Toms LNER Workbench - Comet V2 Chassis

[grob1234]

Hello again,

 

Another YouTube video experiment. Different viewpoint, different camera, and different editing.

 

https://youtu.be/dcJniDKPEHs

[gr.king]

Hello everyone,

 

Just a very quick (small) heads up for a new YouTube channel I'm developing. It's called Toms Trains, and its primary focus is kit building.

 

At this stage very much a test bed, so a sort of 'soft launch' at this stage. If there is some interest, then I'll be expanding what I cover on the channel, and will be making improvements to video quality, sound, editing, lighting and so on. Anyway, here is the first video (part 1 of 3) any comments or suggestions welcome.

 

 

https://youtu.be/_v8EgsYgnFc 

 

Having watched the three J3 videos so far available, I have one observation / request. Could you please either leave out entirely, or greatly reduce the volume of the brief piece of introductory music? I had set my speakers only just above the minimum, but the music almost blew my head off! After rapidly turning the sound down even further for comfort, the description of the kit was inaudible....

[grob1234]

Having watched the three J3 videos so far available, I have one observation / request. Could you please either leave out entirely, or greatly reduce the volume of the brief piece of introductory music? I had set my speakers only just above the minimum, but the music almost blew my head off! After rapidly turning the sound down even further for comfort, the description of the kit was inaudible....

 

Hello Graeme,

 

Thank you ever so much for the honest feedback, its exactly what I need to make better videos.

 

I knew that one of the problems in the early days would be sound quality. The first video I shot (the J3 review) was done on an older compact camera. I chose this because it had continuous AF during video. However, I regard this as being an inferior camera to my DSLR, which despite being way more expensive, does not have continuous AF during video! The workbench video, and the video below were made with the DSLR, using the on board mic. Not ideal but I hope slightly better? I do intend to buy an external mic which should vastly improve the sound quality. I also intend to get some powerful LED studio lights which will double up as lighting for stills photography too.

 

In the following video, I have turned down the intro music, and maximised my own voice. I hope its a bit better now?

 

Thanks very much for taking the time to look at my video and offer constructive criticism; it actually sounded ok through my headphones as I was editing it, but I suppose all systems are different.

Edited April 6, 2017 by grob1234

[grob1234]

Now with video re uploaded due to editing errors!

 

https://youtu.be/-8sUg8T2R40

[Mookie]

Now with video re uploaded due to editing errors!

 

https://youtu.be/-8sUg8T2R40

 

 

Great Youtube channel. Look forward to the next instalment.

[grob1234]

Great Youtube channel. Look forward to the next instalment.

Thank you very much! Very much in it's early days at the moment but hoping to get a few followers. I'll be implementing some improvements in the next month or so that should improve the viewing experience.

[islandbridgejct]

Hello Tom,

 

I wonder could I ask a question prompted by your beautiful C12?

 

Initially I was surprised to see the location of the balance weights on the drivers, so I checked photos on lner.info and elsewhere to see if there was any obvious principle governing the location of balance weights. I had always thought they had to be directly opposite the connecting rod, and that seems to be the case on modern outside cylinder locos. But on older, inside cylinder locos it seems the balance weights can be almost anywhere, and that they do not have to be in the same place on both wheels, as with your C12. Was there some disagreement in the late 19th century as to the optimum location? Or is it because there is no necessary correlation on an inside cylindered loco between the location of the connecting rods and the location of the piston and crank? Or has it something to do with an inside cylindered loco being better balanced because there is less of a turning moment from the action of the pistons on each stroke?

 

I suppose I'm wondering if I need to check for each individual loco, or if I should expect it to be consistent among a class.

 

Thank you; apologies for the off-topic; and congratulations on your lovely modelling.

 

Alan

[grob1234]

Hello Tom,

 

I wonder could I ask a question prompted by your beautiful C12?

 

Initially I was surprised to see the location of the balance weights on the drivers, so I checked photos on lner.info and elsewhere to see if there was any obvious principle governing the location of balance weights. I had always thought they had to be directly opposite the connecting rod, and that seems to be the case on modern outside cylinder locos. But on older, inside cylinder locos it seems the balance weights can be almost anywhere, and that they do not have to be in the same place on both wheels, as with your C12. Was there some disagreement in the late 19th century as to the optimum location? Or is it because there is no necessary correlation on an inside cylindered loco between the location of the connecting rods and the location of the piston and crank? Or has it something to do with an inside cylindered loco being better balanced because there is less of a turning moment from the action of the pistons on each stroke?

 

I suppose I'm wondering if I need to check for each individual loco, or if I should expect it to be consistent among a class.

 

Thank you; apologies for the off-topic; and congratulations on your lovely modelling.

 

Alan

 

Hello Alan,

 

Thank you very much for your kind comments. Well observed too!

 

I simply attached the balance weights on the C12 according to the Isinglass drawing I have of the class. I also looked at the reference picture I used for the loco, and you're right it seems the balance weights are in 'random positions'. Unfortunately I don't know the reason for this. Possibly it was found that on the C12 this was the optimum position given the design of the wheels? Just like balance weights attached to the rim of a car tire perhaps?

 

I would probably check the photograph of the model you actually wish to make in order to get things right, however failing that, an average position should suffice. At the end of the day, its that classic thing of how far you wish to take your own model. Some wish to make an actual replica, others are happy to have a general likeness. Personally, I'm somewhere in between - I'll get it right if I can, but there is a definite limit to how far I will go - the time taken versus the reward given is usually the deciding factor.

 

Thank you very much for looking in, I hope to have more to share later in the day.

[gr.king]

I have no special knowledge or experience in these matters, but if you think about it, an inside cylinder loco has a crank axle. The webs of the cranks and the attached connecting rods provide a substantial amount of off-centre and reciprocating mass. If the wheels were fitted with the outside crankpins (and coupling rods) lined up with the crank webs there would be even more offset mass at the same angular orientation, creating the need for even bigger balance weights. I imagine the engineers of the day weren't slow to spot this, nor would they be slow to realise that by distributing the crank webs, the outside crank pins, and the balance weights at suitable angles around the full circle, the whole thing could become balanced with minimum overall weight.

Edited April 13, 2017 by gr.king

[grob1234]

My latest workbench update is now available, featuring how to make guard irons and cylinder drains, using blackening fluid, and a few new deliveries as well. Thanks for looking in,

 

https://youtu.be/bTmcIagGnyo

[gr.king]

Definitely a good idea to make the two guard irons and a stretcher all in one, where possible - it gives so much more chance of getting a reliable attachment to the loco.

[micklner]

Sound volume is very variable throughout the video. 

 

Drain cocks very nice, but very restrictive for the Bogie to be able  go around any sort of curve , I presume this is a OO gauge Loco ? .

[gr.king]

Build more realistic curves then?

[grob1234]

Using the 'goal post' method has ensured a good firm hold for the guard irons. I've checked on the Hornby A4 - I'm not convinced there is enough room ahead of the bogie to fit them. I'll investigate today.

 

Sound volume is very variable throughout the video. 

 

Drain cocks very nice, but very restrictive for the Bogie to be able  go around any sort of curve , I presume this is a OO gauge Loco ? .

 

Not quite sure what you mean here Mick? Yes its a OO loco. Due to current limitations, my locomotive chassis are configured for radius 3 set track, however the intention is to set them to approximately 3ft minimum radius in the future. Obviously with 00 being a huge compromise in terms of scale width, wheels, etc, then of course the drain cocks cannot be to scale. Also, it would be fantastic to be able to use 6ft + radius curves, but who has the space for that?! All the clearances work, and the bogie at least negotiates set track radius 3 without snagging on the drain cocks. The W1 itself struggles around rad. 3, but it really isn't designed for such tight radii. I think for all of us, either P4, EM, or 00, there will always be some form of compromise, especially if a layout needs to incorporate return loops or employs continuous running. 

 

Once again I apologise for the sound quality - I hope the videos are at least watchable, it seemed OK during testing. New mic will arrive in May so there will be improvements then.

 

Thanks for watching.

[micklner]

   By saying OO I should have also added EM or P4 for  thescale width. I cant imagine the Bogies having hardly any movement at all due to extended drain cocks in the other gauges . W1 is a real test for any curve due to the huge rear overhang. I had a Finecast version and didn't like the effect and sold it on.

   My current one I built using a Hornby A4 and Grame's Resin parts. No idea why but the  rear  takes the curves much better perhaps due to more space for the rear bogie to move into the curves.

   Guard irons should fit , I have a used a Brassmaster detail etch for the Irons on a non valanced Hornby one and they just cleared the Bogie wheels.

Edited April 13, 2017 by micklner

[grob1234]

I definitely agree that the W1 Chassis is a challenge around anything like 'set-track' radii. When tested on Grantham (3ft min rad I believe?) the locomotive went well, despite being truly underweight (now fixed with the addition of lots and lots of lead).

[gr.king]

I paid particular attention to see whether Tom's long cylinder drain pipes had been formed up so as to include the correct double bend behind their point of attachment to the guard irons (on some locos it's the steps instead). I note that Tom has included these bends, which provide space for bogie (or pony) wheels to move on the real thing. It's easy enough to exaggerate the offset at these bends a bit in the model, giving even more room for the loco to cope with curves. I notice that the moulded long pipes that Hornby supply, in the case of Cock o' the North for instance, are incorrectly dead straight. Fit those and tuck them behind steps or guard irons and you will definitely invite trouble......

[grob1234]

Hello Everyone, Happy Easter.

 

The C12 is finally complete. Taking on the experts advice, I weathered it from the following picture (from Yeadon's Register): 

 

 

I used a variety of techniques, including clay weathering wash, stippling with talc, some powder where the engine will not be handled and of course airbrushing with enamels and acrylic. I was particularly pleased with how the frame and brakes turned out, using Martyn Welch's book for advice. The effect I was after (as per the picture) was of a loco that had been cleaned in certain areas, and therefore displayed a range of finishes, from almost pure gloss, down to matt on the smokebox and cab roof. I wanted to show that a driver or cleaner had made some attempt to clean the loco sides, giving the impression that it was actually in good order. A closer inspection will reveal the muck on the loco frames and general build up of deposits on less accessible areas. I'll just need to add the crew and some coal, and 4527 will be ready for traffic. Anyway, here are the pics:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[grob1234]

Hello Everyone,

 

Well, you wait months for finished locomotives, and two appear almost at once. I have fully completed my W1. SE Finecast chassis and white metal tender, Hornby body, Graeme King resin conversion and full repaint. I am in the process of editing my latest workbench update video, which features how I did all the weathering on the W1.

 

Using quite a wide range of techniques. I have spent the last day weathering 10000, and I was really keen to recreate the classic look that the W1 (and A4's) have. I hope I have gone some way to achieving this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have also been working on my LRM J3. Apart from some mis-numbered parts on the fret, inconsistent instructions, and some odd building techniques, the kit is actually shaping up pretty well:

 

Edited April 27, 2017 by grob1234

[Atso]

Looking forward to watching the video later. That J3 is shaping up rather nicely, isn't it?

[gr.king]

I do like the weathering on the W1. Not over-done, present in the right places, convincing on comparison with photographs from the thirties.

[grob1234]

I do like the weathering on the W1. Not over-done, present in the right places, convincing on comparison with photographs from the thirties.

 

Thanks Graeme, I appreciate that, all down to the fact that you made the parts in the first place, so thank you! Well, that's all I did really, look at a few pictures of the W1 and A4's and try to copy the characteristics of the stains and muck. I suppose its impressionism in a way, but enjoyable none the less!

 

Looking forward to watching the video later. That J3 is shaping up rather nicely, isn't it?

 

Thanks Steve, yes the J3 is a nice looking little loco, and easy to paint, being all black

[grob1234]

And here is the full video on how I finished the W1's weathering - a day late, but who's counting?

 

https://youtu.be/ILW37O4EJGA

[grob1234]

Hello everyone.

 

After a bit of a break back in the UK, I'm back with a vengeance!

 

As Tony Wright mentioned in his thread, I popped over to see him at LB and had a great day playing trains. We ran the whole sequence of moves, and also had the opportunity to run my own models on his layout. I was most concerned about the W1 due to the very limited clearance this loco has, however, it went round really well at a scale speed of 140mph - awesome! The only alteration we had to make to it was to adjust the cylinder drain cocks as they fouled the leading bogie, but other than that it went well. The C12 and the J69 also had an outing, and after a little wheel clean, they went round well too. There are a few of Tony's pictures in his thread, but here is one of my own:

 

 

I have also been working on my London Road Models J3. It is definitely not a kit for the feint hearted, I have had to use all of my modelling experience to get it to where it is now. I'm not sure at the moment if it will be any good, in terms of running - I'm confident that the chassis is good, but I am concerned about clearances and potential shorts. However I will definitely try my best to make it a good un. In order to help with this I'll be swapping the current HL Loadhauler with a Loadhauler + to give me a little more room inside the boiler.

 

I modified the valves on the boiler sides with a small washer to give a better appearance:

 

 

The small handrails on the cab sides have been fitted:

 

 

Here is the boiler dry fitted. This was a difficult part to fit, a lot of fettling required! I polished up the brass fittings and they are just resting on in this pic:

 

 

Here is the current state of play. All lost wax castings fitted, boiler fitted, etc. I'll work on items below the footplate soon, once I have done the rest of the work on the boiler and interior.

 

 

I'm in the process of editing a new video for my YouTube channel, the new format will see a show released every Thursday night at 8PM UK time.

 

Cheers.

 

[John Rich]

Lovely shot of the W1 on LB Tom, your video on weathering the W1 using Flory Models washes was inspirational. I have just used them on a couple of Hornby A3's to try them out and I am really pleased with the result, many thanks for the tips.

 

John