Warren Branch

[Edwardian]

The Ratio pump house kit has always struck me as odd.  

 

Twopenneth time ...

 

Yes, overall I think it looks too modern, but if I am not mistaken it has two entirely appropriate Nineteenth Century arched windows to one side. 

 

 

I suspect that the mongrel appearance of the pumphouse results from Ratio's wish to squeeze another kit out of the base for their water tower kit. Fair aspiration, but for me it doesn't quite work.

 

 

I guess this is why it is given a flat concrete roof instead of the pitched slate roof you'd expect.

 

So .... if it were me, I'd:

 

(i) discard the concrete flat roof and build a hipped roof using something like Wills slate roof sheets.  You might even be able to use parts of the nice roof windows in the kit:

 

 

(ii) replace the metal chimney with a short resin-cast one 

 

e.g. Anyscale; FOS; Bachmann

[chuffinghell]

15 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

The Ratio pump house kit has always struck me as odd.  

 

Twopenneth time ...

 

Yes, overall I think it looks too modern, but if I am not mistaken it has two entirely appropriate Nineteenth Century arched windows to one side. 

 

 

I suspect that the mongrel appearance of the pumphouse results from Ratio's wish to squeeze another kit out of the base for their water tower kit. Fair aspiration, but for me it doesn't quite work.

 

 

I guess this is why it is given a flat concrete roof instead of the pitched slate roof you'd expect.

 

So .... if it were me, I'd:

 

(i) discard the concrete flat roof and build a hipped roof using something like Wills slate roof sheets.  You might even be able to use parts of the nice roof windows in the kit:

 

 

(ii) replace the metal chimney with a short resin-cast one 

 

e.g. Anyscale; FOS; Bachmann

 

The Ratio N gauge pump house kit is better, although basically the engine shed with a chimney strapped to it but is more the style I was thinking of with the stone finish and arched windows

 

I'm going to have go at a bit of 'kit bashing' me thinks

 

 

 

Edited June 18, 2019 by chuffinghell

[chuffinghell]

Oh and @Edwardian thanks for the links, just the type of chimney I was looking for

[Harlequin]

12 hours ago, Harlequin said:

I think I read recently that a station on the Berks & Hants got it’s water supply from the Kennet & Avon canal but I can’t find the reference. The GWR owned the canal so they could do that...

 

A history of the Berks and Hants line, Reading to Westbury p.107:

 

"During 1938... The pumping plant at Savernake Low Level (water from the canal for railway purposes) was converted to electric operation"

 

So there you are -  a prototype for what you are doing!

[Nick C]

On 13/06/2019 at 00:18, chuffinghell said:

 

Had a play about with ballast too, this is fine weathered brown, I’m thinking of using extra fine around the engine shed to simulate a compacted surface and fine or medium for the track maybe?

 

 

The area around the engine shed would usually be ballasted with ash rather than ballast - as would the goods yard.

[Martin S-C]

Yup, the surface would be very flat and at least up to the sleeper tops.

 

Or even up to the rail tops.

 

[chuffinghell]

I’d rather use brown ballast to be honest but I suppose I’ll have to have a look into ash

 

I can’t imagine it would be particularly easy to work with though

 

can anyone point me in the direction of some modelled examples and what materials to use

 

 

 

 

Edited June 18, 2019 by chuffinghell

[Edwardian]

13 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

I’d rather use brown ballast to be honest but I suppose I’ll have to have a look into ash

 

I can’t imagine it would be particularly easy to work with though

 

can anyone point me in the direction of some modelled examples and what materials to use

 

 

 

 

 

Chinchilla dust.

 

I dyed some dark grey and used it for NER ash ballast. 

[St Enodoc]

3 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

Chinchilla dust.

 

I dyed some dark grey and used it for NER ash ballast. 

Ash from the fireplace works well too.

[Martin S-C]

Chris Nevard uses DAS modelling clay. When you consider the real size of the particles and the scale, an almost perfectly smooth surface is probably correct. If you look again at that photo of the larger multi-road engine shed I posted you'll see what I mean - imagine that surface in 4mm scale.

[chuffinghell]

15 minutes ago, Martin S-C said:

Chris Nevard uses DAS modelling clay. When you consider the real size of the particles and the scale, an almost perfectly smooth surface is probably correct. If you look again at that photo of the larger multi-road engine shed I posted you'll see what I mean - imagine that surface in 4mm scale.

 

I’ll have a look at that

 

I’m assuming at the engine shed end I’d have ash ballast on just the track into the shed? and ‘normal’ ballast on the headshunt and run around loop?

 

how would you do the transition from the ash ballast to ‘normal’ ballast as the line exits the goods yard

 

apologies for the stupid questions but ash ballast was not something I had considered, allowed for or even aware of

[sb67]

I'd go for using DAS, there's plenty of info on here and the internet on how to do it. You could even sieve a small amount of ash in places  over the wet pint to give a bit of texture, in 4mm scale I sometimes think textures on models are too coarse. To get the transition you could smooth the DAS in places over the ballast.

Here's a link to a blog by Chris Nevard about using DAS, do a search and here's loads more info.

http://nevardmedia.blogspot.com/2011/08/creating-effect-of-ash-ballast.html

Hope that helps. 

Steve.

Edited June 19, 2019 by sb67

[chuffinghell]

So would it be acceptable to do the shaded area in ash ballast and the surrounding areas with normal brown ballast?

 

I'm a bit out of my comfort zone now so you'll have to forgive my ignorance

[Harlequin]

I think the ground surface would become naturally compacted with ash wherever it was being produced and dealt with. And it would be deliberately used wherever a compacted surface to move wheeled vehicles on was required.

 

So I wouldn't push the compacted surface up alongside the engine release. Keep it close to the shed line and maybe the line below it where locos might also have had their fires dropped sometimes.

 

Moretonhampstead:

From left to right: Back siding, goods yard. goods shed siding, (stacks of sleepers), main line, run round loop, engine shed siding. You can see ballast under the sleepers but just inches further out (sorry, centimetres) the surface is compacted material.

 

View from the engine shed looking in the opposite direction:

 

Away from the shed and the yard the track is cleanly ballasted.

 

Edited June 19, 2019 by Harlequin

[chuffinghell]

Thank you @Harlequin :)

 

So something like this?

[chuffinghell]

Thank you @Martin S-C and @sb67 for pointing me towards

Chris Nevard's blog on the subject

 

A very interesting and helpful blog

 

Chris

 

 

Edited June 19, 2019 by chuffinghell

[chuffinghell]

11 hours ago, Edwardian said:

 

Chinchilla dust.

 

I dyed some dark grey and used it for NER ash ballast. 

 

I didn't even know Chinchilla dust was a 'thing'

 

Very interesting though, thank you

[Edwardian]

11 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

 

I didn't even know Chinchilla dust was a 'thing'

 

Very interesting though, thank you

 

Yes, if you're a chinchilla, it's certainly a thing ....

 

 

It is very fine.  I take the point about using clay to represent compacted yard surfaces.  There are, however, areas of ash and other areas where something finer than stone ballast that is not compacted might be found.  

 

Here it is used as ash ballast (on my daughter's NER-themed school project layout) ....

 

 

And here as the surface of a building forecourt on Castle Aching ....

 

 

i have also seen it used on platform surfaces.  For instance, by Bluelightening on Oakhill. 

[Martin S-C]

Thank you sb67, that was the blog entry I was recalling but couldn't find the link.

 

Chris - the compacted surface was there for a reason - that being to make it less hazardous for people or animals to walk about the area and not trip over raised sleeper tops or walk on less stable loose ballast, so anywhere where people would habitually walk would be compacted. This covers areas where engines need to be serviced, where things like barrows need to be wheeled, where shunters need to get at wagon couplings, or yard horses need to haul on lines to move wagons about. That might be a better way to approach the issue. Across running lines where drainage was paramount and so looser ballast was necessary, you'd have sleepered board foot crossings more than likely.

Edited June 19, 2019 by Martin S-C

[Harlequin]

Not sure it would get around the back of the shed, unless if was deliberately piled there (possible idea!)

So here's Just a quick sketch of how I might do it, maybe, possibly:

[chuffinghell]

14 hours ago, Edwardian said:

 

Chinchilla dust.

 

I dyed some dark grey and used it for NER ash ballast. 

 

May I ask with what/how you dyed it and how best to apply to the layout

 

Thanks

 

Chris

[Edwardian]

20 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

 

May I ask with what/how you dyed it and how best to apply to the layout

 

Thanks

 

Chris

 

Chris,

 

I tend to use slightly dilute pva for most 'groundworks' jobs. Spread the glue evenly, sprinkle and gently tamp down.

 

As for colour, I suspect that the professional approach would be to lay it in its natural colour and, once set, spray it with airbrush or rattle cans, varying the tone.

 

My approach is generally far from professional, however.

 

What I have done  - and it was much more fun for my 11-year old - is to mix the dust with paint (the less diluted the paint, the darker the colour) - then bake it dry in the oven.

 

 

Mixed:

 

 

Baked:

 

 

It then needs crumbling down back into its original grains, which takes some time, but beats a stress ball any day.

 

Re-crumbled:

 

 

This way I end up with different shades of any given colour, which I can mix both applying, so I never get an unnaturally even tone that way.  

[chuffinghell]

Thanks for that, any particular type of paint or just anything water soluble?

[Edwardian]

23 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

Thanks for that, any particular type of paint or just anything water soluble?

 

I used the tubs of water-soluble acrylics sold in art shops, but I guess anything water soluble would do the trick. 

[chuffinghell]

15 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

I used the tubs of water-soluble acrylics sold in art shops, but I guess anything water soluble would do the trick. 

 

Thanks for the tips

 

I realise I'm not quite at the ballasting stage yet but it's good to be prepared, plus what I can do now is to weather/air brush the track leading upto the engine shed before applying the ash ballast. Everywhere else I plan on ballasting first and then air brushing afterwards

 

I've got plenty of track off cuts that I can glue to a spare bit of timber to practice different techniques as suggested........who knows I might come up with a different one

 

As the removable section is complete in as much as fully wired and soon to be removable (following a saw cut) I thought I could make a start on that section treating it almost as a separate diarama

 

Although I mostly try to tackle things in a methodical mannor my approch is a little haphazard sometimes as I flit from one aspect of the hobby to another but it keeps me occupied and happy

 

 

Edited June 19, 2019 by chuffinghell