South Wales Valleys in the 50s

[The Johnster]

A small windfall, overpaid Council Tax, means a bit of a spending spree, hence the new 57xx body and today I've ordered a couple of kits from Dapol, an Interfrigo and a ventilated meat van.  Long time since I've built any of these, indeed they were Airfix back in those days and the meat van was 2/6d, 12 and a ½ pence to you children (we used ter walk 300 mile cross freezing moor, work 12 year shift down t'pit, and come 'ome to supper, one breadcrumb between 18 million of us.  Tell kids terday that, they don' berleev yer...).  My memory is that they are shake the box easy and should present no problems; I believe they come with bearings and decent wheels deze daze.  I built the Interfrigo successfully and ran it on my layout when I was about 10 I think.  

 

I may extend the shopping list to include the next projected Comet, an A44 'cyclops' compartment auto trailer.  I have a photo of Abergwynfi which shows what looks like one of these in a 57xx hauled train of 3 trailers, which means my original theory that they didn't appear at Tondu until the 64xx for the Porthcawl branch after my period no longer applies.  That, along with the lighting project and cutting the top feed off 5707's body, is plenty of modelling to keep me occupied for a good few months!

 

I've been giving some thought to the river, Nant Dimbath.  I have previously thought of it as being in between the viewer and the layout, but there is a significant gap between the back of the platform and the mountainside where it could conceivably have been channelled, with a bridge under the platform and railway just past the water crane.  This could be suggested rather than actually modelled by a parapet at an angle between the platform and the mountainside; I have some Wills plate girder panels suitable for it.  At the road entrance, another brick parapet could suggest it disappearing under the road with the footpath running alongside the platform fence, maybe with a different fence protecting passengers off the last auto returning from debauchery in Bridgend from falling in.

 

It will be running clear here; we are upstream of the washery outfall that will blacken it and destroy all life in it.  Running under the railway bridge at an angle, it will emerge just upstream of the Cwmdimbath Non Political Club, and I can make an indent in the boards here for it it, with perhaps a footbridge for club members.

 

Other thoughts have been directed to the mountainside, a bit bare.  Some outcrops of Pennant Sandstone could provoke a trip into the valleys to pick some up, and the lower slopes need pigeon lofts, which'll have to be scratchbuilt out of whatever is to hand, as were the real things mostly.

[Darwinian]

Regarding pigeon lofts Unit models did a selection of cast resin ones, I have two for the back gardens of the terraced cottages on Cwmhir.  Although Unit have gone the web site still exists and suggests that the range might be available from FMR models now.  Of course scratch building your own might be more fun, especially as you can take field trips to likely locations.

[The Johnster]

5 hours ago, Darwinian said:

Regarding pigeon lofts Unit models did a selection of cast resin ones, I have two for the back gardens of the terraced cottages on Cwmhir.  Although Unit have gone the web site still exists and suggests that the range might be available from FMR models now.  Of course scratch building your own might be more fun, especially as you can take field trips to likely locations.

Thanks Darwinian, I’ll check this out.  Important that they’re all different. 

[tomparryharry]

13 hours ago, The Johnster said:

A small windfall, overpaid Council Tax, means a bit of a spending spree, hence the new 57xx body and today I've ordered a couple of kits from Dapol, an Interfrigo and a ventilated meat van.  Long time since I've built any of these, indeed they were Airfix back in those days and the meat van was 2/6d, 12 and a ½ pence to you children (we used ter walk 300 mile cross freezing moor, work 12 year shift down t'pit, and come 'ome to supper, one breadcrumb between 18 million of us.  Tell kids terday that, they don' berleev yer...).  My memory is that they are shake the box easy and should present no problems; I believe they come with bearings and decent wheels deze daze.  I built the Interfrigo successfully and ran it on my layout when I was about 10 I think.  

 

I may extend the shopping list to include the next projected Comet, an A44 'cyclops' compartment auto trailer.  I have a photo of Abergwynfi which shows what looks like one of these in a 57xx hauled train of 3 trailers, which means my original theory that they didn't appear at Tondu until the 64xx for the Porthcawl branch after my period no longer applies.  That, along with the lighting project and cutting the top feed off 5707's body, is plenty of modelling to keep me occupied for a good few months!

 

I've been giving some thought to the river, Nant Dimbath.  I have previously thought of it as being in between the viewer and the layout, but there is a significant gap between the back of the platform and the mountainside where it could conceivably have been channelled, with a bridge under the platform and railway just past the water crane.  This could be suggested rather than actually modelled by a parapet at an angle between the platform and the mountainside; I have some Wills plate girder panels suitable for it.  At the road entrance, another brick parapet could suggest it disappearing under the road with the footpath running alongside the platform fence, maybe with a different fence protecting passengers off the last auto returning from debauchery in Bridgend from falling in.

 

It will be running clear here; we are upstream of the washery outfall that will blacken it and destroy all life in it.  Running under the railway bridge at an angle, it will emerge just upstream of the Cwmdimbath Non Political Club, and I can make an indent in the boards here for it it, with perhaps a footbridge for club members.

 

Other thoughts have been directed to the mountainside, a bit bare.  Some outcrops of Pennant Sandstone could provoke a trip into the valleys to pick some up, and the lower slopes need pigeon lofts, which'll have to be scratchbuilt out of whatever is to hand, as were the real things mostly.

Scratchbuilding  the pigeon loft young Johnster? There are hundreds-nay- thousands of examples in the valleys. If you're using the wood again, you'll need to 'Costa ' that one out carefully.  Actually,  may I suggest a check out  of Wills Scenic SS14, for a 'basic' structure.

 

Cheers,

Ian.

Edited August 13, 2019 by tomparryharry
Ideas time.

[The Johnster]

The tea kiosk; good idea and not one that would have occurred to me; muchias gracias, muy compadre! I'm planning a visit to L & B's later and might come home with one if he's got one.  The serving hatch needs to be replaced with windows and little hatch door the birds use.  It's narrow enough to be easy to perch on the precipitous slope as well; just the thing.

 

I was going to have a go a scratching one with Sainsbury's cafe coffee stirrers, also available from Burger King, and will do this as well, as in general wherever there is a pigeon loft in the Valleys there is another one or more close by.  No two are the same, and they change over time as bits rot and are replaced with more skip raids; recovered wood, galvanised sheets, corrugated iron or asbestos being common materials.  The classic look is semi derelict and there seems to be a competition for who can have the roughest looking one in serviceable condition.  They are, of course, man caves.

[tomparryharry]

1 hour ago, The Johnster said:

The tea kiosk; good idea and not one that would have occurred to me; muchias gracias, muy compadre! I'm planning a visit to L & B's later and might come home with one if he's got one.  The serving hatch needs to be replaced with windows and little hatch door the birds use.  It's narrow enough to be easy to perch on the precipitous slope as well; just the thing.

 

I was going to have a go a scratching one with Sainsbury's cafe coffee stirrers, also available from Burger King, and will do this as well, as in general wherever there is a pigeon loft in the Valleys there is another one or more close by.  No two are the same, and they change over time as bits rot and are replaced with more skip raids; recovered wood, galvanised sheets, corrugated iron or asbestos being common materials.  The classic look is semi derelict and there seems to be a competition for who can have the roughest looking one in serviceable condition.  They are, of course, man caves.

 

I don't know why, it just popped into my head. happy modelling.

[88C]

Hi Johnster, I don’t know if you are aware of it but in the latest BRM there is an ad for Pen & Sword books with one of the featured offers Tondu Valleys, just your part of the world. I haven’t seen this particular book but others from the same publisher that I have are very useful for reference. My particular favourite is John Hodge’s book about Barry, lots of nostalgia.

 

Might be worth considering in view of your windfall, unless of course you have spent it twice already.

 

Brian

[The Johnster]

Haven’t finished spending it once, yet, Brian, and this looks like a good way to dispose of some if it!

 

No tea kiosk at L & B, so that’ll be an internet purchase, but I came home with some grotty huts and privy.  And 2 Dapol working signals, one square and one round post, and a l

pair of centre-off switches Peter reckons I need to make ‘em work!

.

[Danemouth]

1 hour ago, 88C said:

Hi Johnster, I don’t know if you are aware of it but in the latest BRM there is an ad for Pen & Sword books with one of the featured offers Tondu Valleys, just your part of the world. I haven’t seen this particular book but others from the same publisher that I have are very useful for reference. My particular favourite is John Hodge’s book about Barry, lots of nostalgia.

 

Might be worth considering in view of your windfall, unless of course you have spent it twice already.

 

Brian

 

Thus one comes out at  the end of August

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Railways-Industry-Tondu-Valleys-Treherbert/dp/1526727250/ref=sr_1_2?crid=3H42LD66J9CNR&keywords=tondu+valleys&qid=1565719356&s=books&sprefix=tondu%2Caps%2C475&sr=1-2

 

and this one is due at the end of November

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Railways-Industry-Tondu-Valleys-Porthcawl/dp/1526726599/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3H42LD66J9CNR&

keywords=tondu+valleys&qid=1565719356&s=books&sprefix=tondu%2Caps%2C475&sr=1-1

 

The bad news is they  are each £30

 

Dave

[88C]

Only! £22.50 in the BRM ad ordering from the publisher but you have to quote the code in the ad to get this price.

 

I can PM the code if needed or you don’t have the mag.

 

Brian

[The Johnster]

Took the Dapol signals out of the packets today and had a good look; seems simple enough but no doubt I'll find some problem or other to overcome.  I will need to get hold of a big enough drill and something to make the 14mm holes with, a job for tomorrow.  The signals look the part and my only minor (very minor) grouse on that score is the finials, which can be easily replaced with the much better Modelu prints.  I have a square post and a round post home, GW/BR(W) of course.  These were all that Peter had in the shop, but will be ideal as the round post is shorter than the square post one, so that can go as the loop starter and the square post one can act as the platform road starter.  The splitting junction home can wait for now.  The working lamp is very well rendered, only tiny cables at the top giving the game away.  The ladders and brackets are well renderded and the colours look right

 

My instinct is to power them with a 9v DC supply rather than the 14v AC from my power controller, and this may well be a battery supply initially to see how they go with it.  Ultimately the same 9v DC supply as I am going to use for the platform lights might be sufficient, but not if there is a dip in the lighting every time I throw the signal switch/button.  I have a feeling that 14v AC will leave me with a light too powerful for my taste; in any case I have a feeling it might be a bit blue cast and need warming up a little; a dab of dilute yellow acrylic paint on the bulb/lens should achieve this. 

 

They've been given a project box to sit in for now, and I've put them back in their inner clear plastic casing for protection.

[The Johnster]

As predicted, I've found an irritating little problem.  The signals require a hole drilled 14mm diameter to sit in, and I have been unable on today's shopping trip to find a spade bit this size; they seem to go from 13mm to 16mm at Wilko's and The Range.  I bought a 13mm in case that's all I can get, so I can at least drill a hole and try to ream it out to the correct size.  Postman left me a card to pick up the Dapol kits I ordered 3 days ago; this is excellent service, well done Dapol!  I'm expecting the pannier body sometime over the weekend as well.

 

As I've got to go to Penarth Road tomoz for the kits and there's a good tool shop in Canton, I'll check that out before I start work on the drilling.  The instructions specify a regulated power supply, and note that output from transformers is not regulated and has spikes which can damage the signals.  I am hoping that this will not be the case with a 9v DC battery, which is what I am going to try the signals out with.  How do I tell if a power supply is regulated or not?

[tomparryharry]

Screwfix will supply you with the 14mm brad point drill bit (code 3760V @£2.99). I don't know what drill you're using, but the shank is reduced in diameter to accept a 13mm  chuck.  If you've already possess a 13mm drill, take it to size, and gently file out the extra 0.5mm on the diameter from 13mm to 14mm. 

 

Hope this helps,

 

Ian.

[The Johnster]

I've already drilled the holes to 13mm, Ian.  Screwfix, which of course I hadn't thought of, is only a 10 minute walk over the road from Sainsy's, so I'll pop over there tomoz or Saturday.  The drill is a Wilko own brand 500W.  I'll get the 14mm bit rather than faff with files and fitting anyway, because I will have at least one more of these holes to drill for the bracket splitting home signal.

 

The signals will almost go in as an interference fit, with the threaded tube underneath acting as a tap, but it's plastic and not designed for this so I don't want to force the issue!

[tomparryharry]

8 hours ago, The Johnster said:

I've already drilled the holes to 13mm, Ian.  Screwfix, which of course I hadn't thought of, is only a 10 minute walk over the road from Sainsy's, so I'll pop over there tomoz or Saturday.  The drill is a Wilko own brand 500W.  I'll get the 14mm bit rather than faff with files and fitting anyway, because I will have at least one more of these holes to drill for the bracket splitting home signal.

 

The signals will almost go in as an interference fit, with the threaded tube underneath acting as a tap, but it's plastic and not designed for this so I don't want to force the issue!

That's sort of why I suggested using a file. The tip of a brad point drill is designed to cut 'virgin' holes. If you've already drilled a hole @ 13mm, the the drill bit is liable to 'bounce' as it enters the existing hole. My suggestion is that the file is not so liable to inflict collateral damage to your layout.  It sounds as though you've already drilled the original hole, so you've done all of the hard work.  I haven't fitted one of these signals either, so I'm watching with interest.

 

Cheers,

Ian.

 

 

[The Johnster]

I drilled pilot holes with a brad fitted 6mm wood drill first, then opened them out with the 13mm spade, but could probably have gotten away with just using the 13mm spade, which also has a brad.  But you've persuaded me, and I'll ream the holes with a file until there's a clearance fit.  As I understand it, it is important not to put any undue stress on the tube which contains all the gubbins as everything depends on being dead centre in line; the Dapol instructions specify that the securing nuts only be brought home finger tight.   A drop of superglue under the base plates should hold them in position well enough.

 

Off to Penarth Road Sorting Office now just to pick up a delivery I missed yesterday from Dapol, a construction kit meat van and an Interfrigo.  The Interfrigo is pushing the period a bit for Cwmdimbath, and will be in shiny new condition.  Lord knows what the traffic flow is, but it's going to be once a week to the cold store on the industrial estate siding.  IIRC Interfrigos are not XP, being piped only vacuum, and it must thus come up on the pickup. 

[The Johnster]

Current sitrep is that a very stupid person went out in the rain and picked up 2 packets from the sorting office, when he could’ve easily done it another day or arranged to pick them up at a local Post Office.  Anyway, it’s done now, and the Kitmaster Meat Van and Interfrigo, along with the bodyshell that is to eventually become  5707, are accompanying me home on a Cardiff bus stuck in traffic on Newport Road.  All part of the rich and varied tapestry of my life...

[tomparryharry]

3 hours ago, The Johnster said:

I drilled pilot holes with a brad fitted 6mm wood drill first, then opened them out with the 13mm spade, but could probably have gotten away with just using the 13mm spade, which also has a brad.  But you've persuaded me, and I'll ream the holes with a file until there's a clearance fit.  As I understand it, it is important not to put any undue stress on the tube which contains all the gubbins as everything depends on being dead centre in line; the Dapol instructions specify that the securing nuts only be brought home finger tight.   A drop of superglue under the base plates should hold them in position well enough.

 

Off to Penarth Road Sorting Office now just to pick up a delivery I missed yesterday from Dapol, a construction kit meat van and an Interfrigo.  The Interfrigo is pushing the period a bit for Cwmdimbath, and will be in shiny new condition.  Lord knows what the traffic flow is, but it's going to be once a week to the cold store on the industrial estate siding.  IIRC Interfrigos are not XP, being piped only vacuum, and it must thus come up on the pickup. 

 

With regards to the drill bits, you need to know that the brad point  of a spade bit can cut its own way into wood. If you push too hard, the wood will splinter as it exits through the hole, sometimes leaving an unsightly job. If you do use a smaller pilot hole, remember that the pilot hole diameter should be slightly smaller than the tapered 'brad' point on the spade bit. That way, the spade is always led into the hole by the pilot, allowing the brad point of the drill to 'cut into clear'.  If it's plywood, let it work its own way through. There's a rough correlation that the thinner the wood, the less you push.   

[The Johnster]

Work on the signal project is progressing albeit slowly, and I have been delayed by a bit of a shake that has appeared in my left hand after doing a bit of heavy work I'm not used to that has prevented me attempting anything delicate.  But the signals are now in their holes and secured with a dab of pva.  The wiring remains to be done, but shouldn't take too long once I achieve escape velocity with it, and likewise the station lamps, and I'm hoping to have these all in operation by Monday as there's no rugby this w/e...

 

On the van front, the Meat is complete and painted, awaiting weathering, but I don't like the Dapol transfers which I am sure are too big, so will be sourcing these from that nice Mr Isherwood.  The Interfrigo is also complete but awaits painting, a possible job for later this evening as I'm just in the mood for something like that now, if my shake has diminished a little.  Don't think it's Parkinson's as I haven't got any of the other symptoms, but it's a bit of a worry!

[The Johnster]

On 16/08/2019 at 17:47, tomparryharry said:

 

With regards to the drill bits, you need to know that the brad point  of a spade bit can cut its own way into wood. If you push too hard, the wood will splinter as it exits through the hole, sometimes leaving an unsightly job. If you do use a smaller pilot hole, remember that the pilot hole diameter should be slightly smaller than the tapered 'brad' point on the spade bit. That way, the spade is always led into the hole by the pilot, allowing the brad point of the drill to 'cut into clear'.  If it's plywood, let it work its own way through. There's a rough correlation that the thinner the wood, the less you push.   

Thank you Ian, good advice.  In the end I enlarged the holes by cheating and waggling the 13mm spade bit around in the holes it had already drilled; the signal underparts now slip in nicely and a secured by a dab of pva beneath the mounting plate.  The way my baseboards are constructed, or to be more accurate thrown on top of each other, there is an Ikea shelf, then a gap, then another Ikea shelf, all 3 thicknesses being about ½ inch.  This means that I may have been having slight problems with the holes lining up if the boards had moved a little with the vibration, 

 

But all is well now.  Removing the signals, should I ever have to do it, will mean softening the pva with warm water and pulling them out like teeth; no biggie even it the basic engineering is a bit suspect!

[The Johnster]

The Interfrigo has proven a bit of a faff to paint, but 3 coats of white are on and I have made a start on the black parts.  Despite priming the light grey plastic with spray matt varnish, it took 3 coats of white to cover adequately.  Then it's grey for the roof and the ice hopper covers, and then I've got a decision to make.  There is an electrical junction box on one end with wiring conduits emerging from it, and these are moulded as part of the body end tooling.  They should, I reckon, be orange, but to paint such fine detail is probably beyond my deteriorating ability, and I think I'll leave it.  It'll always bother me, though!

 

I'm a little worried about the transfers of this van as well.  A lot of photos I've seen show that they have badly discoloured over time, and I'm hoping a top coat of matt varnish will prevent or at least delay this.

 

I'm intending to relay the layout in Peco code 75 bullhead, but will not be able to do this until next year when the medium radius turnouts appear

[The Johnster]

The Interfrigo is finished but has taken longer than I'd planned so I won't be starting the signal/platform light wiring today, as dinner and the pub are calling...  The Interfrigo is riding a little low, and seems to have developed a penchant for spitting right hand turnouts, which is a bit of a problem given the number of them on Cwmdimbath.  The answer to both problems, I believe. is replacing the 12mm Dapol wheels that I never had much faith in anyway (though the back to backs check out) with 14mm Bachmanns.  This will require the cutouts in the floor to be enlarged, but will give the extra mm in height that will get the buffers to align, improve coupling performance (Bachmann short straight NEM t/ls, and should hopefully mean that the bottom side panel and roof lines will match other vans. 

 

This is AFAIK a vacuum piped only vehicle and cannot run with passenger rated stock.  It will therefore make it's once a week visit with the pickup rather than the Remploy clearance, and make the shunting a bit more interesting.

 

I've also had a bit of fun assembling a set of Wills' 'Grotty huts and privy'; a shelter has appeared halfway up the mountain and a hut at the bottom end of the field next to the Remploy platform, heavily weathered, and the privy has taken up residence at the back of the Non-Political.

 

I've got some lighter coloured grass to 'texture' the mountainside with, and that, along with a bit foliage around the new grotty 'uts and wiring the signals and platform lamps, should take me through next week, with any luck In'ch Allah.

Edited August 25, 2019 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

Events on another layout thread of a somewhat ovine nature had focussed my mind on the girlfriends, I mean sheep.  One of the grotty 'uts is on the mountainside, the open fronted one, as a shelter for them and a trough with a block of salt would complete the scene.  I've got a trough somewhere but I can't recall now whether it came with the Scalescene or the Bachmann girlfriends.  The Scalescene girls are far more scraggy and Valley appropriate than the plump and healthy looking Baccys, and at least one more pack is needed to populate the mountainside, possibly with a pack of 2mm scale ones for the higher reaches as perspective modelling.  Ultimate mountainside improvements include some suitable Pennant Sandstone outcrops with the correct dip and strike to satisfy my inner 6th form geologist, and some pigeon lofts.  

 

Rock outcrops in those days were often graffitoed with suitably dreadful biblical quotations, sometime in Welsh but always of the 'Repent before it is too late/Be sure your sins will find you out' variety, hand painted in white.  I suspect that this may have been because the sheltered bits below them were popular with courting couples in summer; you could get down out of the wind and out of sight.  I seriously doubt if the threats of eternal damnation to the nethermost pits of hell stopped any of the action,  though!

[The Johnster]

Windfall money is getting a bit depleted, so I've bitten on a 'buy it now' 8750 on Bay while I can still impulse buy this sort of stuff.  This one will be stripped of it's vacuum pipes and renumbered as steam brake only 6750 variant 6762, at Tondu 1948 until xfer to Upper Bank, Swansea mid 50s.  Delivered new to Tondu during 1943, so black austerity G W R initials livery and probably red backed plates including smokebox plate.  The only use for it will be the pick up, as the minerals are too heavy for it and everything else is vacuum fitted.  I doubt the real loco saw much use away from Tondu coal sidings as a pilot in reality, but an odd run up the valley is allowable I think.  2761 appears on a similar basis.

 

It'll make a nice running partner for 9649, in green G W R initials livery.

Edited August 29, 2019 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

Dapol signals installed and working, down home platform and loop starters.  If I can wire these up anyone can!  Current power supply is 9V dc batteries which is intended as a temporary test arrangement.  Even at 9v they are a little bright, and I might try less for the permanent setup but not sure this is enough to work the signals themselves.  Or I can put a dab of cream paint on the bulbs.  The signals are a bit slow in operation but this is preferable to them karate chopping all over the place; it just looks like a longer, harder, lever pull that it could possibly be but I'll live with it.  Bounce was always going to be a big ask...

 

The light level through the glasses is not too bad, and the look of the station with no layout or room lighting, everything shut down for the night, is very atmospheric, but the light escaping sideways is a little problem.  May be able to baffle it a bit.

 

8448 works the first train past a working signal at Cwmdimbath, a loaded coal working for Tondu.  The platform starter protects the movement with a red light.  Bloody marvellous!