Hornby A4 60009 Union of South Africa

[TravisM]

I’m looking to buy a recent released Hornby model of A4 which I’d like to renumber as 60009 Union of South Africa.  I’m not prepared to pay the high prices for either the “Great Gathering” or “Great Goodbye” models, so I’ve got the nameplates, smoke box plates and Springboks which I’ll use to create the locomotive.

 

I know that it’s running with a corridor tender and I seem to remember reading that whilst in BR service, it didn’t and does it have a double chimney?  I would be grateful if somebody could recommend a suitable model?

[JamieR4489]

What era are you going for?

 

For the BR era, 60009 had a streamlined corridor tender until 1963 when it got a non streamlined corridor type. In 1966, it got another non streamlined corridor and this is what it tows now. The double chimney was fitted in 1958.

 

So your options are:

1949-52: I can't find a BR blue model with the right tender

1952-58: R2825 Commonwealth of Australia

1958-63: R2340 Golden Plover (would need OHLE flashes removing for pre 1961)

1963-present: R2535 Woodcock

[Wheatley]

The tenders aren't quite so easy but the Hornby A4 chimneys are separately fitted so can be swapped. 

[adb968008]

The tender its got in preservation isn’t an original A4 tender, its pedigree is much historic / appropriate..  its ex W1 Hush Hush, 10000, though how much of it is original is debatable.

Edited September 9, 2020 by adb968008

[TravisM]

1 hour ago, JamieR4489 said:

What era are you going for?

 

For the BR era, 60009 had a streamlined corridor tender until 1963 when it got a non streamlined corridor type. In 1966, it got another non streamlined corridor and this is what it tows now. The double chimney was fitted in 1958.

 

So your options are:

1949-52: I can't find a BR blue model with the right tender

1952-58: R2825 Commonwealth of Australia

1958-63: R2340 Golden Plover (would need OHLE flashes removing for pre 1961)

1963-present: R2535 Woodcock

I’m attempting to model it as it is now as you can see in the pictures I took at Peterborough in December 2018.  Can I assume that R2535 would be the closest match?  The tender maybe from the W1 but it’s a close match (In my opinion) and meets the 3 foot rule 

[TravisM]

Just had a quick look on Flickr and it seems that the Springbok badge on the boiler is only on one side, the left.  Has it always been like that?

Edited September 9, 2020 by jools1959

[JamieR4489]

50 minutes ago, jools1959 said:

I’m attempting to model it as it is now as you can see in the pictures I took at Peterborough in December 2018.  Can I assume that R2535 would be the closest match?  The tender maybe from the W1 but it’s a close match (In my opinion) and meets the 3 foot rule 

I was on that tour, a lovely day out.

 

Yes R2535 would be the best match. Although 60009’s tender is from the W1 I think when it was partially streamlined in 1937 it was modified so that it’s identical to an A4’s tender. The only difference AFAIK was that the tender had holes drilled in the buffer beam so that the instruments in the dynamometer car could be connected to the cab.

 

I think the springbok was always just on one side.

[G-BOAF]

I remember reading somewhere that the curve round of the platework at the front by the handrails is/was different on the W1 tender to the 1928 corridor tenders, but don't know if this is still the case today, as I think significant areas of the tender have been replaced (certainly at the NRM in 2012, the inside of Number 9s tender corridor appeared welded vs the clear riveting on nos 7 and 10, suggesting major platework replacement, but don't know if that was with BR or in preservation.

 

For 60009 in final BR years or preservation

yes R2535 Woodcock as highlighted

Also R2910 Dominion of Canada (commonwealth collection)
and R3008 Empire of India (commonwealth collection)

 

Both are double chimney, 1928 corridor tender models.

 

Now where to obtain any of these three is another and much more difficult question...

 

[The Black Hat]

20 hours ago, adb968008 said:

The tender its got in preservation isn’t an original A4 tender, its pedigree is much historic / appropriate..  its ex W1 Hush Hush, 10000, though how much of it is original is debatable.

 

Loads of it... someone on the end of a platform said Scotsman is too.... 

Edited September 10, 2020 by The Black Hat

[G-BOAF]

1 hour ago, The Black Hat said:

 

Loads of it... someone on the end of a platform said Scotsman is too.... 

I would say the underframe is 100% original, barring any minor platwork and component replacement.

Below picture from 2013 of one of the afforementioned holes in the bufferbeam platwork, where test cables to the Dynamometer car were run for the W1.

See further into bottom of this page (Tender 5484) on SNG website

https://www.sirnigelgresley.org.uk/chime-archive/mob-tenders1.shtml

 

I can't find a detailed enough picture of the rear of 10000 that would show the same hole in 1929/early 1930s. But if anyone has access to one, please share!

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by G-BOAF

[adb968008]

Rather than drill a hole, you’d have thought clamping a pipe under around might have been easier ? Or am I being over simplistic ?

 

At least it proves the bit that is missing, is original... (ie the hole) 

 

fyi 60008 has a GNR axle box cover too, just an interesting off topic.

Edited September 11, 2020 by adb968008

[Steamport Southport]

Might be of use.

 

http://www.ten.rhrp.org.uk/tens/TenderInfo.asp?Ref=180

 

Loads of info on preserved and scrapped tenders on that website.

 

 

Jason