Water activated powdered glue

[Fixair]

I know that DeLuxe manufacture an excellent product of this type but in such small quantities at a relatively high price excellent for tender coal and wagon loads but not for a big layout. Does anyone know of a source of bulk powdered glue that is perhaps used in industry that would behave in the same way as the Deluxe product. I have looked for powdered PVA which I believe is the DeLuxe product without success.

 

 

Ron

[Pete the Elaner]

Wallpaper paste flakes. These can be crushed into a fine powder.

Their disadvantage is that they swell when wet then contract again when fully dry. They may look ok when touch dry after a day but can leave cracks in the 6' when fully dry after a few days.

I always recommend experimenting new techniques on a small test track before committing them to your layout.

 

BTW, I hate PVA for ballasting. I think it is totally unsuitable for the task because it dries too hard & makes granite ballast turn green.

Edited November 10, 2017 by Pete the Elaner

[dhjgreen]

Cascamite is a water activated glue. Worth an experiment, not tried it myself.

[Fixair]

Wallpaper paste flakes. These can be crushed into a fine powder.

Their disadvantage is that they swell when wet then contract again when fully dry. They may look ok when touch dry after a day but can leave cracks in the 6' when fully dry after a few days.

I always recommend experimenting new techniques on a small test track before committing them to your layout.

 

BTW, I hate PVA for ballasting. I think it is totally unsuitable for the task because it dries too hard & makes granite ballast turn green.

Pete,

 

Thanks for that. I have just looked at Cascamite resin powdered wood glue. Looks promising and inexpensive. Any opinions?

[Phil Bullock]

Have used cascamite in the past.

 

Sets like concrete - make sure the track is correctly aligned before ballasting!

 

Phil

[Fixair]

Cascamite is a water activated glue. Worth an experiment, not tried it myself.

You beat me to my reply to Pete's post. I think for a Fiver a tub I will try experimenting with it. If no good it will still be useful for something. Your blog looks as if it is a layout like mine in a converted garage minus up and over door with window and door.

[Fixair]

Have used cascamite in the past.

 

Sets like concrete - make sure the track is correctly aligned before ballasting!

 

Phil

O.K. Phil I will give it a test shot ff the actual layout. Sounds good to me.

 

Ron

[chris p bacon]

We used Cascamite a lot in Joinery (PVA & Resin based ones now) it's very good but it can resist mixing with water,  we used to have to make a thick paste of it before thinning with more water, it could take 4-5 minutes of mixing to deal with lumps.

 

Make sure you get fine powder.

[dhjgreen]

You beat me to my reply to Pete's post. I think for a Fiver a tub I will try experimenting with it. If no good it will still be useful for something. Your blog looks as if it is a layout like mine in a converted garage minus up and over door with window and door.

I really must update that Blog. As the layout is fixed I have not glued the ballast in place, people say you get noisy running if you do. If any ballast wanders it is simple to rectify.

[rue_d_etropal]

thing with cascamite, is not to get it into point blades, as they will be stuck completely.Unlike PVA you can not disolve it to clear it. I used to use it many year ago, but find PVA OK ,as long as you protect the base under the track(I use a very wet mixture). I tend to ballast track before fitting down as I use lightweight cardboard as baseboards(box files). Not so easy with flexi track though. I also use ready mixed brown wood filler/plaster from Wilkinsons to represent less than perfect balllast.

The green ballast problem with PVA is dependent on type of ballast used. It used to be very common with one supplier, but have not heard of so many cases recently.

[Pete the Elaner]

 As the layout is fixed I have not glued the ballast in place, people say you get noisy running if you do.

Yes. The harder the glue, the more noise it transmits.

Ballast fixed with PVA is a little noisier than ballast fixed with Copydex, but this is still much noisier than loose ballast.

[The Johnster]

Weren't the Cascamites one of the 12 tribes of Israel that were always a'smoting of each other in the Old Testament; 'And the Cascamites smote mightily the Trilobites, who were sore afraid and a great wailing and a'gernashering of teeth was heard' sort of thing.

[Phil Bullock]

That sounds like the genesis of a punch up!

 

Phil

[steve1]

Still happy with using Klear for ballasting.

 

steve

[Alcanman]

Cascamite was very popular and recommended in magazines back in the day.  I tried it for ballasting with disastrous results.

 

After 30 years of modelling, I've had the best results with Woodland Scenics Scenic Cement.

 

Expensive, but a quality product.

[rab]

Weren't the Cascamites one of the 12 tribes of Israel that were always a'smoting of each other in the Old Testament; 'And the Cascamites smote mightily the Trilobites, who were sore afraid and a great wailing and a'gernashering of teeth was heard' sort of thing.

Which version of the Good Book

did you find that in??

[Branwell]

I've used yellow dextrin in the past. Worked well, albeit that I'd imagine that like cascamite it could be difficult to remove.

[stewartingram]

All this negativity about Cascamite! I've used it since the 60s, no problems. And I've lifted track for re-se. Admittedly, the ballast tends to lift with it but is easily broken off. There may be better alternatives, but I've stuck (sorry) with it.

Here in Chatteris, when I moved here a few years ago, we had a wonderful hardware shop, the old fashioned type, but sadly now closed. When I heard they were closing, I went in to stock up with Cascamite. The guy behind the counter thought they could get it, but now under a different name. I have it in the man cave model room garage, when I get in there tomorrow I'll check the name.

 

Stewart

[Mike Storey]

Still happy with using Klear for ballasting.

 

steve

 

Is that the new Johnsons Klear? Is it still ok since they changed the formula?

[PatB]

Cascamite is a brand name for a urea-formaldehyde resin glue. There are (or were) many others, so if you do a search on the generic term you should find some alternative names. It's good stuff. Once considered good enough to stick wooden aircraft together (still is in the US), it works fine for ballasting, coal sticking etc.

[robert17649]

Which version of the Good Book

did you find that in??

clearly the Book of Erbros Chap 2 v 5 the (Edinburgh ) Waverley edition.

[Silver Sidelines]

Hello Ron

This was a recent picture for my Blog. The ballast and the 'ground' between the tracks (silt and sand) was all glued with wallpaper paste. It has been down now for five years without any further attention.


D369, English Electric Type 4

There are a number of Posts on my Blog about using wallpaper paste - this one for instance about mixing with silt and sand.

Ray

Edited November 11, 2017 by Silver Sidelines

[steve1]

Is that the new Johnsons Klear? Is it still ok since they changed the formula?

I have a small stockpile of the original but I am led to believe the new stuff is as good.

 

steve

[Mike Storey]

Hello Ron

 

This was a recent picture for my Blog. The ballast and the 'ground' between the tracks (silt and sand) was all glued with wallpaper paste. It has been down now for five years without any further attention.

 

D369, English Electric Type 4

 

There are a number of Posts on my Blog about using wallpaper paste - this one for instance about mixing with silt and sand.

 

Ray

 

Interesting, thank you. I have never considered using paste, because I had assumed (apart from the potential for shrinkage on drying, as described above) that the end result would be as rigid as PVA, and thus cause noise problems from vibration. Have you managed to overcome that? (Apologies if that is already covered in your blog).

[Silver Sidelines]

Thanks Mike

Interesting, thank you. I have never considered using paste, because I had assumed (apart from the potential for shrinkage on drying, as described above) that the end result would be as rigid as PVA, and thus cause noise problems from vibration. Have you managed to overcome that? (Apologies if that is already covered in your blog).

It is a big solid layout and the track is pinned directly to 1/2 inch MDF.

 

Ballasting has fixed the track in place and running is improved compared to the non-scenic sections where the track is only pinned.  Don't know how to answer your noise question.  There are lots of videos of my layout on YouTube and I have been complemented for the lovely clickety click sound on some of them.  Here are two of the latest videos - a newish Bachmann DS locomotive (on analogue) and a venerable (noisy) Bachmann A4.

 

I shall be interested to hear what you think.

 

Regards

 

Ray