Castle Aching

[Compound2632]

7 minutes ago, Northroader said:

There must be a reason for that..

 

I'm afraid I can't suggest any Slaters or Cambrian kit that could be of assistance here...

[Nearholmer]

Ah, now there’s a book that will survive any clearout of books to regain shelf-space.

[Argos]

25 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

Ah, now there’s a book that will survive any clearout of books to regain shelf-space.

 

 I might have to go and lie down now to recover from the shock of the very thought of a clearout...............

[Hroth]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I'm afraid I can't suggest any Slaters or Cambrian kit that could be of assistance here...

Try Smallbrook Studio

http://smallbrookstudio.co.uk/

Its where my On16.5 Loco came from

http://smallbrookstudio.co.uk/kits-parts/4569521214/7mm-ng-'thor'-saddle-tank/3771351

 

Resin kits in a variety of gauges and scales...  (No connection, but a satisfied purchaser)

 

1 hour ago, Northroader said:

There must be a reason for that..

 

One of my favourite "railway" books, I was given it as a present too many years ago.....

 

Edited February 11, 2019 by Hroth
tpying errors...

[Edwardian]

Now that finances have eased a little, I shall resume collecting when I can, though building stuff for future projects must take second place to CA.  Nevertheless, I already have quite a bit stashed away, while sufficient model real estate to run this collection remains a good way off.  In the meantime, I would like to get as much of my stuff out of boxes and at least visible. The idea is that this will inspire me to complete, titivate or add to stock to complete trains from time to time.  When CA is up and running, much of this stuff can then at least get its wheels turned on Rule No.1 running sessions. 

 

The Memsahib started work full time late last year, leaving Yours Truly in possession of a home office.   Cogs began to grind resulting in the impulse purchase of a redundant shop fitting.

 

I need to rearrange the furniture in this little room, add a base, internal shelf and dust curtain to the rear, but I hope soon to have a cabinet that can hold several trains worth of stock, with sufficient length to accommodate trains of up to an equivalent of five 56' coaches and an Atlantic. 

[Hroth]

And in addition, the top of the display case acts as a means of checking that all the wheels are in correct alignment!

[Edwardian]

A package arrived at Aching Towers today, courtesy of Turbosnail of this Parish.

 

The print is good and clean and looks as if it will need minimal preparation.  It is a better finish and better value than I am used to from Shapeways, so well done there, Tom.  The only damage in transit was a brake shoe with a particularly fragile attachment, but easily glued I suspect. 

 

So, looks like one from the Old Country for Castle Aching ....

[Martin S-C]

That DOES look nice! Mr Turbosnail, do you accept orders, sir?

[Edwardian]

1 minute ago, Martin S-C said:

That DOES look nice! Mr Turbosnail, do you accept orders, sir?

 

Well, he accepted mine, so I daresay you're in luck ...!

[Annie]

Oh I do like that.  Very nice indeed.

[TurboSnail]

38 minutes ago, Martin S-C said:

That DOES look nice! Mr Turbosnail, do you accept orders, sir?

 

I certainly do! Drop me a PM if you're interested.

 

And here's one I made earlier... (still in need of toning down slightly)

 

[drduncan]

On 04/02/2019 at 17:58, Edwardian said:

Sorry to flog this one (but it's all I have to show for the last 5 months!). I had a chance to photograph the Drill Hall in daylight today, so please indulge me in two or three further shots ...

Exquisite.

drduncan

[Regularity]

3 hours ago, drduncan said:

Exquisite.

drduncan

And also at the same time, magnificent.

[phil_sutters]

On 11/02/2019 at 19:47, Nearholmer said:

Phil

 

Your GC cattle van looks suspiciously like a GW Siphon, as per the ones I'm currently not-quite-finishing.

 

K

It was seeing your similar vans that got me thinking about my oddity. I really don't know where I got the GC from. It was the days of Denny's Buckingham etc.. It's a bit like my SDJR engineers' half van half open. I know I saw that one as a model in MRN or MRC and made a copy of it. Seeing your 'papered' wagons I am just about to try using photo prints of van sides that I have worked up on computer. Knowing how shades and sizes can be affected by the commercial photo printing process, I sent off for several different shades and slightly different sizes as an experiment to see how accurately they are reproduced. They are all in SDJR passenger blue livery - a horse box, a ventilated fruit van and a Fuller's of Bath PO CCT. I don't think I shall be bold enough to make the panelling on the fruit van raised.

[drmditch]

Please excuse me if this has been mentioned before. I'm not quite sure as the relationship of CA to the M&GN. 

While re-reading Mr Hamilton Ellis' 'The Midland Railway', I found on page 167 a picture of an M&GN 4-4-0 outside cylinder tank engine No.8, attached to 'one of the original Pullman cars of 1874 converted into a control-trailers'.

 

I could scan the picture, but am unsure as to copyright status, nor have I managed to find a version on the WWW.

It would make a splendidly idiosyncratic train for CA, but the station layout cope with the length of the Pullman?

Although of course no run-round would be required!

[Edwardian]

48 minutes ago, drmditch said:

Please excuse me if this has been mentioned before. I'm not quite sure as the relationship of CA to the M&GN. 

While re-reading Mr Hamilton Ellis' 'The Midland Railway', I found on page 167 a picture of an M&GN 4-4-0 outside cylinder tank engine No.8, attached to 'one of the original Pullman cars of 1874 converted into a control-trailers'.

 

I could scan the picture, but am unsure as to copyright status, nor have I managed to find a version on the WWW.

It would make a splendidly idiosyncratic train for CA, but the station layout cope with the length of the Pullman?

Although of course no run-round would be required!

 

Good question.

 

The relationship of CA to the MGN

 

The West Norfolk Railway is one of those independent lines, of which many were built from town A to town B in the Nineteenth Century.  These companies tended to get amalgamated as part of larger pre-Group companies.

 

In Norfolk, they were brought together to form, via the Eastern & Midland, the MGN, a MR and GNR scheme to rival the GER.  

 

The story behind the West Norfolk Railway is that it retained its independence.  The GER holds a substantial minority holding in the company and supports it as a buffer against further MGN incursion.  The WNR has maintained its independence by balancing these two larger rivals.

 

Both the GER and the MGN have physical connections with the WNR.  The GER off the Lynn & Hunstanton Line near Wolfingham and the MGN off the Lynn & Fakenham Line near Massingham.

 

Services off the MGN, bound for the WNR-served coastal resort at Birchoverham Next the Sea must reverse at CA.

 

Several ex-L&F/E&M/MGN locos were purchased by the WNR around the turn of the century.

 

Midland & MGN Locos

 

Turning to the question of motive power, the MR took over responsibility for MGN motive power (1893), but even before that, the Eastern & Midland was dependent upon the MR and GNR to work its Western Section, i.e. west of King's Lynn, as it had not enough locos of its own. 

 

The Midland introduced Johnson 0-6-0s and 4-4-0s and once in sufficient number, the use of MR and GNR locos on the MGN lessened.  I  still intend to have MR and GNR through services off the MGN reversing at CA.  

 

MR locos were lent to E&M/MGN from time to time.  Your picture doubtless relates to a swop, IIRC 1906-1912, of Johnson 0-4-4Ts for MGN tanks.  IIRC, one of the latter worked at Wirksworth in the company of a Midland Pullman.

 

EDIT:  As a pedant to your picture of a MGN tank on loan to the MR, here is a picture of the other side of the exchange, a MR Johnson 0-4-4T at Cromer Beach.  The loco is in MGN service, whereas the coaches are visiting MR through coaches. 

 

 

Thus, it ought to be possible in time to see MR, GNR, MR-on-loan-to-MGN and MGN and WNR-ex-MGN locos at CA!   

Edited February 13, 2019 by Edwardian

[phil_sutters]

1 hour ago, Edwardian said:

Midland & MGN Locos

EDIT:  As a pedant to your picture of a MGN tank on loan to the MR, here is a picture of the other side of the exchange, a MR Johnson 0-4-4T at Cromer Beach.  The loco is in MGN service, whereas the coaches are visiting MR through coaches. 

 

Thus, it ought to be possible in time to see MR, GNR, MR-on-loan-to-MGN and MGN and WNR-ex-MGN locos at CA!   

J.E.Kite's 1850 - 1925 Vintage Album has a nice photo of M.R. 2-4-0 198 at Cromer in the late 1890s, with assorted railway staff posing around it. Above it is a splendid view of M&GNJR 4-4-2T No.9 heading for Cromer on a substantial through train from Kings Cross, photographed by C. Laundy in 1921.

Edited February 13, 2019 by phil_sutters
too much of original post carried forward.

[Northroader]

I thought that the GER put in an appearance at CA too?

[Edwardian]

1 hour ago, phil_sutters said:

 

J.E.Kite's 1850 - 1925 Vintage Album has a nice photo of M.R. 2-4-0 198 at Cromer in the late 1890s, with assorted railway staff posing around it. 

 

 

Indeed it does. This said to be a loan engine, the E&M/MGN being short of locomotives even for working East of Lynn.  Interestingly it is said to have lingered on the MGN until 1904; the influx of new Johnson-designed in MGN ownership locos did not happen overnight! 

 

Of course, in an alternative history, with the existence of the WNR, there might have been need to retain this locomotive past 1904 yo work through to the WN!

 

I should be so lucky to have a model of this! 

 

 

To illustrate the continued presence of MR locomotives working over the Western Section, again, despite the progressive introduction of new MGN motive power, below is a MR 2-4-0, pictured sometime between 1903 and 1907 at Lynn.

 

Such services were often extended as far as the WN lines, with MR locomotives often remaining in charge!

 

 

 

 

 

29 minutes ago, Northroader said:

I thought that the GER put in an appearance at CA too?

 

Yes, very much so.

 

Well, there is the GER-WNR Jnt. Cttee's Bishop's Lynn Tramway that runs into CA; G15s and the odd C53 with appropriate rolling stock. 

 

Also, as noted above, the WNR has a connection with the GER off the latter's Lynn & Hunstanton line, so arranged that, again, services for Birchoverham Next the Sea must reverse at CA.  I think that there should be some GE services to CA, if only to connect with the GE/WN Tramway.  The latter service should give me an excuse to run those GE 4-wheelers into CA in due course.

 

[Regularity]

3 hours ago, drmditch said:

Please excuse me if this has been mentioned before. I'm not quite sure as the relationship of CA to the M&GN. 

While re-reading Mr Hamilton Ellis' 'The Midland Railway', I found on page 167 a picture of an M&GN 4-4-0 outside cylinder tank engine No.8, attached to 'one of the original Pullman cars of 1874 converted into a control-trailers'.

 

I could scan the picture, but am unsure as to copyright status, nor have I managed to find a version on the WWW.

It would make a splendidly idiosyncratic train for CA, but the station layout cope with the length of the Pullman?

Although of course no run-round would be required!

It is in use on the Hemel Hempstead Branch. If the picture is the one I think it is, it will be standing in the bay platform at Harpenden.

whilst the M&GN was using some 0-4-4T locos, the Midland had some of the class B tank locos in exchange.

 

Linked image:

 

Edited February 13, 2019 by Regularity
Linked image added

[Nearholmer]

Was that M&GN loco painted dark red, or golden, when with the MR?

 

just wanting to complete my mind’s-eye picture of it at the other end of the branch, at the edge of Hemel, which is something i’d love to see replicated as a model.

[Compound2632]

According to Summerson, Midland Railway Locomotives Vol. 3 (Irwell Press, 2002), the three Midland 6 Class 0-4-4Ts lent to the Joint, Nos. 142, 143, and 144, retained their red livery but received the initials M & G N on the tank sides, straddling the brass numerals which they retained. While they were away, the great renumbering of 1907 occurred, so these three engines didn't get their new numbers 1232-4 until 1910. The way Summerson presents the events, it sounds as if the Midland wanted to get its hands on the 4-4=0Ts to experiment with motor train working. The swap was four 4-4-0Ts for three 0-4-4Ts, apparently not from any operational consideration but because they had approximately the same capital value. It's worth noting that the engines sent to the Joint were among the oldest 0-4-4Ts, having entered traffic in June 1875. (NB the forthcoming Bachmann model of a 1532 Class engine cannot very well represent a 6 Class engine, the differences of basic dimensions and detail are too great.) Summerson says that No. 142 and probably the other two were equipped with Whittaker tablet exchange apparatus - I can't see any sign of it in James's Cromer Beach photo.

 

Midland Style states that the 4-4-0Ts transferred to the Midland at first retained their M&GN livery but with the M&GN initials removed and the Midland coat of arms applied. They were "later" repainted in Midland livery and given brass numerals, the numbering matching that of the Pullman cars to which they were attached. This would appear to be the condition of the engine in Simon's Harpenden photo. Summerson, Vol. 1, has a photo of No. 8 in the earlier livery - the oval cast numberplate has been retained with the Midland coat of arms (the pre-1907 diamond-shaped version) midway between that and the tank front.

 

Theses first motor trains were evidently quite a success as they were followed by the fleet of two-carriage motor trains with the engine sandwiched in the middle. Summerson gives the most detailed account I know of these trains from the locomotive point of view.

 

 

Edited February 13, 2019 by Compound2632

[Compound2632]

6 hours ago, Edwardian said:

To illustrate the continued presence of MR locomotives working over the Western Section, again, despite the progressive introduction of new MGN motive power, below is a MR 2-4-0, pictured sometime between 1903 and 1907 at Lynn.

 

Such services were often extended as far as the WN lines, with MR locomotives often remaining in charge!

 

 

 

 

We discussed No. 198A at Cromer Beach a while back. 

 

No 69A at South Lynn has got me scouring Summerson. She's a member of the 890 Class, ordered by Kirtley but seen to completion by Johnson. She entered traffic in May 1874, received a Johnson boiler in June 1878, was given new 18" x 24" cylinders in June 1890, went on the duplicate list in July 1899, renumbered 107 in December 1907, and wasn't withdrawn until 1930. Originally a Saltley engine, she was at Leicester from at latest 1892 until at least 1921. There are several features that are particularly interesting. One is the use of seven clips to help seal the Johnson smokebox door, in place of the "clock hands" securing the central dart. This type of fixing was standard under Deeley but with his style of door with its seating ring. I can find no mention in Summerson of the use of these clips (referred to as "dogs") with Johnson smokebox doors.

 

Next is the smokebox door numberplate. Again according to Summerson, the last ten Belpaires, Nos. 860-869, entered traffic in July-September 1905 in the new livery style with the number in 18" numerals on the tender but no identification on the engine itself. This oversight was "quickly remedied" by the introduction of cast iron numberplates on the smokebox door. Finally, No. 69A carries her number on the trailing splasher in the traditional way but on the leading splasher, she sports the "new" coat of arms - generally considered to be rather more elegant than the fussily Victorian diamond-shaped design. According to Midland Style, this was brought into general use in the "latter part" of 1906.

 

So, we can infer that No. 69A received an overhaul at Derby that was sufficiently extensive to warrant a full repaint in the simplified Deeley style and with the new coat of arms some time no earlier than late 1906. At this overhaul, some experimentation in securing the smokebox door took place, though not as drastic as the full new Deeley smokebox and chimney she would have got if she'd been in the works a year or two later. The photo was taken before she was renumbered at the end of 1907. My guess would be, sometime in the summer of 1907, when there would likely be more need for Midland engines to work through with the extra traffic of the holiday season.

 

 

[Edwardian]

Spring cleaned the office today.  

 

It seems that I will struggle to accommodate the new display cabinet!

 

[glum face]

[Talltim]

On 13/02/2019 at 14:11, Regularity said:

It is in use on the Hemel Hempstead Branch. If the picture is the one I think it is, it will be standing in the bay platform at Harpenden.

whilst the M&GN was using some 0-4-4T locos, the Midland had some of the class B tank locos in exchange.

 

Linked image:

 

Wish the trains had been like that when I commuted from Harpenden. (Not that I was going to Rebourne or Hemel)

Edited February 14, 2019 by Talltim