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Ray H

Mercian 7mm Midland 1F Kit

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I am about to start building my first loco kit and as a nominal 4mm modeller this is also my first venture into the senior scale.

 

I recently purchased a Mercian 1F loco kit via a well known electronic auction site.

 

I took it to my club last week to show a couple of 7mm modellers and they weren't too sure how the coupling rods should be assembled.

 

post-10059-0-29901000-1541436695_thumb.jpg

 

The two etches appear to be identical so the left hand side of my hand-drawn "line" on the upper etch has hidden part of what we think is a component of the coupling rod assembly.

 

The instructions with the kit simply state "Laminate the coupling rods together, taking care to ensure that the bosses are on the outside."

 

Can anyone recall how these parts parts go together?

 

We have a similar kit from Slaters at the club and its coupling rods appear to have been made from three layers.

 

I'll endeavour to keep this thread updated during the rest of the kit's build.

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Good buy Ray.  I have the Slaters kit to build.  Wondering if yours is round top or Belpaire boiler.  The Slaters is round top but I want to convert to Belpaire.  I'll watch with interest.

 

I can check to see if Slaters provides more detail on coupling rod assembly.

 

John

Edited by brossard

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It looks like each front and rear is made up from a full and short rod. So you get a lap joint on the centre pin. The parts on the left will make up the bosses and the dummy joint by the centre crank pin.

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Not sure how you would get a dummy centre joint from those bits.

 

it looks to me like the bits will make a 2-layer rod lap-jointed on the centre pin with a boss and an oil box above each pin.

 

For information, here's what the front, centre and rear pins of 41708 look like. This loco is at Barrow Hill which is quite local to me. I made an EM Gauge version of this loco so I have dozens of detail photos from crawling all over it. Just say if you want close-ups of anything and I'll see if I've got a picture.

 

post-2189-0-04398800-1541443542_thumb.jpg post-2189-0-75513500-1541443237_thumb.jpg post-2189-0-19972300-1541443549_thumb.jpg

 

Best of luck with this! I'll be watching as I want to build a 7mm version of 41708 with Belpaire firebox.

 

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Not sure how you would get a dummy centre joint from those bits.

 

it looks to me like the bits will make a 2-layer rod lap-jointed on the centre pin with a boss and an oil box above each pin.

 

For information, here's what the front, centre and rear pins of 41708 look like. This loco is at Barrow Hill which is quite local to me. I made an EM Gauge version of this loco so I have dozens of detail photos from crawling all over it. Just say if you want close-ups of anything and I'll see if I've got a picture.

 

attachicon.gifP1050901.JPG attachicon.gifP1050902.JPG attachicon.gifP1050904.JPG

 

Best of luck with this! I'll be watching as I want to build a 7mm version of 41708 with Belpaire firebox.

If you look at the bosses on the left side you will see the bottom one of top set and top of lower set are the centre boss with detail of the joint on them. They won't make a joint but the representation of one.

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If you look at the bosses on the left side you will see the bottom one of top set and top of lower set are the centre boss with detail of the joint on them. They won't make a joint but the representation of one.

 

Yes, i see what you mean now Peter and I agree.

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That's absolutely brilliant chaps. Very many thanks Duncan for the pictures and to John for his PM.

 

The picture of the model on the box is the round top version but a quick glance at the instructions suggests that there may be parts supplied for either round top or Belpaire firebox. I'll check this out in more detail and post accordingly.

 

Thanks once again.

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That's absolutely brilliant chaps. Very many thanks Duncan for the pictures and to John for his PM.

 

The picture of the model on the box is the round top version but a quick glance at the instructions suggests that there may be parts supplied for either round top or Belpaire firebox. I'll check this out in more detail and post accordingly.

 

Thanks once again.

Trevor used the 4mm instructions for the 7mm kit in which were parts for both the round top and belpaires (or at least there was in the kit I assembled to write the instructions, sorry the coupling rods was not clear  :blush: Duncan

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And a nice little model it is too.....I did add a few extra details as is my wont.

 

post-3059-0-86988700-1541534198.jpg

 

post-3059-0-64532000-1541534209.jpg

 

Richard

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And a nice little model it is too.....I did add a few extra details as is my wont.

 

attachicon.gif1F a.jpg

 

attachicon.gif1F b.jpg

 

Richard

Wow! I'm also considering a Belpair 1F half cab with vac brake as my first kit so I'd be interested to know more about 41804 and how it was to build? Edited by w124bob

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Thanks for the pictures, especially the side view. I hope that I can get somewhere near that standard of build.

 

I was going to build the round top version but now, having seen those two images I'm not so sure. I just bought the kit because it was (a) a "Midland" loco, (b) because it seemed a reasonable price & © because I'd like to try my hand at building a loco kit.

 

I'm hoping to at least make a start on the coupling rods tomorrow, ready to take to club tomorrow evening.

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I have one of these in the "to do cupboard" so will be interested to watch your progress.

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If anyone has Belpaire parts going spare, I'd be interested. 

 

Cheers

 

John

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For those interested 41835 was never rebuilt and lasted to 1965, posted piccy here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/139187-1f-41835-never-rebuilt/&do=findComment&comment=3358019

Edit to add rebuilt with Belpair box around 1961! But for modellers thats still a big window of running in as built condition.

Edited by w124bob

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post-10059-0-31170500-1541793860.jpg

 

This is as far as I got last evening prior to going to the club. Etch pieces 3 & 4 have been soldered together from each fret as have 5 & 6 to give the two parts of each of the two overall coupling rod combinations. Pieces 7 & 8 (again from each fret) have just been removed from the fret and cleaned up.

 

And this is how the situation looks today having been guided by my colleague yesterday.

 

post-10059-0-01228800-1541793840.jpg

 

The single thickness end of each coupling rod component 3/4 & 5/6 will be overlaid - this is why pieces 4 & 6 are shorter than pieces 3 & 5 respectively.

 

It appears that the larger of the two small etch pieces - which is piece number 8 on the etch - should actually be separated into two pieces. This will provide a duplicate of piece number 7 - both it and piece number 7 are to be affixed to the outer ends of the two coupling rods - and the remaining larger piece is overlaid & soldered in the centre, the smaller hole in this piece being where the pin went through to connect the two coupling rod parts together on the actual locomotive - the middle image in post 5 above hopefully demonstrates this.

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I builtone of these locos in 7mm about ten years ago. Like you, I model in 4mm scale and this was my first attempt at 7mm modelling. I found it one of the easiest kits to build, everything fitted and I was very impressed with it. I did vear from the straight build by installing beam compensation, so had to be a bit careful with the coupling rods as to how I put them together. If I can find the photos I will post them

Derek

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The beauty of this kit is that you get enough etches to allow for a full or open cab.

I built mine as an open cab, then looking at the bits left over, built a second one as a closed cab. To build the second one meant fretting out a footplate and mainframes from nickel silver sheet, and rolling a boiler from the same sheet. both engines were provided with home made compensation and run very reliably.

They were actually built for my son and grandsons 0 gauge layout. the closed cab was finished in lined crimson lake. The open cab in plain black.

post-6110-0-12918800-1541869165_thumb.jpg

post-6110-0-05324600-1541869225_thumb.jpg

Edited by Mrkirtley800
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My apologies, sent the wrong pic and don't seem to  be able to delete it.  Here is the one I meant to send. sorry for the poor photography.

Derek

post-6110-0-08403900-1541869634_thumb.jpg

Edited by Mrkirtley800
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Thanks for the pictures. I know that I couldn't copy an original to make a duplicate. I have enough trouble doing that with slices of toast!

 

I've spent this afternoon finishing off the coupling rods and drilling the holes to suit the 2.5mm Slater's bearings

 

I have assembled the frames just using the two screwed spacers at the moment. I hope to get the wheels on tomorrow. Then I'll have something to take a picture of.

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I also should have said that when the kit was given to me as a birthday present, I was so unsure of myself, never having done anything in 7 mm. I contacted the proprietor of Mercian Models and he kindly sent me some spare etches to practise on. He really helped me to get started, but after that, no problem.

Derek

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Time for a slightly belated update.

 

post-10059-0-01377900-1542489892_thumb.jpg

 

The chassis went together quite easily although I'm a little puzzled over the two square brass frame spacers (and fixing countersunk screws) that are supplied - or I've completely mistaken their purpose. I fixed the two spacers in the only holes that I could see they would go and added the bearings, axles and wheels. The chassis free-wheeled nicely along my 2 yard long straight test track. I then added the end plates as can be seen in the above image but they were wider than the brass spacers and I could only keep the two frames parallel by loosening the screws on the brass spacers. Subsequently and because it was in the way of the "springing" that I have had it suggested that I could add, I replaced one of the spacers with a piece of code 75 rail cut to size and soldered to the inner faces of the two frames.

 

post-10059-0-37679300-1542489950_thumb.jpg

 

post-10059-0-67876900-1542489959_thumb.jpg

 

Spot the difference in the above two images!

 

I read the instructions for the kit when I opened the box and I've been re-reading/following them as I've gone along.

 

When it came time to assemble the coupling rods I looked at several photos that I've been sent/shown and decided which end of the frames was at the front of the loco. I made the coupling rods up accordingly - see the first image.

 

I'd opened the holes to 2.5mm and fitted both sides and the frame still rolled nicely.

 

For some reason I went looking at something else in the instructions and happened upon the drawing showing which way the motor should be fitted. Here I noticed that I'd assembled the coupling rods back to front. Much swearing ! ! !

 

I was slightly tempted to leave well alone but decided that wouldn't be right so I re-orientated the coupling rods with the aid of a 2.5mm drill slightly oiled so nothing would solder to it and pushed it in a hole on a piece of wood. I then slid the various parts of the rods over the drill, lined them up and re-soldered. The result is shown in the lower image.

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It looks to me like the holes you were using for the square framer spacers are actually for plunger pick-ups, as there is a hole near each axle, directly behind the wheel rim.

Edited by Fastdax

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I did think that might be the case but the holes align with the spokes not the back of the tyre/wheel rim such that I can tighten said securing screws by putting a screwdriver blade between the spokes.
 
There aren't any other holes as far as I can see through which the spacer securing screws will fit and its not the positioning that is puzzling so much as why the spacers themselves seem to be under length as can be seen in the first image in post 22.

 

I also can't think why the securing screws for the spacers are countersunk when the frame holes aren't and probably can't easily be.

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