Barnetby and the new signaling work

[D1059]

Why does almost EVERYTHING modern on the railway have to be so UGLY?!!!

 

 

I don't think its much more ugly than this

 

Didcot Signals by Stephen Dance, on Flickr

 

Its just that we are used to seeing the older style. Both are brutally functional, but technology has moved on. The days of decorative finials on signals are long, long gone

[russ p]

At least it's conventional

[Mallard60022]

....................and about to be replaced.

P

[Reorte]

Its just that we are used to seeing the older style. Both are brutally functional, but technology has moved on. The days of decorative finials on signals are long, long gone

I'm not so sure about the finial part, sometimes when the odd new semaphore is put in the finial seems to be more decorative than pure function would demand. I'm sure I remember seeing some pictures on here a while back. As for new vs older colour lights I agree, they don't look the same but I don't find one is uglier than the other.

[Reorte]

Why does almost EVERYTHING modern on the railway have to be so UGLY?!!!

 

Would it cost so much more to make the infrastructure a bit nicer to look at? I know I'm old, and it's all in the eye of the beholder, but so few modern structures look like they've had any thought given to their aesthetics, and that must have an unconscious, negative effect on the people who have to look at them.

I completely agree with the sentiment (and I'd apply it to most of life in general, it's gradually becoming less pleasant to live in even if it's more functional) but I suspect that you'd have to go back quite a long way to find things being different. There are / have been plenty of very plain box-like signal boxes for example (although they're possibly mostly the ARP ones).

As vegetation claims back the yards and permanent way no longer used, palliside fencing blocks the camera views and stations are no longer quite as welcoming to enthusiasts you have to wonder what happened, but it's just progress.

Makes it rather hard to get enthusiastic about progress though (remember it's not just the railways that are changing in similar ways). I suppose overall it's supposed to make life better but I just find it makes it more depressing. The worrying thing is that it might be the best possible to stop it getting worse faster, when it's become "change or fail". And on that cheery note...

 

edit to add: Station-wise maybe not as welcoming in one way but they generally don't seem to be the tatty falling apart run-down dumps I remember them being in my childhood (80s). It's not all bad.

[The Stationmaster]

At least it's conventional

And rather nice looking although various items have been replaced on the basic structure over the years.  Definitely a 'something different signal' in any case as its post arrangement was a not very common design from Reading although there are one or two contemporaneous examples about.  The semaphore it replaced was absolutely delectable - but then so were a number of semaphores at Didcot when they were displaced  by colour lights 50 years ago.

....................and about to be replaced.

P

Fortunately I think not.  Below is a picture of it that I took on New Year's Day and it has gained both a new (Dorman LED) signal head plus a new route indicator but that is all.  It should be sufficiently clear of the overhead when(ever) that arrives although I wonder if the number might change (again) sometime depending on what happens with TVSC control area - I will freely admit that the fact that it has carried a Swindon 'B' ID for the past 20 years is largely down to me and teh layout alterations I had made at Did cot also further west which led to control being transferred from Reading to a new (temporary) 'box at Swindon.

 

[D1059]

And rather nice looking although various items have been replaced on the basic structure over the years.  Definitely a 'something different signal' in any case as its post arrangement was a not very common design from Reading although there are one or two contemporaneous examples about.  The semaphore it replaced was absolutely delectable - but then so were a number of semaphores at Didcot when they were displaced  by colour lights 50 years ago.

Fortunately I think not.  Below is a picture of it that I took on New Year's Day and it has gained both a new (Dorman LED) signal head plus a new route indicator but that is all.  It should be sufficiently clear of the overhead when(ever) that arrives although I wonder if the number might change (again) sometime depending on what happens with TVSC control area - I will freely admit that the fact that it has carried a Swindon 'B' ID for the past 20 years is largely down to me and teh layout alterations I had made at Did cot also further west which led to control being transferred from Reading to a new (temporary) 'box at Swindon.

 

DSCF8924.jpg

Thanks for the update - I have updated the caption on my photo to suit

[caradoc]

Centralising signalling is not new; IIRC Reading and Swindon panels opened in the 60s; Certainly when I first spotted at Didcot in 1971 the signals were colour lights and the only box anywhere near the station was the crossing box at Appleford. I do share concerns regarding over-centralising however, particularly when Control is located in the same building. When (not if, because it will happen sooner or later) such a centre has to be evacuated or suffers a major failure, not only is control of signalling over a huge area lost but also the means to arrange response and provide a point of contact for the many trains trapped. The theory is that another such centre would take over, however how practical this is given that such incidents usually occur without warning, and that there are not spare staff sitting around waiting for such an eventuality, remains to be seen.   

[Classsix T]

Getting back to Barnetby, I wonder if the smashing hosts at Holcombe Guesthouse (the superb B&B down the road) wonder what goes on that they possibly keep hemorrhaging custom every decade or so?

 

I didn't visit the area when Peds and Tractors handled the freight traffic, but attempted at least one stay per annum when 56 and 60 traction held sway. Only popped in on passing when the Grids finished.

 

The demise of the semaphore signalling must surely mean another reduction in enthusiasts intending to doss in Barnetby?

 

C6T.

[Banger Blue]

I don't think its much more ugly than this

 

Didcot Signals by Stephen Dance, on Flickr

 

Its just that we are used to seeing the older style. Both are brutally functional, but technology has moved on. The days of decorative finials on signals are long, long gone

Quite the historical photo!

 

The signal heads have been replaced (as per the Stationmasters photo), 166208 is now in GWR green and of course the three cooling towers in the background, no longer dominate the skyline after they were demolished.

[The Stationmaster]

Quite the historical photo!

 

The signal heads have been replaced (as per the Stationmasters photo), 166208 is now in GWR green and of course the three cooling towers in the background, no longer dominate the skyline after they were demolished.

If you really want to be historical I have a picture of the semaphore signal it replaced!  Post No. 48 in the thread linked below

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/105756-favorite-signal-on-the-network-whats-yours/page-2

[phil-b259]

Seems like another decision made by network rail by persons who haven't got a clue!

 

Not so. If you get very prescriptive on designs then you stifle innovation and remove a significant part of the ability of manufacturers to compete against each other effectively. We are constantly told competition is the 'best ' way of reducing prices for consumers so is it that surprising that NR are following this advice. This is also what led the newly formed Railtrack to shun the established signalling suppliers of Westinghouse and Alstom (was GEC) in favour of Ansaldo, Bombardier and Siemens for their first resignalling schemes and while in those cases the gamble didn't work, for simple stuff like signal heads it actually works quite well.

 

Thus far I have seen the following LED signals:-

 

• The'flat screen' type as shown at Peterborough
• The 'Searchlight' style (looks very similar to those installed on the LNE)
• An outwardly conventional 4 aspect head but with individual LED modules stacked one above each other in a column of 4 (not to be confused with a conventional 4 aspect signal head where the individual filament lamps have been replaced by LED 'Light Engines' (which simply plug into where the old lamp went)

[russ p]

And if you look in the Peterborough area you will see all of these.

Next time you do your mainline steam duties in the dark have a look to see how the different types project light particularly in poor weather.

LED light does not project in fog anywhere near as good as a filament bulb

[The Stationmaster]

Having acted in one of the Ansaldo trials as an Independent Safety Assessor the thing that most impressed me was by how much their re-worked design still failed to comply with the former BR spec for colour light signal aspect colours (I know that because the man who was the 'owner' of the BR Spec was also at the trial).  While it is also noticeable with some of the other modern designs the yellow in the revised Ansaldo signal head was not only massively brighter than the other colours but appeared green when seen through tree foliage that was being blown about by the wind - very disquieting.

And if you look in the Peterborough area you will see all of these.
Next time you do your mainline steam duties in the dark have a look to see how the different types project light particularly in poor weather.
LED light does not project in fog anywhere near as good as a filament bulb

This was very noticeable on some signals at Twyford where one was placed by a Dorman LED unit some months prior to the one serving another line.  Irrespective of the viewing angle the LED head seemed not to give as tight a beam as the filament bulb signal head.    However from what I have observed I would think the opposite is true in clear weather, especially with yellows, where aspects almpst a mile away can be picked out with no problems.

 

What I do wonder about the 'flat screen' type (as Phil has aptly christened them) is how they will perform in very cold weather and particularly when there is driving snow.  I presume they would be warm enough not to frost over and they are, in my view, excessively bright anyway.  But when snow is driving really hard against them I do wonder how they will cope? 

[russ p]

With the dorman LED heads in clear darkness they dazzle you which is not good but on fog they disappear. I've not seen the flat ones in fog yet but I'm sure the result will be the same. I'm not sure whether it's down to there beinyno focusing lens or the frequency of LED light

 

I would think in driving snow the light will disappear unless there is some form of deicer built into it

[ForestPines]

There are / have been plenty of very plain box-like signal boxes for example (although they're possibly mostly the ARP ones).

The recently-demolished Pasture St was one example of a rather plain and boxy box - it was a 1960s ER standard mechanical box design. Nevertheless last week there were plenty of people in the internet saying what an awful shame its demolition was, that NR were committing a criminal offence because it was listed (it wasn't), that even if it wasn't listed it should have been, etc etc.

[Welly]

I spoken with an ex-colleague who is now a train driver. He said that he really likes the new signals at Barnetby as they are so much easier to see. Also the old semaphore distant signals tended to be fixed at on so he was always slowing down for Wrawby and Barnetby - now he could just pass by at 50 and only need to slow to 40 in the platform lines.

[Shed]

Great pictures and informative thread

[beast66606]

I spoken with an ex-colleague who is now a train driver. He said that he really likes the new signals at Barnetby as they are so much easier to see. Also the old semaphore distant signals tended to be fixed at on so he was always slowing down for Wrawby and Barnetby - now he could just pass by at 50 and only need to slow to 40 in the platform lines.

 

Until the late 1960s Wrawby had splitting distants back at Barnetby, for the Scunny line, which helped keep things moving along at a reasonable rate - when the gantry at the end of the platforms was replaced by the two tubes with home + distant arms, the distants became applicable to the straight on route to Brigg only.