Imaginary Rolling Stock

[Gibbo675]

The Triang Pullmans are the correct length for the two Metropolitan cars. Unfortunately the window size and spacing is completely wrong.

Hi Phil,

 

It would seem that the Wrenn ones are only a midges short for the SE&CR ones that ended their days on the Golden Arrow, again with incorrect window spacing.

 

Do you also have a full set of the Pullman Profile series books ?

 

Gibbo.

[BernardTPM]

The good thing about Pullman cars is that cutting and shutting is easy because the sides are flat. You could use the later Hornby versions as main line stock with the Wrenn ones for secondary services and perhaps use the Triang ones as suburban versions by working extra doors into the sides.

 

Avoid the Graham Farish Pullmans for they are acetate and are very often warped as a result.

Triang Puillmans don't have completely flat sides as they angle in from the waistline upwards.

 

Later Farish Pullmans have styrene bodies but they seem to turn up on ebay much less often than the wavy acetate ones.

The Triang Pullmans are the correct length for the two Metropolitan cars. Unfortunately the window size and spacing is completely wrong.

And the reason they are the shape they are is because they're based on the Southern Railway EMU Pullmans, just WAY too short.

[PhilJ W]

Hi Phil,

 

It would seem that the Wrenn ones are only a midges short for the SE&CR ones that ended their days on the Golden Arrow, again with incorrect window spacing.

 

Do you also have a full set of the Pullman Profile series books ?

 

Gibbo.

Oops, it is the Wrenn not the Triang one that is the same length. I compared one with drawings in a couple of books of Metropolitan stock. If you wanted to make a conversion etched overlays would be the best idea.

[BernardTPM]

I like those pullman full brakes, Gibbo. Might try something similar as I am trying to come up with a ‘house style’ for my railway’s coaches that’s distinctly different from the Big 4, but not yet found what I’m looking for.

A quick photomontage of Triang-Hornby Thompson sides rearranged:

 

 

Quite a few Irish (Great Southern Rly?) coaches had central toilets. The toilet windows could be squared out to make them less Thompson. (Apologies, the coach I bought was an early example where the corridor and compartment glazing was stuck to the wrong sides).

[HonestTom]

Oops, it is the Wrenn not the Triang one that is the same length. I compared one with drawings in a couple of books of Metropolitan stock. If you wanted to make a conversion etched overlays would be the best idea.

 

Very interesting. I have a Met Bo-Bo, but all I have to run with it is a pair of ballast wagons. Pullmans would be a good start.

[Gibbo675]

Very interesting. I have a Met Bo-Bo, but all I have to run with it is a pair of ballast wagons. Pullmans would be a good start.

Hi Tom,

 

There are drawings and plenty of photographs in Pullman Profile Volume 5 by Anthony M Ford should you need.

 

Gibbo.

[sncf231e]

Alexandra,

 

A CIWL observation car? There has never been one except in the messy minds of the makers of the last film adaptation of Murder on the Orient Express.

 

Regards

Fred

[sem34090]

I think that's part of the point, Fred. As best as I know it Alex's plans are for a series of cars that were supposedly built as part of a joint venture between the Pullman Car Co. and CIWL for proposed cross-channel services. I could be wrong, and I expect Alex will correct me if so. The plans all tie up with a piece of fiction she is writing that can be found here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/135313-madame-noir-a-womans-history-of-blackstone/

[sncf231e]

I think that's part of the point, Fred. As best as I know it Alex's plans are for a series of cars that were supposedly built as part of a joint venture between the Pullman Car Co. and CIWL for proposed cross-channel services. I could be wrong, and I expect Alex will correct me if so. The plans all tie up with a piece of fiction she is writing that can be found here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/135313-madame-noir-a-womans-history-of-blackstone/

 

Oops! I should have noted that the title of this thread is imaginary rolling stock and there are no boundaries to imagination (as Triang already new in 1965 ).

 

 

Regards

Fred

[BernardTPM]

Another idea for generic corridor coaches. Start with the Hornby 1978 Grouping (now 'Railroad') type coaches, of the Southern Railway variety. These combined the sides of the GWR 1925 Collett with a wooden roof typical of Southern Maunsell and Bullied stock. Move the battery boxes to the middle, flatten the ends and straight away you've got something that can't be nailed down to any one railway company (save your own?). Removing the curly GWR style grab handles would be an extra refinement, but the way the door lines are moulded slightly raised means that you can rework the corridor side with fewer doors too and end up with something like this:

 

 

[The Johnster]

I'd suggest further refining this by cutting the tiebars out of the B1 bogies and accentuating that there are only 3 doors in this corridor side by placing footsteps beneath them.  Don't forget the inside corridor handrail across the droplights where the now solid sides used to have doors, droplights nos 1, 3, 5, and 7 on this example.

Edited January 15, 2019 by The Johnster

[BernardTPM]

Good point on the corridor rail. Back in the '70s I used to hack BR1 bogies like that (and added steps) to make them more GWR in appearance. Easier when they were styrene, especially gluing things on! Another thought I had was to remove the existing rather high roof nameboard supports and bring them down to just above gutter level. There's also the possiblitiy of adding waistline beading to make them look older, or vents over the doors.

[The Johnster]

I've made ersatz Dean 8'6" bogies out of the B1s on my shorty clerestories in this way; they don't look too bad.  Another thing that would backdate these a bit would be gas cylinders and pipes for lighting.

[BernardTPM]

I was thinking of them as supposed 1920s/early '30s era build rather than much earlier when you could probably do with some proper panelled sides (acknowledging, of course, that the LMS still used panelling on some coaches to around 1929/30).

Edited January 15, 2019 by BernardTPM

[The Johnster]

There were still gas lit coaches on express trains in the 20s; the report into the Charfield accident is highly critical of the situation.  None had been built for many years, of course, but plenty were still in service.

[RLBH]

Something slightly different: breakdown vans. Per the Breakdown Crane Association's website, a committee was set up in 1953 to investigate ways of improving the breakdown system. The report of this committee (wihch doesn't seem to be online, so I'm going off the BDCA's article) led to the ordering in 1959 of 22 modern breakdown cranes, and the conversion of disused bogie coaching stock to provide breakdown vans.

 

The committee itself, however, was very taken by the idea of purpose-built breakdown vans, particularly liking the modern vans operated by the Danish railways. There was precedent on the British railway network, too, in the GWR's purpose-designed breakdown tool and riding vans. Had purse strings been a little looser - and if we can free up funds for other flights of fancy, a hundred or so coaches is easy - might not the British Transport Commission have found funds for a fleet of modern bogie breakdown vans?

 

I'd envisage that there would be, as a minimum, a tool van and a riding van, probably also a packing van. One of these (probably the tool van) would carry an electrical generator. A combination tool & riding van seems likely for those depots where a breakdown train was required on a smaller scale only. To my mind, these would naturally be members of the Mark 1 coaching stock family, probably using the GUV as a basis for its' go-anywhere design and vertical sides for better use of space.

 

Thoughts?

[cctransuk]

Something slightly different: breakdown vans. Per the Breakdown Crane Association's website, a committee was set up in 1953 to investigate ways of improving the breakdown system. The report of this committee (wihch doesn't seem to be online, so I'm going off the BDCA's article) led to the ordering in 1959 of 22 modern breakdown cranes, and the conversion of disused bogie coaching stock to provide breakdown vans.

 

The committee itself, however, was very taken by the idea of purpose-built breakdown vans, particularly liking the modern vans operated by the Danish railways. There was precedent on the British railway network, too, in the GWR's purpose-designed breakdown tool and riding vans. Had purse strings been a little looser - and if we can free up funds for other flights of fancy, a hundred or so coaches is easy - might not the British Transport Commission have found funds for a fleet of modern bogie breakdown vans?

 

I'd envisage that there would be, as a minimum, a tool van and a riding van, probably also a packing van. One of these (probably the tool van) would carry an electrical generator. A combination tool & riding van seems likely for those depots where a breakdown train was required on a smaller scale only. To my mind, these would naturally be members of the Mark 1 coaching stock family, probably using the GUV as a basis for its' go-anywhere design and vertical sides for better use of space.

 

Thoughts?

 

Nice idea - but with an endless supply of superannuated passenger stock available, I can't see new build being adopted even by a better-funded BR - no extra revenue possibilities!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[RLBH]

Nice idea - but with an endless supply of superannuated passenger stock available, I can't see new build being adopted even by a better-funded BR - no extra revenue possibilities!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Bah, there's always someone comes along and spoils things with realism!

[PhilJ W]

Bah, there's always someone comes along and spoils things with realism!

In that case apply rule one.

[BernardTPM]

To be honest, I'm glad they didn't make all the departmental stuff one boring standard design but bodged it out of whatever they had. Much more variety. And you can always add another...

[sem34090]

Final place I'll be posting this, honest! :p

 

I thought this would belong here quite nicely - More details in my workbench thread.

[PhilJ W]

Just posting here to test something.

[Skinnylinny]

Got to say, I love those Triang clerestories for bashing. My current plan is to convert them into a dining car triple set for my fictional Great Southern Railway company - lots of hacking and slashing on the go for these!



The elongated windows are made by simply sawing out the columns between compartments. This means there are a LOT of chops to make, but still. We'll see!

[sem34090]

Nice!

 

My ones are from Ratio bits as I found that there is a lot less work involved (as far as this project goes) as basically the only bit (from a fresh kit) that I wouldn't be using would be the solebars and chassis.

[Satan's Goldfish]

Should a Mk1 take on a quad-art have a brake at each end or is 1 brake ok?

 

 

(original Mk1s shown for length comparison)