RMweb Premium BR60103 Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2016 Did any of the GWR City class overlap with the LMS City class? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RosiesBoss Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 G'day, all, A slight variation to the main theme - identical running numbers for two locos of the one class. In 1968, AD60 garratt 6042 was outshopped from Cardiff Workshops (NSW) and was photographed next to ....... another 6042 - with both engines in steam! More details of how this came about are listed here: https://en.wiki2.org/wiki/New_South_Wales_AD60_class_locomotive https://www.railpage.com.au/f-t11337807.htm Reference: "A Tale of Two Garratts" in Essays in Steam (Eveleigh Press, Sydney, 1995) pp35-38 Here is (2nd) 6042 in regular service: Regards, Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Did any of the GWR City class overlap with the LMS City class? The GWR engines were all withdrawn several years before the Coronation class appeared (except for City of Truro which wouldn't count). Several shared names however. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Although not quite the same, 70021 Morning Star, 92220 Evening Star and 70023 Venus were all named after the same celestial body, the planet Venus. Sandra There are also two Pendennis Castles (Class 57 and steam loco) and there were for a while two Cities of Truro (HST power car - since de-named - and steam loco). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 There is a photo of two GWR no. 111s together. One is somewhat larger than the other. Near the bottom of the page - http://www.steampicturelibrary.com/dmcs_featured.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Why? Because they are named after different organisations with the same name? Just thought I'd ask !! At least you knew why. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pendlerail Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Didn't there used to be two L S Lowrys one 86 and a coach on the manchester pullman rake? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Don't know how many of them existed at the same time, but there has been a Bulleid west country, a 33 and a 159 all named Templecombe. I suspect in terms of actually existing the 33 overlapped with both, but they may not have carried the make simultaneously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jub45565 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 To go off at a tangent if I may, how many instances where one loco carried more than one name? More meaning at the same time rather than the likes of renamed Royal Scots and Kings due to ceremonies, and Jubilees whose countries were renamed! One of the Ashover Light Railway Baldwin 4-6-0s carried one name of Joan, but one side tank sprung a leak so a spare tank from an out of use loco was swapped in - and the name Bridget was left applied. Probably less common on standard gauge mainline railways, where side tanks were less of a separate entity, and tank engines far less regularly named. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PMP99 Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2016 Britannia 70010 and V of R No 7: 'Owain Glyndwr' 70010 received correct Welsh spelling in 1966 I think, having originally been named Owen Glendower. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PMP99 Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2016 Britannia 70010 and V of R No 7: 'Owain Glyndwr' 70010 received correct Welsh spelling in 1966 I think, having originally been named Owen Glendower. In similar vein: Class 47 47145 and FR Fairlie No 10 Merddin Emrys Class 86 86258 and Talyllyn No 1 Talyllyn Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 I suppose the next obvious question has to be - have any two locos with the same name met in normal service, rather than for publicity purposes (so one loco turning up at the other loco's naming ceremony doesn't count, nor would say 47145 being specially chosen to take a charter to Blaenau). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jub45565 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 At least 2 locos were named 'Bellerophon' concurrently - an LMS Jubilee & a Haydpck foundry well tank built on 1874 & not retired until 1964, & then preserved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 At least 2 locos were named 'Bellerophon' concurrently - an LMS Jubilee & a Haydpck foundry well tank built on 1874 & not retired until 1964, & then preserved. Bellerophon was also a LNWR Precursor. Withdrawn in June 1933 not long before the Jubilee entered service in 1936. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 To go off at a tangent if I may, how many instances where one loco carried more than one name? More meaning at the same time rather than the likes of renamed Royal Scots and Kings due to ceremonies, and Jubilees whose countries were renamed! One of the Ashover Light Railway Baldwin 4-6-0s carried one name of Joan, but one side tank sprung a leak so a spare tank from an out of use loco was swapped in - and the name Bridget was left applied. Probably less common on standard gauge mainline railways, where side tanks were less of a separate entity, and tank engines far less regularly named. There's a Class 87 in the NRM with different names on the two sides. And 'Earl of Merioneth' has/had Welsh plates on one side and English on the other. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 LMS Royal Scot 6142 was named Lion between 1927 and 1936 so it could have been a possibility that it met Liverpool & Manchester Railway's Lion at some point. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crantock Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 There seem to be a lot of locos called "Thomas" around. Gets coat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 There have been plenty of 'Lions' over the years, including the BRCW one-off, a Class 50 and a Guinness 08. These latter two survive in preservation, as of course so does the L&M loco. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 There have been plenty of 'Lions' over the years, including the BRCW one-off, a Class 50 and a Guinness 08. These latter two survive in preservation, as of course so does the L&M loco. I was thinking that it must be rare to have a locomotive that was named after another locomotive rather than being named after something or someone else as a coincidence. Especially in the 1920s. It even had a plaque depicting the locomotive on it. Can't find a decent photo. But you can get the idea from here. http://fox-transfers.co.uk/6142-lion Surely they met when Lion was running around in the 1930s? Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 I suspect the 'City of Truro' HST power car was named after 3440 rather than the city in Cornwall. Class 66 Evening Star is certainly named after 92220. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal.n Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 60103 'Flying Scotsman' and 91101 'Flying Scotsman' both currently have the nameplate Flying Scotsman.... Edit: corrected wrong '91 number Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviesparx Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 A slight tangent, but in the vein of two locos with the same name... I do remember reading a story about the Battle of Britain class 'Winston Churchill' being prepared to pull the Late statesman's funeral train... The story suggested it was in storage at Salisbury, and was moved to Nine Elms for preparation to pull the funeral train. Another BoB was also prepared as a back-up... During it's prep a problem was discovered, requiring the second BoB to be readied. However, the thought of Sir Winston's final journey not being pulled by the loco named after him was unthinkable, and so the nameplates / numbers were swapped and the spare BoB went out as 'Winston Churchill'.... OK, so probably an urban myth from the same people who suggested there were no moon landings, and no doubt the photographic evidence will confirm that it was the real loco.... But then again, they had photos from the moon, right ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 A slight tangent, but in the vein of two locos with the same name... I do remember reading a story about the Battle of Britain class 'Winston Churchill' being prepared to pull the Late statesman's funeral train... The story suggested it was in storage at Salisbury, and was moved to Nine Elms for preparation to pull the funeral train. Another BoB was also prepared as a back-up... During it's prep a problem was discovered, requiring the second BoB to be readied. However, the thought of Sir Winston's final journey not being pulled by the loco named after him was unthinkable, and so the nameplates / numbers were swapped and the spare BoB went out as 'Winston Churchill'.... OK, so probably an urban myth from the same people who suggested there were no moon landings, and no doubt the photographic evidence will confirm that it was the real loco.... But then again, they had photos from the moon, right ? No, that's a (relatively) common occurrence. According to Pat Whitehouse & David St John Thomas's GWR150 book, 'Windsor Castle' was supposed to haul King George VI's funeral train from Paddington to Windsor (HM having driven the loco on one occasion). However the loco was in Swindon Works when HM died, so the plates were swapped with another loco and never returned. There's also a rumour (which may or may not be true), that the Guinness Hibberd locos 'Carpenter' and 'Walrus' swapped identities on entering preservation as a prospective purchaser wanted a particular loco, but the other was in better condition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Not quite the same name, but the GWR (and later BR(W)) had two locos named after the same person at the same time. Castle 5056 'Earl of Powis' and W&LLR No 1 'The Earl'. The first two VoR locos 'Prince of Wales' and 'King Edward VII' were both named after the same person! 'Prince of Wales' was delivered first as it wad thought inapproproate to run 'KE VII' before the coronation had taken place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Gringo Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Here's a few more "locomotives with the same name at the same time" from the last days of the Big Four (just before 1948) and the early days of the British Railways era. All of which you could have spotted in different regions and just occasionally a few might turn up together if you were in the right place at the right time! e.g., Shrewsbury, Oxford, Carlisle, etc.GWR Saint 4-6-0s and ex-NBR, Scott 4-4-0s;2902, Lady of the Lake, 626902981, Ivanhoe, 624102970, Quentin Durward, 624322989, Talisman and (The) Talisman, 62428 GWR, Bulldog 4-4-0s and a WC Light Pacific, four LMSR, Jubilee 4-6-0s and three LNER A4 Pacifics;3383 (although name removed by 1948), Ilfracombe, 340173393, Australia, (4)55633395, Tasmania, (4)55693407, Madras, (4)55753408, Bombay, (4)55763391, Dominion of Canada, 600103448, Kingfisher, 600243453, Seagull, 60033 GWR Stars and an assortment of LNER engines and LMSR Pacifics;4012, Knight of (the) Thistle, 60065 *4042, Prince Albert, 62663Princes Henry and George already mentioned.4047, Princess Louise, 46204 (and was also carried by the last ex-LNWR Claughton, allocated 46004)4048, Princess Victoria, 46205Princesses Mary, Alice, Beatrice, and Alexandra are also part of this series and already mentioned.4057, Princess Elizabeth, 46201 GWR Castle, 5043, Earl of Mount Edgcumbe and P,D & SWR tank,30757. GWR, Dukedog 4-4-0s, SR N15X, 4-6-0s and a couple of LMSR 7P, 4-6-0s;9083, Comet, (4)57359064, Trevithick, 3232732329, Stephenson, 45529 Jubilee (4)5574 India and George V, 4-4-0, allocated 58011, but never carried. GCR, Director 4-4-0s and NBR 0-6-0s (the latter of which had seen service on the Western Front)62665, Mons, 6522462669, Ypres (6)526962668, Jutland, and 45684 (Jubilee, 4-6-0) A4 Pacific, SR, King Arthur 4-6-0 and BR Standard 5, 4-6-0.60027, Merlin, 30740 and later 73080.As mentioned previously 20 names from withdrawn King Arthur 4-6-0s were passed on to B.R. Standard 5/4-6-0s, as also were a series of names from ex-NBR, Scott 4-4-0s passed on to the new Peppercorn A1 Pacifics: 60115, Meg Merrilies, from 62406; 60116, Hal o' the Wynd, from 62417; 60124, Kenilworth, 62431; 60129, Guy Mannering, 62413; 60135, Madge Wildfire, (6)2407; 60137, Redgauntlet, 62402; and 60143, Sir Walter Scott, from (6)2403.Edit: Four A4 Pacifics also provided names for the new Peppercorn A1s, A4/No.3 (60003, Andrew K. McCosh) was Osprey which went to 60131; A4/26 (60026, Miles Beevor) was Kestrel, later 60130; A4/28 (60028, Walter K. Whigham) was Sea Eagle, later 60139 and A4/34 (60034, Lord Faringdon) was Peregrine, later 60146. In fact, several more A4s carried more than one name and A4/No. 20 Guillemot was renamed Dominion of Pakistan for a time, before reverting back to Guillemot as 60020.All the Lord Nelson class names (excepting 30853, Sir Richard Grenville, why?) could be found as shortened versions on ex-LMS Jubliee 4-6-0s. However, as previously mentioned, only the superb "Howard of Effingham" (30854/45670) was exactly the same. There are a few engines with very similar names, for example: 30458, Ironside and 30799, Sir Ironside! Castle class, 4037 is The South Wales Borderer, and so is 46156 (but the Royal Scot has 'Borderers' on the nameplate), Castle, 5076 is Gladiator, or you can have Gladiateur on A3, 60070; then, B4, 0-4-0T, 30081 is Jersey but GWR, Dukedog, 9084, Isle of Jersey! You can start lots of arguments in a quiz, if you're not very careful with the questions!* Edit: apparently 4012 and 60065 fell into this category after Nationalisation, see pH post 53, on next page.The name "Gazelle" would also have appeared on the odd-looking 0-4-2 Well tank (ex-Shropshire & Montgomeryshire Railway and latterly on the Longmoor Military Railway) at the same time as on the B1/4-6-0, 61003.I'd like to have owned one of each of the most popular name carried by steam engines between 1948 and 1964: "Prince of Wales", found on 9, 4041, 60054, 62662.All the best,JohnOnce a spotter - always a spotter! Edits were added on the afternoon of 8th November Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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