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gordon s

Eastwood Town - Whatever became of Newton Heath LYR?

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Going back to Post #1 (3rd picture) you showed a partial underboard view of your support legs which do not appear to be linked to each other nor cross-braced. How did you avoid wobble or swaying of these legs on an open frame board construction?.

 

An impressive layout in the making! icon_clap.gif

 

 

Thanks DonB. As you can see the spiral is a somewhat unusual construction. These very narrow boards sit under and behind the main scenic boards and I came up with this idea to make access as easy as possible. The open plan boards are in essence made up as I beams and with side rails on both sides of the track bed, they make a very rigid and flat track bed. The double track bed is 130mm wide and the single as used in the reverse loop, just 80mm wide. As you can imagine these would be very unstable so the legs were designed as a T shape with a 300mm cross bar made from 50 x 50, which is drilled to accept two adjustable feet. The legs sit inside the side supports and the track bed is screwed into 50 x 50 blocks with three screws. Although it is more stable at this point, it is not until several of the I beams are screwed together, does it become one rigid loop.

 

Of course the legs can move slightly from side to side if singled out, but once all the adjustments have been made to ensure both feet are firmly in touch with the floor, the whole thing sits well and as yet, no problems have been encountered at all.

 

Hopefully these pics will help.

 

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For those of you that have followed this thread, you will know that I managed to purchase a set of ECML buildings from Great Northern who was breaking up his Peterborough layout. Having been build by Alan Downes, they would be ideal for my layout, other than they are of brick construction and I have used stone walls for the tunnel areas I have built so far. This won't be such an issue with the main terminus board as that will only use the Downes buildings and it sufficiently far away, so as not to cause a massive contrast. If anyone asks, I can always say the original line was build many years before and used local stone. As this became more difficult to source and subsequently far more expensive, the operating company chose to build the new teminus buildings and surrounds used conventional brickwork......icon_wink.gif

 

These really are lovely buildings but some will need some weathering to dull them down a little and as I said they won't prove such an issue where they are all grouped together. The tunnel area of the layout was crying out for a signal box and just standing one at ground level, didn't work at all. The height of the walls and the use of 7mm stone, just dwarfed the box and made it look far too small. There wasn't room to position it higher up, so I thought I would try and build a plinth for the box to sit on and see how that looked. I'm still undecided and if all else fails, I'll hunt around or try and scratchbuild a stone one.

 

Were there areas where stone and brick came together or is it just wishful thinking on my part?

 

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For what it's worth Gordon I think that really looks the part. You've made a cracking job of the base, don't second guess yourself, it would be a shame not to include that. What with this layout, Cramdin and Mangarth three of the Go5 are producing layouts which anybody on this forum would be proud of - well done!

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looking good.

 

love the ballasting.....an inspiration.

 

scott

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There wasn't room to position it higher up, so I thought I would try and build a plinth for the box to sit on and see how that looked. I'm still undecided and if all else fails, I'll hunt around or try and scratchbuild a stone one.

Hi Gordon,

 

I think a stone-built signal box would be a bit unlikely in such a situation. Brick is fine, but surely if the sighting requirements needed a tall box, that is what would have been built -- a tall box all in brick set in close against the stone wall. That stone plinth looks wrong, especially in similar age/colouring to the walls and with the steps at the wrong end for the box. At the time the original stone walls were built the signalling would have consisted of a man on a shaky wooden platform waving a flag. :) Centralized signal boxes with interlocked lever frames came later, and wouldn't have been designed into the original stoneworks.

 

If you leave the platform as-is, at the very least it will need some heavy modification to allow the rodding runs down the vertical face, and colouring to indicate a later construction.

 

regards,

 

Martin.

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Hi Gordon,

 

I think a stone-built signal box would be a bit unlikely in such a situation. Brick is fine, but surely if the sighting requirements needed a tall box, that is what would have been built -- a tall box all in brick set in close against the stone wall. That stone plinth looks wrong, especially in similar age/colouring to the walls and with the steps at the wrong end for the box.

 

Yup, I'm afraid I agree with Martin, the stone plinth just looks wrong. Save that lovely box for somewhere else, and build a custom brick structure to fit, that is if your railway really needs one there. ;)

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Thanks Martin for your constructive comments. I really appreciate them as you have raised some valid points that wouldn't (and didn't...) occur to me. It's great to get another viewpoint and will give it some thought as to how I can improve things. I guess that's the difference between a train set and a model railway....

 

Right now, this could go either way....icon_winker.gif

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Hi Gordon,

 

I found this while browsing RMweb and thought of you: :) http://www.flickr.co...57622970345171/

 

The walls of the cutting are brick, not stone. But just over the near parapet is the roof of what I think may be a signal box, dwarfed by the surrounding walls.

 

regards,

 

Martin.

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Flippin Eck Gordon........I don't know whether I get more motivated or demoralised when I look at your latest achievements, how am I ever expected to get this level. Kidding apart though.....that is just brilliant Gordon, cant wait to see it in the flesh maybe later this year.

Bob

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Hi Gordon,

 

I found this while browsing RMweb and thought of you: :) http://www.flickr.co...57622970345171/

 

The walls of the cutting are brick, not stone. But just over the near parapet is the roof of what I think may be a signal box, dwarfed by the surrounding walls.

 

regards,

 

Martin.

 

That's Weekday Cross Jn on the GC just south of Nottm Vic. If I recall, the signalbox was in the "V" of the junction with a brick base and wooden upper section. What we see is probably a pw hut.

 

I think the signalbox fits in quite well, but I'd turn it around - I presume it only controls the two higher-level lines. It would also line up better with the approach steps set in the stonework.

 

I'd have another signalbox controlling the low-level tracks.

 

Peter

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That's a great picture Martin. Atmosphere by the bucket load....icon_thumbsup2.gif

 

The box is there to cover both the lower level junction and a high level junction that is yet to be built. I've made a few changes to the front to add some trunking for point rodding and added a coal store and store shed to the back. A bit more weathering and it looks a lot better, although I accept it's probably not prototypical.

 

In the end it was always going to be a compromise as to make major changes would have been more difficult. Thanks for your input guys. It was really useful and I'll certainly bear it in mind as the layout progresses.

 

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Gordon,

Don't worry about the inter-relation of stone walling and other railway structures. For example Sheff Mid had stone retaining walls but standard MR wooden signalboxes. Lots of other examples.

 

You appear to be modelling the GN/LNER/ER, so as long as those railway buildings are typical of those designs, which your signalbox obviously is, then it's fine.

 

Peter

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When can we see some videos Gordon ?

 

Very excited by this...!

 

JB.

 

You and me both.!!!!!!! Cant wait.

Bob

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Hi Gordon S,

 

excellent work, look forward to seeing more & maybe video sometime.

 

Mark

from downunder

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Sadly video footage will be a month or two away. I have to start on the next scenic board and once that is complete, the spiral will be joined to the main junction board that you have seen. That will at least allow trains to pass through the finished section without falling off onto the floor.

 

I'm also waiting for a plumber to move our central heating pump, which is located behind the spiral. At present it can be reached quite easily, but another month or two and replacement will turn into an SAS exercise and the thought of having to dismantle the spiral to allow access was keeping me awake at night....

 

There will certainly be more updates to follow, so bear with me.

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The last few weeks have given time to reflect on the plan for Eastwood Terminus and I recognised some shortcomings with the current plan. Although a large MPD, it was pushed away into a corner which would not have been easily accessible and the combination of 4-6-2 locos and a succession of pointwork to be encountered was perhaps asking for trouble. Add to that the issues of potentially dirty track and pick ups and the odd prod would have to be done with a six foot length of wood. Not quite the hand of God, but just as bad. My other thought was that steam locos are a thing of beauty and I want to see mine, not just gaze from afar.

 

So numerous evenings have been spent looking at alternatives and eventually I have managed to create something I am reasonably happy with. It does mean a peninsular board intruding into the central area but with a minimum of 2'6" clearance all round, I don't believe it will be a huge issue. You can access this area from three sides and no duck unders are required.

 

Here's the track plan which was developed over several evenings, which provides a four road shed, coaling stage and turntable. The flow chart would be on shed, then coaling and finally the option of the turntable before returning to the terminus. I accept it is some way from the terminus proper but then so was Kings Cross and this hobby is often about compromises.

 

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This has allowed me to also redesign the terminus itself, adding a further platform and lengthening the platforms to 10'. This is still a work in progress as the area freed up by the MPD will now become a residential or industrial area, still to be decided. I also have to add a small diesel refuelling area and possible two road shed plus release pointwork from the platform roads. I have retained the goods relief road which has yet to be added to the plan. Access to this will probably be via a third track some way back down the gradient towards the steam MPD.

 

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One of the real benefits of Templot is the ability to see what something may look like in full size, so I have printed off the MPD on A4 sheets and patiently stuck them together. Once laid out on the floor and with a few buildings placed, you can get a real feel for this new board. I'll leave it in place for a few days and adjust various bits and pieces if required before cutting any wood and building the track. With the Eastwood Junction board now in place and construction wise, virtually complete, the MPD board will form one of the next few boards around the loop.

 

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Inspiring pictures ;)

Very impressive and it makes me even more determined to crack Templot...

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Inspiring pictures wink.gif

Very impressive and it makes me even more determined to crack Templot...

 

Happy to help out with Templot. I struggled at the beginning, (my failing not the software), until I learned some very basic commands and then it all fell into place. I use it exclusively for my train set and can certainly help with the basics, but can't help re protypical use. Mind you there are plenty of users on here that can....

 

I have compiled some very basic Jing videos to help a few people. They really only cover the basics, but if you are struggling, let me know.

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Hello Gordon,

I just think the whole think looks superb,I had been lucky enough to see the buildings in situ on Peterborough and they are going to look just as good on your layout. The whole area around the tunnels just yells out "Kings Cross Approach" and so OK to the purist there may some technical errors,but for me and I would guess a great many other people that Signal Box area is the DOGS.

I do hope to meet you at Ally Pally at the BRM Show,there can't be that many people of your height so I have a far chance of spotting you.

Kind Regards,Derek.

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Had a note from Phil H who gave some valuable input about possible improvents to the shed layout, with particular reference to access to the coaler and returning on shed. After much head scratching and hair pulling, I've managed to redesign the flow and still maintain a minimum 36" radius, by moving the coaler south to occupy the two lines at 10 o'clock to the turntable. The line closest to the turntable is used for coal wagons to supply the loader and the second line for loco's. Adding an additional turntable road now means loco's can either return to shed after coaling or take the new turntable road before returning to the main line.

 

Loco's hauling coal wagons now have a similar choice via a new release crossover below the shed access. This new layout certainly gives further operational potential and removes possible bottlenecks. Next stage will be to print another set of sheets to see how it stacks together with buildings in place.

 

Thanks Phil for your input. Much appreciated. Of course at this stage it's much easier to spend a few hours tweaking a plan than waste time and money later on.

 

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Hi Gordon,

 

Looking good. :icon_thumbsup2:

 

Do these track ends need to be curved? The design would look much less cramped if they can straighten out, and it wouldn't take up much extra space:

 

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regards,

 

Martin.

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They don't need to be Martin, other than the edge of the board is the grid line to the right of the turntable and I was playing around with low relief buildings on that edge (see previous pics). I have left 2'6" clearance all round the peninsular so widening it out will impinge on that space. Same with the length.

 

I agree it does look less cramped and it is certainly a possibility. I'll take another look and see what can be done without compromising the gangway space too much.

 

It's great to have input at this stage before too much is done....icon_thumbsup2.gif

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They don't need to be Martin, other than the edge of the board is the grid line to the right of the turntable and I was playing around with low relief buildings on that edge (see previous pics).

Hi Gordon,

 

You can keep within that grid line by moving the turnout a bit further back, see below. The original design had sharply curved track against the buffer stops, which never looks quite right. Few railway lands are made up of neat rectangles, so it usually looks better to avoid having features parallel to the baseboard edges -- I would angle the shed a fraction too. :)

 

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regards,

 

Martin.

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