FPH 603 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 (edited) I have had a project back logged for quite some time now, little did I know that a RTR manufacturer has tooling to produce an RTR model of the very same train! Ok the title may be exaggerated but I don't know what to do about this now. I only found this out today and I'm annoyed as I know my scratchbuilding is nowhere near the quality of RTR, and my first attempt at scratchbuilding an almost identical class wasn't great either! The point of doing this project has been pretty much lost, but I can predict like nearly all Aussie outline RTR it will be ridiculously overpriced and way out of my budget. So I don't know what to do. Edited March 27, 2018 by FPH 603 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Keep at it and spend more time on research so that you can produce a more accurate model. RTR manufacturers often include compromises because of production restraints. Gordon A 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimC Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 The point of doing this project has been pretty much lost, Ultimately isn't the point of the project to have fun building a model. So is that lost? Taking it to extremes 90% of us could have better model railways if we shelled out megabucks to get the best available pros to build every last thing, but where would be the fun in that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad McCann Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Stick in man. These things do happen, but at the end of the day your own creativity and skill has produced something that is uniquely yours and it has heart and soul that is all of your own making. You can always upgrade it as time goes on but you will always have the satisfaction of knowing that your model exists purely because of your own imagination, skill and persistence. I’ll take that feeling over cracking open another RTR box any day - unless it’s a classic Scottish 0-6-0... ;-) Dave. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPH 603 Posted March 25, 2018 Author Share Posted March 25, 2018 Keep at it and spend more time on research so that you can produce a more accurate model. RTR manufacturers often include compromises because of production restraints. Gordon A I can already see intrusive chassis blocks, dim interior lights and poor sound coming our way... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad McCann Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 The primary advantage for you here is that you have absolute control over the final end product. You’ll only stop when you’re satisfied with the result. And of course, every one you do will be just that bit better, particularly as your research and observational skills develop. I must be careful here, I’m talking myself into actually doing something for a change! ;-) Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPH 603 Posted March 25, 2018 Author Share Posted March 25, 2018 Thanks guys, now to find a way to build the damn thing! Has the most deceptively complicated shape I'll say! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Miles Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Scratch building at times can seem like a form of masochism but when you get it right it is far more satisfying than opening a box and putting a RTR item on the track. I have learned a lot by picking up ideas from others and by having a go and learning when things go wrong. Gaining skills and knowledge takes time but IMHO it's worth it. Also there are lots of things which RTR companies are never going to get around to providing so there is plenty of scope for scratch building. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Scratchbuilders worrying about RTR? RTR manufacturers spoiling scratch-building projects is a new one on me. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PaulCheffus Posted March 25, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2018 Hi I’ve had this happen a couple of times. The most annoying was Dapol announcing the Telescopic steel hood wagons the very week I finished my pair. Cheers Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Geep7 Posted March 26, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 26, 2018 I had exactly the same thing happen when I started scratchbuilding my TC set. Never did I think one would appear RTR, but low and behold, the Kernow one was announced, so I made it sort of a race to see which was "finished" first. Next up is a Tadpole unit, hopefully sufficiently obscure that one will never be made RTR..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPH 603 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Share Posted March 26, 2018 (edited) I had exactly the same thing happen when I started scratchbuilding my TC set. Never did I think one would appear RTR, but low and behold, the Kernow one was announced, so I made it sort of a race to see which was "finished" first. Next up is a Tadpole unit, hopefully sufficiently obscure that one will never be made RTR..... I've started drawing up the model on Sketchup so hopefully I can 3D print the thing before the RTR version is released! See my Aussie Content thread (see signature) for more. Edited March 26, 2018 by FPH 603 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Kirk Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Going back in time I can remember the same complaint being made about kits. A good friend of mine was a prolific scratch builder and in the 70/80s he invariably (it seemed) completed a new loco only to find the announcement of the kit release in the Railway Modeller. He solved his problem by going O gauge where he is still happily loco building and having chosen to model 1890/1900 North British Railway is unlikely to be troubled by the increasing amount of RTR in O gauge. best wishes, Ian 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 I have known a couple of folk take up scales with no RTR support for this reason, 'S' particularly popular in this respect. The only aspect of a RTR production that grinds my gears is when the RTR item is so 'off' that it cannot run alongside my kit and scratchbuilt items: lead offender Hornby's Gresley gangwayed stock... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPH 603 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Share Posted March 26, 2018 Going back in time I can remember the same complaint being made about kits. A good friend of mine was a prolific scratch builder and in the 70/80s he invariably (it seemed) completed a new loco only to find the announcement of the kit release in the Railway Modeller. He solved his problem by going O gauge where he is still happily loco building and having chosen to model 1890/1900 North British Railway is unlikely to be troubled by the increasing amount of RTR in O gauge. best wishes, Ian I have known a couple of folk take up scales with no RTR support for this reason, 'S' particularly popular in this respect. The only aspect of a RTR production that grinds my gears is when the RTR item is so 'off' that it cannot run alongside my kit and scratchbuilt items: lead offender Hornby's Gresley gangwayed stock... Going up a few scales? I've actually considered this to become another project, for this and the fact that bigger scales are easier to work with when it comes to smaller details and complex shapes. I wouldn't move everything to a bigger scale but I think a one off larger scale model would be good. Imagine the possibilities... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted March 26, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 26, 2018 The worst aspect of this in my view is when a manufacturer announces a model and you deprive yourself of a kit or kitbash for several years waiting for it to appear. I am looking at you, Bachmann 94xx! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Can I just say, after seeing some superb workmanship at Ally Pally yesterday, the shear pleasure and rightly pride either scratch or kit building gives the modeller and viewer far surpasses the cheque book modelling of some. So what if a RTR model comes out, whats better saying I bought this or I made this Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 Scratchbuilders worrying about RTR? RTR manufacturers spoiling scratch-building projects is a new one on me. It's a First-World problem, I believe, Larry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger123 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 That's why iam sticking to my mucky ducks lol no o gauge manufacturer would say these are cost effective so part kit+strach =a ugly duck just a thought if a job sheet came out in a land across the sea for a mucky duck the employees might take it away lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest teacupteacup Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 I have had a project back logged for quite some time now, little did I know that a RTR manufacturer has tooling to produce an RTR model of the very same train! Ok the title may be exaggerated but I don't know what to do about this now. I only found this out today and I'm annoyed as I know my scratchbuilding is nowhere near the quality of RTR, and my first attempt at scratchbuilding an almost identical class wasn't great either! The point of doing this project has been pretty much lost, but I can predict like nearly all Aussie outline RTR it will be ridiculously overpriced and way out of my budget. So I don't know what to do. Taking your last line into account... I've looked online at this loco, and its DCC Sound price of $395 AuD works out at £215 (£160 without sound). Considering the likely sized market from a 25m population, plus overseas modellers of the Australian scene, I'd say this was a rather fair price to pay. This might seem expensive to a lot of people (and in the grand scheme of things it is), but the manufactures have to cover their backs. Its not cheap to design, tool, manufacture, paint, box and distribute. From you further posts about predicting visible motor blocks, dim interior lighting (which is should be anyway?) and poor sound, then why not continue with your scratchbuilding? It builds your skills and you'll get there eventually. Then you can choose your propulsion and sound recordings to suit Fortunately Im in a position that just about all I want is available rtr (or will be), but I cant scratchbuild stock. I have tried, but I just cant. However its not the end of the world, its only toy trains Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RosiesBoss Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 I used to think that every new RTR model that was released devalued the efforts I had made to create a model of the same prototype. Let me explain. I have been actively modelling (not just playing with my train set) since the mid-1960s and cut my modelling teeth with Airfix and Kitmaster kits. Some of those models are still in use, albeit refreshed from time to time. While still in high school, I decided to accumulate a representative collection of GWR/BR(W) locos, together with suitable rolling stock. Very little was available then as RTR, so I tried my hand at scratchbuilding a couple of loco bodies. I soon tired of those, as they were just too crude: poorly soldered brass bodies on Tri-ang chassis. I moved on to a couple of whitemetal kits and adapting Kitmaster and Airfix bodies on scratchbuilt chassis. These looked much better. Re-working/rebuilding of RTR models followed. In 1975, while visiting the UK, I bought a “truckload” of kits, including many K’s, Peco and PC examples, which I began to build over the next few years. Subsequently, many RTR GWR types were released and (what a surprise!) several of those were already in my collection. Rather than just give up, I chose to review my own models and upgraded them where applicable. I did also buy some RTR types not already on hand. My collection now includes the following non-RTR models that have been (or are about to be) duplicated by RTR examples. I still enjoy running and exhibiting them. My modelling skills have continued to improve and I still get a thrill from seeing each of my new models emerge from my workshop, whether someone else has made one or not. I enjoy the challenge and the journey. Somehow, my RTR models don’t give me as much satisfaction. 5 “Portishead” – K’s kit 848 – Kitbashed Airfix/Dapol 1014 “County of Glamorgan” – Motorised GBL 2161 – Centre Models kit 2251 – Airfix/Tri-ang 2517 – Mainline/Wills/Airfix 2818 – K’s kit 2953 “Titley Court” – Tri-ang/Dublo/Airfix 3026 – K’s kit 3040 – K’s kit 3265 “Tre Pol & Pen” – Kitbashed Airfix 3440 “City of Truro” – Motorised Airfix 3713 “City of Chester” – Motorised GBL 3814 “County of Chester” – Kitbashed Airfix 4833 – K’s kit 4508 – Crownline/Lima 6435 – rebuilt Tri-ang Hornby 70021 “Morning Star” – Motorised GBL 78005 – Crownline/Hornby 82004 – Detailed Tri-ang 15105 – Kitmaster body on Lima chassis M79971 – Motorised Dapol railbus GNR No.1 – Motorised Kitmaster CR 123 – Motorised GBL L & M “Rocket” – Motorised GBL LNER 4468 “Mallard” – Motorised GBL The skills that I learned and practised on the above models are now in use for the occasional scratchbuild, such as you may find here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/126196-gwr-ex-cambrian-railways-large-belpaire-passenger-4-4-0-94-class/ http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/132253-gwr-ex-cardiff-railway-kitson-0-6-2t/ Happy modelling! Regards, Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 I dont have a possessive bone in my body and if everyone and his gran were building Carrog from ready-to-plonk buildings, I would be happy for them, not p*ssed off. This might well happen one day when one looks at the heritage stations that have already been covered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 The main problem with scratch building is when your finished you are never really happy as you hold an inquest and realise where the errors and compromises are! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPH 603 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Share Posted March 26, 2018 The main problem with scratch building is when your finished you are never really happy as you hold an inquest and realise where the errors and compromises are! And the fact that what I'm trying to make has an extremely deceptive body profile! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FPH 603 Posted March 27, 2018 Author Share Posted March 27, 2018 And the fact that what I'm trying to make has an extremely deceptive body profile! Well I've gotten around the profile of the body and the front is nearly completed! More can be found here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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