All reserved seats?

[Reorte]

7 minutes ago, hayfield said:

No its not that you cannot travel if you have not booked days before, you can turn up and book a seat right up to departure, providing there is room on the  train, and we are talking long distance journeys. With most of us having access to apps or the internet, just log on and book the next available seat, of if you have decided to go the next day book the night before

"Most of us" doesn't include me, and the idea that I've got to carry around an expensive lump of electronics just to do things that I could do perfectly well before without one just makes me more contemptful of the idea. And in any case that assumes there is a seat to book. If there isn't then you're still in the same boat with or without your phone, if there is then there shouldn't be any need to book it.

[woodenhead]

The 'privatised' railways have sold us an idea of turning up at a station to find regular long distance trains to key locations, this idea from Virgin turns that on its head into no reservation no train and then they want to cancel the services in the middle of the day that aren't busy or make them runs as required where they will do their damnedest to make sure they don't have to run them.

 

The only reason to do this is to make more money and is nothing to do with crowded trains other than it makes for a nice smokescreen. 

[Zomboid]

1 hour ago, Reorte said:

"Most of us" doesn't include me, and the idea that I've got to carry around an expensive lump of electronics just to do things that I could do perfectly well before without one just makes me more contemptful of the idea. And in any case that assumes there is a seat to book. If there isn't then you're still in the same boat with or without your phone, if there is then there shouldn't be any need to book it.

If you choose not to take advantage of the facilities that modern tech provides then that's up to you, but that doesn't mean that it's not a useful tool for the majority.

 

Anyway, presumably if on departure seat reservations were to become a thing, you'd also be able to do it either by talking to a person at a large enough station or through the ticket machines.

[Reorte]

22 minutes ago, Zomboid said:

If you choose not to take advantage of the facilities that modern tech provides then that's up to you, but that doesn't mean that it's not a useful tool for the majority.

 

I question whether they're really anywhere near as useful as most people seem to believe (I'm getting ever more disillusioned adding more technology to everything) but that's beside the point. Add more options by all means. It's taking others away that I've got the problem with here. Good to have the option, not good to make it harder to not use it.

 

Quote

Anyway, presumably if on departure seat reservations were to become a thing, you'd also be able to do it either by talking to a person at a large enough station or through the ticket machines.

 

That's still trying to solve an artificially created problem, and doesn't address the point where if you have to change plans you may get stuck if they insist on reservations and there aren't any.

[Zomboid]

I don't think that making all long distance trains reservation only would be a good move, so I don't think we're disagreeing much here. I do think that having some services reservation only might have merit, provided any available seats on those trains can be reserved until just before departure - in which case there are many mechanisms to provide that service.

 

I've just come back from a holiday in Japan, and I found that having the internet (mainly Google maps, translate, Hyperdia and a vegetarian restaurant finder) in my pocket made life so much easier and enabled us to do a bunch of things that would have been much harder or even impossible without it...

[hayfield]

25 minutes ago, Reorte said:

 

I question whether they're really anywhere near as useful as most people seem to believe (I'm getting ever more disillusioned adding more technology to everything) but that's beside the point. Add more options by all means. It's taking others away that I've got the problem with here. Good to have the option, not good to make it harder to not use it.

 

 

That's still trying to solve an artificially created problem, and doesn't address the point where if you have to change plans you may get stuck if they insist on reservations and there aren't any.

 

In one way I do agree that many of the apps we have can be a massive distraction or time wasters

 

But there are many which are of great benefit, my heating turns itself off/down if both of us are away from the house and turns itself on as soon as we are close to the property,

 

Likewise our satnav on the phone shows traffic congestion and looks for an alternative route.

 

Now my phone is not an expensive lump of technology I think its well worth the modest monthly outlay, if I were a business traveller then an app for the railways would be a useful tool, especially if I wanted to alter my travel arrangements

 

Unlike the suburban trains and the tube, intercity trains tend not to accommodate standing travellers, there must be a reason.  As I said we are going to Italy by train and one of the reasons is its a nice leisurely way of going on holiday having a stop over both going and coming back, everyone has a seat on the intercity services, plus the space to easily find the buffet and toilets.  

[Reorte]

Well it looks like I've helped us go way off topic. Sorry!

 

It's not as if I'm unaware of what phones can do, I can do most of what they do anyway (make calls, look at the internet, I've driven cars with a satnav built in etc.), so I'm familiar enough with the functions to realise that most of the time I've no particular need or desire to have access to them when I'm out and about. I don't have a problem with just turning the heating on and off manually (and anything automatically keeping track of where I am - a big no thanks at all!) There are exceptions, such as the upthread mention of being in Japan, or for some jobs, where I can see a lot of use. On average there's about one occasion a year where I think it would be useful if I'd had one on me (was even less before most phone boxes closed). And entirely personally I find that sort of permanent connection to everything slightly disturbing.

 

Each to their own though, like I said if they simply add options that's all to the good, I might not see the benefits but if others do and I can't see any downsides either that's fine.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Reorte

[caradoc]

22 hours ago, woodenhead said:

Maybe what TOCs could do is better signpost the level of reserved seating on trains - I know they show currently the best coaches but it's not the most clear indicator and requires a bit of effort to translate.

 

What is they had an expected loading indicator against trains, something like 97% of standard class is reserved on the 1900 to Manchester but the 1920 is 75% loaded.  That would give people a better indication of which train they are more likely to find a seat on.

 

Not totally relevant as there are no reserved seats, but Scotrail do have posters up at stations on the Cathcart Circle (and possibly elsewhere) to advise passengers which trains are likely to be busy and which should have more space.

 

Regarding seat reservation levels, LNER's traffic light system (also to be adopted by Transpennine) is very clear and helpful when looking for a seat; Maybe it should be specified as standard for future franchise bids, where appropriate.

 

[woodenhead]

1 minute ago, caradoc said:

 

Not totally relevant as there are no reserved seats, but Scotrail do have posters up at stations on the Cathcart Circle (and possibly elsewhere) to advise passengers which trains are likely to be busy and which should have more space.

 

Regarding seat reservation levels, LNER's traffic light system (also to be adopted by Transpennine) is very clear and helpful when looking for a seat; Maybe it should be specified as standard for future franchise bids, where appropriate.

 

It's also on WCML services but it can look a little cramped when it's an 11 coach Pendolino - I think a single loading percentage is quicker to decipher if you want people to perhaps select another train at a large terminus like Euston.

 

 

[Reorte]

Not seen this traffic light thing - is that on the outside to help you find an empty (or at least slightly less busy) coach straight away, or something above the seats showing which ones are free?

[caradoc]

46 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Not seen this traffic light thing - is that on the outside to help you find an empty (or at least slightly less busy) coach straight away, or something above the seats showing which ones are free?

 

Its inside Reorte; Red shows seat reserved now, yellow is reserved later, green is free. The displays of where seats are reserved from and to are very clear too. You still have to be inside to see the displays of course !

[caradoc]

4 hours ago, woodenhead said:

The 'privatised' railways have sold us an idea of turning up at a station to find regular long distance trains to key locations, this idea from Virgin turns that on its head into no reservation no train and then they want to cancel the services in the middle of the day that aren't busy or make them runs as required where they will do their damnedest to make sure they don't have to run them.

 

The only reason to do this is to make more money and is nothing to do with crowded trains other than it makes for a nice smokescreen. 

 

If this proposal seriously involves cancelling trains on the day due to poor loadings, it shows even more how little whoever is behind this madcap scheme knows about railway operations. Virgin will have had to bid and pay for the path, and provide a set and crew to work the train. If they then cancel it, it counts against their performance figures, and leaves them short of a set, and possibly crew, at destination for the return working !

[david.hill64]

In an age where the amount of infrastructure limits what we can do, we are going to have to get used to demand pricing. It’s already present for rail travel and the idea of compulsory reservations for long distance travel ensuring that every traveller  has a seat would make for a more pleasant journey for those on the train. 

 

Smart meters will will mean you get charged more for power at peak times. Road pricing will do the same. 

 

The alternative, investment in new rail, new roads, new power generation would be better but results in howls of protest from those directly (or even indirectly) affected. 

 

No no easy answer. 

[Reorte]

Those sorts of choices are a choice of which way you want things to become worse, so I'm going to carry on saying "no thanks" to all of them no matter how often those pushing for the changes argue "we need to do something, this is something, therefore we need to do it." That there would be "howls of protest" tells you that an awful lot of people don't find those alternatives better.

Edited April 27, 2019 by Reorte