Annie's Virtual Pre-Grouping, Grouping and BR Layouts & Workbench

[Hroth]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Note the piece of sacking or whatever on which the wagon door rests.

 

Yes, very impressive. Workers took more care of Railway Property in those days.

 

Nowadays they'd just pull the pins out and CRASH!!!!  "Not our problem Guv"

 

[Compound2632]

4 minutes ago, Hroth said:

 

Yes, very impressive. Workers took more care of Railway Property in those days.

 

Nowadays they'd just pull the pins out and CRASH!!!!  "Not our problem Guv"

 

 

I'm wondering though if the purpose was to make the step up more yielding when rolling a cask over it.

[Annie]

I had so much trouble with this map.  The Basemap software kept running out of memory so I had to cut the map down smaller and reduce the resolution before I could get the software to create the base template image without it freezing up and tipping over.

Most of the pieces I had to cut back are background street sections which would be easy enough to put in place later.  It was the line of trackwork for the vinegar branchline, the surrounding roads, the canal and the viaduct that I particularly wanted to be properly mapped out and after about three attempts I got it done.

I decided on using the Trainz Model Railway format to build the Vinegar Works Branch since it will be a lot easier for me to build it using this method.  Something for me to quietly potter away at with a reasonable chance of success at actually finishing the darn thing.

 

[Annie]

Evening GWR Cheer Up Quiz Picture:  Is there anyone among  our learned community who is able to identify this small and interesting 2-4-0T ?  It looks very familiar, but my brain is refusing to cooperate  with me to find the answer.

 

 

EDIT:  Ha ha...... I found the answer.  1st prize goes to ME!  It's 'Lady Margaret' which I should have known since I had a go at modelling the Looe branch back when I was first messing about with  Trainz TS2009.

 

Edited June 23, 2022 by Annie
More words needed.

[Mountain Goat]

Cambrian railway loco.

[Compound2632]

That's what happens when you use an H0 chassis for an 00 body...

[Annie]

22 minutes ago, Mountain Goat said:

Cambrian railway loco.

'Lady Margaret' formerly Liskeard & Looe railway, (G WR 1308),  was a 2-4-0 side tank engine built by Andrew Barclay (WN 956/1902).   It had inside frames, wheelbase 6ft 0in + 7ft 0in·, leading wheels 2ft 7½, coupled 4ft 0in, cylinders 14½ x 22in, grate area 11.6 ft2, pressure 160 psi., tank capacity 560 gallons, overall cab and weighed 28tons. Until about 1920 'Lady Margaret' worked in the West of England; from then till her withdrawal in May, 1948 she. was stationed at Oswestry except for a short period immediately after rebuilding in 1929, spent at Exeter working on the Culm Valley line.

[Annie]

Broad Gauge Cheer Up Pictures:  No. 3508.  (The following words shamelessly borrowed from the Broad Gauge Society)  

 

The hilly sections of GWR territory west of Newton Abbot were too difficult for the Rovers that hauled the expresses thus far, so more suitable engines were always needed.

In 1885, ten side tank 2-4-0 engines were built specifically for these duties. However, there was still a need for a loco with greater water capacity, and thus a longer non-stop range, for hauling the newly introduced Cornishman express.

So five of them were rebuilt as 2-4-0 tender engines, using tenders that, luckily, were going spare from the Hawthorne class that were having the opposite conversion done - tender engine to saddle tank.

The very last one to be done was 3508 - she gained her tender in May 1891, just a year before she was withdrawn at the end of the Broad Gauge, and subsequently converted to standard gauge.

 

 

[Regularity]

1 hour ago, Mountain Goat said:

Cambrian railway loco.

Used on Tanat Valley Light Railway by GWR, but I think you have confused it with:

 

Which the GWR turned into:

 

(Both images are embedded links.)

 

 

[Compound2632]

59 minutes ago, Regularity said:

I think you have confused it with:

 

I see they did find a 00 chassis for that one!

 

1 hour ago, Annie said:

So five of them were rebuilt as 2-4-0 tender engines, using tenders that, luckily, were going spare from the Hawthorne class that were having the opposite conversion done - tender engine to saddle tank.

 

Looking very like ordinary standard gauge engines!

 

Five seems to b a common batch size for engines built for specific duties - i suppose two up, two down, and one in the shops. Compare the various later GNR(I) 4-4-0 classes.

[Edwardian]

1 hour ago, Regularity said:

Used on Tanat Valley Light Railway by GWR, but I think you have confused it with:

 

Which the GWR turned into:

 

(Both images are embedded links.)

 

 

 

Yes indeed, the charismatic and frequently discussed 4'6" Sharp Stewart 'Seaham' tanks.

 

Sharp Stewart 2-4-0Ts

 

Before the Cambrian mucked about with them:

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Annie said:

'Lady Margaret' formerly Liskeard & Looe railway, (G WR 1308),  was a 2-4-0 side tank engine built by Andrew Barclay (WN 956/1902).   It had inside frames, wheelbase 6ft 0in + 7ft 0in·, leading wheels 2ft 7½, coupled 4ft 0in, cylinders 14½ x 22in, grate area 11.6 ft2, pressure 160 psi., tank capacity 560 gallons, overall cab and weighed 28tons. Until about 1920 'Lady Margaret' worked in the West of England; from then till her withdrawal in May, 1948 she. was stationed at Oswestry except for a short period immediately after rebuilding in 1929, spent at Exeter working on the Culm Valley line.

 

The Andrew Barclay Lady Margaret IIRC (I don't have many books to hand yet) was used by the Liskeard & Looe to work the passenger service up the steep extension line to the GWR Liskeard station. 

 

She would have gone to the GWR in 1909 when it took over the Liskeard & Looe. I have a feeling that I recall a picture of her still on the line in GW guise, but memory is a treacherous thing. Anyway, as you say, she didn't leave the west of England for Wales until circa 1920, and after that on the Culm Valley.

 

Annie, you have a virtual section of the L&L IIRC?

 

 

Edited June 23, 2022 by Edwardian
spelling

[Schooner]

2 hours ago, Annie said:

Broad Gauge Cheer Up Pictures

Correct!

 

Of the many things in those pics to love, I think my favourite can be seen on the splashers and frame. IIRC, those marks are photographic artifacts from a wipe with an oily rag. Looking at the splashers, whoever was giving the old girl a pre-portrait go-over seems to have started on the rear splasher, wiping in single strokes from top to bottom. Likewise the forward splasher until the plate, after which the zig-zag pattern suggests someone keen to finish the job! Time pressure? Backache? Who knows, but it brings so much life to the scene :)

[Annie]

39 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Annie, you have a virtual section of the L&L IIRC?

Yes I do James, but I made a real of a mess of it since I was brand new at building layouts in the Trainz simulator back then.  Some bits were alright, but a lot of it wasn't.  The biggest problem was that I had the ground levels as well as some of the distances all wrong so in the end I flagged it away.

I did find a lot of information about the L&L though as well as a good few photos so perhaps one day I'll go back to it and see if I can make a better job of it.

 

[Annie]

28 minutes ago, Schooner said:

Correct!

 

Of the many things in those pics to love, I think my favourite can be seen on the splashers and frame. IIRC, those marks are photographic artifacts from a wipe with an oily rag. Looking at the splashers, whoever was giving the old girl a pre-portrait go-over seems to have started on the rear splasher, wiping in single strokes from top to bottom. Likewise the forward splasher until the plate, after which the zig-zag pattern suggests someone keen to finish the job! Time pressure? Backache? Who knows, but it brings so much life to the scene :)

In many ways those two old photos show what could have been if the Broad Gauge had continued in the West.  I very much love the sense of pride the footplate crews had in their engines that comes through in these photographs.

[Adam88]

37 minutes ago, Schooner said:

Correct!

 

Of the many things in those pics to love, I think my favourite can be seen on the splashers and frame. IIRC, those marks are photographic artifacts from a wipe with an oily rag. Looking at the splashers, whoever was giving the old girl a pre-portrait go-over seems to have started on the rear splasher, wiping in single strokes from top to bottom. Likewise the forward splasher until the plate, after which the zig-zag pattern suggests someone keen to finish the job! Time pressure? Backache? Who knows, but it brings so much life to the scene :)

 

You beat me to it.  I too was going to comment on the cleaning pattern, I've sometimes seen it referred to as tallowing although I cannot imagine tallow was ever used for this purpose.  Many years ago someone published a piece in 'Backtrack' by a man who had been tasked with preparing and cleaning an LT&SR 4-4-2t for an exhibition, almost a lost art.  I must try and look it out.  In many years I have never seen such a finish represented on a small scale model locomotive - I think it would be very difficult to do and would certainly not find favour with the unholy "lets make our models as filthy as possible" brigade.

[Hroth]

2 hours ago, Schooner said:

Correct!

 

Of the many things in those pics to love, I think my favourite can be seen on the splashers and frame. IIRC, those marks are photographic artifacts from a wipe with an oily rag. Looking at the splashers, whoever was giving the old girl a pre-portrait go-over seems to have started on the rear splasher, wiping in single strokes from top to bottom. Likewise the forward splasher until the plate, after which the zig-zag pattern suggests someone keen to finish the job! Time pressure? Backache? Who knows, but it brings so much life to the scene :)

 

I'm a fan of the "oily rag" cleanup method that appears on a number of GW locos.  My favourite is that of 3373 "Atbara", which might well stand as a Standard Gauge Cheer Up picture...

 

 

Someone has had a good go at the splashers, cab side and tender.  The tender in particular has a very consistent patterning!

 

This photo of Atbara is also very popular in the "Imaginary Locomotives" thread....

 

I say no more!

 

 

 

[Annie]

5 hours ago, Adam88 said:

I think it would be very difficult to do and would certainly not find favour with the unholy "lets make our models as filthy as possible" brigade.

(sigh) Yes let's not mention the 'Pig Pen' followers of filth in my thread.  The most noticeable thing about the tragic lines of Broad Gauge locomotives on the dump sidings at Swindon is that they are all clean which is a total contrast to the lines of filthy and rusting engines standing on sidings at the end of steam on BR.  Yes it happened, yes it's history, but I fail to see the appeal of it.

 

3 hours ago, Hroth said:

I'm a fan of the "oily rag" cleanup method that appears on a number of GW locos.  My favourite is that of 3373 "Atbara", which might well stand as a Standard Gauge Cheer Up picture...

Oh yes a definite Cheer Up picture candidate which I shall carefully file away for future reference.

 

 

[Annie]

Broad Gauge Cheer Up Pictures:  After yesterday's pictures I couldn't miss an opportunity to post my favourite picture of a '3501' class 2-4-0T.  I consider these final engines built for the Broad Gauge to be an indication of what could have been possible if the Broad Gauge had been permitted to continue in the West.  Modern engines for their time in every sense of the word.

Major cheer ups needed as I've had a rotten day with not being able to stay awake.

 

 

Another favourite. The Gooch designed Standard Goods, or 'Ariadne' class.  'Europa' was the only one of this class to undergo a major rebuild at Swindon in 1869 and for that reason survived to see out the end of the Broad Gauge.  And just look at that magnificent Gooch designed boiler.

 

 

 

Rover class 'Tornado'. Built 1888.  The last of the 'Rover' class and certainly the most powerful of the class with its larger boiler.  Magnificent in every sense of the word.

 

[Hroth]

4 hours ago, Annie said:

Broad Gauge Cheer Up Pictures:  After yesterday's pictures I couldn't miss an opportunity to post my favourite picture of a '3501' class 2-4-0T.  I consider these final engines built for the Broad Gauge to be an indication of what could have been possible if the Broad Gauge had been permitted to continue in the West.  Modern engines for their time in every sense of the word.

Major cheer ups needed as I've had a rotten day with not being able to stay awake.

 

 

Another favourite. The Gooch designed Standard Goods, or 'Ariadne' class.  'Europa' was the only one of this class to undergo a major rebuild at Swindon in 1869 and for that reason survived to see out the end of the Broad Gauge.  And just look at that magnificent Gooch designed boiler.

 

 

 

Rover class 'Tornado'. Built 1888.  The last of the 'Rover' class and certainly the most powerful of the class with its larger boiler.  Magnificent in every sense of the word.

 

 

What a wonderful picture of "Tornado", with a working life of 4 years.  As foreshortened as the last BR Standards, she would have been somewhere in that scrap line at Swindon...

 

Hope you have a better day.

 

[Edwardian]

5 hours ago, Annie said:

Broad Gauge Cheer Up Pictures:  After yesterday's pictures I couldn't miss an opportunity to post my favourite picture of a '3501' class 2-4-0T.  I consider these final engines built for the Broad Gauge to be an indication of what could have been possible if the Broad Gauge had been permitted to continue in the West.  Modern engines for their time in every sense of the word.

Major cheer ups needed as I've had a rotten day with not being able to stay awake.

 

 

Another favourite. The Gooch designed Standard Goods, or 'Ariadne' class.  'Europa' was the only one of this class to undergo a major rebuild at Swindon in 1869 and for that reason survived to see out the end of the Broad Gauge.  And just look at that magnificent Gooch designed boiler.

 

 

 

Rover class 'Tornado'. Built 1888.  The last of the 'Rover' class and certainly the most powerful of the class with its larger boiler.  Magnificent in every sense of the word.

 

 

Best wishes, Annie.  I hope, too, your days improve.

 

I take what you mean about 'modern broad gauge', hints of how it might have appeared going into the 1900s, if only .....

[Annie]

22 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

Best wishes, Annie.  I hope, too, your days improve.

 

I take what you mean about 'modern broad gauge', hints of how it might have appeared going into the 1900s, if only .....

Thanks James and Horth too.  It's the tale end of having been on powerful antibiotics followed by 3 injections of a local anesthetic that are knocking me around.  I've never been good with anesthetics and it always seems to take me some time to recover in the aftermath.  I'm basically Ok,  just fatigued and likely to fall asleep without much warning.  It's frustrating as there's a few things that I'd like to get started on.

 

Yes I can't help, but wonder what would have happened if the Broad Gauge had continued through into the 1900's.  Now there's a 'what-if' scenario for somebody to take up.  Steve Flanders mentioned to me a while ago that he'd like to revisit making Broad Gauge models again so perhaps if I can make the right suggestions at the right time one or two of these later engines could be a possibility.

Edited June 24, 2022 by Annie
can't spell for toffee

[NeilHB]

Sorry to hear that you're still suffering the after effects Annie, hope you are back to some semblance of normality soon. 

[Annie]

13 hours ago, NeilHB said:

Sorry to hear that you're still suffering the after effects Annie, hope you are back to some semblance of normality soon. 

Thank you Neil.  I'm still sleepy, but I seem to be having a better time of it today.

 

My  mid-1950s Western Region layout 'Ashington' is always good fun to play trains on.  It translated across to Trainz TRS22 without any problems and it does exactly what it says on the tin without any fuss.  I know 'Ashington' isn't pre-grouping, but if I spent a couple of hours changing out the signals, some buildings and most of the vehicles on the roads it could be if I wanted it to.

 

The green Triang 3MT 2-6-2T rides again!  No. 82030 is usually seen on the morning train from Ashington to Castleton and all stations after that as represented by the 'Bath' storage loop at the end of the main line.  A nice old model for Trainz from TS2004 days, but it really could do with its steam and smoke animation files upgrading.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And arrival at Castleton.

[Annie]

The latest project from Steve Flanders.  An absolutely amazing project to create Chippenham Station as it was during the 1840s era.  Amazingly the original drawings do still exist even though some of them look more like fine lace than drawings.  Steve intends to make the station buildings in sections so that parts of the station could be used to create other Brunel era stations, but however he does it it is one amazing project that's going to occupy his spare time for a good long while.

All is not perfect even with having copies of the original drawings to hand as there are some differences from one drawing to another, but Steve thinks he's been able to  resolve some of those issues. 

Definitely a Cheer Up for me this morning.

 

 

 

[Edwardian]

Before the BoT specified platform ramps!