A_S's workbench thead

[Western Star]

Not really sure anyone is paying attention to this thread...

 

Anyway, now time to put the painting stuff away back onto the building. Will start up the hopper again and onto one of Connoissours Jintys' bought at Kettering. However, i want to add some "detailing" - does anyone know of any detailing kits for this loco?

 

I am specifically looking for the following:

Cast Wheels (rather than slators plastic wheels..)

Cast Rods, rather than laminates

Better Coupling (i see people using several types? can someone expand on the options?)

Sprung Buffers (not sure if it has these, i havent checked the kit out in too much detail yet)

 

We are watching - you are not alone. I seem to recall that there is a RM Web thread on building this kit by "Adrian", might be on old RM Web.

 

There are a couple of suppliers of cast-iron wheels, including Alan Harris and Walsall - I believe that each has web sites. If you go this way then you have to consider how to get the wheels turned, see the RM Web "Finney A4 in 7mm for S7" where the model has AGH wheels and the subject of turning etc.. was aired.

 

I am not aware of any supplier of cast rods... Precision Components and Key Kits can supply rods which are milled from nickel silver.

 

If the kit does not include sprung buffers then look at the Slater's website for components as Slater's does a kit for the MR 0-6-0T.

 

regards, Graham Beare

[Rob Pulham]

Finnished!

 

 

 

 

Can anyone advise the best technique to glueing the coal into the bunker?

 

 

 

 

The easiest way is to just drip some dilute PVA over the coal once you have placed it in the bunker.

 

 

[will5210]

Thats rather admirable for a first effort! Hats off for perservering.

 

 

[A_S]

We are watching - you are not alone. I seem to recall that there is a RM Web thread on building this kit by "Adrian", might be on old RM Web.

 

There are a couple of suppliers of cast-iron wheels, including Alan Harris and Walsall - I believe that each has web sites. If you go this way then you have to consider how to get the wheels turned, see the RM Web "Finney A4 in 7mm for S7" where the model has AGH wheels and the subject of turning etc.. was aired.

 

I am not aware of any supplier of cast rods... Precision Components and Key Kits can supply rods which are milled from nickel silver.

 

If the kit does not include sprung buffers then look at the Slater's website for components as Slater's does a kit for the MR 0-6-0T.

 

regards, Graham Beare

 

Thanks, I will have a look for those threads and check the Gauge O Guild suppliers for these companies - I currently have 3 suppliers of Cast Wheels, Premier, Walsall (local to me anyway so could useful) and Alan Haris will look for the contact details of the above on the guild suppliers list.

 

will5210, thanks, as much an effort of fitting the time required in! Really enjoyable though, and a good start

 

edit: what do you mean getting the wheels "Turned" - Sorry for what is probably such a basic question, ive had a read of the wheel section on the above mentioned posts/threads and it is all going in one ear and coming out the other!

[Western Star]

Thanks, I will have a look for those threads and check the Gauge O Guild suppliers for these companies - I currently have 3 suppliers of Cast Wheels, Premier, Walsall (local to me anyway so could useful) and Alan Haris will look for the contact details of the above on the guild suppliers list.

 

edit: what do you mean getting the wheels "Turned" - Sorry for what is probably such a basic question, ive had a read of the wheel section on the above mentioned posts/threads and it is all going in one ear and coming out the other!

 

When you buy wheels from Slater's Plastikard the product is ready for use, just un-wrap and fit to the model (well almost, after cleaning and fitting crank pins if necessary). When one buys castings from the suppliers mentioned what one gets is just that - a casting fresh from the foundry. The casting needs to be machined (turned) to produce the necessary tyre profile, to clean up front/back faces and to bore the boss for the axle. I think that Walsall may supply their castings in a ready-to-go form. AGH does not provide machined castings, there are several avenues for getting the machining done (one as per the referenced thread). I have no information about Premier.

 

regards, Graham

[A_S]

When you buy wheels from Slater's Plastikard the product is ready for use, just un-wrap and fit to the model (well almost, after cleaning and fitting crank pins if necessary). When one buys castings from the suppliers mentioned what one gets is just that - a casting fresh from the foundry. The casting needs to be machined (turned) to produce the necessary tyre profile, to clean up front/back faces and to bore the boss for the axle. I think that Walsall may supply their castings in a ready-to-go form. AGH does not provide machined castings, there are several avenues for getting the machining done (one as per the referenced thread). I have no information about Premier.

 

regards, Graham

 

 

Thanks, I will try and get some research done and re-read that thread. I will probably try and buy them at Telford.

 

In the meantime i would like to get the handrail knobs, the coupling and the buffers - I'm not sure what style i need - i know it will be LMS maybe MR or LNWR? style but on slaters website there are loads of different options - rather confusing for a relative newbie..! Can anyone advise? I'm a bit stuck at the moment.

 

hand rail knobs

7951L Turned Handrail Knobs long [12 per packet] £5.05 £5.93

 

7951M Turned Handrail Knobs medium [12 per packet] £5.05 £5.93

 

7951S Turned Handrail Knobs short [12 per packet] £5.05 £5.93

 

Buffers (and hopefully housing!)

 

7900 MR Square base, long £7.57 £8.90

 

7901 MR Kirtley Square base, short £7.57 £8.90

 

7904 Pre-Group Round Base Parallel £7.57 £8.90

 

7905 London and North Western £7.57 £8.90

 

7906 GWR Collett Parallel £7.57 £8.90

 

7907 GWR Early Collett Taper £7.57 £8.90

 

7908 GWR Dean/Churchward/Armstrong Taper £7.57 £8.90

 

7909 LNER/SR Stepped Parallel £7.57 £8.90

 

7910 Drummond Standard LSWR/HR/CR/GSWR £7.57 £8.90

 

7911 LNWR Cooke Type £7.57 £8.90

 

couplings

 

https://slatersplastikard.com/scaleParts/7mmParts/locoParts/locoRods.php

 

any ideas which are prototypical/suitable for the Jinty?

 

 

[A_S]

phoned Jim yesterday and he was very helpfull - Advised that the buffers on the slaters site were not suitable so i now need to find another source, he mentioned Gladiator. I notice a supplier advertised in the gazette (very good issue by the way) so i will try them (hobbyhorse).

 

Anyhow, 2 days work and progress is good, going well so far. Only issue is that the bunker is not totally square, can't really notice it though. It isnt glued at the moment so the pictures are a bit more "wonkey" than when lined up in the slots. Quality of the pics isnt great - i can't get my head round how to get a good flash exposure with my compact camera.

 

 

 

 

 

[A_S]

Been progressing slowly this week. Had a conundrum of how best to fit (and not waste too much brass) the coal bars but the helpful folk on the guild forum pointed me in the right direction:

 

 

 

I had not considered putting the wire through the holes (in their raw form they don't have the diameter to push the wire all the way through).

 

 

Once I had tried this, bending around the correct length with the pliers was much easier. I also left the legs fairly long to enable me to position well and hold in place while I soldered the opposing leg. I did the left side first, so that is a bit wonky (Trial and error, learning curve etc) and I might just strip it... but I am pleased with the right side, I used a file through the middle to ensure all bars were evenly placed and smooth .

 

Current status:

 

 

 

 

[A_S]

I was looking at Adrian's site today which has some nice pictures of his build and i noticed that i had made a fairly elementary mistake, I'd fitted the bunker, tank and 1 cab window beading the wrong way round.... After a few hours and quite a lot of effort halfway there and the refitted beading is "fairly" flat on the bunker! Still you can see my mistake on the tank sides.

 

 

 

Ive also got a slight issue with the cab roof - the casting is quite a bit out of shape - should i give Jim a ring or is this normal (note: it isnt because of the angle of the brass, it doesnt fit if you try to marry up the side/top off the loco...

 

 

 

[bendy1]

If it is any consolation, I bought one of these kits off ebay earlier this year and am in the middle of the build.

 

It has the same problem with the roof casting not matching the sides. I guess it is a problem of getting white metal castings in a precise shape?? I was wondering what to do about it so will be eager to see what you do next!

 

Tony

[A_S]

Luckily there is some duplication in the castings and i was able to use the spare tank beading after i had stripped the beading which had been put on the wrong way... Cab build went well, spot soldered and made sure all was square with my usual trick of lego a few files to act as longer squareness measurers (and the cab roof) before running the iron round to spread the solder. Not cleaned it up yet as i need to file down the cab sides to fit flush with the ends (you can see this on the detail pics)

 

 

Bendy, I'm glad i am not the only one with an issue, heres what i have done so far: After I had soldered up the cab i tried to shape the cab roof with my finger and some hot water (as hot as i could manage, just to try and make the roof a bit more malable - It sort of worked and it isnt too bad now, maybe needs a few more passes. It took me a fair amount of time, and i had to apply a lot of preasure to the right side of the model.

 

 

 

 

How is your build going?

 

edit: sorry about the bold, seems to be this silly "interactive" posting box. Just give me a box and allow me to do the code... please.. this method doesnt work!

[bendy1]

Your cab roof looks better now - especially the front. I will give my roof the hot water treatment to see if I can get a better fit.

 

I had started to press down on the cab roof too much such that the cab sides started to distort a bit so was scratching my head about how to fix it.

 

My "kit" was actually something off ebay where a previous owner had partly completed the body and had made a mess of it. So lots of remedial work was necessary.

 

It is my first go at a brass kit so like you am learning what to do and what not to do! I found the front boiler wrap hard to do especially as I had to clean up the previous owners efforts.

 

Tony

[A_S]

I would say try and place equil preasure on both sides despite the fact that you may only need to reshape the one side, that way it will be more uniform.

 

I also have been having a few issues with the smokebox:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/topic/20259-smoke-box-wrapper-technique/page__gopid__200581&?do=findComment&comment=200581

 

Posted quite a bit here.

 

Does anyone know how many boiler bands i need. As suggested in the above thread it appears i need 4 but there are no etches front and rear to fit a band (and all the bands on the fret have a guiding rail to fit into etches!)

[bendy1]

It looks to me as if there are 4. On my kit, not all of the boiler bands have the locating strip.

 

I am not sure if you seen the links below and the photos showing the boiler bands on a completed model?

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/blog/320/entry-3786-jinty-nearly-there/

 

 

Tony

[A_S]

It looks to me as if there are 4. On my kit, not all of the boiler bands have the locating strip.

 

I am not sure if you seen the links below and the photos showing the boiler bands on a completed model?

 

http://www.rmweb.co....y-nearly-there/

 

 

Tony

 

 

Thanks for the link, i will have a look. I will also have a more detailed look at the etches - A lot of parts are duplicated which means i've probably missed the flat versions..!

 

Still having some trouble laminating the boiler band - I had a go after my clean up but it didnt want to laminate. I need to strip the band of the solder and try again. My time is going to get fairly limited soon too so hopefully i can get it moving!

[3 link]

When you solder the boiler bands on you only need to touch the band with the tip of the iron for about 1-2 seconds. This is because the boiler band is very thin so it transmits the heat very quickly, any longer and you will be heating the band so hot that it will take an age to cool enough to bond and in that time will probably slip out of position (been there, done that !!). Also when you tin the band before hand you do not need a large amount of solder, one it's harder to clean off, two because it will not help the band to sit tight around the boiler with excess solder in between. Hope this is of some help to you.

 

ATB, Martyn.

[bendy1]

Any progress recently as it has all gone quiet??

 

Tony

[A_S]

Progress has been slow, i haven't had a lot of time to be honest and I've been having a lot of trouble with the bands and the wrapper - still haven't got the wrapper on. I think i may need a stronger iron than the weller 40watt job. I've managed to get the boiler bands on now - at a fair amount of trial and error. There didnt seem to be a way to touch the band with the iron as the heat just wasnt transmitting.... i had to follow some advice from the guild forum (Where i also have a thread going) to touch the boiler and not the wrapper, even then i had to work my way round very slowly and it probably took me 10/15 minutes to get 1 done and soldered strong. Since i started my starter loco kit i've never really encountered a problem with soldering until this time - its always seemed fairly logical and worked well but i just can't get my head around what has been going wrong in this instance, as even when i follow the good advice as displayed here or at the guild it still doesnt seem to work...! so i must be doing something wrong!

 

Anyway boiler bands complete, but with a lot of cleaning up!

 

 

 

 

[A_S]

Tried the wrapper again - It went well for a while, as per the boiler bands, initially it started to solder but then i got a load of black and nothing from that point on would solder.

 

 

I persisted with the oposite side and got a fair amount soldered:

 

However it is a bit of a mess and I am not sure it is soldered all the way round, just at small points.

 

back not soldered at all. not sure what i am going to do about that!

 

 

 

..The solder doesnt seem to flow like when i heat other parts up, perhaps i need a bigger Iron or more solder? opinions/critisisms/critiques (and spelling amendments!) welcome!

 

 

[Sandy Harper]

More heat, less solder. Try a minature gas blow lamp like those used by chef's for browning food. Loads of heat in a small space .

 

Sandy

[bendy1]

I managed to do the job with a 40w soldering iron(antex) and although it wasn't simple, I completed the job.

 

I was wondering what solder flux combination you are using as you seem to be getting a lot of black residue and lots of solder across the join. I used Carrs red flux and 145ºC solder.

 

I hope this helps.

[A_S]

Thanks - I dont think i would have the confidence to use the gas blower first time out on such a complex peice. I would probably just end up seperating the former and the cover from the smokebox - I think i might have to resort to trying though at this rate.

 

My flux/solder is Bakers soldering fluid/145 deg solder - you are right, it does seem to spread a lot... That has struck me a few times.

[A_S]

problem solved... After having a read here, looking at Chris' technique at the guild/pictures and placing the part in the vice, with card to stop too much heat disapation it struck me - I had more time to think and less to think about (i.e i wasnt thinking about the length of time until my fingers got singed or burnt! - why did i have to hold the iron near the wrapper?

 

By doing such i was not maximising the surface area of the iron.... I changed my angle of atack with the iron to a more side on placement rather than tip/head on and of course the heat transfer was much much more instant and much more effective.

 

 

Finally got round to taking a few pictures. I still haven't had time to clean it up yet, busy weekend/week. I'm not sure when i will get chance between now and next weekend so it might stay like this for a while.

 

 

 

At least the hard work is done... It isnt perfect. when i look at the wrapper from square (photo not from square sorry...) you can see the bends at the neck are not symetrical/uniform between right and left, it is shallower on the left side.. i think the heat seperated the former from the original inner wrapper a bit, I think also the outer wrapper isn't soldered there, or isnt as tight as it should be. I don't think i am going to go back and fix it though in this instance - learn from the expereince and do better next time.

 

 

[A_S]

Progress slow due to Work and study commitments but i cleaned up my wrapper and resolded the sides this evening. I still need to secure the base of the circumfrance where the wrapper sides join. It isnt exactly soldered well there, as you can see above. Anyway some more photos.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[A_S]

 

Did a bit more today, filed the splashers and the smokebox to improve the fit, re-enforced the boiler/firebox locating tabs and refitted the left front tab, resoldered the base of the wrapper and built the basic chassis.

 

Also took the plunge on slaters wheels. I really wanted to get some cast wheels, tried to contact Alan Harris and Walsall model industries by e-mail but I didnt get a response, so i didnt bother to follow that option up. Maybe next time.

 

I'm now looking for a method of building the firebox wrapper, seems like it could go wrong very easily!