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TurboSnail

TurboSnail's Workbench - 3D Printing and General Bodgery

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1 minute ago, TurboSnail said:

 

That's a heck of a macro lens if you can actually see the print lines. Each of those lines is 25 microns wide...

Certainly, but is that actually what we're seeing? I've always suspected that there are patterns along the z-axis at much longer spatial-frequencies than the layer-size, caused either by issues in the slicing software or misalignments between layers in the printers. 

 

That said, Edwardian's photos are exceptionally sharp and the revealed texture is going to vanish like scotch mist under the thinnest coat of primer.

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7 minutes ago, TurboSnail said:

 

That's a heck of a macro lens if you can actually see the print lines. Each of those lines is 25 microns wide...

 

Just now, Guy Rixon said:

Certainly, but is that actually what we're seeing? I've always suspected that there are patterns along the z-axis at much longer spatial-frequencies than the layer-size, caused either by issues in the slicing software or misalignments between layers in the printers. 

 

That said, Edwardian's photos are exceptionally sharp and the revealed texture is going to vanish like scotch mist under the thinnest coat of primer.

 

Certainly that's more than my Mark I Eyeball reveals. 

 

I do indeed suspect that filler primer will not be necessary and that plain primer will smooth out any relief pattern there might be.  

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4 hours ago, Ruston said:

It's something used by some "finescale" modellers in building model locomotives and is supposedly the "cutting edge of technology", although it makes the locomotive run/stay on the track, no better than one that uses simple compensation. It's the next big argument to kick off in the P4 world and will make the gauge wars look like a teddy bears picnic, or so I am told... https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/emoticons/default_rolleyes.gif

Hi Ruston,

 

Are P4 those that have really lovely fine scale wheels and track work to offset the ugliness of the huge great big knuckle coupling hung from the buffer beam ?

 

I have to say I spent enough time with my profile and wear gauges along with wrestling real springs onto the flexible couplings of real axle boxes, in a real pit, under real locomotives,  before then rawling on with spring adjusters while the locomotive floated on the Kelbus gear to be fiddling on with my models to that extent.

 

I like my OO gauge stuff for its simplicity.

 

Cheers,

 

Gibbo.

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17 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said:

have to say I spent enough time with my profile and wear gauges along with wrestling real springs onto the flexible couplings of real axle boxes, in a real pit, under real locomotives,  before then rawling on with spring adjusters while the locomotive floated on the Kelbus gear to be fiddling on with my models to that extent.

And that is exactly the point of CSBs: that the suspension can be made to give good enough weight distribution and running at the design stage without having to adjust afterwards.

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12 minutes ago, Guy Rixon said:

And that is exactly the point of CSBs: that the suspension can be made to give good enough weight distribution and running at the design stage without having to adjust afterwards.

Hi Guy,

 

When I wrote "real locomotive" I mean actual real locomotives, some of which have twenty two ton axle loads and run at 75mph on Network Rail sort of real !

 

Gibbo.

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13 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Guy,

 

When I wrote "real locomotive" I mean actual real locomotives, some of which have twenty two ton axle loads and run at 75mph on Network Rail sort of real !

 

Gibbo.

Yes, I understood. Full-size suspensions are harder than model suspensions and the design-it-so-it's-never-adjusted approach doesn't work for full-size vehicles, given the greater degree of wear and the far higher requirements for safety and reliability. For 4mm-scale models, CSBs do eliminate the need to adjust, if they're designed properly, and this I hold to be a good thing. But unless TS expresses an interest in printing chassis with CSB fittings (doable, never been done AFAIK), we should drop the subject on this thread.

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3 hours ago, Caley Jim said:

With due respect to my learned friend, I must speak in defence of the 2fs community who have a reputation for being encouraging, accepting and tolerant of all.  In over 40 years membership I have never seen any heated discussions or falling out. 

 

Jim 

I feel it only appropriate here to mention S Scale, brothers-in-arms to 2mm FS in pioneering finescale modelling techniques. (Although CSB seems to be a P4 concept.)

There was a bit of ill-feeling generated in the 90s between S7 and 0 gauge, but that seems to have settled down now.

 

Yes, S7 does look better than 0 gauge, and P4 than EM than 00, everything else being equal. But it’s not for everyone. End of story!

 

In S, unless one follows North American or “anglosphere antipodean” prototype’s, there isn’t anything with other standards to compare with. Rather relaxing, actually.

 

I have said it before, but about 15 years ago I asked Bob Essery what made him switch from 0 to S7. His response was startling in its simplicity: he realised that having to cut holes in the boiler to accommodate 0F wheels for a Midland “Spinner” was making things more complicated than if it was being built to S7 standards.

That is a reason worthy of serious consideration.

 

I recently came across a letter in an early 1960s MRN, from “Smokey” Bourne, which revealed the truth behind the origination of EM.

It started with a set of wheels to the British Railway Modelling Standards Bureau* “00” finescale standard profile, set to provide a scale dimension over the outer faces.

If they had used the BRMSB flangeways, the gauge could have been 18.75mm, but they felt this was too sloppy, and it was reduced to 18mm (hence EM, of course), but later on it was relaxed slightly to 18.2mm.

It won’t surprise many that the letter was somewhat ill-tempered about the proposed P4...

 

* Like the “Model Railway Study Group”, a bunch of self-appointed experts. Nuff sed!

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Chaps and Chapesses,

 

I made a silly comment, based on something that a P4 modeller friend recently told me - that's all. I have no personal opinion on the merits, or otherwise, of CSB, or P4 modelling in general and I certainly never expected that my comment would end up with Turbosnail's thread being hijacked and I am sorry that it has.

 

If we can please let him have his thread back, I will go and crawl back under my stone...

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Maybe I'll have to take back my thread, by force if necessary! In this case, the combined forces of Messrs Sharp, Stewart and Co.

 

I'm having a go at fixing a reject print, to join the burgeoning Shakespeare Colliery fleet. This is based on the same model Linny is currently building, but with a weatherboard cab and a different motorisation method that I'm not sure will work yet...

 

IMG_20190212_213733.jpg.1cac94857acf9ae486a906df9d5c5a7d.jpg

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That looks very nice Tom! 

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Full of character.  I'm thinking that the West Norfolk Minerals Railway might like one ...

 

Still, must wrestle with the Neilson 2-2-2 first!

 

Mind you, I could do with just such a SS chimney for WNR No.3.

Edited by Edwardian
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Does anyone know a source of 10mm driving wheels? I found a truly tiny loco I want to make at some point.

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19 minutes ago, TurboSnail said:

Does anyone know a source of 10mm driving wheels? I found a truly tiny loco I want to make at some point.

Hi TS,

 

Would coarse scale N gauge be suitable for adaption ?

 

Gibbo.

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28 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi TS,

 

Would coarse scale N gauge be suitable for adaption ?

 

Gibbo.

 

Hmm... Would the spokes look right though? Supposed to be 8-spoke Manning Wardle wheels. 

 

Even if I could just use the tyres and replace the centre, that would probably be good enough.

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2 hours ago, TurboSnail said:

Does anyone know a source of 10mm driving wheels? I found a truly tiny loco I want to make at some point.

You've found the Class B and C Manning Wardles? Can't help with the wheels, I'm afraid. Perhaps there's a suitably sized wagon wheel rim that you could use and make the wheel centre as a 3D print?

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5 hours ago, TurboSnail said:

Does anyone know a source of 10mm driving wheels? I found a truly tiny loco I want to make at some point.

Thousands of years ago when I built my own tiny Manning Wardle 0-4-0 I used Mike Sharman wheels, but I suppose that's not an option anymore.  I also used the outer casing of the tiny can motor to represent the boiler which is how I got a motor to fit into such a small locomotive.

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The smallest ones in the Gibson range are 2'9" which is 11 mm.

 

The small wheels they make are

 

4835       2’9” 11.0mm 10 Spoke Hudswell Clarke

4836BH 3’ 0" 12.0mm. 10 spoke Black Hawthorn

4836E    3’ 0" 12.0mm. 9 spoke LNER Y9 

4836IW 3’ 0" 12.0mm. 8 spoke Manning Wardle

 

Not much in the tender/bogie wheels either, But these aren't far off the size.

 

4831 2' 8" 10.5mm. 8 Spoke Plain 

4832 2' 8" 10.5mm. 10 spoke Plain 

 

 

http://www.alangibsonworkshop.com/

 

 

Jason

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9 hours ago, Ruston said:

You've found the Class B and C Manning Wardles? Can't help with the wheels, I'm afraid. Perhaps there's a suitably sized wagon wheel rim that you could use and make the wheel centre as a 3D print?

 

That sounds like a plan. As Jason says, I may have to go for 10.5mm wheels, but I think I can make my own wheel centres like I did for the Neilson 2-2-2T. 

 

But first, I need to find some drawings and photos of the Manning Wardle B class, and work out whether it's feasible at all. I think I've got a good idea of how to make it work.

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Speaking of tiny Manning Wardles, this one is small enough already! A little more chassis fettling needed then I can motorise it.

 

IMG_20190215_215950.jpg.d30776d8b444770c9213ea4e4fdf36dc.jpg

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Well, 3Dhubs has now priced me out of the market entirely. I've just been quoted £105 for an F class in OO, excluding the chassis. Given that I aim to sell them for £70, including chassis, motor, gears and delivery, this method of getting prints done is now not an option. I'm seriously considering getting myself a 3D printer, but that would have to wait until I've graduated in the summer. I'll find a way to get back into it somehow!

 

I might have to go back to old-fashioned RTR-bashing for a bit, which would hardly be a disappointment. At least I've still got the Manning Wardle and Sharp Stewart builds to keep me going for a while.

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1 hour ago, TurboSnail said:

Well, 3Dhubs has now priced me out of the market entirely. I've just been quoted £105 for an F class in OO, excluding the chassis. Given that I aim to sell them for £70, including chassis, motor, gears and delivery, this method of getting prints done is now not an option. I'm seriously considering getting myself a 3D printer, but that would have to wait until I've graduated in the summer. I'll find a way to get back into it somehow!

 

I might have to go back to old-fashioned RTR-bashing for a bit, which would hardly be a disappointment. At least I've still got the Manning Wardle and Sharp Stewart builds to keep me going for a while.

Knuckles recently said he can do prints on his machine of other people's designs which is the first place Im turning for seaford

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I've lacked the energy to do practical modelling this week, but I've made a start on another CAD model, this one for the shortened Electrotren chassis. No drawings to work from either, just a fun one from photos and guesswork. Anyone recognise it?

 

image.png.9293f7607833bc0ff043510d3978f1c1.png

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would that be the very tiny Hudswell Clarke 0-4-0st off the Taff Vale Rly, drawings for which are available on the Colin Binnie website?

 

 

taff-vale-267-3w.jpg

taff-vale-267-4w.png

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50 minutes ago, Killian keane said:

would that be the very tiny Hudswell Clarke 0-4-0st off the Taff Vale Rly, drawings for which are available on the Colin Binnie website?

 

 

Loosely based on, yes, also based on photos of 'Lord Mayor' on the KWVR. There are a few compromises in width, height, wheelbase and wheel diameter to call it a model of that loco, so I'm aiming for the look of a similar class that Hudswell Clarke could have made.

Edited by TurboSnail
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A bit more progress made on the imaginary Hudswell Clarke - the chassis is based on the Electrotren 0-6-0 one, so the new smaller motor on the 0-4-0 isn't in there yet, hence the bits that don't fit in properly. The cylinders are also smaller than shown.

 

image.png.c88437647befa404cbecb13e54f5185d.png

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