Arr-of-Oil-Loco/1751391.record?ImageId=665272&pt=S

That last one is very interesting but I wouldn't have thought it would have many uses as a standard gauge loco if it was ever built!

[Etched Pixels]

It seems to me that, as the 48DS is such a small prototype and it would not be expected to have much of a haulage capacity, there is plenty of room to fit a small motor and gear box and that it would be necessary in 7mm scale to drive only one axle.  At least, that is what I would do.

 

David

A real 48DS could move a reasonable load slowly on light gradients. My N gauge one struggles with more than about 4 wagons but I can live with that limitation to be honest.

 

According to the official documentation in the lowest gear on the flat you can pull 226 tons but only 80 tons on 1 in 75.

 

Alan

[Mad McCann]

A few images of the WRHA's late production 48DS though admittedly it's a little tattier looking today after five years of Whitrope winters!

 

Dave.

Edited September 7, 2016 by Mad McCann

[decauville1126]

Anyone?

 

Why 44/48?

Used mostly for the narrow gauge locos. ie: 16/20 means normally 16hp but can be floored to 20hp for short periods. So a 44/48 is 44hp normally with the ability to be pushed to 48hp at times. The first 48DS was based, I think, on a 44/48hp engine and gearbox in a standard gauge frame, before being marketed as the 48DS. As slightly higher output engines were evolved, the 16/20 became the 20DL, with 30DL and 40DL models also available. Then there are the flameproof and underground variants ......

[south_tyne]

This is wonderfully informative!

 

Sweeping question but..

Were many 48ds exported? I know at least one went to The Netherlands (actually the example in my avatar picture) and I imagine others went to Australia and New Zealand?

[Ruston]

About 47 out of a total of 236 were exported in gauges from metre to 5ft. 6in. Known destinations being Belgium, Brazil, Burma, Egypt, Holland, India, Malaya, Mexico, New Zealand,  Nigeria, Norway, Pakistan, Portugal, South Africa, Spain, United Arab Emirates and Zambia.

[south_tyne]

About 47 out of a total of 236 were exported in gauges from metre to 5ft. 6in. Known destinations being Belgium, Brazil, Burma, Egypt, Holland, India, Malaya, Mexico, New Zealand, Nigeria, Norway, Pakistan, Portugal, South Africa, Spain, United Arab Emirates and Zambia.

Thanks that's great (ask the expert and you get an expert answer!!) It'd be fascinating to see photographic evidence of examples working abroad, although I suspect it is a longshot. An extensive list of countries across the world mind and I imagine for a wide range of different types of industry and users.

 

I've always had a bizarre/wild idea to develop a small diorama/layout based on a Carribbean island (or something of that ilk)... the imagination runs wild with that list of countries...!

[pete_mcfarlane]

I found a couple of interesting photos in my endless shots of preserved railways. 

 

This example didn't work abroad, although it's currently metre gauge. In fact, it started it's working life just down the road from where I live, at the sleeper depot in Beeston in Nottingham as 3' gauge loco ED10. 

 

Photographed at the Irchester narrow gauge museum in Wellingborough back in 2002. It's had an interesting career - it was sold by BR to the civil engineering contractor who built the M1 Tinsley viaduct, and then ended up working on the Tracked Hovercraft test track (photo here) before eventually ending upon the metre gauge line at the museum. 

 

 

Edited January 2, 2023 by pete_mcfarlane

[Dava]

I've been intending to post these photos for a few weeks but have been too busy. They are real rivet-counter's photos of a 48DS, intended for those, like me, who have yet to get round to building the kit they bought.

 

Here is DS48, 'Ryan' Ruston & Hornsby works no. 305306 of 1952, built for W.G.Moreton, wagon builders of Rotherham. Currently on the Chasewater Light Railway and nicely restored back in 2007 in spring green, but now in a line of rather forlorn demic small diesels in the platform road at Chasewater. Ideal for detailed photography, however.

 

There are some nooks, crannies and corners of these little machines that are not easily descried from the normal drawings and photos, so hopefully these views will help with the sandboxes, axleboxes, steps, controls etc.  The photos cover the general views, bonnet, underframe and cab interior.

 

And here's hoping that 'Ryan' gets some TLC too. I'll try to dig out a photo from when he was a bit smarter!

 

NB: I've added two photos  of the loco dating from 2011, when the other side was visible and  it was in rather better nick. But note the brick on the footplate keeping the bonnet door closed!

 

Dava

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 30, 2016 by Dava

[Ruston]

It is in a bit of a state, isn't it? I too remember when it was freshly painted. 48DS always seem to get negelected at preserved railways. I suppose because their uses and opportunities to work are limited they don't get the attention, or undercover storage, that revenue-earning locos get.

 

I first saw that particular loco when it was at Buxton. It had a broken gearbox, which was probably due to someone fitting a Gardner engine of over twice the horsepower of the original Ruston engine. I went to look at it with members of the GYRPS, who bought it and took it to Starbeck. I don't think it ever worked at Starbeck though. IIRC the Gardner engine was put to use in a Fowler there.

[Dava]

I've added in post #51 two photos  of the Chasewater 48DS  loco dating from 2011, when the right side was visible and  it was in rather better nick than when photographed this year. But note the brick on the footplate keeping the bonnet door closed!

 

Dava