sb67 Posted May 8, 2017 Author Share Posted May 8, 2017 I've ordered a Zimo MX622n, Zimo MX600, Lenz Standard and a Lokpilot 21 pin so I'll see how I get on with them then start saving! Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted May 10, 2017 Author Share Posted May 10, 2017 As an update I phoned and ordered some bits from Coastal DCC Mon afternoon it arrived yesterday, great service and very helpful. Fitted a class 03 with my Zimo mx622n and placed it on the track with a Bachmann decoder fitted 03 and wow! The Zimo one crawled along and I was nowhere near matching it with the other one. It is so slow and smooth, I didn't think it would be that obvious, cant wait to fit some more stock now! Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted May 10, 2017 Share Posted May 10, 2017 As an update I phoned and ordered some bits from Coastal DCC Mon afternoon it arrived yesterday, great service and very helpful. Fitted a class 03 with my Zimo mx622n and placed it on the track with a Bachmann decoder fitted 03 and wow! The Zimo one crawled along and I was nowhere near matching it with the other one. It is so slow and smooth, I didn't think it would be that obvious, cant wait to fit some more stock now! Steve. Yep - seeing is believing Steve........... For a good quality reasonably priced DCC set - the complete Roco Multimaus system is worth considering - they are often split from new train sets, and can be found - (eBay etc) for around £100 or so. It's very smooth rotary speed knob will also be ideal for your shunting plank . it also has a 128SS option - which will give even better slow speed control, especially with the Zimos. Regards Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpgibbons Posted May 10, 2017 Share Posted May 10, 2017 Bear in mind that decoders sometimes need their CV settings tweaked to give the best performance with a particular loco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Izzy Posted May 10, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 10, 2017 I would suggest that if you stick with/use Zimo's and dial in a moderate amount of acc/dec - I usually use around the 30 mark but basically anywhere between 20-50 - then using 28ss is no problem because the performance is better than many other decoder makes can give on 128ss, indeed with button control it is easier. I now believe that using Zimo or CT decoders is really a no brainer over the long term. Izzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted May 11, 2017 Author Share Posted May 11, 2017 Yep - seeing is believing Steve........... For a good quality reasonably priced DCC set - the complete Roco Multimaus system is worth considering - they are often split from new train sets, and can be found - (eBay etc) for around £100 or so. It's very smooth rotary speed knob will also be ideal for your shunting plank . it also has a 128SS option - which will give even better slow speed control, especially with the Zimos. Regards Ken Thanks Ken. I'll admit I'm tempted to get a new system and have been looking at the NCE powercab, I had a look on e bay for the Roco Multimaus but a wasn't sure what I found as I think some were just handsets. My layout is pretty small so I'm not sure I can justify it yet and It will have to wait until next payday! Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 Thanks Ken. I'll admit I'm tempted to get a new system and have been looking at the NCE powercab, I had a look on e bay for the Roco Multimaus but a wasn't sure what I found as I think some were just handsets. My layout is pretty small so I'm not sure I can justify it yet and It will have to wait until next payday! Steve. You'd need the complete Roco Multimaus set, (hand throttle/booster-amp/transformer.) as an example like these - although they are already sold......... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Roco-Fleischmann-Multimaus-Complete-DCC-system-/122375775617?hash=item1c7e2a2581:g:22EAAOSwvFZW8UZT http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Roco-Fleischmann-Multimaus-Dcc-Command-Control-System-/332145570615?hash=item4d556b3337:g:BlAAAOSwWxNYu~sg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokebox Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 If you have any doubts about what is being sold just message the seller and ask whether it's a full system or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil S Posted May 11, 2017 Share Posted May 11, 2017 Since this has evolved into a bit of Roco/Fleischmann Multimaus discussion... As mentioned, the BASIC MULTIMAUS SETUP requires: A Multimaus handset (red=roco,grey=fleischmann) and 10764 Amplifier (/Fleischmann part number) THE FIRMWARE/processor is in the Handset, and the controller plugged into the 'master' socket of the Amplifier is the software + memory used. (memory of point/signal position between sessions, if dcc controlled - very easy to do with the Mutimaus toggling between loco+accessory, and graphic display of Point Straight or Cuirved (or Left/Right if you prefer). Software V1.04 is latest -use for Z21, but 1.02 is okay normally. Upgrade via MCPro or Z21. EACH handset can remember 64 locos BY NAME (5 characters) - with ANY number 1-9999 (not ONLY CV1 as stated in manual 1-99 !) in common with many systems, Roco do NOT support the use of 'loco 0' - ie NO ANALOGUE LOCO on the layout. (bad buzz vibes, man !!) Accessories 1-2048. Roco is 'offset' by 4 from some other systems - only a problem if swapping between makes of controllers. 1-99 = short addresses,100-9999=long addresses. The Amplifier - is the power stage (amplifying the dcc signal created in the MASTER handset which uses 6 wires). Other handsets and a PC interface can be plugged into the SLAVE socket (max 32) (and need only inner 4 wires) Not just the Roco PC interface (not avaiable) - but any Expressnet PC interface like Lenz (100+gbp) or OPENdcc kit from Germany (15GBP approx). Additional amplifiers CAN be used (each with their own power supply) as BOOSTERS by NOT using the 'Master/Slave' sockets - tape them over - and linking via the BOOSTER sockets (max 4 without more work) 3.2A output each. They USED to come with a conventional transformer -230:16Vac which gave a high track voltage with no trains moving, and was HEAVY. A SMPS is now supplied (Yes, even the old amplifiers could accept a DC power supply) of 18Vdc INTO the amplifier (giving a constant 16V on track)... which in turn will give about 12V max to a motor. OLD transformers are best replaced with a Computer SMPS of 18V 3.5-4A dc output. When used with only the Amplifier. the Red./Grey cabled handset not not offer 'readback' but this is NOT required for successful proramming - in fact it slows it down reading an unwanted value!! [use a SPROG and PC if you want to alter lots of CVs!] The basic Amplifier Setup does NOT use a separate PGM track ...use a switch of your own. The later +Rocomtion PCi/f , MCPro, and Z21 use a separate PGM ouput,and also default to using Readback - but this can be turned off in the menu. Their NEXT controller was the MultiCentralePro and MultimausPro handsets - using 'ZigBee' wireless, and cabled Maulimauses. Now Discontinued. Sets are about 450GBP rrp, handsets 150GBP rrp. The Z21 (BLACK) and z21 (white) are their new models, [z21 now inmany sets] which will accept a Red/Grey Multimaus via cable, if you progress on further.... The Z21/z21 with extras supports WIFI wireless control using Smart Phones or the NEW WIFI MULTIMAUS released on the mainland, but still not in stock in th UK - this is CHEAPER than any previous Multimaus at rrp !! 92GBP (handset only) and BLACK in colour. It INCREASES the Function number range from 0-20 to 0-29 and the NAMES to 10 characters. (The Z21/z21 also gives the option about the accessory 4 offset) Selection by NAME on any Multimaus allows simple scrolling through named locos, but can be toggled to numeric mode whenever wanted. The name files in each handset can be copied toother handsets whenver required (stop the trains first). THE MCPro came bundled with Rocomtion s/w - roughtly equivalent to Bronze RR+Co. THE Z21 uses on screen graphics + photos (supply your own phone/tablet) I like them so much - we have quite a few! - we try to keep them with each layout to avoid re-entering stock into the library each time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Torper Posted May 12, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 12, 2017 Thanks Ken. I'll admit I'm tempted to get a new system and have been looking at the NCE powercab, I had a look on e bay for the Roco Multimaus but a wasn't sure what I found as I think some were just handsets. My layout is pretty small so I'm not sure I can justify it yet and It will have to wait until next payday! Steve. The NCE Powercab is excellent. It's the one I (and many other RMWebbers) started with and I've never regretted it. But if/when you decide to change your control system, do what is always suggested - have a "feel" of the handsets that interest you and decide then which one is most comfortable and suits you best. DT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted May 12, 2017 Author Share Posted May 12, 2017 As I understand it, you cant read/change cv's with the Multimaus so if i was happy with how the locos were running now i've no need to change them. might seem a daft question but why would I want to change them? Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpgibbons Posted May 12, 2017 Share Posted May 12, 2017 CV values define almost every parameter controlled by the decoder, including DCC addresses, motor tuning, lighting configuration, function keys, toggling DC operation, multiple loco operation....it's a long list. So there are many reasons why you may want to change them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokebox Posted May 12, 2017 Share Posted May 12, 2017 As I understand it, you cant read/change cv's with the Multimaus so if i was happy with how the locos were running now i've no need to change them. might seem a daft question but why would I want to change them? Steve. AFAIK the Multimaus can change (program) CVs but can't read them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Torper Posted May 12, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 12, 2017 As a relative beginner to DCC I've had a lot of fun fiddling around with CVs. I'd hate not to be able to read them - if you can't read them first, how do you know how best to change them or, perhaps more importantly, how to change them back again? You can read (and change) CVs with the Powercab. DT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted May 13, 2017 Author Share Posted May 13, 2017 I think I'd like to read cv's before changing them. Think I'm getting hooked on this DCC lark already! Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Izzy Posted May 13, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 13, 2017 As I understand it, you cant read/change cv's with the Multimaus so if i was happy with how the locos were running now i've no need to change them. might seem a daft question but why would I want to change them? Steve. Although the running qualities could be quite okay, with some of the better decoders, Zimo, CT, etc there are many extra options like reducing the lighting output levels etc that you might want to change or experiment with. That just with plain decoders. If you get into sound then that's another level again. I personally wouldn't want any DCC system where I couldn't read/write CV's as a basic function. Izzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil S Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 As I have said before .... The multimaus CAN read back cvs But only when used with any of..... The amplifier With Rocomotion serial computer interface and ppm track output box added Or When plugged into a MultiCentralPro Or When plugged into a z21/Z21 However, it is slower to program when reading is involved because all controllers do that first, and. If simply writing a new value, the old value is irrelevant. For those wanting to 'play' with lots of cvs, they are best recommended to use a sprog and Jmri or similar to log and keep a computer record of all the values... So as to restore them after too much tweaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzie Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 If you keep a roster of all your settings in DecoderPro there is no need to read CVs because DecoderPro will keep track of them for you. You will need a Sprog or a command station that has a computer interface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 If you keep a roster of all your settings in DecoderPro there is no need to read CVs because DecoderPro will keep track of them for you. You will need a Sprog or a command station that has a computer interface. I've used a lot of DCC systems and without doubt the most straightforward in my view to use for reading and writing CVs is the NCE Power Cab (even better than the much more expensive NCE ProCab). It is intuitive and generally requires less button pressing than the alternatives. At around £150 it is fully functional so you will not find after a few weeks familiarisation that there are features that you didn't realise were missing. It can address all 29 function keys - be careful, not all systems can do this. Whilst this may not seem a big issue at the moment, if you decide to go for sound fitted models, you may require access to all F keys, depending upon how comprehensive the sound project is. If you need to access Decoder Pro software, NCE produce an inexpensive USB computer interface, which, if you wish to be even more 'tech' you can use to run Engine Driver software on you tablet or smart 'phone for Wi-Fi control of your layout. Kind regards, Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted May 13, 2017 Author Share Posted May 13, 2017 Back to a decoder question, some decoders dont seem tohave anything covering them, should I wrap a piece of insulation tape around them in case they touch wires or the chasis? Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpgibbons Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 Mask off any potential shorts with insulating tape but don't wrap the decoder as this may promote overheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted May 13, 2017 Share Posted May 13, 2017 Back to a decoder question, some decoders dont seem tohave anything covering them, should I wrap a piece of insulation tape around them in case they touch wires or the chasis? Steve. Steve, Generally, decoders without wires are held in place with pins, This usually holds them in place so that they do not touch anything 'dangerous'. Decoders with a harness or wires are free to move and so are usually insulated for safety. When you perform the installation, you should check if metal components or bare wires could possibly come into contact with your decoder when reassembled, and if the required separation is in any doubt insulate either the decoder or the surrounding areas to prevent shorting. Kind regards, Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PaulCheffus Posted May 14, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 14, 2017 As I have said before .... The multimaus CAN read back cvs But only when used with any of..... The amplifier With Rocomotion serial computer interface and ppm track output box added Or When plugged into a MultiCentralPro Or When plugged into a z21/Z21 However, it is slower to program when reading is involved because all controllers do that first, and. If simply writing a new value, the old value is irrelevant. For those wanting to 'play' with lots of cvs, they are best recommended to use a sprog and Jmri or similar to log and keep a computer record of all the values... So as to restore them after too much tweaking. Hi It can also read if attached to a Lenz system. Cheers Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted May 30, 2017 Author Share Posted May 30, 2017 Having played with my better decoders for nearly a month now, I've been bitten by the DCC bug, and with payday on the horizon I am seriously tempted to get a NCE Power cab starter set. I've seen stuff about using a sprog to read and change cv's so would that be a cheaper option still using my ez command dcc controller on the layout? Also what cv's would I be likley to need or want to tweek? Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted May 30, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 30, 2017 Decoders with a harness or wires are free to move and so are usually insulated for safety. Kind regards, Paul Lenz decoders always have a double sided 3M sticky pad to affix the decoder to something. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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