RMweb Gold Scottish Modeller Posted December 3, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 3, 2011 Hi all, The fit of the gears makes a big difference. For example... Why have idler gears that are tight on the idler shaft? This is the main cause for the idler gears splitting (and something I told Peter Farish about a long time ago). I slightly open out the idler gear so that is runs loose on the idler shaft - this alone is enough to stop it splitting. The gears on the drive axles are more of a problem. Opening out the hole won't work as you lose all traction. I'd love to be able to provide an answer to that one - but I can't. Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Dear all this gear issue has been around since the early Farish locos and Bachmann although are not all 100% are much better as they are a wider gear so less likley to split. To be hoonest don't waste time cutting drilling and sanding the axles smooth this will cause issues like slippage latter one the axles at this time are only £2.60 it's not really worth the bother just change them for new ones. I hope this helps. Thanks Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium richierich Posted November 13, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 13, 2012 I've 66s, 57s with split gears on the wheel set axles, and an intermediate gear train gear on a 57, 66 & 150 crack and fail in recent times. The recent article on the N Gauge Society web site suggests its not gone away:- http://www.ngaugesoc...t01returnid=171 http://www.ngaugesoc...age=split-gears The suggestion of reaming the gear, so the interference fit is not putting the gear under so much stress is an interesting thought. I wish Bachmann would take some action to resolve this issue, because I always have a reservation in my mind when buying a new loco or DMU, about whether this issue will manifest itself. Its not a cheap issue at 15 quid to replace all six wheelsets on a Co-Co loco, with no guarantee this won't happen again! Its such a shame because British N gauge in the last 4-5 years has come on leaps and bounds, and its now a real alternative to OO, for a space constrained modeller. If within the 1:76 camp, geartrain gears where failing, I'm sure it would resolved rather quickly! Its probably a reason why I keep a foot in the 1:76 camp Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les1952 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 I've had my share of split gears, including a new Bachmann SD45 when they first came out some years ago. The most recent UK outline were a class 20 and a Poole DMU chassis under an LNER railcar. However I HAVE had split gears on both Atlas (a Kato-made RS11) and Life-Like (a C-420) so these "superior" makes aren't immune. Currently I have an Arnold Kof and a Weismar railbus, each with a split gear, awaiting cross-cannibalisation so the "pig's nose" can take up duties on Furtwangen Ost. It is not, repeat NOT just a Bachmann problem......... All the very best Les Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Al Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 The split gear issue is much reduced over Poole diesel days by a long long way. Very few split, and it seems specific batches of models that are mainly affected - e.g. Virgin 57s, 66135 and a few others. It's nothing like the epidemic that happened with the Poole models. Though one problem is that geared wheelsets don't fit most of the new tool models (e.g. 57,47,37,24,20,66) as their wheel diameter is correct as compared the older models. The 66 has similar wheels but not identical either. However, you can still just change the gears on the original wheelsets which is what I've always done (on Poole, Bachfar production of Poole models and Bachfar new tool models like 57 and D1500 class 47 etc) and is far cheaper than replacing the full wheelset and maintains the original consistent set of wheels in a loco. The gears are still the same 16 tooth with the same pitch and diameter, so standard spares are a direct replacement. One thing you need to watch on old style Poole models if you do change the wheelsets is that the HST,20,25,31,37,40.47.50,52,55,87,90,91 all use the larger diameter wheels (still small compared to New-tool) and only the 158,159,170,101 and class 56 use the smaller diameter ones. I've seen the smaller diameter ones advertised mistakenly as being correct for the HST, most notably by Peter's Spares on Ebay. So just be sure when ordering!! Best regards, Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vonzack Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Very few split, and it seems specific batches of models that are mainly affected - e.g. Virgin 57s, 66135 and a few others. It's nothing like the epidemic that happened with the Poole models. No kidding, brand new Farish 57 (371-650 Virgin 'Scott Tracy'), running really noisy with a definate tick and a tell tale hesitation when crawling. To add insult to injury, one of the cab windscreens had been pushed in / not installed correctly. Not a happy camper X-( Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Al Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 No kidding, brand new Farish 57 (371-650 Virgin 'Scott Tracy'), running really noisy with a definate tick and a tell tale hesitation when crawling. I've replaced at lease 3 out of the 6 axle gears on my Virgin 57 now. Cheers, Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium richierich Posted November 14, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 14, 2012 Same on my 57 601 Purple Ronnie. Metal gears would be the solution, but expensive . . . . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Robert Shrives Posted November 20, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 20, 2012 Hi BR Lines now have in stock the 66 style wheelsets - having repraired a Shanks 66 - this also had a split/damaged top gear- mashed by worm ! Bob advised that this geat is not the same as farish production with differing gear pitch and notes if you replace with old gear then it will fail! I repaired a "modern" older Poole 37 699 in coal livery and all axles split but chassis very oily as well. Recently fitted a stack of 12 tooth ilders to dmu/ railcar sets - sourced with brass axle from Matt Richter in Bridgwater robert Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium richierich Posted March 23, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 23, 2013 Just had another 66 wheelset gear on 66701 fail. . . . For me its a real disappointment for N Gauge, especially when the detail and accuracy is so good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfsboy Posted March 23, 2013 Share Posted March 23, 2013 Some of the On30 Bachmann have a similar problem .It causes endless frustration . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium richierich Posted March 24, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24, 2013 A solution for those who are in the 2mm association? http://www.2mm.org.uk/products/drop-in-wheels.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jbqfc Posted March 24, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24, 2013 have farish change the size of some of there gears as I have a HST split chassis type with split gears on two wheels got some spares from peters spares blackened type they look the same but the gears will not mesh and jam thanks john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair Modeller Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 There are wheelsets specifically for HSTs - see http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GRAHAM-FARISH-Bachmann-CLASS-158-HST-125-WHEELS-NEW-/310254924776?pt=UK_Trains_Railway_Models&hash=item483ca273e8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Al Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Those wheelsets are wrongly listed as correct for HSTs. They aren't - they are smaller diameter and incorrect. You want to use the standard diameter replacement wheels. Regards, Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-dereham Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Can I ask how easy it is to replace the whole wheelset on the Farish 66 as I have one that's slipping? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Quite easy. Remove the bogie from the loco, unclip the outer frame with a screwdriver at one end (remembering to catch the coupling which will spring out at this point) and any of the wheelsets can be removed from the inner part of the bogie. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-dereham Posted May 12, 2013 Share Posted May 12, 2013 Thanks Edwin_m Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR460 Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 It's amazing such poor engineering can persist for decades. Thing is the 80s gears made slightly differently did not seem to suffer as bad and ran much better. Particularly the white nylon gear versions why don't they stick with them. Or better still brass Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Al Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 It's amazing such poor engineering can persist for decades. Thing is the 80s gears made slightly differently did not seem to suffer as bad and ran much better. Particularly the white nylon gear versions why don't they stick with them. Or better still brass The white nylon was better, but not perfect. As those aged and became well used the corners could start breaking off the tips of the teeth. I have seen a couple of these split too. I wouldn't say they ran any better, just much less prone to splitting - and this is mainly the fitting rather than the gear - any gear will split if the push fit is too tight (which it was for the black gears). The black gears don't split if fitted correctly... Brass is terrible, and Farish knew this which is why they switched from it. Brass on brass wears incredibly badly, particularly worm gears which are shaved away rapidly by their intermediate brass gears. This is why there are so many failed early motor bogies about, and many early farish steam locos with no drive - the worms wear, and sometimes then jam up the whole lot seizing it solid, and then resulting in overheating, melted bearings and in the worst cases burnt out armatures. We should not go back to brass! Solution is the correct fitting of the current gears. Cheers, Alan Cheers, Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy L S Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Agreed Alan, Brass on brass is no solution, It is a recipie for excessive wear of the worm and why you will rarely find it. Brass worm on to decent plastic/nylon gears is much better. Roy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oreamnos Posted June 29, 2013 Author Share Posted June 29, 2013 BachFar Class 40, BR blue, purchased new less than two months ago from Hattons. Less that two hours of use during those months, most of it during running-in. Put on the track tonight and... split gear. Easy to replace but please! Come on, Bachmann! Photo attached. Matt Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium richierich Posted March 25, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2014 Saturday evening got my Farish 150/1 set out and guess what, clunk, clunk, clunk… you guessed it another cracked gear on the wheelset. The annoying thing is, it damages the teeth on the 24t gear that the worm gear meshes with! I'm considering removing the gear from the replacement wheelset once sourced. Remming out the gear so it's not a interference firm then sliding it back on the axle and securing with a dab of superglue. At least the gear won't be under stress of an interference fit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim H Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 One Warship (so far). That loco is now running on three powered axles pending replacement Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Got a 40 with a wheel off, expecting some news from Farish so in no hurry to replace the wheel and it's been passed by the fitters to operate as a 1-Co-Bo-1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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