OO or OO-SF with or without DCC Concepts track

[robmanchester]

Richie,

 

Good sounding project. There are basically two head widths on FB rail  in the 4mm model world. Those with a head width around 0.7-0.8mm and those with a head width of around 0.9mm. The narrower ones are usually 3.5mm scale HO rail as used on older Peco products, Tillig etc etc rather than full width to represent prototype british track . Track gauges are available with slots of either of the above two widths to suit but it isn't advisable to use the wide slot width with narrow width rail as you can end up with some track that is out of gauge.

 

I, personally, would use Peco IL-115 FB rail ( 0.9mm head width ) which is the same head width as C&L code 75 BH rail you may need for sidings .The rails with narrower head width can look a bit skinny especially if you are retaining the Bachmann/Hornby wheels in 4-SF although the narrower head width is actually in scale with the gauge of the track if not the real world.

 

The sleeper/timbers you use are not so simple to decide. Personally I like Peco Pandrol clips used on wooden sleepers. The Pandrols are over scale but painted/weathered they look quite nice. The Pandrol clips can be used for making turnouts with some creative chopping and glueing. The massokits and brassmasters bases are fiddly to use but very nice if you have the patience.

 

Link here to the Peco bits : http://www.osbornsmodels.com/peco-4mm-scale-individulay-components-436-c.asp

 

Any Peco dealer can order the bits for you, rail is in packs of six lengths but the rail fixings and timbers have to usually be ordered in 6 packs ( of 96 or 100 etc ).

 

Peco also do, on the above page, concrete sleepers that come with rail fixings. They are nice but not sure what you do about turnouts if using them.

 

Hope that doesn't confuse too much.

 

Rob

 

 

 

 

 

[hayfield]

Richie

 

Looks like others have answered the questions my response posed

 

Briefly Exactoscale do not make flexitrack. The fast track bases are about 6" long and the sleepers for 00 gauge have moulded chairs, you thread the rail on to the bases and if curved track is required you cut the webs. Exactoscale costings are totally different to Peco's mainly due to limited production runs

 

Exactoscale do not make or supply rail anymore, C&L just do one type. Code 82 is not on C&L's website at the moment, I know Phil picked up a van load of rail last week, but no idea if it included code 82 rail

 

Do look at photos of track work from the era you are modelling.

 

Don't get your hopes up about different track fixings, in 4 mm scale flatbottom track parts are worse off than bullhead. Its a case of making do with whats available

[giz]

That’s interesting thanks. I’ve not looked at Peco concrete track but I presume it’s just a case of taking a hacksaw or sharp craft knife to split the webbing by each sleeper and space it out? Presumably a metre length could be laid on top of a Templot template to get the right sleeper spacing?

 

Given the layout is going to be on the larger side I am conscious of cost, at least until the lottery numbers come up!!

 

Richie

Yes, the webbing can be easily cut with a craft knife. Pete Harvey (PH Design) does an etched tool for spacing sleepers but it's designed for wooden sleepers so I don't know if it would work with concrete ones.

 

http://www.phd-design-etchings.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_70&product_id=130

 

Shouldn't be too difficult to make something similar out of plasticard though.

[Re6/6]

 

.......................Don't get your hopes up about different track fixings, in 4 mm scale flatbottom track parts are worse off than bullhead. Its a case of making do with whats available

 

There are scale sized Pandrol clips from Colin Craig; http://colincraig4mm.co.uk/plain-track/4532599926. They used to be whitemetal last time that l bought them from Colin. He now 3D prints them.

 

They certainly aren't cheap but are superb and more importantly they're the correct size. He also does other types of FB clips.

 

 

 

Phil at C&L sells these which are not so well defined but would be a cheaper option.  http://www.finescale.org.uk/index.php?route=product/category&path=346_375_383

 

 

 

Edited January 18, 2018 by Re6/6

[Junctionmad]

Hi Brian,

 

I suggest that it is much better to transition the plain track, not the turnouts.

 

That way, if you need to lift the pointwork and re-use it in a different track plan, you can do so.

 

It's dead easy to transition 16.5mm flexi-track to 16.2mm:

 

1. connect it to 16.2mm with rail joiners.

2. hold it down flat with a suitable tool.

3. gently heat the last inch or so of the rails with a soldering iron until the chairs have softened.

4. keep holding it flat until they have cooled.

 

I may have mentioned this before.

 

Martin.

Could I humbly disagree with the Maestro here . In my case I flare the 00-SF point approach and exit tracks to match 16.5mm. where I have a collection of turnouts or a complex piece of track and crossings etc , I retain the 16.2mm gauge throughout the area , even making small sections of 16.2mm plain track, and then flare the ends of the relevant pointwork to 16.5 ( over about 3-4 sleepers )

 

This means the rtr plain track is used as is, and can be reused and also means any individual points which are so flared an be reused with any rtr track in the future . Personally I find the opportunity to reuse pointwork very rare

 

SO as an example , where I build a simple crossover or a scissors config, I build either the 2 or 4 points to 00-SF including any short pieces of crossover track , and then just flare the toe and heels as necessary to 16.5, this is extremely easy when hand building the pointwork . maintaining the 00-SF gauge over the crossing road, keeps the stock happier and cuts down on buffer locking when propelling

 

by the way, the move to 00-SF through the points was was my best track work decision yet

Edited January 18, 2018 by Junctionmad

[Richie Kynaston]

Evening guys,

 

Richie,

 

Good sounding project. There are basically two head widths on FB rail  in the 4mm model world. Those with a head width around 0.7-0.8mm and those with a head width of around 0.9mm. The narrower ones are usually 3.5mm scale HO rail as used on older Peco products, Tillig etc etc rather than full width to represent prototype british track . Track gauges are available with slots of either of the above two widths to suit but it isn't advisable to use the wide slot width with narrow width rail as you can end up with some track that is out of gauge.

 

I, personally, would use Peco IL-115 FB rail ( 0.9mm head width ) which is the same head width as C&L code 75 BH rail you may need for sidings .The rails with narrower head width can look a bit skinny especially if you are retaining the Bachmann/Hornby wheels in 4-SF although the narrower head width is actually in scale with the gauge of the track if not the real world.

 

The sleeper/timbers you use are not so simple to decide. Personally I like Peco Pandrol clips used on wooden sleepers. The Pandrols are over scale but painted/weathered they look quite nice. The Pandrol clips can be used for making turnouts with some creative chopping and glueing. The massokits and brassmasters bases are fiddly to use but very nice if you have the patience.

 

Link here to the Peco bits : http://www.osbornsmodels.com/peco-4mm-scale-individulay-components-436-c.asp

 

Any Peco dealer can order the bits for you, rail is in packs of six lengths but the rail fixings and timbers have to usually be ordered in 6 packs ( of 96 or 100 etc ).

 

Peco also do, on the above page, concrete sleepers that come with rail fixings. They are nice but not sure what you do about turnouts if using them.

 

Hope that doesn't confuse too much.

 

Rob

 

Rob,

Many thanks for the input, all really useful.  Some interesting bits in there that i dont think i've seen before.

 

I've confirmed that the size i've got to play with, at a maximum is 24' x 7' - although there is the possibility that for 15' of that I could get to 9 or possibly 10' width.  As a result, a quick estimation (very rough) suggest that a layout over two levels, with fiddle yard underneath would give a run of around 108 foot - based on a four track main line that is 432 foot, and with the station and scenic sidings are that is very roughly 450 foot of trackwork.  Accepting that a reasonable amount of that is fiddle yard track which will be Peco flexi anyway, I think that on cost grounds, the best way of going forward will be to use Peco concrete sleepered track for the metre-length sections (with the sleepers respaced), building concrete sleepered flat bottom pointwork, and making use of the Exactoscale track bases for short straights.  Having said that i'll probably do a short section of hand-build straight track on the countryside section, where pictures can be taken. My proposal is to use hand-built copper clad pointwork in the fiddle yard.

 

I think somebody said earlier that C&L do concrete sleepers for pointwork.

 

Having said all of that i'll look into the Peco Pandrol clips on wooden sleepers for one of the routes that while still a main line will not be WCML, and probably wooden sleepered bullhead track in the yard/stabling areas.

 

 

Richie

 

Looks like others have answered the questions my response posed

 

Briefly Exactoscale do not make flexitrack. The fast track bases are about 6" long and the sleepers for 00 gauge have moulded chairs, you thread the rail on to the bases and if curved track is required you cut the webs. Exactoscale costings are totally different to Peco's mainly due to limited production runs

 

Exactoscale do not make or supply rail anymore, C&L just do one type. Code 82 is not on C&L's website at the moment, I know Phil picked up a van load of rail last week, but no idea if it included code 82 rail

 

Do look at photos of track work from the era you are modelling.

 

Don't get your hopes up about different track fixings, in 4 mm scale flatbottom track parts are worse off than bullhead. Its a case of making do with whats available

 

John, thanks for confirming those bits and pieces.  I'll have a serious think about things. Deep down, id like to use the Exactoscale basis, and perhaps buying in the quantity needed, I may be able to talk with the chap at C&L and agree some kind of deal, I need to speak to him about the rail too.  Going on the above measurements, at 6" I am going to need around 67 packs, which has to be worth his while doing a deal!  Although some of that will be pointwork and some will be hidden so probably nearer to 50 packs i guess, still a considerable sum to spend.  I guess its one of the questions as to for that volume of trackwork, is it worth the extra cost and time - i need to sit and consider that.  

 

Im trying to find photos of trackwork in the area, the problem was a lot of it was relayed in the mid-1980s and finding images from before that during the 1980s is proving a little difficult.  But i keep looking! Given that my aim is to subsequently fit OHL to it as well, im also trying to establish if there is anything that i need to think about on the trackplan, where the OHL is concerned, but i've do a post in the Special Interests > Electrification thread about that.

 

I take your point about whats available - when i start thinking of the time element, there cannot be many people doing large layouts building all track - so i guess the market for this kind of thing is quite small.

 

 

Yes, the webbing can be easily cut with a craft knife. Pete Harvey (PH Design) does an etched tool for spacing sleepers but it's designed for wooden sleepers so I don't know if it would work with concrete ones.

 

http://www.phd-design-etchings.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=25_70&product_id=130

 

Shouldn't be too difficult to make something similar out of plasticard though.

 

Giz - Thanks for that ... thats the road im currently thinking of going down, but i'll drop Pete Harvey and email and ask him.  I recall somebody telling me that in the old days of wooden sleepers and 60ft lengths, that the sleepers got closer together towards each end of the track panel.  Does the same happen on concrete sleepers where, i guess, it was/is Thermit welded, rather than having a fishplate?

 

There are scale sized Pandrol clips from Colin Craig; http://colincraig4mm.co.uk/plain-track/4532599926. They used to be whitemetal last time that l bought them from Colin. He now 3D prints them.

 

They certainly aren't cheap but are superb and more importantly they're the correct size. He also does other types of FB clips.

 

Colin Craig PAN 6.jpg

 

 

Phil at C&L sells these which are not so well defined but would be a cheaper option.  http://www.finescale.org.uk/index.php?route=product/category&path=346_375_383

 

C and L FB 16.5.jpg

 

Hi John,

Thanks for popping in.  I really do like the effect of those Colin Craig clips - what make of concrete sleepers would they be used with? Any ideas?  My only concern is that there are comments about them being somewhat 'fiddly' to do and given the distance im covering.....!  My other thought is to possibly use them on the non-electrified main line, which will only be a shorter section from the junction, and more likely to have wooden sleepers.

 

SO as an example , where  I build a simple crossover or a scissors config, I build either the 2 or 4 points to 00-SF including any short pieces of crossover track , and then just flare the toe and heels as necessary to 16.5, this is extremely easy when hand building the paintwork . maintaining the 00-SF gauge over the crossing road, keeps the stock happier and cuts down on buffer locking when propelling 

 

by the way, the move to 00-SF through the points was was my best track work decision yet 

 

Hi Junctionmad (sorry i dont know your name!)

I can see Martin's point and the pros/cons of doing it the way he suggested, but i can also see pros/cons to your way of working too.  Assuming its personal preference and actually immaterial as to which item of trackwork is changed, i think i'd probably extend the points slightly so the flare was on my handbuilt section, to save heating the chairs and potentially damaging them.

 

Do you have a thread on here showing what you have done in OO-SF at all? Im working my way through Gordon's Eastwood Town thread at the moment, which is giving me plenty of ideas and things to consider!

 

Richie

[Junctionmad]

Do you have a thread on here showing what you have done in OO-SF at all? Im working my way through Gordon's Eastwood Town thread at the moment, which is giving me plenty of ideas and things to consider!

 

I'm not a fan of posting " progress " , I don't tend to photograph my work in progress either , but I'll gladly answer specifics. when I first started hand building points , I was similar to Gordon S , all soldered and copperclad.

 

However on my return to the hobby , I'm building , very slowly , a large OO layout set in the late 70s , 80s , while I'd " like" to hand built all the track , I do think you have to balance build time against progress to ensure you don't suffer the " Eastwood " effect of a layout partially in build for a very long time. So for me it was a decision to use RTR bullhead and handbuild the scenic area pointwork. Even though , in my case the sidings of the prototype were not in BH , but in lightweight FB , Ive chosen not to model that aspect as it would mean too much plain track construction.

 

for me the appearance in BH rail of chaired track , means soldered construction doesn't cut it an more. So I use a hybrid method of soldering the common crossing to 0.5mm shims and building the point from a combination of functional full and cosmetic half chairs. I have a combination of C&L 00-SF gauges and more recently I have made my own. ( i now prefer flat bar gauges to roller one ) , while at the gauge O show in Telford last year , I saw some lovely crossing jigs , allowing a very easy soldering of the shims to the V and wing rails and I'm now building these for OO-SF

 

The key is to make a start , rather then endlessly discussing options. because it's only as you build , you realise what's works for you and what doesn't and more importantly , where your standards lie , or more correctly " what can you live with "

 

Dave

Edited January 18, 2018 by Junctionmad

[Richie Kynaston]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for that - some very valid points in there (excuse the pun!).  I have acquired the 'vee' jig from the EM gauge society, for filing down the vees, and I am looking forward to getting on with things, hopefully in the next month or so.  I have sat pondering for around four months already But that has been no bad thing, as it allowed me to rule somethings out and clarify what I actually wanted.  

 

But I agree with you, balancing build time and with progress and the enjoyment of running is key to any model railway, although I think that always strikes of toy trains, so im leaning towards the phrase of 'miniature worlds'!

 

Thank you for your input however, its all valid and very appreciated.

 

Richie

[MikeH_83]

I'm not a fan of posting " progress " , I don't tend to photograph my work in progress either , but I'll gladly answer specifics. when I first started hand building points , I was similar to Gordon S , all soldered and copperclad.

 

However on my return to the hobby , I'm building , very slowly , a large OO layout set in the late 70s , 80s , while I'd " like" to hand built all the track , I do think you have to balance build time against progress to ensure you don't suffer the " Eastwood " effect of a layout partially in build for a very long time. So for me it was a decision to use RTR bullhead and handbuild the scenic area pointwork. Even though , in my case the sidings of the prototype were not in BH , but in lightweight FB , Ive chosen not to model that aspect as it would mean too much plain track construction.

 

for me the appearance in BH rail of chaired track , means soldered construction doesn't cut it an more. So I use a hybrid method of soldering the common crossing to 0.5mm shims and building the point from a combination of functional full and cosmetic half chairs. I have a combination of C&L 00-SF gauges and more recently I have made my own. ( i now prefer flat bar gauges to roller one ) , while at the gauge O show in Telford last year , I saw some lovely crossing jigs , allowing a very easy soldering of the shims to the V and wing rails and I'm now building these for OO-SF

 

The key is to make a start , rather then endlessly discussing options. because it's only as you build , you realise what's works for you and what doesn't and more importantly , where your standards lie , or more correctly " what can you live with "

 

Dave

Which jig is that for the V and wing rails? Is it the EM society one or another make?  I have ordered the em society one to see what it is like as doing the vee's and wing rails are the one part I have not tried yet!  I need to find some of that 0.5mm copperclad too then,  Urgh another 2-3month wait from c&l then lol.  There must be an alternative source somewhere!

 

Hi Dave,

Thanks for that - some very valid points in there (excuse the pun!).  I have acquired the 'vee' jig from the EM gauge society, for filing down the vees, and I am looking forward to getting on with things, hopefully in the next month or so.  I have sat pondering for around four months already But that has been no bad thing, as it allowed me to rule somethings out and clarify what I actually wanted.  

 

But I agree with you, balancing build time and with progress and the enjoyment of running is key to any model railway, although I think that always strikes of toy trains, so im leaning towards the phrase of 'miniature worlds'!

 

Thank you for your input however, its all valid and very appreciated.

 

Richie

Yeah I have spent ages going over plans and changing things and It would be nice to get going!  I know I could fit alot into the space I have but I decided to keep it more simple and small to see how handbuilt 4-SF track went,  I didn't want to start a huge project myself (although you could say handbuilding about 26ft of track with functional chairs just for the main loop is a huge project) but it would be nice to see how long it takes, how it holds up to the temperature fluctuations in the loft over the years, And also allows me to save up for a house by not having to buy 100's of point motors and detector modules etc etc.  Still whatever you go for trackwise enjoy the journey and start a layout thread too

[Junctionmad]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for that - some very valid points in there (excuse the pun!).  I have acquired the 'vee' jig from the EM gauge society, for filing down the vees, and I am looking forward to getting on with things, hopefully in the next month or so.  I have sat pondering for around four months already But that has been no bad thing, as it allowed me to rule somethings out and clarify what I actually wanted.  

 

But I agree with you, balancing build time and with progress and the enjoyment of running is key to any model railway, although I think that always strikes of toy trains, so im leaning towards the phrase of 'miniature worlds'!

 

Thank you for your input however, its all valid and very appreciated.

 

Richie

Good stuff Richie , best have a shot and see . in my case there's 45 points to construct , so I decided to build the track work in stages so as to get something working, I'm using a lightweight ply construction ( I posted pics somewhere on Rmweb a while back ) which allows me to remove individual baseboards to work on them.

 

I'm like you , although my layout is a model of a particular station at a particular point in history , it's rather large and complex, because ultimately I'm a signalling fan , so I wanted a complex semaphore signalled area. but the trade off is to build as much of the track work from RTR parts where possible , in fact if PECO had a reasonable range of the new bullhead in points, i suspect I'd forgo much of the pointwork construction as well . I built two GWR classic BLTs with all hand built track and is in one case , arbortively in EM. not going back there , thanks.

 

Best of luck.

[martin_wynne]

In my case I flare the 00-SF point approach and exit tracks to match 16.5mm.

 

Each to his own, as always.

 

I'm still living in hope that some 16.2mm flexi will appear. Changing over later would be difficult if 16.5mm gauge has been built into the ends of the pointwork.

 

Indeed, the DCC Concepts flexi is reported at around 16.3mm, and there were hints from Richard Johnson in his posts on MRF that the DCC pointwork would be heading towards 16.2mm with "narrower flangeways". If he gets the message and changes to nickel-silver rail the DCC flexi might become the preferable option. It also has the thin base to match plywood, Scaleway, etc.

 

I tend to regard 16.5mm flexi as a stop-gap solution and disposable, hence the willingness to melt it to fit.

 

A pure 4-SF layout would be all 16.2mm, so it seems best not to compromise that by permanently building bits of 16.5mm into the pointwork.

 

regards,

 

Martin.

[Junctionmad]

Which jig is that for the V and wing rails? Is it the EM society one or another make? I have ordered the em society one to see what it is like as doing the vee's and wing rails are the one part I have not tried yet! I need to find some of that 0.5mm copperclad too then, Urgh another 2-3month wait from c&l then lol. There must be an alternative source somewhere!

 

This is not a filing jig, I have those as well, from the scalefour society

 

What these are is a jig to facilitate soldering the V and wing rails onto a 0.5mm copper shim , i.e. An assembly jig, I found a sheet of 0.5mm solid copper , about 6 " x 4" in my local local shop . The 0.1mm undersize makes no real difference imho. I cut strips of the shim on my proxxon table saw and then solder the completed V assembly and wing rails to the shim. I then stick the shims to the ply with super glue and surround the assembly with cosmetic chairs cut from C&L chairs

 

I solder the V with 180 degree electrical solder and the shims from 148 degree solder. However the main issue is keeping the wing rails and the V in position as you solder the shims

 

Then at Telford I saw this

 

 

And I'm currently machining some for 00-SF ( I am fortunate to have a proxxon MF50 converted for CNC work )

 

Dave

Edited January 18, 2018 by Junctionmad

[MikeH_83]

This is not a filing jig, I have those as well, from the scalefour society

 

What these are is a jig to facilitate soldering the V and wing rails onto a 0.5mm copper shim , i.e. An assembly jig, I found a sheet of 0.5mm solid copper , about 6 " x 4" in my local local shop . The 0.1mm undersize makes no real difference imho. I cut strips of the shim on my proxxon table saw and then solder the completed V assembly and wing rails to the shim. I then stick the shims to the ply with super glue and surround the assembly with cosmetic chairs cut from C&L chairs

 

I solder the V with 180 degree electrical solder and the shims from 148 degree solder. However the main issue is keeping the wing rails and the V in position as you solder the shims

 

Then at Telford I saw this

 

IMG_1301.JPG

 

And I'm currently machining some for 00-SF ( I am fortunate to have a proxxon MF50'comveryed for CNC work )

 

Dave

 

Awesome I shall try using that method!  I've got plenty of rail now so it won't hurt if I make a mistake or 2.  That looks really useful so if you ever get to making some for sale then let me know   Any tools that make the job easier are much welcomed

[Junctionmad]

Each to his own, as always.

 

I'm still living in hope that some 16.2mm flexi will appear. Changing over later would be difficult if 16.5mm gauge has been built into the ends of the pointwork.

 

Indeed, the DCC Concepts flexi is reported at around 16.3mm, and there were hints from Richard Johnson in his posts on MRF that the DCC pointwork would be heading towards 16.2mm with "narrower flangeways". If he gets the message and changes to nickel-silver rail the DCC flexi might become the preferable option. It also has the thin base to match plywood, Scaleway, etc.

 

I tend to regard 16.5mm flexi as a stop-gap solution and disposable, hence the willingness to melt it to fit.

 

A pure 4-SF layout would be all 16.2mm, so it seems best not to compromise that by permanently building bits of 16.5mm into the pointwork.

 

regards,

 

Martin.

As always , Martin , your a purist, and thankfully templot is the result ! . I have some DCC track and I see no gauge narrowing in evidence and as a product I believe it brings nothing to the table over the recent PECO announcement, but that's another debate

 

When the 16.2 mm RTR track appears , I will of course weep at the catastrophic error of flaring my points to 16.5 and in fury no doubt rip up all my carefully laid work .

 

Until that day , I shall continue in bliss, using the new PECO rtr , without attempting to melt its chairs, all the while enjoying my muddle of 16.2 and 16.5 trackwork as it delivers great running and visual benefits.

 

Dave

Edited January 18, 2018 by Junctionmad

[Junctionmad]

Awesome I shall try using that method!  I've got plenty of rail now so it won't hurt if I make a mistake or 2.  That looks really useful so if you ever get to making some for sale then let me know   Any tools that make the job easier are much welcomed

Be glad to make then available , obviously you need to plan your points in templot to have common V angles ( or at least the same ones as mine !!! )

[robmanchester]

The assembly jig that Dave saw at Telford was for O Gauge as it is an O gauge Show. They are made in a paxolin-like material by the Scale7 guys.

 

Rather than make a similar jig in 4-SF/EM etc you can print out a mirror image of your turnout/slip/crossing inTemplot and stick it on a flat board. Put double sided tape over the areas you want to solder with the shims, file/bend up the rails and stick them head down onto the plan. Then simple to add the strips of brass/NS or whatever you wish. Peel the assembly off the tape when done.

 

Rob

 

[Junctionmad]

The assembly jig that Dave saw at Telford was for O Gauge as it is an O gauge Show. They are made in a paxolin-like material by the Scale7 guys.

 

Rather than make a similar jig in 4-SF/EM etc you can print out a mirror image of your turnout/slip/crossing inTemplot and stick it on a flat board. Put double sided tape over the areas you want to solder with the shims, file/bend up the rails and stick them head down onto the plan. Then simple to add the strips of brass/NS or whatever you wish. Peel the assembly off the tape when done.

 

Rob

I tried that , personally , I found the adhesive on double sided tape does not like any form of heat and rapidly goes gooey and looses grip , secondly there's nothing to keep the rail in place vertically , so I still had to use lace pins and it still requires a flangeway shim gauge to ensure correct spacing etc.

 

The jig removes all that flaffing about. yes it requires manufacture , but getting templot into a cad drawing is easy and the CNC machining is easy ( it's a simple 2D pocket ) and a lot of my pointwork is simple and similar. I find that with shim based plastic chair construction , flettling the common crossing is very tricky so it's needs to be right first time

 

In fact , my layout has one irregular diamond and traditionally I've struggled with the alignment of the K crossings, so I'm actually going to machine a one use jig for that

Edited January 18, 2018 by Junctionmad

[Richie Kynaston]

This is not a filing jig, I have those as well, from the scalefour society

 

What these are is a jig to facilitate soldering the V and wing rails onto a 0.5mm copper shim , i.e. An assembly jig, I found a sheet of 0.5mm solid copper , about 6 " x 4" in my local local shop . The 0.1mm undersize makes no real difference imho. I cut strips of the shim on my proxxon table saw and then solder the completed V assembly and wing rails to the shim. I then stick the shims to the ply with super glue and surround the assembly with cosmetic chairs cut from C&L chairs

 

I solder the V with 180 degree electrical solder and the shims from 148 degree solder. However the main issue is keeping the wing rails and the V in position as you solder the shims

 

Then at Telford I saw this

 

IMG_1301.JPG

 

And I'm currently machining some for 00-SF ( I am fortunate to have a proxxon MF50 converted for CNC work )

 

Dave

 

Interesting Dave, I may have got hold of the wrong end of the stick when i found that then!  I'll wait til it arrives and see.

 

If your open to any commissions, your jigs sound like a logical help!   You did say you were doing 1:6 through to 1:12 didn't you  lol!

 

Richie

[Junctionmad]

Interesting Dave, I may have got hold of the wrong end of the stick when i found that then! I'll wait til it arrives and see.

 

If your open to any commissions, your jigs sound like a logical help! You did say you were doing 1:6 through to 1:12 didn't you lol!

 

Richie

i did say that didn't I

 

the filing jigs you've ordered are " useful " , even if after a few points you will find you can freehand file the rails by eye just as good. ( and Martin has outlined a method of V construction that's even easier , elsewhere in this sub-forum

Edited January 18, 2018 by Junctionmad

[trustytrev]

Hello,

 

 

transition curves are not something i've come across, but another thing added to my list of things to look up!  Is that a real thing, or a model (ie Templot) thing?

 

It is both. Martin has created Templot so all us enthusiasts can replicate the real thing as faithfully as possible give or take a few compromises.

trustytrev.

Edited January 18, 2018 by trustytrev

[Junctionmad]

Hello,

 

 

 

It is both. Martin has created Templot so all us enthusiasts can replicate the real thing as faithfully as possible give or take a few compromises.

trustytrev.

Indeed , I had an email ding with the creator of SCARM , who doesn't see the point of transition curves on model railways and SCARM can't do then any all , I pointed him in the direction of templot

 

( bizzarly the word d.o.n.g is banned by this site )

Edited January 19, 2018 by Junctionmad

[martin_wynne]

( bizzarly the word d.o.n.g is banned by this site )

 

Not by this site.

 

The bad word filter is provided by the board software (Invision): https://invisioncommunity.com

 

Andy Y can edit it if you ask him nicely.

 

Martin.

[hayfield]

Richie

 

I think I confused you with the way i suggested using the Exactoscale Turnout timber strips for both timber and concrete Timbers by just painting another colour

 

The Scalefour or EMGS Vee jigs are for filing the rail, though you can use the clamps to hold them whilst soldering

 

The common crossing jigs are a great help, I have one for a 1-7 in 0 gauge

 

C&L have found a source of 0.5 mm strip, will be in stock soon (if not already)

 

 

This is a good piece of kit from the EMGS in EM or P4 gauges, initially designed for P4 and for use when building the turnout in situ, but by soldering a length of tail to a sheet of copperclad an EM gauge]e block gauge can be used for 00sf

 

 

This is an 00 gauge (16.5) one milled up for me 

 

 

Used slightly differently than the Commercial one by using a wing rail gauge

 

 

Do the other side

 

 

File the copperclad strips back to the rail sides

 

I have an even simpler method using a home made jig, will up load photos later

 

 

 

 

[Richie Kynaston]

Hello,

It is both. Martin has created Templot so all us enthusiasts can replicate the real thing as faithfully as possible give or take a few compromises.

trustytrev.

I’ve been reading up on Templot transition curves and I think I’m starting to understand them a little, although putting them into practise may be different! Still I’m hoping to sit down and try some serious track planning with Templot today! I may report back!

 

Richie

[hayfield]

This is a simple jig for any angle and or gauge or scale. Just a board with a piece of metal bar screwed to ii, keeping a gap between the board and metal for the copperclad to fit under

 

 

Just solder strips of copperclad (0.5 mm for 4mm and 1 mm for 7 mm) or just use scrim from an etched kit, slide the Vee under the metal strip, line the wing rail in place using a wing rail gauge and solder

 

 

Simple as this

 

Just turn the sub assembly round, then fit the second wing rail using the wing rail gauge

 

Cost minimal