Top Gear?

[Dagworth]

Only one answer...

 

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My post is actually a lot more serious than it would at first appear, Gareth Jones (or Gaz Top as he was in our youth) is a TV presenter who has made a petrolhead show in the vein of Top Gear for a long while now. Check out http://www.garethjones.tv/onspeed.html

[rockershovel]

A sometime work colleague found his way into the logistics side of the entertainment business, some years ago. He reckons it is far easier than the oil business... he offered an interesting view of CE, from experience. His view was that CE was no more or less obnoxious than plenty of other people whom it might be your misfortune to meet in that business, but was a very competent and hardworking production executive with very high standards of execution.

 

He liked working on CE productions because (provided you avoided the man himself, which wasn't difficult) things happened that were supposed to happen, didn't happen that weren't, and generally functioned quite well.

 

It's like believing that Gordon Ramsey is simply an obnoxious, ill-tempered thug. People don't get to that level of success, in that fashion. They may present that image, but it's just an act.

 

So, I don't have a problem with the apparent contradiction of CE being brought in to do the overall work of getting the show running, but leaving because his presentation style didn't gel. I particularly couldn't see how the widely reported issues with Le Blanc fitted together with CE having overall control of the team composition.

[rockershovel]

Not sad to see CE going. EJ needs to follow suit.

 

Whilst undoubtedly a very talented and great driver, Sabine isn't great at presenting. perhaps they should have her as a Stig replacement - leave her to do what she's good at, driving??

 

Why not, indeed? My understanding of the whole "Stig" issue is that Clarkson was unwilling to have any sort of shared billing, for reasons of rights and remunerations, but couldn't find a driver of a sufficient standard who was prepared to sign such rights away for a fairly low remuneration, which was never fully resolved (both drivers going "public" about it for financial reasons, sooner or later). The Stig wasn't intended to be a character per se, or even necessarily the same driver from week to week, but the whole running gag of the "tame racing driver" evolved from the initial idea.

 

With Clarkson gone, and SS already part of the overall franchise, I don't see why she couldn't fill the role

Edited July 5, 2016 by rockershovel

[DavidB-AU]

The Stig wasn't intended to be a character per se, or even necessarily the same driver from week to week, but the whole running gag of the "tame racing driver" evolved from the initial idea.

Indeed when not actually driving (e.g. in the studio or the cross-London race where The Stig took the Tube) it's often one of the production staff in the suit.

 

Cheers

David

Edited July 5, 2016 by DavidB-AU

[45156]

Now he's quit TG what's the chance that he'll quit the Radio 2 breakfast slot as well, and make my day rest of my life.

 

Question is did he fall, or as speculated on hereabouts earlier, was he pushed?

[Dunsignalling]

Now he's quit TG what's the chance that he'll quit the Radio 2 breakfast slot as well, and make my day rest of my life.

 

Question is did he fall, or as speculated on hereabouts earlier, was he pushed?

Don't hold your breath.

 

I'm reminded of the riddle that circulated shortly after CE took over the R2 Breakfast Show:

 

Q. What's the difference between Terry Wogan and Chris Evans?

 

A. Terry Wogan got on your wick some of the time.........

 

John

[ParkeNd]

As has been said before, the success of the original TG was down to the unique combination of the three main presenters personalities. Trying to replace them is like trying to replace the two girls in ABBA with the unique way their two voices combined.

 

I fear TG is doomed.

[t-b-g]

I can't say that I am a huge fan of Chris Evans but I would say echo the comment above that he does seem to have a knack of making things happen and on his radio show (which I don't listen to for more than half an hour two or three times a week) I have got to the stage where I can enjoy him in that quantity.

 

I really don't think that anybody can last as long as he has in this type of business (plus he seems to have done OK financially - if a bit up and down over the years) without having some talent or ability.

 

The problem is that it is pretty much impossible for anybody in the entertainment industry to be liked and have their talent appreciated by everybody. There are some performers/presenters that are possibly less polarising than others but the ones who don't polarise opinions tend to be the most bland and boring ones.

 

If you don't like Chris Evans, it is quite possible to avoid him by turning over when he comes on, whether it be the telly or the radio.

 

My prediction is that whoever takes over as the lead presenter, there will be pages of posts on here complaining about it.

[chaz]

I can't say that I am a huge fan of Chris Evans .....

 

My prediction is that whoever takes over as the lead presenter, there will be pages of posts on here complaining about it.

 

That may well be so, but we can't possibly think that criticism on this forum has any effect on the BBC programme controllers. Surely the viewing figures are a bit more influential?

 

TG was very popular, it was starting to get a bit tired even before JC threw his punch, the relaunch was always going to struggle and the lack of humour is critical. I have often laughed out loud at some of the antics of Jezzer, Captain Slow and the hamster, and still do when I watch on Dave. But all good things come to an end.

 

Chaz

Edited July 5, 2016 by chaz

[Phil Parker]

Why not, indeed? My understanding of the whole "Stig" issue is that Clarkson was unwilling to have any sort of shared billing, for reasons of rights and remunerations, but couldn't find a driver of a sufficient standard who was prepared to sign such rights away for a fairly low remuneration, which was never fully resolved (both drivers going "public" about it for financial reasons, sooner or later). The Stig wasn't intended to be a character per se, or even necessarily the same driver from week to week, but the whole running gag of the "tame racing driver" evolved from the initial idea.

 

With Clarkson gone, and SS already part of the overall franchise, I don't see why she couldn't fill the role

 

The Stig was a solution to the problem that many manufacturers wouldn't let a TG team member drive the super-dupa cars they supplied. All the track stuff had to be handled by their own driver. Rather than have lots of different names, the Stig was invented. Anyone could be in the suit and we wouldn't know. There might have been a "main Stig" on the staff, but when Lamborrari say they won't let him drive, then their man goes in the suit and helmet.

 

As an aside, it turned into a useful brand and promotional idea and the BBC have made a lot of money licencing the character.

 

All of which suggests the Stig stays. I would be surprised if we don't end up with a presenting team larger than 3 though.

[ianwales]

Hi

 

Best thing BBC could do now is beg Clarkson & Co to come back

 

Ian

[Arthur]

 

 

My prediction is that whoever takes over as the lead presenter, there will be pages of posts on here complaining about it.

Not sure that is entirely borne out by this thread.

 

CE was always a Marmite choice as presenter, his production abilities aside, so it would have been a remarkable feat if he had turned all those people who did not like him into fans. As Martin (MJI) also pointed out earlier, it is unlikely there was already much overlap with the existing TG fan base and the CE fan base.

 

So it was almost certainly never going to work. If he had been brought in just as producer that may have worked better but maybe his ego was never going to see him always behind camera.

 

Jordan, to a much lesser extent, also came with negative baggage and, again, has fulfilled the expectations people had of him.

 

Peoples judgements have been much more nuanced to the others. I was on the warm side of neutral towards Le Blanc, thought him a bit subdued in episode 1 but have seen him grow into the role.

 

Sabine, great behind the wheel, must be hampered by language in a show needing fast wit and responses, I'm far less amusing in German!!

 

The others have had a mixed reception but, again seem to be garnering improved responses and have has favourable reviews for the on line Extra programme.

 

BUT, and I return to this again, so long as the new show remains a pastiche of the old, it will always receive unfavourable comparisons. Old TG was the showcase for the unique talents and chemistry of C/H/M, and will not work for others.

 

Now I hope that, with CE gone, the remaining team get the chance to work on their own format for the next series, some really new ideas, and I look forward to it with a degree of optimism.

 

 

.

[Glorious NSE]

If indeed that has been his main function, then by any metrics of success he has signally failed: critical response and viewing figures don't lie.

 

He fell out with or alienated co-presenters and crew alike, if the reports are to be believed.  The next series will stick with the remaining motley crew of presenters, the BBC has said.

 

So I'm not sure what his function was other than to pick up where the previous team had left off, tinker with the format, and inevitably watch the whole thing fall flat.

Alt view - Did he always have half a thought he might be a sacrificial lamb - whoever it was that took over will have had "he's not as good as...." as the verdict. 

 

Now we've all (mostly) got that out of the way, and he's drawn the flak from the rest of the team, will we watch the next series happily thinking that whoever has the lead it'll be an improvement?

[Reorte]

Alt view - Did he always have half a thought he might be a sacrificial lamb - whoever it was that took over will have had "he's not as good as...." as the verdict. 

 

Now we've all (mostly) got that out of the way, and he's drawn the flak from the rest of the team, will we watch the next series happily thinking that whoever has the lead it'll be an improvement?

My cynical side (which is most of me) has wondered that. Having someone divisive or plain unpopular would make it easier to shake things up a bit in the long run, and it seems that a lot of people thought that Top Gear could do with a bit of a shake-up.

[Kelly]

TG was tired about 5 years before the 3 amigos got the boot, with the way they were carrying on they'd have gotten themselves fired or the show cancelled with the negative political problems they'd have likely continued to generate, and the BBC being state funded the government would have put more and more pressure on them to change it and calm down (it no doubt has been made abundantly clear to them before the relaunch).

 

What is sorely needed is a total refresh of the format and style. Its likely the new Amazon show will be more of the same, but likely that will be rather flat as there's only so many times you can act like clowns in cars like they've done for 22 series!

[DavidB-AU]

Best thing BBC could do now is beg Clarkson & Co to come back

The BBC couldn't afford them. They are laughing all the way to the bank on Amazon Prime.

 

Cheers

David

[jjb1970]

I think the idea that whoever replaced the old trio was always going to fail is a bit unfair. There are plenty of examples of people stepping into the shoes of much loved predecessors and being accepted. Jack Dee on “I’m Sorry I Haven’t Got a Clue” stepped into a British institution and was embraced by the shows fans. I was a bit unsure about the remake of “Dad’s Army” but I gave it a chance and thought that the cast did a terrific job. Admittedly it is a very different comparison but “Strictly Come Dancing” appears to have retained the enthusiasm of its fans without Bruce Fivesyth (or at least my wife is still bonkers about the show). Even Evans established himself in the BBCR2 breakfast show, admittedly with a new audience. These other examples are different in that the old regime left in rather different circumstances but I really believe that TG fans would have responded well to the right host. Indeed, they do seem to have responded well to the new team except for Evans and Jordan. I think there were a few people unsure about Matt Leblanc but all credit to him, he is an excellent driver and an engaging personality with a dry sense of humour.

I think that the TG team should have looked at the initial launch of Clarkson era TG or even “Doctor Who” example of how to relaunch a show. In both cases they took a format that had been shelved and re-invented it for a new audience. In the case of TG they moved in a completely new direction and turned a rather dry, factual program into a motoring themed entertainment show. In the case of “Doctor Who” they retained enough of the old show to retain old fans whilst refreshing it and not being shackled to what went before so as to win a new audience. I’m very much with those who think JC era TG had reached the end of its life as if you take the personal chemistry of the presenters out of the equation the challenges etc had gone as far as they could several years ago and the other parts of the show had become a self-parody. I still loved it because the chemistry carried it a long despite looking tired in other ways but without that chemistry trying to revive the same show with new presenters was always going to be very difficult, regardless of Evans.

[bertiedog]

It is all under negotiation at present, Leblanc will stay if he gets CE's money, and a new production team is brought in to re-do the show from top to bottom, something the Beeb did not feel they could risk, as the show is very valuable to them. But with the disastrous ratings and poor feedback they have a stark choice, close down completly, or re-boot.

As the show was already slated as near to it's end before the Clarksongate, getting the CE series completed was always a risk. It has not paid off in any way, except to confirm the old format has had it's day. Time for a deep rethink this summer, they plan to do car films that might be used in a new format, or a new motor show altogether. Apparently Matt Leblanc, if he stays, would host any new format show proposed, but only if the money is right.

Stephen.

[DavidB-AU]

There are plenty of examples of people stepping into the shoes of much loved predecessors and being accepted. Jack Dee on “I’m Sorry I Haven’t Got a Clue” stepped into a British institution and was embraced by the shows fans.

True but they experimented with Stephen Fry, Jack Dee and Rob Brydon first.

 

Cheers

David

[45156]

True but they experimented with Stephen Fry, Jack Dee and Rob Brydon first.

 

Cheers

David

And they never found an adequate replacement for Willie Rushton when he passed away.  Clue is a show which works and will continue to do so, as long as the originals draw breath, and reamins true to its format, and as that old trouper, Barry Cryer told me once, "it's not broke, so it doesn't need mending" - so true.  But TG was broke, or close to broke, so more of the same meant that patching up was never going to do any good.

[Phil Parker]

Best thing BBC could do now is beg Clarkson & Co to come back

 

Ian

 

And accept that beating up a member of staff is perfectly acceptable? You might be happy with your boss punching you, or be just as willing to accept one of your children getting a split lip from their employer, but the most of us would consider this a bad thing. Being entertaining on the telly doesn't make it any better. It wasn't like he hadn't gone well beyond the point most people would have been sacked anyway.

 

Personally, I'd like to see the return of May, and Hammond if required, but not on TG. That job has passed to someone else.

 

You're also assuming that they won't be begging to return themselves of course. While I'm sure Clarkson lovers will be on Twitter lauding The Grand Tour as the greatest TV ever made within seconds of the first episode appearing, there's no guarantee it won't just be as tired as the later series of TG - reports on here suggest not all is rosy in the Amazon. If it is, them Amazon are likely to bin it rather faster than the Beeb did.

[Phil Parker]

And they never found an adequate replacement for Willie Rushton when he passed away.  Clue is a show which works and will continue to do so, as long as the originals draw breath, and reamins true to its format, and as that old trouper, Barry Cryer told me once, "it's not broke, so it doesn't need mending" - so true.  But TG was broke, or close to broke, so more of the same meant that patching up was never going to do any good.

 

I disgaree. A rotating position on the team has made a big difference to a show. Without it never enjoyed the singing of Rob Brydon or Jeremy Hardy.

[45156]

I disgaree. A rotating position on the team has made a big difference to a show. Without it never enjoyed the singing of Rob Brydon or Jeremy Hardy.

In its way, yes that's true, and you've got a point, but it's still a point that Willie was irreplaceable.  They didn't change the format, just the variations in the team.  I wonder what will happen when another regular departs?

[Arthur]

True but they experimented with Stephen Fry, Jack Dee and Rob Brydon first.CheersDavid

They did but none really brought any negative baggage and all more or less did a reasonable job. They went with Dee because he was the best, one of the others might also have made a reasonable fist of it.

 

Edit; Dee has also made a pretty good job of replacing Dara O'Briain on 'The Apprentice; You're Fired' show.

 

Maybe Dee for Top Gear

Edited July 5, 2016 by Arthur

[2mmMark]

Hi

 

Best thing BBC could do now is beg Clarkson & Co to come back

 

Ian