Bromsgrove New Station

[D854_Tiger]

The new station at Bromsgrove opened this month offering some new photographic opportunities for the Lickey banking operation.

 

As this rather excellent clip shows.

 

[rovex]

I must say it looks a vast improvement on its predeccesor.

 

I also understand at some point the line from Barnt Green to Bromsgrove will be electrified to allow the Cross City line to be extended

[D854_Tiger]

I must say it looks a vast improvement on its predeccesor.

 

I also understand at some point the line from Barnt Green to Bromsgrove will be electrified to allow the Cross City line to be extended

 

Currently six electric trains per hour (off-peak) ply their way over the Cross City South, three terminating at Longbridge and three extending to Barnt Green and Redditch.

 

I believe the plan is that all three trains currently terminating at Longbridge will extend to Barnt Green and Bromsgrove.

 

The first time I visited Redditch in the 1970s it was on one of the two only (both ways) per day peak time DMU workings.

 

The other stations on the Cross City line had only one extra working over that.

 

Not sure about Bromsgrove back then, when the service was at its nadir, but I'm guessing it wasn't too many trains.

 

It only had one platform as I remember the trains had to use the same crossovers the bankers used in order to call there.

 

Not that I ever experienced it, my abiding memory of Bromsgorve was always passing non-stop keeping an eye out for the bankers (Hymeks in those days).

 

A hydraulic was an exotic beast to us Brummies back then, rarer than girls, the sight of those bankers (always the same three) being a first exciting glimpse of what was to come further south.

[Ramblin Rich]

Really enjoyed that clip, the exterior design of the station is rather nice!

Having experienced the cross city line during the end of the DMU era when Tyseley struggled to field a full side of units, it's good to hear that the service is busy & due to be extended.

[Captain Kernow]

When out on a visit to Oddingley crossing with a former colleague who still works in operations for NR covering that area, I was given to understand that certain operational 'issues' with the new station and track layout as regards banking of freight trains have still to be resolved.

 

Also, the increase in electric passenger services on the bank, while welcome in many respects, is causing a lot of concern to the FOCs, who are not convinced that the NR project team have fully understood the operating characteristics and limitations of freight trains on the Lickey Incline, whether going up or coming down the bank, in terms of how those freight paths will actually integrate with passenger paths 'in the real world'.

[John_Miles]

There is still a loop to be laid behind the down platform. It looks like the loop behind the up platform will be used for the Cross City trains and freights waiting to be banked which could be the problem referred to above.

 

I was at Birmingham University when the Cross City service started - with cast off DMUs from the BedPan service amongst others. I think it was a train scheduled every 20 minutes - the service was very unreliable. Much better these days and a train every 10 minutes.

[Edwin_m]

The eventual layout will have the Cross City terminating on one of the centre tracks and the through trains going either side, but I read somewhere this can't be done until the existing station is demolished to allow realignment of the outer tracks. 

[edcayton]

I'd have thought double-heading was easier than banking, or are they worried about couplings breaking?

 

Ed

[Zomboid]

Do they bank in the traditional manner these days, where the helper isn't actually coupled to the train?

[D854_Tiger]

Do they bank in the traditional manner these days, where the helper isn't actually coupled to the train?

 

There and are some nighttime cab rides on youtube showing this to be the case, the banking locomotive dropping off at Blackwell.

 

Special headlights are equipped on those class 66s for such purposes.

 

I was given to understand that certain operational 'issues' with the new station and track layout as regards banking of freight trains have still to be resolved. 

 

Regarding service levels, a quick check on Real Time Trains reveals that banking operations during the day are few and far between, most freights up the hill seem to be diagrammed for the evening and early hours.

[D854_Tiger]

There and are some nighttime cab rides on youtube showing this to be the case, the banking locomotive dropping off at Blackwell.

 

Special headlights are equipped on those class 66s for such purposes.

 

I was given to understand that certain operational 'issues' with the new station and track layout as regards banking of freight trains have still to be resolved. 

 

Regarding service levels, a quick check on Real Time Trains reveals that banking operations during the day are few and far between, most freights up the hill seem to be diagrammed for the evening and early hours.

 

 

P.S. Some of the freights are used to return the bankers from whence they came, as they are no longer based at Bromsgrove full time, in which case I would imagine they will be coupled up.

[D854_Tiger]

There and are some nighttime cab rides on youtube showing this to be the case, the banking locomotive dropping off at Blackwell.

 

Special headlights are equipped on those class 66s for such purposes.

 

I was given to understand that certain operational 'issues' with the new station and track layout as regards banking of freight trains have still to be resolved. 

 

Regarding service levels, a quick check on Real Time Trains reveals that banking operations during the day are few and far between, most freights up the hill seem to be diagrammed for the evening and early hours.

 

P.P.S. It also depends on the coupling type buckeyes presumably demand that the banker should be coupled up.

 

Perhaps an expert could tell us how the procedure works nowadays regards TPWS working.

[Tavy Man]

There is still a loop to be laid behind the down platform. It looks like the loop behind the up platform will be used for the Cross City trains and freights waiting to be banked which could be the problem referred to above.

 

I was at Birmingham University when the Cross City service started - with cast off DMUs from the BedPan service amongst others. I think it was a train scheduled every 20 minutes - the service was very unreliable. Much better these days and a train every 10 minutes.

The line being laid behind the Down Platform island will be the new Down Gloucester Line and when it's commissioned on November 7th will have a maximum speed of 90mph through it. The existing Down Main alignment will become the Down Bromsgrove Station Loop and it is this platform that is ear marked for the terminating Cross City Services. At present only the 2 centre platforms will be electrified although some of us are pushing hard for the Up Bromsgrove Loop platform 1 to be wired as well.

[Zomboid]

Would seem to me to be an idea to electrify over to where the bankers join in, and use an electric loco to give trains a shove. Would be a much more powerful shove than a diesel could manage.

[surfsup]

Would seem to me to be an idea to electrify over to where the bankers join in, and use an electric loco to give trains a shove. Would be a much more powerful shove than a diesel could manage.

And could be a good use for some of DBCs underutilised Class 92 fleet as well!

[Captain Kernow]

The problem with the banking is, as I understand it, more of an operational procedural one as regards the new arrangements. I believe there are also inadequacies in the phone provision.

 

The facility for banking is 'as and when required' and double-heading is not normally permitted, this is connected to the steepness of the gradient and coupling strength. Freights are getting ever longer, so I doubt that the requirement for banking will completely disappear any time soon, although new traction such as Class 70s does help. The banker, under normal circumstances, is still permitted not to attach to the rear of the train being banked.

 

However, if the outer face of the Up platform becomes the fast line (like the Down), then that is potentially not good news for banking freights, because that would mean the banking loco having to cross the Up Main line from the banker loco siding, to reach the rear of a train requiring banking.

[Great Western]

And could be a good use for some of DBCs underutilised Class 92 fleet as well!

I reckon if a 92 took full power banking a train up hill, most of the West Midlands power supply would trip !

[Joseph_Pestell]

Would seem to me to be an idea to electrify over to where the bankers join in, and use an electric loco to give trains a shove. Would be a much more powerful shove than a diesel could manage.

More power certainly but do they have such good traction control (anti-slip) provision?

[Joseph_Pestell]

 

However, if the outer face of the Up platform becomes the fast line (like the Down), then that is potentially not good news for banking freights, because that would mean the banking loco having to cross the Up Main line from the banker loco siding, to reach the rear of a train requiring banking.

 

Not ideal but at least it means that the banking loco gets to shove on straight track which must make things a bit easier.

 

Also, I don't think that the track layout is definitive yet. Perhaps the Up Main could diverge further south and the banker siding be between the Up Main and the Up Centre Line.

[Zomboid]

More power certainly but do they have such good traction control (anti-slip) provision?

depends on the loco, I'd guess. Of stuff that exists today a 92 would seem the obvious choice as it's got six axles rather than the four that most other electrics have, which normally means 50% more tractive effort, though how it actually compares to an 88 or a 90 I have no idea. Of course, in this hypothetical world we could have a six axle electric with advanced traction control.

 

I imagine if it was an electric loco on the front, then banking up there would be a thing of the past. Not sure of train weights, but 92s get up the hills on HS1, which would almost have needed a rack in steam days...

[Tavy Man]

Not ideal but at least it means that the banking loco gets to shove on straight track which must make things a bit easier.

 

Also, I don't think that the track layout is definitive yet. Perhaps the Up Main could diverge further south and the banker siding be between the Up Main and the Up Centre Line.

Just a quick line to clear up any confusion. The new Up Gloucester Line formerly the Up Main, stays on its existing alignment through platform 2. The existing Up neck for the bank engine stays in its existing position and has direct access to both the Up Bromsgrove Loop platform 1, or the Up Gloucester platform 2. Therefore freights can be banked from both Up Lines.

There is no main to main crossover south of the station. However, there are trailing and facing main to main crossovers at the north end of the station.

[Fat Controller]

depends on the loco, I'd guess. Of stuff that exists today a 92 would seem the obvious choice as it's got six axles rather than the four that most other electrics have, which normally means 50% more tractive effort, though how it actually compares to an 88 or a 90 I have no idea. Of course, in this hypothetical world we could have a six axle electric with advanced traction control.

 

I imagine if it was an electric loco on the front, then banking up there would be a thing of the past. Not sure of train weights, but 92s get up the hills on HS1, which would almost have needed a rack in steam days...

The trains the 92s work on HS1 are relative light-weights, just passing the 1000t mark at a guess. In the Tunnel, they're allowed about 1300t working alone or about 1700t when in multiple. Some of the freights that work up the Lickey will be considerably in excess of this, notably the coil workings for Corby and elsewhere.

[The Stationmaster]

depends on the loco, I'd guess. Of stuff that exists today a 92 would seem the obvious choice as it's got six axles rather than the four that most other electrics have, which normally means 50% more tractive effort, though how it actually compares to an 88 or a 90 I have no idea. Of course, in this hypothetical world we could have a six axle electric with advanced traction control.

 

I imagine if it was an electric loco on the front, then banking up there would be a thing of the past. Not sure of train weights, but 92s get up the hills on HS1, which would almost have needed a rack in steam days...

 

But don't forget - as the good Captain said - there is also the rather important matter of Coupling Strength and that can be just as important in some situations, especially on very steep gradients, as the matter of sheer load moving grunt.

[Mallard60022]

Send the freights a different route?

Good station if rather lacking in character, but then I like brick.

Phil

[Zomboid]

But don't forget - as the good Captain said - there is also the rather important matter of Coupling Strength and that can be just as important in some situations, especially on very steep gradients, as the matter of sheer load moving grunt.

In my imaginaryland where the freight up the lickey has electric traction, we abolished the archaic screw coupler in favour of the better-in-every-way knuckle couplings in about 1920... Obviously they're not unbreakable, but I doubt coupling strength would be an issue with British train sizes.