Franchise shortlists announced

[Talltim]

http://www.dft.gov.u...press-20120329/

The firms bidding to take over the franchises have been chosen following a pre-qualification process.

Bidders for Great Western franchise:

 

First Great Western Trains Limited (FirstGroup plc)

GW Trains Limited (Arriva UK Trains Limited – DB (UK) Investments Limited)

NXGW Trains Limited (National Express Group PLC)

Stagecoach Great Western Trains Limited (Stagecoach Group plc)

 

These potential providers will receive the Invitation to Tender which is anticipated will be issued in May 2012. It is anticipated that the successful bidder will be announced in December 2012, with the contract commencing in April 2013. The length of the franchise term will be 15 years.

Bidders for Essex Thameside franchise:

 

Abellio Essex Thameside Limited (NV Nederlandse Spoorwegen)

First Essex Thameside Limited (FirstGroup plc)

MTR Corporation (Essex Thameside) Limited (MTR Corporation Limited)

NXET Trains Limited (National Express Group PLC)

 

These potential providers will receive the Invitation to Tender which is anticipated will be issued in June 2012. It is anticipated the successful bidder will be announced in January 2013, with the contract commencing in May 2013. The length of the franchise term will be 15 years.

Bidders for Thameslink franchise:

 

Abellio Thameslink Limited (NV Nederlandse Spoorwegen)

First Thameslink Limited (FirstGroup plc)

Govia Thameslink Railway Limited (Go-Ahead Group plc and Keolis SA)

MTR Corporation (Thameslink) Limited (MTR Corporation Limited)

Stagecoach Thameslink Trains Limited (Stagecoach Group plc)

 

These potential providers will receive the Invitation to Tender which is anticipated will be issued in October 2012. It is anticipated that the successful bidder will be announced in May 2013, with the contract commencing in September 2013. The length of the franchise will be a minimum of 7 years, with pricing also required for a potential extension of up to 2 years at the discretion of the Secretary of State.

[Armchair Modeller]

Why is the Thameslink franchise period so short?

[Bon Accord]

I find it odd that the DfT continue to allow NatEx to bid for franchises after the dummy spitting episode over East Coast - there should be consequences for abandoning a franchise and leaving the state to pick up the pieces simply because they decided it wasn't making enough money.

[Talltim]

And Arriva are curently in breach of their XC franchise agreement due to failure to roll out wifi

[Burkitt]

The short Thameslink franchise is odd, because it would appear to cover the introduction of the new trains in one livery, then end potentially leaving them all brand new and already in the wrong colours. But the end of the franchise is a couple of years after Crossrail opens, so perhaps it will then be merged with it under TfL control.

[Ron Ron Ron]

Just a thought.....DB (in the guise of Arriva) would be reforming the bulk of the old Western Region, or what's left of the GWR (GW, ATW & Chiltern).

 

I wonder what the chances are of Govia taking on the Thameslink franchise, given the DafT's announcement that they intend to eventually merge this franchise with the South Central franchise?

Then there's Govia's SouthEastern Trains franchise too !

In some respects it makes some sense, with the expanded Thameslink network extending out into Southern and SET territory.

 

The short franchise period for Thameslink has been discussed before.

Up to now 7 years has been the norm for most franchises, but this time it is designed to fit in with future changes that may lead to a merger of franchises and/or the transfer of some of the South London network to TfL.

[Glorious NSE]

Why is the Thameslink franchise period so short?

 

I think it's to keep all the disruption from Thameslink 2000 - introducing brand new trains, expanding the routes served, coping with the rebuild of London Bridge etc within this franchise and then re-let it as an 'easy' one afterwards.

 

Not a job i'd relish personally!

[Glorious NSE]

Just a thought.....DB (in the guise of Arriva) would be reforming the bulk of the old Western Region, or what's left of the GWR (GW, ATW & Chiltern).

 

Plus various Cross Country services too...

 

I wonder what the chances are of Govia taking on the Thameslink franchise, given the DafT's announcement that they intend to eventually merge this franchise with the South Central franchise?

Then there's Govia's SouthEastern Trains franchise too !

In some respects it makes some sense, with the expanded Thameslink network extending out into Southern and SET territory.

 

Interesting concept - with C2C/Greater anglia getting merged too it's not unbelievable....

 

Personally i'm hoping First holds on to Greater Western, and I never thought i'd be saying that even 5 years ago!

[Kris]

I find it odd that the DfT continue to allow NatEx to bid for franchises after the dummy spitting episode over East Coast - there should be consequences for abandoning a franchise and leaving the state to pick up the pieces simply because they decided it wasn't making enough money.

 

Should Stagecoach not be excluded as well given their previous record.

 

Like Martyn I also hope that First keep the Great Western franchise. They haven't always been good, and at times in the past they have been appalling but recently they have got their act together and the service is now good.

[lmsforever]

Having spent a few days sampling FGW I hope they keep the franchise as they provided on time trains and clean ones to, also the staff are excellent they checked all tickets after each stop all done with a smile and displayed good customer care something certain other franchises dont do.

[phil-b259]

Why is the Thameslink franchise period so short?

 

Because it is intended to cover the final phase of the Thameslink 2000 programme. Basically after 2018, what is currently Southern, FCC (Thameslink) and FCC (Great Northern), not forgetting some South Eastern services will all be combined in one super franchise. This combined franchise will then (assuming government policy remains unchanged) be offered on a long franchise like the other opperattions talked about in this thread. In the meantime however whoever takes over the Thameslink franchise has the unenviable job of intoducing a brand new fleet of trains the design of which still has to be finalised as well as coping with the complete rebuilding London Bridge station which will cause signifficant disruption for several years. Thus the short franchise is basically a contract job to keep things ticking over and hopefull avoid anoying passengers too much as the scheme advances.

[Ron Ron Ron]

Should Stagecoach not be excluded as well given their previous record.

 

Their previous record appears to be good.

They've retained the SW franchise after successfully improving the service there, although the constrains they now have to operate under have meant drastic cost cutting and a shortage of long distance train stock.

Their half share in Virgin West Coast seems to be doing alright, with that TOC recently lauded for good service.

Admittedly, they appear to have a battle on their hands with the MML franchise, which came with the Dog end of the old Central Trains network tagged on. With no suitable stock available and the DafT pulling all the strings, it looks at best a "just get by" situation.

 

 

.

[John M Upton]

Working for Southern and on target to be merged into 'Greater Thameslink' from July 2015, needless to say I am taking a very keen interest in how this turns out.

 

My rating on the runners and riders for Greater Thameslink in alphabetical order:

 

Abellio:

They seem to have done well with the Northern franchise and made the best of the motley collection of second hand cast offs that the DfT have insisted they use, not helped by being forced to take part in the seemingly endless DfT sponsored game of Musical DMU's. I have been impressed with what I have seen of them thus far, their bus operations in London (taken over from NatEx) are certainly improved in terms of presentation and appearance of vehicles etc.

 

Worth an each way bet - 12 to 1

 

First Thameslink:

Current holders of the Thameslink franchise and in my opinion only bidding because of that. Universally hated by commuters, passengers and pretty much everyone else, firmly nailed to the bottom of customer satisfaction survey and often give the public image of a company descending into an utter shambles. The completely trashed and graffiti wrecked state of their 319's both internally and externally shows (in my opinion) all the signs of a company that has given up and been told they won't be getting any renewal. First Group will get Great Western (on which much pulling up of socks seems to be taking place) to keep them happy.

 

Outsiders at 30 to 1.

 

Govia (Go-Ahead Group plc and Keolis SA):

Current holders of Southern and South Eastern (along with London Midland). Southern in paticular has a very strong brand image and has to cope with some of the most intensive and busiest commuter lines in the country (so many services run between Brighton and London during the peak you could almost walk from one end to the other without getting off a train). Knowing the way the Government likes to keep a fairly even spread in franchise allocation, they will take into account that as of July 2015 Govia will have had a franchise taken away (Southen) and lost chunks of another one (South Eastern, some routes being transferred to 'Greater Thameslink' from 2014).

 

Favourites at 4 to 1.

 

MTR Corporation:

Operators of London Overground and experienced with intensive urban transport networks worldwide. I don't think they will get this franchise but expect them as London Overground to take over the London metro routes of both the Great Northern and Southern areas of 'Greater Thameslink' before 2020 which works out nicely as that is when most of the stock (455's, 313's etc) is due for replacement presumably with a fresh batch of 378's.

 

Middle of the field at 12 to 1.

 

Stagecoach:

Seem to have done very well with South West Trains and expereince with a large Siemens Desiro fleet. Would certainly do a better job than FCC (who wouldn't?) but the question is will the DfT take the risk as they and Stagecoach have clashed in the past. I have a feeling though...

 

Second favourites at 7 to 1.

 

 

Of course the plans for merger and remerger along the length of the franchise will no doubt change as the DfT changes it mind every other week it seems. Also there is the ongoing issue of what on earth is happening with the new rolling stock order for the Thameslink core services. Seems to have ground to a halt, getting increasingly late. At the rate things are going, Greater Thameslink will have a nice shiny new rolling stock depot at 73C (Three Bridges) and no trains to put in it!!

 

There is also the issue with the alleged efficiencies from merging what is in effect three and a quarter franchises (Southern, Thameslink core, Great Northern and bits of South Eastern) into one as the new Thameslink core services will eventually be run with Siemens stock, south of the river it is all Bombadier Electrostars and north of the river it is a mix and match of 1980's BR stock with additional odds and sods, all of which are not in any way compatible with each other so in effect the new franchise will have to be operated as three seperate operations under the one banner, ripe for another Government in ten years time to break it down into smaller franchises again if (when) they change their mind.

 

All of the above mine and my opinion alone...