kevblokey Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Indeed so, there's no artists impression of the PB, but in the meantime... Other announcements from Oxford with a railway theme include: 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andye Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 I like the commer PB - I have found a couple on flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigerman20/6264694970/in/faves-90163850@N02/ from the road vehicles group http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnmightycat/5965525300/in/faves-90163850@N02/ this one is the later dodge space van minibus Does any one have any more pics of these, or the later spacevan? Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merfyn Jones Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 I like the commer PB - I have found a couple on flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/tigerman20/6264694970/in/faves-90163850@N02/ from the road vehicles group http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnmightycat/5965525300/in/faves-90163850@N02/ this one is the later dodge space van minibus Does any one have any more pics of these, or the later spacevan? Andy Most of the Commer PBs I have seen in pictures were of the later Spacevan type with the black plastic grille. I think the Reddish one, URC S is one. Very few of the earlier ones have come to light. Hard to tell which type Oxford are doing from the artist's impression. I have a feeling they may do both front styles (hope so) Merf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) The outline draing has the raised stand for the side lights (stack of two, so not the early version) so must be before the plastic grille as that incorporated them within it. http://www.flickr.com/photos/7430965@N05/6089351570/ Edited January 28, 2013 by BernardTPM Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) apologies if seen before, but a nice Bedford Workabus http://www.leedsmrs.org/jpegs/Gallery/AlanSmith/HL/Healey Mills CCE dormobile 1963-4.jpg just being written by the look of it. My first vehicle was a Workabus, dreadful rust bucket incapable of going above 55mph going down hill, but wonderful fun, it was possible to get an awful lot of students in it! The sliding doors could be held open, so chatting to passing pedestrians was interesting. Paul Bartlett Edited January 29, 2013 by hmrspaul 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcb 3c Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Fascinating photo of the Bedford , is it being sign written ? assumed this would be done in a workshop. Nice to see a model of the Commer PB , very common on the streets especially as telephone vans and then the same vans sold off were seen long after production ceased with builders etc. But not a van I would associate much with BR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merfyn Jones Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 apologies if seen before, but a nice Bedford Workabus http://www.leedsmrs.org/jpegs/Gallery/AlanSmith/HL/Healey Mills CCE dormobile 1963-4.jpg just being written by the look of it. My first vehicle was a Workabus, dreadful rust bucket incapable of going above 55mph going down hill, but wonderful fun, it was possible to get an awful lot of students in it! The sliding doors could be held open, so chatting to passing pedestrians was interesting. Paul Bartlett Super photo Paul. I had not seen it before. You can just see the first part of the fleet number, so EWY x1xx , the E being a prefix for the engineers vehicles but not always carried. New in May 1961, a Bedford CALV (long van) Very odd being lettered outside ! I thought they were transfers, so maybe accident patching up ? Merf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merfyn Jones Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Fascinating photo of the Bedford , is it being sign written ? assumed this would be done in a workshop. Nice to see a model of the Commer PB , very common on the streets especially as telephone vans and then the same vans sold off were seen long after production ceased with builders etc. But not a van I would associate much with BR. There seemed to be a lot in Yorkshire, particularly Doncaster. A bit thin on the ground elsewhere. We had one when I started in 78, but it was soon replaced, so a few on the Midland Region. Merf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Super photo Paul. I had not seen it before. You can just see the first part of the fleet number, so EWY x1xx , the E being a prefix for the engineers vehicles but not always carried. New in May 1961, a Bedford CALV (long van) Very odd being lettered outside ! I thought they were transfers, so maybe accident patching up ? Merf. why I called it a Workobus was that it has side windows. In the commercial version these had a pair of long benches either side and were aimed at the market for cheap personnel transport for, as a commn example, building site workers. I believe they were all on the long wheelbase chassis. Interesting how a concept such as "dormobile" gets corrupted as in the caption. Paul Bartlett Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merfyn Jones Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) why I called it a Workobus was that it has side windows. In the commercial version these had a pair of long benches either side and were aimed at the market for cheap personnel transport for, as a commn example, building site workers. I believe they were all on the long wheelbase chassis. Interesting how a concept such as "dormobile" gets corrupted as in the caption. Paul B Bedford used the term Workobus although some were registered as vans and some as workobus. I believe the term Dormobile was the trade mark of Martin Walter of Kent who took the vans and converted them to minibuses as well as campers. B R had some of them too, almost impossible to tell apart unless you can see inside in the photos. It seems that once the long version came out (c1959) B R bought very few short ones, if any. Merf. I have recently added the NERegion fleet list to the BRRT Yahoo group and many of these will be found there. http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/BRRT/?yguid=522976322 Edited January 29, 2013 by Merfyn Jones Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted January 29, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 29, 2013 Actually I think it is a Dormobile. Looking at the inside it appears to have forward facing upholstered seats. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) Actually I think it is a Dormobile. Looking at the inside it appears to have forward facing upholstered seats. Ok, I thought Dormobiles were motor caravan conversions. Paul Bartlett PS incidentally, if it has a side windows am I wrong that it is not strictly a van. Wasn't there a difference in tax payable on whether a vehicle was a van or not. When the body was like a van but had side windows then it was taxed like a car? Edited January 29, 2013 by hmrspaul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Ok, I thought Dormobiles were motor caravan conversions. Paul Bartlett PS incidentally, if it has a side windows am I wrong that it is not strictly a van. Wasn't there a difference in tax payable on whether a vehicle was a van or not. When the body was like a van but had side windows then it was taxed like a car? Apart from the motor-caravans, from which they derived their name, Dormobile of Folkestone did crew-buses, and possibly even ambulances. For many years, they were one of the biggest employers in Folkestone, closing in the mid-1990s ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bedford_Dormobile ). The factory was between Junctions 13 and 12 of the M20, on the London-bound side- there's a concrete-batching site next to its location. The last buildings were only cleared a year or so ago. The name lives on, with a firm in Romsey, Hants, doing bespoke conversions. I have a feeling that vans without side-windows weren't liable for Purchase Tax, as well as possibly paying lower Motor Excise Duty- a lot of builders used to put school benches in the back of thei vans to take advantage of this. In France, this sort of rule applies still; you can order a saloon car as a 'voiture de fonction' and pay less, but it'll come without a rear seat.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringo Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Going back to the Dodge PB/Spacevans, we had some when I started as an an apprentice, one at Tysley and another at Saltley, I remember the Saltley one well, we were coming back from a chippy run and as I was the young hand apprentice I had to sit in the middle seat.... I kept complaining that my bum was getting hoter and hotter......we got back to Saltley, with a smell of very ht engine fumes......it never went again, off to the big BR van scrapyard, or at least sold on to a unsuspecting soul! Irronically,i have just bought a corgi PB, in about 1/50th )ish) scale, was going to rebuild it and paint it yellow and lettered accordingly! Cheers Ringo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merfyn Jones Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Apart from the motor-caravans, from which they derived their name, Dormobile of Folkestone did crew-buses, and possibly even ambulances. For many years, they were one of the biggest employers in Folkestone, closing in the mid-1990s ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bedford_Dormobile ). The factory was between Junctions 13 and 12 of the M20, on the London-bound side- there's a concrete-batching site next to its location. The last buildings were only cleared a year or so ago. The name lives on, with a firm in Romsey, Hants, doing bespoke conversions. I have a feeling that vans without side-windows weren't liable for Purchase Tax, as well as possibly paying lower Motor Excise Duty- a lot of builders used to put school benches in the back of thei vans to take advantage of this. In France, this sort of rule applies still; you can order a saloon car as a 'voiture de fonction' and pay less, but it'll come without a rear seat.. The local authoraties who registered vehicles were given details of them by the customer/dealer/manufacturer. This is why (still today) my camper van is shown as a Tregano (the converter) rather than a Fiat Ducatto, which it really is. The Bedford CAs in the B R lists I have are shown as - Van, Utility, Workabus, Personnel carrier, Utilabrake, van-extra seats, Utilicon, Utilivan, and that's just the Eastern Region ones. Many were by Martin Walter and some by Grosvenor Grafton. So the B R fleet had a huge variety of vans or a lot of different people describing them ! Merf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted January 29, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) There was also the Utilicon. That might be what it is rather than a Dormobile. If a vehicle had windows and fewer than 12 seats it was regarded as a car and attracted purchase tax. That was the situation in the 1960's. EDIT Merf just pipped me to the post. Edited January 29, 2013 by PhilJ W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Martin-Walter was the company that would become Dormobile; it was originally established in the late 18th century as a coach-builder and harness-maker. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcb 3c Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Ok, I thought Dormobiles were motor caravan conversions. Paul Bartlett PS incidentally, if it has a side windows am I wrong that it is not strictly a van. Wasn't there a difference in tax payable on whether a vehicle was a van or not. When the body was like a van but had side windows then it was taxed like a car? Think the rule was that if a van with side windows had 12 seats or more it was classed as a commercial , which is why many conversions had 12 very small seats squeezed in. If a van with side windows had less than 12 seats it was taxed as a car and attracted purchase tax . Similar thing exists today with these crew cab vans and pick ups , vans/pick ups with side windows behind drivers must have a payload of 1000kg or more to be classed as a commercial . Edited January 30, 2013 by jcb 3c 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quicksilvercoaches Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Just stumbled across this: http://trucks-buses-trams.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/gandeys-circus-birmingham-april-1990.html The subject of photo 12 is clearly an ex BR crewbus that ran away to join the circus! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RANGERS Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Pic 14 is an ex BT external works wagon. The reg belies it as one new to the Coventry Area of what would have been Post Office Telephones. Just stumbled across this: http://trucks-buses-trams.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/gandeys-circus-birmingham-april-1990.html The subject of photo 12 is clearly an ex BR crewbus that ran away to join the circus! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merfyn Jones Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Pic 14 is an ex BT external works wagon. The reg belies it as one new to the Coventry Area of what would have been Post Office Telephones. Also picture 10 is ex BR. The Dodge S50 van formerly at Kings Cross. Good find. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andye Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Just stumbled across this: http://trucks-buses-trams.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/gandeys-circus-birmingham-april-1990.html The subject of photo 12 is clearly an ex BR crewbus that ran away to join the circus! Yes a Leyland terrier, standard issue crewbus, I still want a terrier! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andye Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Also picture 10 is ex BR. The Dodge S50 van formerly at Kings Cross. Good find. I wondered that as the bulkhead looks yellow.....and pic five looks very ex airport..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quicksilvercoaches Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 I wondered that as the bulkhead looks yellow.....and pic five looks very ex airport..... Yes pic 5 is an ex airport transfer bus trailer. It's been used as a box office on several circuses over a long period and may even still exist. Didn't realise pic 10 was ex BR too, bonus! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcb 3c Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) Like the circus trucks , here are a few new uns I think on flickr - Bedford Bruff Eastleigh http://www.flickr.com/photos/sparrowhawk7/8148336837/in/photostream/ Dodge dropside Eastleigh http://www.flickr.com/photos/sparrowhawk7/8346423957/in/gallery-seacoaler-72157632147393221/ Fat Sherpa and Dodge crewbuses Beighton http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackwatch55013/8427504270/http://www.flickr.com/photos/sparrowhawk7/8148339129/ Edited February 3, 2013 by jcb 3c Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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