South Wales Valleys in the 50s

[The Johnster]

The drivers have been complaining to Tondu's already harrassed shed foreman (he hasn't been allocated enough auto fitted engines to adequately cover the work) that they are experiencing wheelslip with 5633 on loaded coal trains,  An inspector has had a day out riding on her to investigate the problem, and it is accepted that driving technique is not the cause of this problem.  When leaving Cwmdimbath, whether from the platform road or the loop road, the loco has problems getting away on even dry rail.  She pick up eventually, but timings are tight at some times of the day and she is affecting other services.  6642, identical mechanically, can take a loaded coal train out with no issue whatsoever, even if you are a bit rough with her. 

 

An investigation is to be carried out, but it is likely that the issue is rooted in weight distribution and that adjustments to the equalising beams will bring her into line with the expected performance.  In the meantime she is not to be rostered to mineral duties pending the outcome of the investigation.  The Per Way Dept have been asked to provide a report on the level of track in this location, but no serious anomaly is expected to be found here.

 

In other words, 5633 needs more ballasting above the driving wheels...

Edited October 24, 2018 by The Johnster

[5BarVT]

I do like the way you concoct a whole (realistic) story around a ‘simple’ modelling issue.

Paul.

[Ian Smeeton]

Have you thought about building a couple (or more) cassettes, and replacing one of the roads in the fiddle yard to save physically handling the stock?

 

Regards

 

Ian

[tomparryharry]

The drivers have been complaining to Tondu's already harrassed shed foreman (he hasn't been allocated enough auto fitted engines to adequately cover the work) that they are experiencing wheelslip with 5633 on loaded coal trains,  An inspector has had a day out riding on her to investigate the problem, and it is accepted that driving technique is not the cause of this problem.  When leaving Cwmdimbath, whether from the platform road or the loop road, the loco has problems getting away on even dry rail.  She pick up eventually, but timings are tight at some times of the day and she is affecting other services.  6642, identical mechanically, can take a loaded coal train out with no issue whatsoever, even if you are a bit rough with her. 

 

An investigation is to be carried out, but it is likely that the issue is rooted in weight distribution and that adjustments to the equalising beams will bring her into line with the expected performance.  In the meantime she is not to be rostered to mineral duties pending the outcome of the investigation.  The Per Way Dept have been asked to provide a report on the level of track in this location, but no serious anomaly is expected to be found here.

 

In other words, 5633 needs more ballasting above the driving wheels...

Ooh, tyre profiles. Back to Caerphilly. I'd guess they would send another loco, say, 5690? Or, 6601, 6675, and 6676?

[The Johnster]

I do like the way you concoct a whole (realistic) story around a ‘simple’ modelling issue.

Paul.

 

I find this back story sort of stuff adds to the fun, and the illusion of it being a real railway, admittedly a small one and in the 1950s. What, I say to myself, would happen if a real loco failed to perform in the way that my 5633 has, to satisfactorily haul it's booked loads despite identical locos of the same class having no problem.  Something I suspect like this; the loco starts to get a reputation among her regular link drivers on this job. who discuss it and agree something is wrong.  Different driving techniques are employed, somebody brims the tanks to increase the tractive weight, but nothing works.

 

Convinced among themselves now that there is a real problem, they complain as a group to the shed foreman.  They have all mentioned it to him individually on previous occasions, and he has promised to look into it, but of course he hasn't, putting it down to greasy rails, dragging wagon brakes, bad driving technique and so on; he's seen this sort of thing before and is far too old a hand at the game to take much notice of what drivers say, but now even he is fairly happy that something really is amiss with 5633.

 

He goes through the records of the loco since she was allocated and realises that the problem has arisen since her last works visit, and suspects that she is not set up as she should be.  He contacts the Loco Dept's Area Manager, who sends an inspector to ride on the engine and take notes next time she is allocated to duty U23, the afternoon Cwmdimbath Colliery clearances.  He duly turns up and rides on the loco for the day's duty, taking a turn on the regulator to see for himself how the problem manifests itself; 5633 duly obliges by slipping to a standstill leaving the theoretically easier platform road with a full load of 262 tons trailing, 11 wagons including one hopper and the van, well within a 56xx's capacity.  The train can only be got away by setting back and having such a run at the station throat that controlling it on the steep descent following is a bit hairy, but they get away with it!  This is not recommended technique, however!

 

The inspector's report, which does not mention his failure to drive the loco successfully (!), something he would rather a discreet veil be drawn over,  concludes that the loco must return to workshop for work to be done on the equalising beams and precise weighing done to resolve the issue.  Until she can be found a workshop place, she remains in service but is not to be used for mineral work.  Luckily there are alternatives available, and 8448 and 6642 will share the work with 4214.

 

I'm going out for a beer shortly, so will take the top off her tomoz and cram as much ballast in her as I can manage, then we'll giver her another shot at U21 or U23.  I am actually a bit mystified; the only difference between her and 6642 is that 6642's identical mechanism is more run in and the wheel tread surfaces may be less smooth, and the her body is presumably slightly lighter being an old Mainline without the weight of the firebox backhead, but I can't imagine that makes much difference.  If the ballasting doesn't cure 5633, I will have to reload my minerals by taking the existing coal out and filling the wagons with blocks of expanded poly on which the top dressing of coal is put to save weight, but I rather like the heft and feel of this 'heavy' train and don't want to do that unless there is no alternative.  

 

I have done some modelling this evening, though, stripping down my newly acquired clerestory composite for repainting and adding interior detail.  This, and the brake 3rd that it came with, is a Hornby Made in China LNER liveried coach to be repainted into austerity plain brown GWR, and has different B1 bogies to the riveted ones on my previous Triang brake 3rd, which is in 1947 choc/cream, but I have modified them into ersatz Dean bogies in the same way, cutting out the tie bars and glueing footboards to them, made from coffee stirrers cut in half lengthways and to length.  I am leaving the newer brake 3rd for now.  Further work will include compartment dividers and seats, and I must buy some Ratio seating strips for it.  It doesn't actually look like a composite, in the sense that all the compartments are equally spaced, and I will probably model it as an all third.

 

Onwards and upwards, or perhaps sideways and backwards...

 

I have no other haulage issues with any of my locos, all of which will easily haul any train on the layout.  The slipping occurs at the same spot every time, and it may be that something is dragging or otherwise impeding the train's progress, but if there is I can't find it.  I should be able to ballast my way out of the problem, but will report back if I can't!

Edited October 24, 2018 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

5633 is now capable of hauling a full coal train, 11 loadeds and a van, but we've had a bit of an adventure getting her to this state, partly because of my own hamfistedness and partly because Bachmann have not designed this chassis to be proof against a bit of hamfistedness, which I reckon they should...

 

Firstly I haven't had the body off this chassis before.  I've had 6642's, on what I thought was an identical chassis, off many times with no problem, but this little so and so proved a bit more recalcitrant.  On 6642, you remove the couplings from their NEM dovetails and the body securing screws are underneath them; not on this, there's a hidden one that you have to removed the keeper plate to get at.  Unless you are extremely careful (and I wasn't) at this point you stand a very good chance of breaking the contact between the supply cables and the copper pickup strips bonded to the keeper plate.  

 

Ok, out with the soldering iron.  Now, I'm not the world's best solderer, and the worry with heat that close to a plastic part is that you are all too liable to melt it.  Nonetheless, I managed to solder the very delicate little wire back on successfully.  Pleased with myself, I proceeded to separate body and chassis; the chassis needed a bit of persuading with a screwdriver as a jemmy but the task was accomplished without further disaster.  Looked like I could jam a good bit of blu-tack in the smokebox and more above the motor, especially in the top of the firebox.  Not sure that this was enough to make any real difference, but hey ho, we've got it open and now's the time to do it.

 

Re-assembled carefully and put on track for test; dead loco.  Bad words at this point.  Went away and had a cup of tea.

 

Took it all apart again and found that one of the feed wires from the DCC chip I don't need had come off the motor terminal, and this is in a particularly inaccessible spot to get my soldering iron into, with all sorts of electronical gubbinses for me to cook if anything went wrong.  Ok, I thought, I know how to make this job easier and safer. I'll take the motor out and unscrew the DCC chip so I can get at things.  During which procedure I managed to break the other wire at the chip end.  More bad words.

 

At this point, I realised that the stupid pathetic flimsy little wires had beaten me, and that anything I do now is only going to make matters worse.  I took 6642's body off it's chassis and transferred 5633's body onto 6642's old chassis.  The firebox backhead has been transferred as well.  I have a current spec body on a recent spec chassis (there is a difference in the wiring and the DCC chip which is irrelevant to my purposes.  6642 is withdrawn from service pending a repair to 5633's original chassis, and since this is not a current spec body but an antediluvian Mainline one with no backhead or front step handrails, maybe permanently.  The chassis remains in component parts, and I will investigate getting it properly repaired, i.e. not by me, then seeing if Baccy will supply me with a current spec body to go on it.

 

As I say, a loco calling itself 5633 and in late 1948 BR livery with red backed numberplates is now able to handle a loaded coal train on my layout without any problem.  Whether this is because it sits on top of a chassis that was always capable of this or because I have ballasted it a bit I do not know, or particularly care!  6642's chassis is a smooth, silent, and sufficiently powerful one and I am happy with the illicit union between it and 5633's bodywork.

[31A]

Would it be easier to just take all the DCC stuff out, if you're not going to need it, and 'hard wire' from the pick ups to the motor?  I'm not familiar with the insides of this model, but have done it myself a couple of times on other locos which I've ham fistedly damaged internally.

[The Johnster]

I had thought of this, but the problem is the difficulty of accessing anywhere on the motor to hardwire to.  The place that needs to be soldered to is in a narrow space between the motor and it's housing, and not easy to get at to hold the wire in place while you solder it.  It is certainly not impossible, just very fiddly and I will not attempt it with my current 400 watt soldering iron after todays debacle; this is a good excuse to buy a better one, possibly controllable.

 

Current thinking is to at least have a go at this and go down the professional repair route if it fails, but I need to cost the job out first, and compare the estimate for professional repair (local model shop) against the price of a new iron.  I need to go model shop shopping tomoz anyway for brown paint to do the clerestory in for 1942 austerity livery, and will make some enquiries.

[Happy Hippo]

A 400 Watt iron? Wow!

 

 

Make my day, Punk!

 

Seriously, I'm sure that must be sufficient fellow modellers in the Cardiff area with smaller soldering irons and nimble fingers that could do the work you want.

[tomparryharry]

A 400 Watt iron? Wow!

 

 

Make my day, Punk!

 

Seriously, I'm sure that must be sufficient fellow modellers in the Cardiff area with smaller soldering irons and nimble fingers that could do the work you want.

What you haven't been told, is that Young Jonners is doing a soldering job in Cardiff, whilst sitting in Bristol.....

[The Johnster]

For safety reasons.

 

What I think I need is a more powerful iron with a smaller bit.  I'll have a look in town today at what they've got in Antics, but I'm starting to miss the Maplins 5 minutes walk from where I live!  As I've said I'm no great shakes as a solderer, but I reckon a hotter iron would enable me to get in and out quicker and reduce the likelihood of damage from heat to local components.  The one I've got seems to take ages to melt the solder, which means I have to hold things in position with my shaky hands for impractically long periods, while the temperature is rising...

Edited October 26, 2018 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

Numbers had arrived from sunny Ayrshire, Modelmasters, for 4218, 5555, and (red backed) 9649, and will be applied to the relevant locos later today, but I must go shopping for brown paint suitable for the new clerestories and pricing up soldering irons first.

 

I like Modelmasters' numbers.  They take a little while to arrive, but are worth the wait; they 'look right' and I am especially pleased with 9649's red backed ones, an improvement on my home painted efforts.  They are very reasonably priced for a product of this quality as well.  No connection, just a satisfied customer!

[The Johnster]

Bad news, folks; Antics in Wood Street in Cardiff is closing in November.  The building it is in is to be demolished for a new development, and plans for alternative premises have fallen through.  I will miss them; they have been an excellent source of glues, paints, materials, tools and so on, and the odd wagon or Oxford road vehicle.  Good luck to the staff, who have been friendly and knowledgable.

[Ian Smeeton]

Bad news about Antics and worse on the soldering front.

 

 

What you really need is a set of these, for all soldering jobs from substations down! (2mm finescale track for scale)

 

Best regards

 

Ian

[tomparryharry]

I think your on 'bay nowadays. However, try Argos...... Or, Screwfix, and my last gasp, Toolstation.

Edited October 26, 2018 by tomparryharry

[The Johnster]

Amazon will probably be my next port of call for a soldering iron, Ian.  By the way, I think I may have meant 40watt, not 400.  I'd have burned half of Cardiff down by now with one of those, even sitting in Bristol...

 

I've decided not to do anything to 6642 for at least a week, while I ponder the situation.  I reckon I need a new soldering iron, 60 or 65 watt, in any case but I am not sure how much more soldering I will actually ever do once 6642's chassis is running properly. How many brass kits am I going to build in the next 20 years.  Maybe some Comet coaches and perhaps a Southeastern Wills 2761 to replace my Hornby if I'm feeling particularly adventurous, and careless with my cash (the recent improvement in 2761's running has made me much more favourably disposed towards her and less likely to go for a replacement).

 

My new numbers are on which means that 9649, and 5555's makeover, are complete.  I bought a pack of P D Marsh pre-painted loco crew, 2 crews in a pack, and some wire to have a go at 6642 with.  Numbers are another 'pending' job as, although all my locos now have correct Tondu numbers for locos that spend a reasonable amount of time at the shed during my period, and all bar 2761 have etched brass, all bar 2761 need smokebox numbers as well (9649 is modelled in early BR condition with G W R unlined green livery and red backed number plates, smokebox plate, and a BR shedcode plate).  They all have them, of course, but they are etched brass, which although it looks wonderful on cab side plates is wrong for smokebox numbers, which were cast iron plates with white painted numbers on black or red backgrounds.  I am reasonably certain that 2761 never carried a smokebox number plate or a BR shedcode plate. basing this on a 1950 photo of the withdrawn loco at Swindon awaiting disposal which shows no trace of brackets or fixings for the number plate or shedcode plate.  I have not bothered with an etched plate for this loco as I don't want to mess about with filing the moulded raised Hornby plates off; the other locos all had printed or transfer plates.

 

So my smokebox numbers must be white.  There are two ways of doing this; I can attempt to paint the etched numbers by means of painting the whole numberplate white then painting a coat of black over it and wiping the black off the number surfaces to reveal them in white, or, if this proves unsatisfactory, attempt to apply the tiny HMRS transfers over the brass numbers.  At least the brass numbers will be a position guide in this case.  Actually there is a third option, attempt to hand paint the raised numbers on the etched plates.

 

Either of the latter two options are going to be very close to the limit of what my eyesight and hand/eye co-ordination can achieve, and will have to be done very slowly and carefully, one number per plate per session and even that is probably going to drive me insane, or, to be more exact, even more insane than I already am!  But my recent success with 9649's buffer beam numbers is encouraging, and I am going to give it a go, starting with the black on white and then rubbed off method.

 

Back to the operating session; the evening Remploy clearance won't shunt itself!

Edited October 26, 2018 by The Johnster

[31A]

Eileen's Emporium and Squires sell soldering irons and equipment suitable for model railway use, as well as a lot of other useful stuff.  For the wiring inside a loco you don't need a very big one, 15 watts or maybe 25 watts would suffice:

 

https://eileensemporium.com/index.php?option=com_hikashop&ctrl=category&task=listing&cid=1125&name=brass-3&Itemid=189

 

http://www.squirestools.com/files/12-17.pdf

[31A]

Here's another way of getting smokebox number plates, which I have used:

 

http://www.pacificmodels.co.uk/smokebox-numberplates/4mm/br-western-region

 

Printed on paper, with white numbers on a black background you just need to cut them out with a sharp knife, blacken the edges with a felt tip pen and stick 'em on the smokebox door!

[Northmoor]

I am reasonably certain that 2761 never carried a smokebox number plate or a BR shedcode plate. 

Do you know if ANY 27xxs carried a BR smokebox number plate, BRITISH RAILWAYS lettering (or in GW font) or even early BR logo?  Every post 1947 photo I've seen is impossible to ascertain the livery or lettering.  It looks as if, knowing they weren't long for this world, BR simply didn't bother spending even the cost of paint on them.

[The Johnster]

Here's another way of getting smokebox number plates, which I have used:

 

http://www.pacificmodels.co.uk/smokebox-numberplates/4mm/br-western-region

 

Printed on paper, with white numbers on a black background you just need to cut them out with a sharp knife, blacken the edges with a felt tip pen and stick 'em on the smokebox door!

 

The answer to my problem, 31A, many thanks for this information!  I will definitely investigate this on pension day!

 

Do you know if ANY 27xxs carried a BR smokebox number plate, BRITISH RAILWAYS lettering (or in GW font) or even early BR logo?  Every post 1947 photo I've seen is impossible to ascertain the livery or lettering.  It looks as if, knowing they weren't long for this world, BR simply didn't bother spending even the cost of paint on them.

This is fundamentally what seems to have happened; at the point of nationalisation Swindon was well advanced in a program of replacing these locos with new 96xx series 8750 panniers, in effect the modern version of the same loco.  I doubt any ever carried a BR livery, and they would either have been in GW unlined green or austerity black, with locos painted at Caerphilly between 1942 and 1945 (including my 2761) sporting the 'grotesque' sans serif initials.  The economy had not recovered from the war in 1948 and full austerity measures were still in place, and paint was one of the things in short supply!  If you are modelling a Caerphilly painted engine, remember to include the works' trade mark, red painted reversing lever linkage.

 

I am less sure about smokebox number plates, though; I think I remember seeing a photo of a Merthyr 2721 at Potsticill somewhere (it might have been at Pontsticill on a visit to the Brecon Mountain Railway) in 1949 or 50, with a smokebox number, presumably red backed, but don't quote me on it!  AFAIK smokebox numbers and shedcode plates were affixed to locos in service at their shed, and a works visit would not be required, so you might see clean numbers on a filthy loco.  2721's were at the bottom of the food chain in the late 40s and 1950, and rarely well presented.  Tondu's were probably used as yard pilots and I'm pushing Rule 1 a bit having one at the top end of a valley; if anyone asks she's been commandeered off a pilot duty to replace a failed loco, or ordered up the valley at Control's behest with an ad hoc clearance, to the delight of her bottom link crew.  In recognition of this, she is facing the 'wrong' way, smokebox down the valley to emphasise that she is probably not the booked loco for the job.

 

I have been booking her on the miner's workman's, but the crews have been complaining about rough riding at passenger speeds; she is, after all, on her last legs.  But I prefer a BR liveried pannier on this job because the stock is in GW livery and I like to mix things up a bit to re-assert that I am not modelling the GW, only it's aftermath, one of the reasons for choosing this period.  I try to avoid her appearing on the layout at the same time as 8448, not built when she was withdrawn from service.  

Edited October 27, 2018 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

Bit of progress with the new shorty clerestories today; managed to paint them unlined austerity brown, do the lettering and crests, matt varnish to seal the transfers, re-glazed, and got the compartment dividers (the piece of card my latest Modelmaster numbers came attached to) in.  I have a new train!  Well, almost; they need to be numbered and this needs another HMRS sheet.

 

What to number them?  They are originally Hornby LNER liveried coaches, but the old Triang GW versions from 1961 to go with Lord of the Isles, (the bodies are identical except for the bogie mounts) were numbered 2316 for the brake 3rd and 5017 for the all second, which I think was sold as a composite, incorrectly.  The Hornby LNER claims to be a 1st/3rd composite, but all the compartments are the same size.

 

I already have a Triang shorty brake 3rd in shirtbutton livery carrying 2316, (as of today when I applied the shirtbutton, guard, and luggage transfers) (incidentally, kudos to Margate's 1961 GWR numbers; not bad at all), so presumably my new one can be 2317, and the all second, for want of another suggestion, might as well be 5017.  But the brake 3rd is apparently (GWR Modelling website) not an accurate model of 2316; that coach was a brake 3rd but on a longer underframe and with a bigger luggage compartment, and 5017 was not a GWR coach number; similarly the all 2nd is not an accurate model of any identifiable coach.  So we are into Rule 1 'impressionist modelling' territory anyway.

 

This sort of works; I can happily blame Triang for the error and, having accepted these impressionist models into service, I can live with the numbers.  I will listen to suggestions if any of you have them, though.  The brake 3rd came with Hornby long clerestory Dean 10'6" bogies, and I also have a set of Southeastern Finecast flush glazing for them, but, in order for them to match 2316, I have opted to use the original glazing and fit the brake 3rd with B1 bogies that I can convert to my ersatz Dean 8'6" type with footboards; this sounds more crude than it actually looks on the finished model.  I have a set of correct whitemetal bogies, from 24/7 Developments I think, but will not fit them until I have another 2 so that all the coaches will continue to match visually.  

 

I also still need to paint the compartment dividers and fit and paint seats, and glaze the clerestory lights.  Current thinking is to use them on the Tremains ROF workman's, unless I decide that this train requires first class accomodation, possibly as a 3-coach set with the older brake 3rd, which would mean reverting to the 2 Ratio 4 wheelers (still haven't sourced a brake 3rd for this set) and a passenger brake, BG or BY, for the miner's.

Edited October 28, 2018 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

There doesn't seem to be a HMRS sheet with GW coach numbers, and I am now assuming that the small black numbers on the Loco and Coach Insignia sheet is them, and that the other side is gold leaf.  I can't find out at the moment, as the railway room, which the squeeze thinks is a bedroom on the flimsy excuse that it's got a bed, wardrobe, and dressing table in it in the parts not occupied by a ficticious South Wales mining village's railway in the 50s, is currently occupied by the squeeze having a snooze.  Trust me, she's best left undisturbed...

 

Will let you all know about the numbers when it's safe!

[The Johnster]

Here's another way of getting smokebox number plates, which I have used:

 

http://www.pacificmodels.co.uk/smokebox-numberplates/4mm/br-western-region

 

Printed on paper, with white numbers on a black background you just need to cut them out with a sharp knife, blacken the edges with a felt tip pen and stick 'em on the smokebox door!

Just been checking out the website, and it looks like the way to go.  I am making some assumptions here, though, and perhaps you can answer some questions.  Do the sheets contain all the numbers for all the locos in the class or classes specified, or just sample examples?  And do the numbers come in pre printed 'blocks' or do you have to cut out individual numbers and align them?  Unless all the numbers are printed on the sheets, it is not likely that any or all of the ones I want will be supplied, and I don't want to be involved in correctly lining up and spacing numbers in that size.

 

There are of course smokebox type white numbers on the HMRS BR steam loco sheet, and it may be possible to overlay the etched brass numbers with these.

 

Have you thought about building a couple (or more) cassettes, and replacing one of the roads in the fiddle yard to save physically handling the stock?

 

Regards

 

Ian

Certainly considered it, Ian, but they would be a little heavy and awkward to handle with a full size train; my coal trains run to 11 and a van and the pickup can muster not much less sometimes.  It might be a solution for the shorter loco hauled and auto passenger trains, though; I admit the idea of only one fiddle yard road leading to a cassette had not occurred to me!

[The Johnster]

There doesn't seem to be a HMRS sheet with GW coach numbers, and I am now assuming that the small black numbers on the Loco and Coach Insignia sheet is them, and that the other side is gold leaf.  I can't find out at the moment, as the railway room, which the squeeze thinks is a bedroom on the flimsy excuse that it's got a bed, wardrobe, and dressing table in it in the parts not occupied by a ficticious South Wales mining village's railway in the 50s, is currently occupied by the squeeze having a snooze.  Trust me, she's best left undisturbed...

 

Will let you all know about the numbers when it's safe!

 

it's safe now; she's up, had a cup of coffee, and is approaching semi sub-human, not that I occupy any moral high ground for that sort of judgement.  We are going up the pub later, but I have time to paint the compartment dividers and glaze the clerestories before throwing my mortal remains into the shower (I do this every year when the clocks go back whether I need it or not).

 

The small black numbers are indeed the coach numbers, but only the later sans serif type and I can't find Egyptian Serif small coach numbers anywhere.  This is not a big problem; the sans serif numbers will be fine on austerity coaches and match the guard and luggage lettering on the brake 3rd.  I have couple of old firework rocket sticks, square section, that can be cut for seating if I can't find any Ratio seats locally.  I had to trim the top corners of the compartment dividers so that the roofs will sit on the coaches properly, but all is well now.  With the dark brown paint and small insignia and lettering they are looking very much the austerity part, and might be even better when I've weathered them.  Should finish tonight except for the numbers, which need to be done one at a time, so Wednesday at the earliest, then a final light varnish and the weathering.  I have decided to replace the buffers on all 3 coaches as the recent Hornby ones are not much better than the old Triang mushrooms; at least they are metal.

[31A]

Just been checking out the website, and it looks like the way to go.  I am making some assumptions here, though, and perhaps you can answer some questions.  Do the sheets contain all the numbers for all the locos in the class or classes specified, or just sample examples?  And do the numbers come in pre printed 'blocks' or do you have to cut out individual numbers and align them?  Unless all the numbers are printed on the sheets, it is not likely that any or all of the ones I want will be supplied, and I don't want to be involved in correctly lining up and spacing numbers in that size.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Johnster, this page on their web site gives general information about the smokebox number plates:

 

http://www.pacificmodels.co.uk/smokebox-numberplates/

 

It says "all the numbers in classes of locos running in 1955", and looking at the two sheets I've got (both for ER classes) there are certainly numbers missing from the numerical sequence of printed numberplates; presumably the missing numbers would belong to locos in the classes which had been withdrawn before 1955.  So that may limit their usefulness for you as I believe some of your locos may have been withdrawn earlier than 1955?  However they do advertise a "custom service" which might be useful?

 

The good news is that the printed numberplates are exactly that, printed numberplates with the numbers printed on, which you just cut out from the sheet of paper, blacken the cut edges, and stick on the front of your engine.  If you look at the above page, their are some images which give you an idea of what the printed sheets look like.

 

I have sometimes made up the numbers on smokebox plates using numbers from the HMRS wagon lettering sheets but not always with much success.  Assuming you can find a suitable size, it's very fiddly juggling the transfer on the smokebox door of a loco, unlike say a wagon or coach which you can put down flat on the bench whilst you work on it.

 

Hope this helps!