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Oxford N7

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I have a few pictures of N7s at Enfield (where 69670 was sub-shedded) but this is the only one I can find of '70 but it's from the wrong end. But in the run up to electrification it certainly had white trimmings painted on - and frequently touched up -  by the regular crew. It also had red coupling rods as did many of the cleaner N7s at Enfield. Also attached is a picture of 69665 which the same crew ran until it was withdrawn and they got '70 in its place. 

2011-01-17_3.JPG

69665.jpg

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A man I met sometimes at work on the railway in the 1990s had been a fireman at Enfield Town (by the time I met him he was a booking clerk) and he told me that the crews had their regular engines, and tried to outdo each other in cleanliness and embellishments - the pictures above and in various photo albums showing the end of GE steam reflect this!  I don't particularly think the over-the-top 'bling' look suits them either particularly, but there's always black paint!

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Not much weathering needed on these ones then.

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I really should speak to a driver (Former Fireman on BR) I know who worked on the Jazz trains and on the N7's especially, he always said the N7 was his favorite loco to work on, may have to find his regular loco, and see if he knew the men who worked on the 69670 & 65. Be really interesting to find out. 

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Crew for 69665 and '70 were Laurie Griffin (who died last year in his 90s) and Roy Swain. The other main Enfield "star" N7 was 69664.

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Was the smokebox door ring actually painted white, or was it polished steel?

 

Stewart

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5 hours ago, stewartingram said:

Was the smokebox door ring actually painted white, or was it polished steel?

 

Stewart

 

I think they could be either; originally polished as with other GE engines and sometimes so in later days, but some colour pictures from the late '50s give the impression that white paint was also sometimes used (a bit like the Immingham B1s and Brits used on theKX - Cleethorpes).  The picture above of 69665 certainly has the appearance of polished metal.

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Slightly off topic,the use of white paint at the front of a loco was not confined  to BR(E) .On the WR in the late 1950’s Landore Castles (87E) could be distinguished by white paint on their buffers.

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14 hours ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Slightly off topic,the use of white paint at the front of a loco was not confined  to BR(E) .On the WR in the late 1950’s Landore Castles (87E) could be distinguished by white paint on their buffers.

Cambrian manors too.

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15 hours ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Slightly off topic,the use of white paint at the front of a loco was not confined  to BR(E) .On the WR in the late 1950’s Landore Castles (87E) could be distinguished by white paint on their buffers.

 

Yes,but wasn’t that when the Cambrian was transferred to the LMR ?    Better stay on topic,though..This new Ox release promises to be a fine model of an iconic prototype.

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On 07/06/2019 at 23:02, 31A said:

A man I met sometimes at work on the railway in the 1990s had been a fireman at Enfield Town (by the time I met him he was a booking clerk) and he told me that the crews had their regular engines, and tried to outdo each other in cleanliness and embellishments - the pictures above and in various photo albums showing the end of GE steam reflect this!  I don't particularly think the over-the-top 'bling' look suits them either particularly, but there's always black paint!

I think the man you spoke to my have been Brian Williams who was fireman on 69664 and later became a booking clerk in the Bishops Stortford/Cambridge area. I don't suppose any of the Enfield N7s ever found their way to Finsbury Square?

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1 hour ago, 84002 said:

I think the man you spoke to my have been Brian Williams who was fireman on 69664 and later became a booking clerk in the Bishops Stortford/Cambridge area. I don't suppose any of the Enfield N7s ever found their way to Finsbury Square?

 

Funnily enough I think that was his name now you mention it (I had forgotten) - it was at Audley End that I used to meet him!

 

There will be at least one N7 on Finsbury Square, since you ask!  Ideally they will be King's Cross/Hornsey/Hatfield ones, i.e. a GN Section one since that is the area the suburban trains on my layout are reckoned to travel to, but if I can't find suitable candidates in terms of detail variations that I can change the number to, I'll be quite happy to have a couple as Stratford ones instead.  I think the GE Suburban locos were all shown as 30A regardless wether sub shedded at Enfield Town, Wood St, Hertford East?  I have always assumed that F Sq is also served from the GE lines, possibly only for freight & parcels.  Anyway I'm looking forward to getting some Oxford N7s to relieve the pressure on my Hornby N2s which are getting bit tired in various ways.

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17 hours ago, 31A said:

...There will be at least one N7 on Finsbury Square, since you ask!  Ideally they will be King's Cross/Hornsey/Hatfield ones, i.e. a GN Section one since that is the area the suburban trains on my layout are reckoned to travel to...

In the BR period the GN section allocation of N7s was officially Hatfield. For my 'Hatfield' allocation I am updating the 8011 model to BR condition with Ross pop valves, no condensing gear etc. as a late survivor N7/2, withdrawn with a Belpaire boiler. The 'best' number would be 69698 as that survived to 1961, but I am going for 69695 out of sentiment, as it worked the last passenger Hatfield-Hertford service. It appears that the expected round top boiler first release will be an N7/3, and any of 69692/696/704 from Hatfield's late 1950s allocation would suit. (Hatfield mostly had N7/5.)

 

17 hours ago, 31A said:

... I think the GE Suburban locos were all shown as 30A regardless whether sub shedded at Enfield Town, Wood St, Hertford East?  ...

Appears to have been the case. Allocation lists are a mess, with the same locos shown at Stratford plus another of its sub-sheds! Any number from Stratford's massive N7 allocation will do...

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41 minutes ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

In the BR period the GN section allocation of N7s was officially Hatfield. For my 'Hatfield' allocation I am updating the 8011 model to BR condition with Ross pop valves, no condensing gear etc. as a late survivor N7/2, withdrawn with a Belpaire boiler. The 'best' number would be 69698 as that survived to 1961, but I am going for 69695 out of sentiment, as it worked the last passenger Hatfield-Hertford service. It appears that the expected round top boiler first release will be an N7/3, and any of 69692/696/704 from Hatfield's late 1950s allocation would suit. (Hatfield mostly had N7/5.)

 

Appears to have been the case. Allocation lists are a mess, with the same locos shown at Stratford plus another of its sub-sheds! Any number from Stratford's massive N7 allocation will do...

 

Thank you for this, very interesting - I hadn't realised any N7s retained Belpaire fireboxes that late but you have sent me scurrying for the relevant Yeadons', and it seems that two N7/2 retained Belpaire 'boxes until withdrawal - 69695 (as you say; withdrawn 1.12.58) and 69689 (w/d 25.3.57).  But I was under the impression that the Oxford model of 8011 (and of the yet to be released BR versions) represents a loco with the original cab arrangement, i.e. with the cab side windows centrally in the cabsides, and coal rail bunker?  The latter could perhaps be altered fairly easily but the former not so easy .... 

 

Agree that the GN section N7s were mostly used from Hatfield in the BR period but taking 69612 as a fairly random example (as that is the number Oxford have put on theirs) according to Yeadons' this was allocated to Hornsey 10.6.56-30.6.57.  And 69698 went from Hatfield to King's Cross on 1.1.61 (as did a few others, when Hatfield closed to steam?) and then to Stratford on 9.4.61.

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Oh indeed, it's a mass  (or mess) of variations of the class parts and specific allocations in the KX area any particular month. But I am a dedicated impressionist, and looks sufficiently like an N7(part) will do. (I have 69640 from a Wills kit as a legacy from my 'accuracy days' all detailed up against photos for circa 1959 in case anyone who knows a lot happens to come by!)

 

You do know you can credibly have an N5 come for a visit to Finsbury Square? 69266 was shedded at Hatfield July to September 1959, for some unaccountable reason. So I can an 0-6-2T example from all the Southern area groups of the LNER. Which is nice.

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32 minutes ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

Oh indeed, it's a mass  (or mess) of variations of the class parts and specific allocations in the KX area any particular month. But I am a dedicated impressionist, and looks sufficiently like an N7(part) will do. (I have 69640 from a Wills kit as a legacy from my 'accuracy days' all detailed up against photos for circa 1959 in case anyone who knows a lot happens to come by!)

 

You do know you can credibly have an N5 come for a visit to Finsbury Square? 69266 was shedded at Hatfield July to September 1959, for some unaccountable reason. So I can an 0-6-2T example from all the Southern area groups of the LNER. Which is nice.

 

It is, indeed a mass/mess.  I did actually alter the cab of a Wills one to reflect the different cab windows and bunker, also including I think making the recessed steps on the bunker side, but don't fancy doing it again!

 

Interesting to hear of the N5, I don't think I've heard of that before - is a kit available?  I've recently been pondering stretching temporal credibility to include a C12 ....

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And why not? 67352 was brought down from Grantham and bulled up for an exhibition at Wood Green, September 1958. Think it was to commemorate an anniversary of the Borough charter.

 

The better known 68846 was exhibited alongside , and this loco went on to work at KX loco for the next 8 months, before being sold into preservation to Captain Smith and running down to Marshmoor sidings on a two coach special. So, a little 'elasticity' and we may imagine that the C12 was used in the same way. That's all the excuse I needed anyway.

 

There was an etched brass N5 kit at one time, but no idea if it is current. I really feel that an N1 is the higher priority for me, among much else in little black locos that is currently near stalled due to pressing elder care issues.

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1 minute ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

And why not? 67352 was brought down from Grantham and bulled up for an exhibition at Wood Green, September 1958. Think it was to commemorate an anniversary of the Borough charter.

 

The better known 68846 was exhibited alongside , and this loco went on to work at KX loco for the next 8 months, before being sold into preservation to Captain Smith and running down to Marshmoor sidings on a two coach special. So, a little 'elasticity' and we may imagine that the C12 was used in the same way. That's all the excuse I needed anyway.

 

There was an etched brass N5 kit at one time, but no idea if it is current. I really feel that an N1 is the higher priority for me, among much else in little black locos that is currently near stalled due to pressing elder care issues.

 

That's the C12 I was thinking of; I believe in reality it was not in working order (already withdrawn?) when displayed at Wood Green, but who knows?  Already have 68846; it does sterling service as station pilot!

 

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SE Finecast do a kit of the N5.

 

My N5 is the old Millholme kit.

 

Andrew

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Posted (edited)
On 07/06/2019 at 23:42, Norton Wood said:

Further Details from Oxford Rail regarding the newly announced BR Late Crested N7 - New Photo attached 
 

OR76N7004- N7 Late crest: 
Livery detail includes white smokebox ring, White chimney top. Full lining including Westinghouse pump and a red smokebox number. 

 

I asked in the comments for those interested if they'd be up for producing an LNER Lined Round Topped Boilered N7, to which they replied Everything is possible...So fingers crossed :D 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_2019_06/61936369_2330960153782955_8912142450135400448_n.png.bae4cd77136b256a023c51b3b657a072.png

 

If they do an LNER RT boilered N7 I only hope they line this one in red as it should be pre-WW2.

 

Andrew

Edited by Woodcock29
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On ‎09‎/‎06‎/‎2019 at 08:55, stewartingram said:

Was the smokebox door ring actually painted white, or was it polished steel?

 

Stewart

Polished steel, regularly rubbed down/brightened up with pumice.

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Posted (edited)
On 15/06/2019 at 10:48, The Snapper said:

Has anyone converted to EM Gauge ?

 

I have P4 wheels (Exactoscale) to try just that...but don't wait up. I bought one to evaluate prior to considering a full P4 etched chassis in the hope it could cover the Finecast and Connoisseur kits too, much as we (mostly Justin N) have done with the Gibson J15. First glance tells me the lower boiler arrangement (much like the Hornby J15 I also looked at but abandoned) renders that element of universality unlikely. If anyone is likely to offer such a chassis specifically for the OR model it seems to be Brassmasters. Some time after his J15 Easichas, I imagine...

 

Alternatively, Chris over at High Level may be looking at a solution along the lines of his Bachmann 64xx kit.

 

So, as with the Gibson conversion for the J15, let's see. The wheels are the same, so why not use one of those conversion sets...

 

The Exactoscale wheels were developed, as I understand things, specifically for the N7. Andrew, any comments?

 

Best,

Marcus

Edited by EHertsGER
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I have the 4mm kit by Connoisseur Models. I’m considering building the chassis to see how suitable it might be. Depending on it’s suitability it might be worth having a word with Jim to see if he would do a run of just the chassis part of the kit. 

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When I built my Wills N7. I got the body (only) second hand, and got a chassis kit for it from South Eastern Finecast - it seems they still sell them:

 

http://www.sefinecast.co.uk/Chassis Kits/Chassis Kits.htm

 

It was quite a nice kit as I recall, from nickel silver - might be useful for anyone wanting to re-gauge the Oxford loco.

 

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