Stoke Courtenay

[Miss Prism]

When did Castles first start receiving elbow the later steam pipes?

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by Miss Prism
erroneous reference to 'elbow'

[checkrail]

The green finish looking good in that pic.

 

(No, don't need another Castle!)

[Limpley Stoker]

Hornby’s delicate lining at its best - and the shade of green is so much better!

 

 

 

 

[BWsTrains]

Odd!

 

Stoke Courtney has dropped out of the content search for "Topics I follow" despite there being a recent post and my still being present and correct.

1) this a test with a new post and 2) anyone else noticed the same?

 

Colin

 

PS That brought it back. Free "bump" for the topic 😎. Some obscure RMWeb glitch it seems

 

 

Edited October 31, 2023 by BWsTrains

[MrWolf]

I had that happen a couple of months back where Chufnell Regis dropped off the scope.

[checkrail]

2 minutes ago, BWsTrains said:

Odd!

 

Stoke Courtenay has dropped out of the search for "Topics I follow" despite my still being present and correct.

It's happened to me in the past when I've suddenly thought, "Not see anything from X for ages", and then found loads of posts I'd not seen, even though they were on threads I was following. I just put it down to IT gremlins.  Anyway, glad you've found the thread again.

[Coach bogie]

On 31/10/2023 at 03:09, Harlequin said:

How were the existing rivet holes dealt with in the buffer plate if that was the case? They aren't visible in photos...

 

E.g.:

 

From Neil Dimmer's ever useful collection:

https://railway-photography.smugmug.com/GWRSteam-1/Churchward-Locomotives/Churchward-Tender-Locomotives/Churchward-4300-Class-Mogul/Churchward-Mogul/i-4dtmr3r/A

 

I do not have an answer. The original buffer beam was removed in the process. I have seen images at Swindon showing  the beam removed and the extra long fixing bolts alongside the loco awaiting the new casting. I do not have the image. I will see if I can borrow it when I go back to the UK at Christmas.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[checkrail]

I mentioned recently that the Airstream ventilators on my Centenary coaches, which I'd fashioned from cream coloured self adhesive labels, had faded - to white in fact.  (With hindsight I could just have fabricated them from Plasikard Microstrip and painted them.).

 

So out came the Railmatch coach cream and a fine brush, results as seen below.  

 

 

In the longer term I intend to renew these coaches with Comet sides, but this latest bodge will do for now.  The thing that keeps me putting off the Comet conversion is the necessity of applying the double lining.  I'm afraid I'm pretty hopeless at applying lining transfers. 

 

The coach behind the King and in front of the D121 in this Penzance - Paddington train is a returning through coach from Newquay, providing an occasional use for a Bachmann E159, relegated from its former role as the Earlsbridge through coach by an E95 toplight.  Longer term I hope to apply Comet sides to this and my other Bachmann Colletts too.

 

John C.

[Neal Ball]

2 minutes ago, checkrail said:

I mentioned recently that the Airstream ventilators on my Centenary coaches, which I'd fashioned from cream coloured self adhesive labels, had faded - to white in fact.  (With hindsight I could just have fabricated them from Plasikard Microstrip and painted them.).

 

So out came the Railmatch coach cream and a fine brush, results as seen below.  

 

 

In the longer term I intend to renew these coaches with Comet sides, but this latest bodge will do for now.  The thing that keeps me putting off the Comet conversion is the necessity of applying the double lining.  I'm afraid I'm pretty hopeless at applying lining transfers. 

 

The coach behind the King and in front of the D121 in this Penzance - Paddington train is a returning through coach from Newquay, providing an occasional use for a Bachmann E159, relegated from its former role as the Earlsbridge through coach by an E95 toplight.  Longer term I hope to apply Comet sides to this and my other Bachmann Colletts too.

 

John C.

 

Nice photos as usual John.

 

The double lining is a faff - like anything, take your time and it'll be ok.  I wouldn't say mine are perfect, but they pass muster at normal viewing etc. 😎

[AlfaZagato]

Have you had a go with a bow pen?  If I'm not mistaken, later lining is pretty straightforward for 'penwork' on a Centenary.

[BWsTrains]

7 hours ago, checkrail said:

I mentioned recently that the Airstream ventilators on my Centenary coaches,

 

John,

 

yet another niche of GWR history of which I was blissfully unaware! Centenary stock and "airstream ventilators"?

 

That sent me off for some brekky reading and I found this highly detailed article:

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/steam-days/20210817/282321093085070

 

from which I learnt that they were even seen in Weston-super-Mare around the time of my "spotting" interest.

 

The airstream ventilators you refer to being presumably the compartment side flush sliding window vents which were installed during a 1938 refit? Was this another GWR first?

 

Colin

 

 

 

 

[Neal Ball]

12 minutes ago, BWsTrains said:

 

John,

 

yet another niche of GWR history of which I was blissfully unaware! Centenary stock and "airstream ventilators"?

 

That sent me off for some brekky reading and I found this highly detailed article:

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/steam-days/20210817/282321093085070

 

from which I learnt that they were even seen in Weston-super-Mare around the time of my "spotting" interest.

 

The airstream ventilators you refer to being presumably the compartment side flush sliding window vents which were installed during a 1938 refit? Was this another GWR first?

 

Colin

 

 

 

 

There was an interesting article in Steam World a couple of years ago I think.

 

It listed  all the different carriages and their history.

[Hal Nail]

On 30/10/2023 at 20:04, Miss Prism said:

When did Castles first start receiving elbow steam pipes?

 

I'm not sure when the first was but generally mid 50s. I've got an Earl with straight pipes and have been digging around to find the latest I could get away with. 

[Coach bogie]

On 31/10/2023 at 06:04, Miss Prism said:

When did Castles first start receiving elbow steam pipes?

 

Although no specific dates are mentioned. O S Nock, Stars Castles and Kings has images to show the change to elbows in the chapter called '1958 and after' .5018 St Mawes Castle seen so fitted. Revised steam pipes of similar style were fitted to the Kings from 1955, the all curve design reducing the breakages common with the straight section of previous designs due to flexing of the front frames/outside cylinders.

 

If anyone has the big castles book, is it recorded in there?

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Miss Prism]

After a brief perusal of the Castle pics at Rail-Online, it seems 1955 was the first year the elbow later pipes appeared, with all the class seeming to have received them by 1957. Elbow Later pipes running with early crest tenders can be seen.

 

The elbow later pipes vary in shape slightly, with some of the later ones having a King-like droop at the front. I haven't checked, but I guess the pipe fixing centres for both classes were the same. 

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by Miss Prism
erroneous reference to 'elbow'

[Miss Prism]

Will look at Nock tomorrow morning.

[BWsTrains]

5 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

After a brief perusal of the Castle pics at Rail-Online, it seems 1955 was the first year the elbow pipes appeared, with all the class seeming to have received them by 1957. Elbow pipes running with early crest tenders can be seen.

 

The elbow pipes vary in shape slightly, with some of the later ones having a King-like droop at the front. I haven't checked, but I guess the pipe fixing centres for both classes were the same. 

 

This shows 4083 bearing "GREAT WESTERN" -Coat of Arms no Garter which coincides with was introduced 3 years after it's build date and lasted until 1934.

 

 

from Smugmug GWRSteam-1 (embedded link)

 

For us Castle lovers it's worth refreshing the memory that 7018 Drysllwyn Castle ran non-stop the 117.6 miles Bristol to London, taking 93 minutes 50 seconds in 1958, an average speed of more than 75 mph (Wikipedia).

 

A trip which today (albeit with a few stops) is done at fastest in 98min!

Edited November 3, 2023 by BWsTrains
amended first line

[Coach bogie]

3 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

 

This shows 4083 bearing "GREAT WESTERN" -Coat of Arms no Garter which coincides with 3 years after it's build date.

 

 

from Smugmug GWRSteam-1 (embedded link)

 

For us Castle lovers it's worth refreshing the memory that 7018 Drysllwyn Castle ran non-stop the 117.6 miles Bristol to London, taking 93 minutes 50 seconds in 1958, an average speed of more than 75 mph (Wikipedia).

 

A trip which today (albeit with a few stops) is done at fastest in 98min!

Do you know for sure that it was taken in 1926? I only ask as the tender does not have the first style of spring hangers which hung below the frames. 

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

[Hal Nail]

Interestingly (or perhaps not!) although steam pipes, buffers, square front edge to steam chest and repaints to totem all happened fairly close together, they all seem to have been done completely independently. I've seen all sorts of combinations. 5058 Earl of Clancarty came out of its totem repaint* still with taper buffers for example, but then had them swapped later. You would think a part that common by then, would be done while it was already in the works but I don't know to what extent changes were done locally?

 

*it wasn't just a tender swap, the loco was painted as well 

Edited November 3, 2023 by Hal Nail

[BWsTrains]

2 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

Do you know for sure that it was taken in 1926?

 

Good question Mike! However, I don't think I said that, but I shall amend my words for greater clarity..

 

Re 1926, I thought that particular Insignia came in around 1928 (my Source: Railway Modeller - special supplement "Modelling the GWR").

 

It hadn't escaped me that the insignia might have been applied as late as 1934 or even had the Coat of Arms added to the earlier plain Great Western it would have been born with in May 1925. Many alternatives are possible. What seems unlikely is that this early insignia from pre-1934 could last through all the shirtbutton and G W R periods unchanged on a prestige Class loco.

 

There is a long list of tenders with which it was paired but that feels like a rabbit burrow and above my pay grade for said burrowing.

Edited November 3, 2023 by BWsTrains

[Miss Prism]

2 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

Re 1926, I thought that particular Insignia came in around 1928 (my Source: Railway Modeller - special supplement "Modelling the GWR").

 

The first instance of the coat of arms (between GREAT and WESTERN) I can find is May 1926, although that photo might be somewhat after loco build (tender swapping always makes things complex), so maybe 1927 (as stated in Great Western Way) is more correct. Garter crests could however be seen on new tender repaints for a year or so after that as stocks ran down.

 

Edited November 3, 2023 by Miss Prism

[Harlequin]

On 30/10/2023 at 20:04, Miss Prism said:

When did Castles first start receiving elbow steam pipes?

 

@Miss Prism Are you asking this in the context of Hornby's model of Caldicot Castle?

 

The steam pipes look right to me, curve-straight-curve as opposed to continuous curves.

 

(Is the continuous curve version what you mean by "elbow"?)

 

Edited November 3, 2023 by Harlequin

[Miss Prism]

On 03/11/2023 at 11:25, Harlequin said:

@Miss Prism Are you asking this in the context of Hornby's model of Caldicot Castle?

 

No. (Just normal thread drift with me wondering outloud.)

 

On 03/11/2023 at 11:25, Harlequin said:

The steam pipes look right to me, curve-straight-curve as opposed to continuous curves.

 

Looks fine to me as well.

 

On 03/11/2023 at 11:25, Harlequin said:

(Is the continuous curve version what you mean by "elbow"?)

 

Yes. Edit: But see later clarification of 'elbow'.

 

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by Miss Prism
erroneous reference to 'elbow'

[checkrail]

A busy morning at Stoke Courtenay with three passenger trains in view, with the usual motley mix of coach types typical of the GWR.

 

 

John C.

[Neal Ball]

12 minutes ago, checkrail said:

A busy morning at Stoke Courtenay with three passenger trains in view, with the usual motley mix of coach types typical of the GWR.

 

 

John C.

 

Lovely mix of carriages John.