Derailment Near Watford Junction due to landslip

[Reorte]

The solution is surely to not allow growth on embankments in the first place. Once you do, you get the vicious cycle you refer to.

Given that we're unfortunately past that point just about everywhere though the question is what's the best thing to do now? Put up with the leaves and occasional tree falling down, or cut them down and try to restabilise the bank, running the risk of landslips in the mean time? I suppose the trees could be cut down and the whole lot concreted but that sounds like an incredibly unpleasant (and expensive) solution, to be reserved for particularly bad spots.

[The Stationmaster]

Given that we're unfortunately past that point just about everywhere though the question is what's the best thing to do now? Put up with the leaves and occasional tree falling down, or cut them down and try to restabilise the bank, running the risk of landslips in the mean time? I suppose the trees could be cut down and the whole lot concreted but that sounds like an incredibly unpleasant (and expensive) solution, to be reserved for particularly bad spots.

 

The WR used to concrete grout troublesome embankments in the Thames Valley and the technique seems to have been successful as some of the once regular slip sites don't seem to have given trouble for years and the former ACE at Slough who I see occasionally has said the system worked well (until you try to pile in the bases for ohle masts).  Whether it could be used in cuttings is probably a slightly different question and in any case the angle of repose of the slope will obviously play a part in the use (or not) of the technique).

 

The older Western technique - almost certainly used elsewhere I would think - in cuttings depended very much on the angle of repose but involved using stone to create both strengthening plus providing a drainage course, but it obviously relied on having good drains in the formation as well.

[Nearholmer]

Possibly more than most people ever wanted to know about methods of stabilising railway embankments http://www.uic.org/cdrom/2008/11_wcrr2008/pdf/I.3.3.1.1.pdf

 

http://railwaysubstructure.org/railwiki/index.php?title=The_Foreword

 

Similarly learned articles about stabilising cuttings can be found on-line, especially if you use "google scholar", rather than plan "google".

 

K

[Fat Controller]

'Soil-nailing', in conjunction with a mesh surface covering, can stabilise both cutting and embankments to allow low-growing vegetation to establish.

Trying to get property-owners to maintain the drainage on their side of the boundary is a big problem, especially as so many farmers now contract out work. There is a second consideration here, in that contractors usually use very large bits of kit, which can compact the ground, and increase run-off.

As to other potential sources of increased run-off, such as providing hard-standing adjacent to railway lands; sometimes Network Rail's Asset Protection staff get to hear about it, or sometimes the local authority planners will get wind of it, but it seems a haphazard process.

[Bernard Lamb]

Taken from the blocked off lane at the bridge north west of the tunnel this morning.

Sorry for the poor photo as it was directly into the sun.

It does show the curve in the slow lines, also the netting, just where trees have been cut down and where they remain and the construction work on the top.

Bernard

[Nearholmer]

Bernard,

 

Could you work out what that thing built on top of the tunnel is?

 

As I said in a previous, I've now drifted into thinking that it is a film set. They build them by stacking ISO containers, plus bits of zip-up scaffolding. If it is a film-set, it will probably disappear as quickly as it arrived, at some point.

 

Kevin

[Bernard Lamb]

Bernard,

 

Could you work out what that thing built on top of the tunnel is?

 

As I said in a previous, I've now drifted into thinking that it is a film set. They build them by stacking ISO containers, plus bits of zip-up scaffolding. If it is a film-set, it will probably disappear as quickly as it arrived, at some point.

 

Kevin

I think it is within the boundary of the WB site Kevin, but no idea what it is. 

It looms up on the skyline like a giant ship.

Checking a map there is no public access any nearer than where I was standing to take the photo.

With better light and a longer lens it might be possible to see enough detail in an image to make out what it is..

Bernard

[Talltim]

Its for a new Spielberg film, 'Ready Player One'

'Spy' video, annoying music and doesn't add much, but I'll put it in anyway.

[Nearholmer]

So, not the Government's latest ill-judged attempt to give the impression that they are doing something about affordable housing, then?

 

K

[Reorte]

1-DSC_0556.JPG

Taken from the blocked off lane at the bridge north west of the tunnel this morning.

Sorry for the poor photo as it was directly into the sun.

It does show the curve in the slow lines, also the netting, just where trees have been cut down and where they remain and the construction work on the top.

That really brings home how steep it is.

[RJS1977]

Those cutting sides do look incredibly steep - I was under the impression most cutting sides were nearer to a 45 degree slope unless the rock is very stable (e.g. the chalk cuttings at Pangbourne are in the latter category).

[Bruce Depot]

Are the slow lines open yet?

[Bernard Lamb]

Are the slow lines open yet?

They were in use while I was there yesterday.

Bernard

[jonathan452]

Those cutting sides do look incredibly steep - I was under the impression most cutting sides were nearer to a 45 degree slope unless the rock is very stable (e.g. the chalk cuttings at Pangbourne are in the latter category).

Did I not once read that the London and North Western Railway (to save on expenditure) undertook as much of the quadrupling works as possible within their existing land ownership?

 

Obviously for reasons already discussed the second tunnel at this location would have required the purchase of additional land but the steep sides to the approach cuttings) may have have been in order to minimise the area required?

[Nearholmer]

Bruce

 

They were certainly open for Monday morning peak, but I don't know when exactly they were returned to use.

 

For the first part of this week, the PA on stations was pumping-out quite a good pre-recorded message from the "route MD" or similar, apologising for the chaos on Friday, and saying that things had been restored as quickly as they could be.

 

As a seasoned (very!) commuter, I've been quite impressed by the blend of NR, VT, and LM this time. They were very swift with info on Friday, pushing it out as fast as they were getting it from the battle front, and there has been none of the excessively precautionary behaviour that has caused more disruption than necessary sometimes in the past. LM staff are even getting better at crowd management, although this is still a weak spot that I fear will catch them out one day.

 

Kevin

[TheSignalEngineer]

Did I not once read that the London and North Western Railway (to save on expenditure) undertook as much of the quadrupling works as possible within their existing land ownership?

 

Obviously for reasons already discussed the second tunnel at this location would have required the purchase of additional land but the steep sides to the approach cuttings) may have have been in order to minimise the area required?

There are some places where you would struggle to get in three tracks to current standards, let alone four.

[TheSignalEngineer]

Bruce

They were certainly open for Monday morning peak, but I don't know when exactly they were returned to use.

For the first part of this week, the PA on stations was pumping-out quite a good pre-recorded message from the "route MD" or similar, apologising for the chaos on Friday, and saying that things had been restored as quickly as they could be.

As a seasoned (very!) commuter, I've been quite impressed by the blend of NR, VT, and LM this time. They were very swift with info on Friday, pushing it out as fast as they were getting it from the battle front, and there has been none of the excessively precautionary behaviour that has caused more disruption than necessary sometimes in the past. LM staff are even getting better at crowd management, although this is still a weak spot that I fear will catch them out one day.

Kevin

Looking at Realtime trains they were open by 0700 approx on Monday. I haven't studied before that.

[96701]

Bruce

 

They were certainly open for Monday morning peak, but I don't know when exactly they were returned to use.

 

For the first part of this week, the PA on stations was pumping-out quite a good pre-recorded message from the "route MD" or similar, apologising for the chaos on Friday, and saying that things had been restored as quickly as they could be.

 

As a seasoned (very!) commuter, I've been quite impressed by the blend of NR, VT, and LM this time. They were very swift with info on Friday, pushing it out as fast as they were getting it from the battle front, and there has been none of the excessively precautionary behaviour that has caused more disruption than necessary sometimes in the past. LM staff are even getting better at crowd management, although this is still a weak spot that I fear will catch them out one day.

 

Kevin

The 'industry' has taken criticism for lack of information on board and are trying to work together despite the legal ramifications. They seem to have woken up to the fact that most people see 'the railway' as one homogeneous being, so Virgin making announcements that Network Rail are at fault doesn't cut any ice from a customer satisfaction perspective. "Passenger Satisfaction" is one of Network Rail's measures on which performance is measured, hence bonuses, so it is no small wonder that things are now improving. By the way, another of Network Rail's measures in "Customer Satisfaction" to differentiate between TOCs / FOCs and passengers. I just think that it is rather fine that such a word as "passenger" has made it back into the railway lexicon.

[BR(S)]

DRS 57312 was sent from Crewe to Watford to shunt the damaged 350264 on to an unwired road in Watford Yard.  This will enable a crane to lift each coach on to a lorry to take them back to Germany, where they were built.  They will be assessed for repair or write-off.  The loco then went back to Crewe light engine.  Photos not mine; sent by a friend with authority to be there and posted here with his permission.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Nearholmer]

Shunting engines look remarkably posh these days!