Mikemeg's Workbench - Building locos of the North Eastern & LNER

[mikemeg]

LNER  J39/2

 

The last of the loco fleet to undergo repairs is now done and photographed being tested on the layout. This was described on the previous RMWeb incarnation and is a heavily modified and rebuilt Bachmann model. The body was significantly reworked with new handrails, glazing, etc. and the chassis is a modified Comet chassis kit assembled to P4 gauge and incorporating full, though none working, inside motion.

 

So more than ten years after this was done, it is now restored to its 'proper' condition.

 

Needless to say, 64914 was a Hull loco in 1950; part of Dairycoates J39 allocation. Since this was done, I've accumulated two more Bachmann J39 bodies (50p each!) so, one day not too far off, I'll do two more J39's; one with the 3500 gallon tender (J39/1) and one with an ex NER tender (J39/3).

 

Another of those clear, blue sunlit days of summer on the layout; totally unrealistic at the moment, one might say!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

Edited April 22 by mikemeg

[30368]

4 minutes ago, mikemeg said:

Needless to say, 64914 was a Hull loco in 1950; part of Dairycoates J39 allocation.

 

Lovely job Mike, it was probably due an overhaul anyway being still in the earliest BR livery.

 

Kind regards,

 

30368

[mikemeg]

4 minutes ago, 30368 said:

 

Lovely job Mike, it was probably due an overhaul anyway being still in the earliest BR livery.

 

Kind regards,

 

30368

 

Thanks Richard

 

I'm sure that it hasn't escaped your notice that this loco, shown above, is not a tank loco; it's a tender loco. So though my tank engine 'habit' is by no means cured, it is now tempered, as I start on the final painting of quite a few more tender locos.

 

Very best regards

 

Mike 

Edited April 22 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LNER J25

 

Next up for painting is this one. This was the test build for the North Eastern Kits LNER J25 and will be yet another model of a Hull Dairycoates loco, as it was in mid 1950.

 

Might just do this one as it was on the day after it returned to Hull from a general overhaul and repaint at Darlington Works.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

Edited April 23 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LNER 20T BRAKE VAN 'TOAD D'

 

Here's another rebuild which was posted on a previous incarnation of RMWeb. Before I embarked on the loco scratch and kit building 'fest', I spent quite a while building wagon kits, mostly the Ian Kirk kits. In the course of doing this and because many of the kits were LNER wagons, I obviously needed to build at least one of the very distinctive LNER 20 ton brake vans. However, there was no kit available to build one of these; the nearest thing, available, was the Dapol kit for the British Railways standard 20 ton brake van, which design was based on the LNER version.

 

So, armed with Peter Tatlow's excellent book on LNER wagons, within which were detailed drawings of the LNER 20 ton Brake Van, I acquired a number of the Dapol kits, intent on re-working  them to represent their LNER forebears.

 

Anyway, the result of these efforts is shown below and is my attempt at representing the very distinctive LNER 20 ton Brake Van. If anyone is interested then I will describe the various modifications and additions made to these kits to produce this model.

 

And yet another of those clear blue, cloud free days at Hessle Haven!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

 

Edited April 23 by mikemeg

[Suffolk Dave]

8 hours ago, mikemeg said:

If anyone is interested then I will describe the various modifications and additions made to these kits to produce this model.

 

 

How, that would be very interesting.

 

And surely, the shores of the Humber are renowned for their big, azure, Mediterranean like skies. 

 

[Portchullin Tatty]

Mike,

 

Can I hold my hand up for interest in the modifications that you have made on the brake van please?

 

I am close to finishing a Bradwell BR underframe and have a second in its pack which I had in mind modifying as the LNER predecessor. I know there are underframe / body differences but not put any effort into determining what they are yet.  

 

I also know there are rather a lot of variants within the BR standard.

 

You can save me the research!

 

 

 

Mark

Edited April 25 by Portchullin Tatty

[mikemeg]

LNER 20T BRAKE VAN 'TOAD D'

 

Ok, so at least a couple of folk would like a little more info on this conversion, so here goes!

 

Firstly, a very short history lesson. The LNER introduced the long wheelbase 20 ton brake van in 1929, to be used at the tail end of fitted freights in order to provide a smoother ride. An initial 20 were built which were based at locations where long distance fitted freights emanated from - Kings Cross, Edinburgh, Aberdeen, Marylebone, York, Glasgow, etc. 

 

These initial examples had steel sheet end platforms and unglazed doors, though the ends of the cabin were glazed. This was the basic format for a number of years. Due to a shortage of iron and steel, during World War II, examples built during this period had end platforms which were raised to accommodate concrete as ballast. This modification stayed in place after the war and as part of the British Railways standard design. These later LNER built vans also had the end doors glazed as well as the cabin ends. A small angle iron truss on the underside of the solebar was also added. 

 

So to the Dapol kit. This represents the British Railways standard 20 ton brake van, based on the LNER design but with modifications. Also, much of the detail on this kit is moulded on i.e. handrails, lamp irons, etc. So the first task is to remove all of the moulded detail - I sand it off with very fine emery paper. Once removed, then the planking lines can be replaced, by scoring with a compass point, where this moulded detail has been removed. I also drill new 0.3 mm holes to accept new handrails at this time.

 

The solebars, which are plastic mouldings, I also modify by thinning the webs down and by 'excavating' some of the channel with a needle file. Then a .010" plasticard strip is glued into the solebar, which has the rivet detail, works plate and the body support brackets - see the photo below. If one of the earlier brake vans, with steel end platforms, is being modelled then the ends of the floor on the kit must be removed and replaced with plasticard (.015")  before assembly as in the photo below.

 

Once all of this removal and reshaping has been done, then the body and the solebars can be assembled. I also add the wheel bearings (pinpoint), wheels, brake hangars and shoes at this point. Buffers can also be added - I use ABS white metal LNER long fitted freight buffers  - at this point. 

 

So the photo below shows the results of these processes.

 

To be continued.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

Edited April 26 by mikemeg

[Suffolk Dave]

Thanks for sharing, Mike. And nice to read how these evolved over time.

[NZRedBaron]

You know, it's funny that I just came across this thread; I was just thinking about the North Eastern Railway, and it suddenly dawned on me that it's actually well served in RTR, locomotive-wise; everything aside from express passenger locomotives is available RTR; the upcoming Rapido Y7's and Bachmann's J72's cover shunting, with the J72's also covering 'trip working'; heavy goods is handled by Hornby's Q6's; Oxford Rail has the J26 and J27 for general mixed traffic; and Bachmann's G5 handles the suburban (and maybe also branchline?) passenger trains- all that's missing is an express tender engine, and the NER will have a full set.

[Compound2632]

Almost makes you wonder why @mikemeg bothers with kits, doesn't it?

[NZRedBaron]

Well, to be fair, there's no NER passenger stock that's RTR, and little if any RTR goods wagons; besides, there's always a place for kit building.

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, NZRedBaron said:

Well, to be fair, there's no NER passenger stock that's RTR, and little if any RTR goods wagons; besides, there's always a place for kit building.

 

But for those to whom the prospect of building an engine from a kit is daunting, kit-building wagons and carriages to run behind those RTR engines is a good way of working up to it.

 

This is very much a kit-building topic, so one does not want to stray too far, but mention should be made of the Accurascale hopper wagons. Don't forget the electric loco and the petrol railcar! Also, there is more appropriate RTR rolling stock about if one chooses to model the NER in LNER or, especially, BR days, those RTR engines remaining highly appropriate. (And the numerous industrial saddle-tanks for colliery exchange sidings.) The NER is also quite well served for RTP buildings - but those signals!

 

All applying to 4 mm scale, of course. 

[MarkC]

1 hour ago, NZRedBaron said:

You know, it's funny that I just came across this thread; I was just thinking about the North Eastern Railway, and it suddenly dawned on me that it's actually well served in RTR, locomotive-wise; everything aside from express passenger locomotives is available RTR; the upcoming Rapido Y7's and Bachmann's J72's cover shunting, with the J72's also covering 'trip working'; heavy goods is handled by Hornby's Q6's; Oxford Rail has the J26 and J27 for general mixed traffic; and Bachmann's G5 handles the suburban (and maybe also branchline?) passenger trains- all that's missing is an express tender engine, and the NER will have a full set.

Um, the J26 & J27 (NER P2 & P3) weren't fitted with continuous brakes - for a genuine mixed traffic 0-6-0 you should look at the J21 (NER Class C). For a bigger mixed traffic loco then the B16 (NER Class S3) would be on the wish list, but getting one of those to run RTR, with the restricted clearances behind the cylinders for the bogie, is quite problematic, I think.

 

Mark

[mikemeg]

11 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

The NER is also quite well served for RTP buildings - but those signals!

 

All applying to 4 mm scale, of course. 

 

Ah, those signals. I spent quite a while working out how to scratch build those great lattice signal bridges and gantries in 4mm scale. Eventually I came up with some techniques which seemed to work, though most of them carry later LNER upper quadrant arms, but the structures are pure North Eastern; well actually McKenzie and Holland.

 

The first photo, below, is the very first signal model that I built but it did embody some of the techniques developed for the much larger models.

 

Photos 2 and 3 are models of structures which once stood at Hessle Haven, when this place just oozed North Eastern and LNER. Now, of course, all of these are gone and are now merely memories and black and white photographs. But as purely functional pieces of equipment, they were lovely things and the railway scene is the poorer for their passing!

 

The long signal bridge - photo 4 below - is a model of one which stood at Scarborough Londesborough Road. This signal bridge, which was supported both at the ends and around one third along its length, actually spanned some 96 feet and the model is some 380 mm long. This bridge was built in two sections which were then joined at the intermediate post. Perhaps not the largest 4mm signal model ever made but it's up there somewhere!

 

As there are, nor were, any detailed drawings of any of these structures, then the first phase, in every model, was to produce a 4mm drawing of the structure. Drawings which I still have; see photo 5 & 6.

 

Yes, the North Eastern is reasonably well represented by r-t-r models but there are no Raven Pacifics, A6's, A7's, A8's, BTP's, B15's, B16's, C6's, C7's, D17's, D20's, F8's, J21's, J24;s, J25's, J71's, J73's, J77's, N8/9/10's, Q5's, Q7's, T1's etc. And as I model to P4, any r-t-r models would need new or at least modified chassis.

 

So plenty of scope for the kit and scratch builder.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 26 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LNER 20T BRAKE VAN 'TOAD D'

 

The next stage of the brake van rebuilds is to make new cabin ends, which will allow the flush glazing and will match the vintage of the prototype being modelled i.e. whether the cabin had solid or glazed doors.

 

Once made and before they are glazed and assembled, I paint the ends inside and out. Much easier than when they are in place on the model.

 

The appropriate cabin ends can then be added to the model, once the painting and glazing is completed. On the photo, below, the guards ducket has also been glazed. The brake yolks, made from .020" x .020" plasticard strip, are also visible on this photo.

 

The grey end was for a model of one of the vans built by the LNER for the CLC (Cheshire Lines Committee) which were unfitted i.e. handbrake only and were painted in LNER freight grey. Some of these vans did pass into BR ownership.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

 

Edited April 27 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LNER 20T BRAKE VAN  'TOAD D'

 

Next task, in this rebuild, is to make new roofs. The roof moulding in the kit, while dimensionally correct, is far too thick, so I cut new roofs from .015" plasticard and then form them using a 'tried and tested' method which does utiiise an otherwise discarded product.

 

The blanks are first rolled through the boiler rollers and then finished off by being taped to a wine bottle, which is then filled with very hot but not boiling water. Once cooled, the roofs now have the correct curvature.

 

The roofs in the photograph are simply placed on the models but not stuck; there is a lot more detail to add to them before fixing.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

Edited Tuesday at 07:24 by mikemeg

[Suffolk Dave]

Any opportunity to pull a cork eh! 😃

[mikemeg]

6 hours ago, Suffolk Dave said:

Any opportunity to pull a cork eh! 😃

 

Just so. A justification for emptying the bottle; for a part filled bottle simply doesn't allow for this technique to be used. It has to be an empty one.

 

As you might imagine the development of this technique, perfected as it was over quite a protracted time, did involve considerable personal sacrifice. But I survived the development process and am now far more proficient in the provision of the necessary 'tools' to undertake this process.

 

Many thanks for your postings and do, please, continue.

 

Regards

 

Mike

 

Edited Wednesday at 11:33 by mikemeg

[Compound2632]

23 hours ago, mikemeg said:

Next task, in this rebuild, is to make new roofs. The roof moulding in the kit, while dimensionally correct, is far too thick, so I cut new roofs from .015" plasticard and then form them using a 'tried and tested' method which does utiiise an otherwise discarded product.

 

The blanks are first rolled through the boiler rollers and then finished off by being taped to a wine bottle, which is then filled with very hot but not boiling water. Once cooled, the roofs now have the correct curvature.

 

Interesting that you're getting good results with hot water in the bottle. I use a similar method but with the bottle put in the cafetiere and very hot water in both - the water in the bottle being primarily to stop it floating. But I've not tried the pre-rolling step, having only very recently got a set of rolling bars. Do you find that you get a constant radius right to the edge? I've taken to bending over-wide pieces and cutting them down to width, to avoid the flatter edges. Standard wine bottles are 3" diameter and good for 10 ft radius roofs - which do for most goods vehicles - but I have a special 2.5" diameter bottle for 8 ft radius carriage roofs.

 

By-the-way you do realise that it's not absolutely necessary to use a fresh bottle every time?

[mikemeg]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Interesting that you're getting good results with hot water in the bottle. I use a similar method but with the bottle put in the cafetiere and very hot water in both - the water in the bottle being primarily to stop it floating. But I've not tried the pre-rolling step, having only very recently got a set of rolling bars. Do you find that you get a constant radius right to the edge? I've taken to bending over-wide pieces and cutting them down to width, to avoid the flatter edges. Standard wine bottles are 3" diameter and good for 10 ft radius roofs - which do for most goods vehicles - but I have a special 2.5" diameter bottle for 8 ft radius carriage roofs.

 

By-the-way you do realise that it's not absolutely necessary to use a fresh bottle every time?

 

To take the 'serious' part of your posting, first. I do try and tape the piece as tightly as possible to the bottle, avoiding any flats at the edges. At first I did get the unevenness which you describe which problem was seemingly solved by putting the piece through the rollers a few times. I couldn't achieve the necessary radius using the rollers but I did achieve a consistent larger radius. The second stage, using the bottle, then simply tightened an already consistent radius to a tighter consistent radius. If in doubt, resort to the bottle!!

 

As to the second part of your posting, my advancing years mean that I frequently forget where I may have stored my 'constructional accessories - aka empty bottles'; forgetting that my citizen's commitment to re-cycling has led me to dispose of them. But such loss is all too easily rectified!!

 

Regards

 

Mike

 

Edited Wednesday at 08:07 by mikemeg

[MarkC]

43 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

By-the-way you do realise that it's not absolutely necessary to use a fresh bottle every time?

It's a dirty & dangerous job, but someone's got to do it... 🙃