Hornby 2017 Range (announcement date)

[toboldlygo]

I think they're going for the type of purchaser that doesn't really care as long as it's a Hornby trainset and has the two engines he's heard of in Mallard and Flying Scotsman.

 

The fact they have sound and you can race them is so much better.

 

 

 

As they always say. Girls grow up and boys turn into bigger boys.

 

 

 

Jason

 

Sounds more like Scalextric   

[tamperman36]

Just for reference 50050 was withdrawn from service in the large logo blue livery with Tops number and Fearless name plates, it had been repainted from original D400 in rail blue prior to operating the Cornish Caper railtour. This railtour brought 50050 and 50033 to York. The day after 50033 ran to Scarbourgh and returned to York at which point 50033 was handed to the NRM. 50050 returned to Plymouth where it ran its final railtour with 50007 before official withdrawl.

(I remember waiting on Bristol station at about 2.30 in the morning to see what livery 50050 and 50033 would be carrying. I spent 25 hours on that railtour and had a great time)

 

Reguarding Hornby model of D400, it is still a better model than the former Lima model, despite the odd error. Bare in mind how the preserved locos have minor differences, you are left with a potential minefield of details. Your better off considering it as a start point and detail it using photos of your desired loco at the time you wish.

 

I would also love a railfrieght grey 08.

[Coryton]

Which "middle aged bloke who buys toys from their childhood" buy railroad quality models with part finished paint jobs (minimal lining, single print numbers etc etc), and 1980's LNER teaks for £600 when there are superseded super detailed superior models available for a few years already, can afford £600, but not £700 or 800 for super detailed  ?

 

I didn't think railroads series trainsets were aimed at modellers, or even mid-life crisis' males looking to their past, I always assumed railroad trainsets were for entry level and kids, obviously i'm wrong on this one, I guess that leads to the question if these sell so well at this price point, and to people with a real interest... why bother making super detailed stuff ?

 

I recently read one of Simon Kohler's articles where he discussed the art of producing train sets with a finely graduated range of prices, from the cheapest up to what he called the "Rich Uncle" set. At £600 that's quite a rich uncle!

[Coryton]

just beat me to it..

 

http://www.goldenarrow.me.uk/goldenarrow_htm_files/pdfs/shunter%20instructions.pdf

 

looks a very easy kit, it's only dozen or so pieces, including 4 buffers, if it's like my Z Class, clearing off the flash took longer than assembling the kit, but was job done bar painting / numbering & handrails in 1 evening.

 

Off topic, but I like the way the instructions finish with:

 

"Please note, the parts supplied are not quite as illustrated above..."

[jjb1970]

On the price of luxury goods, those goods are primarily aimed at people who aren't really bothered about the price. The old aphorism that if you need to ask the price then you can't afford it is pretty much true for those sort of goods. And clearly there are plenty of people in the world who can afford them.

[Hroth]

I recently read one of Simon Kohler's articles where he discussed the art of producing train sets with a finely graduated range of prices, from the cheapest up to what he called the "Rich Uncle" set. At £600 that's quite a rich uncle!

"The Rich Uncle Set" is a concept embedded in the Hornby DNA.

 

In 1952, Triang released the R6 trainset, which became known as... "The Rich Uncle Set" for some obscure reason.

 

http://www.tri-ang.co.uk/R6%20Set.html

 

I suppose the cost was somewhat equivalent to the £600 version of today, althought the modern set is probably operationally more sophisticated!

.

[Dunsignalling]

Off topic, but I like the way the instructions finish with:

 

"Please note, the parts supplied are not quite as illustrated above..."

That's because the sketches show the initial version of the kit, which was designed to fit the Lima 09 chassis.

 

John

[Coryton]

That's because the sketches show the initial version of the kit, which was designed to fit the Lima 09 chassis.

 

 

Interesting.

 

It wasn't intended as criticism. I gather these are primarily intended for them to assemble and sell as RTR rather than as kits, and in any case I do understand the effort required in producing detailed documentation for things that sell in small numbers.

 

It's interesting to compare what they are charging for a locomotive hand-built in the UK with the direction that prices of Chinese "mass"-produced models are taking.

[Rhydgaled]

There are plenty who (probably correctly) consider themselves to be too ham-fisted for the "good stuff".

<Cautiously raises hand>. I do have one modern 'super detail' model (a 2016 range item), which has only been out of the box a few times so far and I don't think I've damaged it yet, but because I'm concerned that I might break off some of the finer details and leave it looking worse than the cheaper stuff; and because I don't think I'd really notice the details much anyway* I don't feel like paying more for a higher-standard model. If my Lima / older Hornby/Bachmann models look ok to me why shell out alot more for the latest Hornby/Bachmann versions?

The one thing I do notice is the livery application; the new £600 Mallard and Flying Scotsmand trainset, the Railroad models of those locos and, it seems, the new Railroad GWR 14xx have 2-dimesional company lettering (and numbers in the case of the LNER locos). This makes them look wrong to me; they need the 3D-effect with the shadowing; a shame as a 14xx would otherwise be something I'm interested in buying (probably not at £100 for the Hattons super-detail one though). I only bought the 2016 super-detail model because I'm not aware of an older, cheaper, tooling of the same item.

 

* hell, if you removed the numbers I'm not sure I could tell a GWR 61xx from a 55xx unless you parked them next to each other (I know that the 61xx is larger, 10+ years ago when I bought mine I didn't even know the GWR had more than one design of 2-6-2 tank engine with angled tanks), and if you took the names off a Hall and a Manor I probably wouldn't be able to tell them apart either; a King I know has a funny bogie, but until I read that in a book I hadn't noticed that either.

[Legend]

I think if you bought the super trainset you could reasonably expect something with better decoration. However the 14xx is built down to a price. Hornby are selling this loco at £45 , that's pretty low. You really can't expect full detailing and livery for that. I'll have a look at it. It's fairly easy to remove Hornby printing ,I think, and replace with GWR. It depends if it has traction tyres and how it runs.

[250BOB]

<

 

* hell, if you removed the numbers I'm not sure I could tell a GWR 61xx from a 55xx unless you parked them next to each other (I know that the 61xx is larger, 10+ years ago when I bought mine I didn't even know the GWR had more than one design of 2-6-2 tank engine with angled tanks), and if you took the names off a Hall and a Manor I probably wouldn't be able to tell them apart either; a King I know has a funny bogie, but until I read that in a book I hadn't noticed that either.

 

Yep, I agree, they all look the same.

[Coryton]

I think if you bought the super trainset you could reasonably expect something with better decoration. However the 14xx is built down to a price. Hornby are selling this loco at £45 , that's pretty low. You really can't expect full detailing and livery for that. I'll have a look at it. It's fairly easy to remove Hornby printing ,I think, and replace with GWR. It depends if it has traction tyres and how it runs.

 

How it runs is indeed the key.

 

I think the Railroad models are great to play around with for repainting/detailing/hacking about - not expensive, and quite robust so you can get them apart without breaking off a tiny bit of plastic that was holding it together.

 

But if they don't run well there's not much point.

 

I find the 0-4-0 tank engines generally run well, especially now the scalextric speed motors have been tamed.

 

But my experience with the 0-6-0s has been poor - they find it hard to get across my insulfrog points without stalling. I suspect most of it is down to my poor track laying, but just about everything else manages OK, including Railroad 0-4-0s. 

 

I think the 14xx model isn't new (though it is new to the Railroad range). Does anybody know how previous versions ran?

[mattingleycustom]

The sets chosen by Hornby being 243 and 247 in SR and BR liveries respectively were two of the seven four coach sets 241 to 247 formed between March 1932 and April 1933 for use on the South Western section. A further release of the high window version of the Maunsells has been very often requested and these are the most logical sets to choose of that type of restriction 4 coach (as opposed to the narrower Hastings line stock of the same period) as other sets of that type comprised of a greater number of coaches so this creates correct and easily achievable sets.

 

Whilst I am delighted that the High Window stock is at last available in fully-lined SR dark green livery, I am disappointed that only the Brake 3rd, 3rd and 1st are available - these have already been produced for the Southern Suburban 1938 Train Pack.

While I applaud the release of the coach types for one coach set, it's a shame examples of the other coach types that Hornby have the tooling for have not been released in this livery.

 

The Composite would have also been useful for loose stock and also the twenty 3 and 4-Sets (221 to 240) and one example would go nicely with the previously released low window Brake 3rds of Set 470 as it ran from the early 1930s.

Brake Composites of both the High Window variety and the flush window 1935 type (the tooling exists in the Maunsell Pull-Push sets repeated ad-infinitum) would also be very useful. An ACE of the 1930s would include a good sprinkling of these types.

 

Whilst the Maunsell high window coaches have been available for some time in other liveries, the early SR livery includes the fine lining that is nigh on impossible to reproduce yourself (even professional coach painters can't achieve the superb finish that Hornby produce).

Whilst renumbering is relatively easy, repainting is not an easy option. So come on Hornby, let's have the other types as well!

 

Oh and while I'm in full rant ... where's the Maunsell Restaurant Car to go with the Open 3rd?

 

Glenn (... and relax)

Edited January 8, 2017 by mattingleycustom

[Legend]

How it runs is indeed the key.

 

I think the Railroad models are great to play around with for repainting/detailing/hacking about - not expensive, and quite robust so you can get them apart without breaking off a tiny bit of plastic that was holding it together.

 

But if they don't run well there's not much point.

 

I find the 0-4-0 tank engines generally run well, especially now the scalextric speed motors have been tamed.

 

But my experience with the 0-6-0s has been poor - they find it hard to get across my insulfrog points without stalling. I suspect most of it is down to my poor track laying, but just about everything else manages OK, including Railroad 0-4-0s.

 

I think the 14xx model isn't new (though it is new to the Railroad range). Does anybody know how previous versions ran?

The 14xx pedigree dates back to the late 70s and Airfix. When they went bust it moved onto Dapol .Hornby then bought the tools for use and it reappeared in Hornby Railways range. It was never a great runner in Airfix days. I think Hornby remotored it , but I believe it has traction tyres to improve load hauling. Not sure if this latest Railroad version will have them or not. So I will wait and see. I think. Hornby have to be commended for maintaining a range at low cost, so I'd like to support them Edited January 8, 2017 by Legend

[Coryton]

The 14xx pedigree dates back to the late 70s and Airfix. When they went bust it moved onto Dapol .Hornby then bought the tools for use and it reappeared in Hornby Railways range. It was never a great runner in Airfix days. I think Hornby remotored it , but I believe it has traction tyres to improve load hauling. Not sure if this latest Railroad version will have them or not. So I will wait and see. I think. Hornby have to be commended for maintaining a range at low cost, so I'd like to support them

 

I think there are various aspects to running.

 

One is certainly the motor.

 

Another is the chassis design. I think the Railroad 0-6-0 has a rather rigid chassis that is prone to ending up with insufficient electrical contact on one side over poor/less than ideal track.

 

If the Airfix model was a poor runner because of the motor then I expect all will be well. If not....

 

I think the Railroad range is a good thing for many reasons, and have certainly done my bit to support it. 

[Rhydgaled]

I think if you bought the super trainset you could reasonably expect something with better decoration. However the 14xx is built down to a price. Hornby are selling this loco at £45 , that's pretty low. You really can't expect full detailing and livery for that. I'll have a look at it. It's fairly easy to remove Hornby printing ,I think, and replace with GWR. It depends if it has traction tyres and how it runs.

Sure, I wouldn't be expecting lots of seperately-fitted detail on a £45 Railroad model, but my gut feeling is the 3D-effect lettering shouldn't be too hard to do (the old tender-drive 4472 in the train sets used to have it after all, as did the Pannier in the GWR mixed traffic set I think; and Smokey Joe (even cheaper than the 14xx?) is in lined (not unlined) black livery). I can understand leaving off the coach-end data panels (as Hornby did with train set Mrk4 coaches), to save printing ink as they are small details not always noticed, but the flat lettering looks obviously wrong.

 

All that said, I must admit that I haven't got a clue how Hornby print the lettering and numbers onto a model, so the process might be more costly than I'm thinking. Does anyone happen to know a good webpage that shows how they do it and possibly explains why the 3D-effect lettering would be costly?

Edited January 8, 2017 by Rhydgaled

[Coryton]

Sure, I wouldn't be expecting lots of seperately-fitted detail on a £45 Railroad model, but my gut feeling is the 3D-effect lettering shouldn't be too hard to do (the old tender-drive 4472 in the train sets used to have it after all, as did the Pannier in the GWR mixed traffic set I think; and Smokey Joe (even cheaper than the 14xx?) is in lined (not unlined) black livery). I can understand leaving off the coach-end data panels (as Hornby did with train set Mrk4 coaches), to save printing ink as they are small details not always noticed, but the flat lettering looks obviously wrong.

 

All that said, I must admit that I haven't got a clue how Hornby print the lettering and numbers onto a model, so the process might be more costly than I'm thinking. Does anyone happen to know a good webpage that shows how they do it and possibly explains why the 3D-effect lettering would be costly?

 

I believe it's done using tampo printing, which prints one colour at a time. So a 3-d effect requiring two colours requires two passes, etc. It's not like applying transfers where it's just as easy to apply a single coloured transfer as one with multiple colours.

 

Anyway if using them as a basis for detailing, the quality of the original lettering shouldn't be much of an issue.

[250BOB]

I believe it's done using tampo printing, which prints one colour at a time. So a 3-d effect requiring two colours requires two passes, etc. It's not like applying transfers where it's just as easy to apply a single coloured transfer as one with multiple colours.

 

Anyway if using them as a basis for detailing, the quality of the original lettering shouldn't be much of an issue.

And much more cost effective via the tampo print method......although registration is more the problem with that method of decoration.....much more accurate when printing transfers.

[railroadbill]

Not in Europe, I think, but Honda sell Acura on the same basis. 

A friend in the States has one, actually very comfortable to travel in.  However, lift the bonnet and it has "Honda" moulded on everything....

She previously had a Dodge Durango,  (5 litre 4x4) which was exactly what you'd expect from the label.   :-)

[metropolitan cammell]

I think there are various aspects to running.

 

One is certainly the motor.

 

Another is the chassis design. I think the Railroad 0-6-0 has a rather rigid chassis that is prone to ending up with insufficient electrical contact on one side over poor/less than ideal track.

 

If the Airfix model was a poor runner because of the motor then I expect all will be well. If not....

 

I think the Railroad range is a good thing for many reasons, and have certainly done my bit to support it.

 

From what I remember one of the biggest problems causing poor running with the airfix 14xx was the plunger pickups which Dapol removed from the design and replaced with wiper pickups.

[Dunsignalling]

From what I remember one of the biggest problems causing poor running with the airfix 14xx was the plunger pickups which Dapol removed from the design and replaced with wiper pickups.

Dapol remotored it too, the original Airfix motor was much larger and fitted into the chassis in a very peculiar way - it came loose if you took the body off and I never had any faith that it would go back in exactly the same place when I reassembled it.

 

My Dapol one is very good, though I have tweaked it, done away with the traction tyres and added quite a bit of lead.

 

The versions made by Hornby seem OK though they appear to have "economised" or "standardised" by fitting a cheaper (looking, at least) motor already in their range.

 

John

Edited January 8, 2017 by Dunsignalling

[mckinneyc]

I was annoyed no teaks made it into the catalogue either corridor or suburban.

 

Seems that my bank balance will thank me this year.

 

However I could be tempted to get another B12 and D16 in LNER livery.

 

Also the Pecket in Lillieshall colours is a must as my Grandma lives in what is now Telford.

[trevor7598]

Whilst I am delighted that the High Window stock is at last available in fully-lined SR dark green livery, I am disappointed that only the Brake 3rd, 3rd and 1st are available - these have already been produced for the Southern Suburban 1938 Train Pack.

While I applaud the release of the coach types for one coach set, it's a shame examples of the other coach types that Hornby have the tooling for have not been released in this livery.

 

The Composite would have also been useful for loose stock and also the twenty 3 and 4-Sets (221 to 240) and one example would go nicely with the previously released low window Brake 3rds of Set 470 as it ran from the early 1930s.

Brake Composites of both the High Window variety and the flush window 1935 type (the tooling exists in the Maunsell Pull-Push sets repeated ad-infinitum) would also be very useful. An ACE of the 1930s would include a good sprinkling of these types.

 

Whilst the Maunsell high window coaches have been available for some time in other liveries, the early SR livery includes the fine lining that is nigh on impossible to reproduce yourself (even professional coach painters can't achieve the superb finish that Hornby produce).

Whilst renumbering is relatively easy, repainting is not an easy option. So come on Hornby, let's have the other types as well!

 

Oh and while I'm in full rant ... where's the Maunsell Restaurant Car to go with the Open 3rd?

 

Glenn (... and relax)

 

HERE, HERE,

 

You've mentioned it , and I have often thought about it.

RE. The 1935 style brake composite in the Hornby push-pull set.

 

I would also hope that Hornby would one day re-tool this model and produce it in it's original

main line condition. Especially as Hornby made such a fine job of capturing the ' look ' of the prototype.

The 1935 style coaches had a very distinctive appearance with the flush glazing, and very visible

body side screw heads, which were peculiar to 1935 built Maunsell coaches.

[fife 27]

the Hornby class 20 tts sound looks like a good buy with (renumbering and light weathering) could look good.i want too model Thornton yard 1977 1980 with a a location of 12 x class 20s a split between. Hornby and Bachmann would be a good save.by the way Bachmann doing the vea. didnt Hornby do the same wagon.

[GordonC]

hornbys VEA is to a much poorer standard and not up to modern expectations